EPTGSL Ro4 Day 1 - Page 79
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
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eggs
1011 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:08 ZerOfy wrote: What season are they going to start using custom maps? Perhaps then we can have some serious macro games. considering Gom is blizzard's lapdog and blizzard doesn't want macro games, it's safe to say: never in the GSL. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
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eggs
1011 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:24 syllogism wrote: Hahah right, maybe you should look at some of the patch notes. Even that aside, you make absolutely no sense. some actual information would be nice, or at least a proper argument. do explain. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:27 eggs wrote: some actual information would be nice, or at least a proper argument. do explain. You made a completely nonsensical assertion which, as such, deserved no serious reply. However it should be obvious there have been numerous recent patch changes that have made it harder to apply pressure early, which obviously leads to longer macro games. See: reaper, zealot build time, supply before rax, void ray nerf etc. Furthermore, even if Blizzard for some reason hated macro games, it would make no sense to force GSL to use official blizzard maps. | ||
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Chocobo
United States1108 Posts
On November 04 2010 20:55 Eufra wrote: At least, winning with a basic unit takes class. =D I could not agree more. You're not "supposed to" make a variety of units and keep trying different strategies. You do whatever works. I love Foxer's style of play and I think it's very exciting to watch because it's unique and new and seems more powerful than it ought to be. I can't wait to see how players figure out how to deal with it. The game is evolving in front of my eyes, this is much more interesting than a standard TvT. If you think it's boring just because it's only one unit, then you're doing it wrong. You're looking for a giant crazy all-over-the-place battle... but if you love the "strategy" in RTS games then what Foxer is doing is very exciting. | ||
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hugman
Sweden4644 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:05 Redmark wrote: It kind of makes you wonder how much of his opponents looking bad were them actually being bad, and how much was Clare being good. It's hard to tell without a high-level understanding of the game. A good player makes his opponents look bad | ||
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Minzy
Australia387 Posts
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eggs
1011 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:28 syllogism wrote: You made a completely nonsensical assertion which, as such, deserved no serious reply. However it should be obvious there have been numerous recent patch changes that have made it harder to apply pressure early, which obviously leads to longer macro games. See: reaper, zealot build time, supply before rax, void ray nerf etc. Furthermore, even if Blizzard for some reason hated macro games, it would make no sense to force GSL to use official blizzard maps. none of which nerf 1-base play. and Gom does what Blizzard tells it to. Gom won't initiate trying to find better maps until Blizzard stops feeding them the maps to use in tournaments, which will be small, fast-paced maps because they said they prefer quick games. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:42 eggs wrote: none of which nerf 1-base play. and Gom does what Blizzard tells it to. Gom won't initiate trying to find better maps until Blizzard stops feeding them the maps to use in tournaments, which will be small, fast-paced maps because they said they prefer quick games. Yes, those changes do make 1 base play less viable. Once again you aren't making sense; What Blizzard "prefers" is completely irrelevant, and I doubt they've specifically said that, because it's in their best interest to allow GSL to use whatever maps are popular among the audience and based on SC1 the audience likes bigger, macro oriented maps. The reason why the current maps aren't bigger is because they are easier for new players to get into and also easier to design. | ||
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eggs
1011 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:46 syllogism wrote: Yes, those changes do make 1 base play less viable. Once again you aren't making sense; What Blizzard "prefers" is completely irrelevant, and I doubt they've specifically said that, because it's in their best interest to allow GSL to use whatever maps are popular among the audience and based on SC1 the audience likes bigger, macro oriented maps. The reason why the current maps aren't bigger is because they are easier for new players to get into and also easier to design. it nerfed super early aggression, not 1-base play. it only affected timing to be more balanced/consistent in non-mirror matchups. it didn't affect the cost of units or their hp/damage so it doesn't nerf 1-base play. they did specifically say they prefer faster games in SC2 to the 45 minute pro BW battles. it is not in their interest to give Gom more freedom. they regret letting BW proleagues get away with it and are now suing them. they specifically chose Gom to give the rights to pro SC2 because they knew they would have direct influence with Gom but not with Kespa/MBC/OGN. the original question was On November 05 2010 06:08 ZerOfy wrote: What season are they going to start using custom maps? Perhaps then we can have some serious macro games. you will not see custom maps in the GSL until after the 2nd expansion. | ||
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kvn4444
1510 Posts
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Moragon
United States355 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:29 Chocobo wrote: I could not agree more. You're not "supposed to" make a variety of units and keep trying different strategies. You do whatever works. I love Foxer's style of play and I think it's very exciting to watch because it's unique and new and seems more powerful than it ought to be. I can't wait to see how players figure out how to deal with it. The game is evolving in front of my eyes, this is much more interesting than a standard TvT. If you think it's boring just because it's only one unit, then you're doing it wrong. You're looking for a giant crazy all-over-the-place battle... but if you love the "strategy" in RTS games then what Foxer is doing is very exciting. Only point I was trying to make. | ||
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syllogism
Finland5948 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:55 eggs wrote: it nerfed super early aggression, not 1-base play. it only affected timing to be more balanced/consistent in non-mirror matchups. it didn't affect the cost of units or their hp/damage so it doesn't nerf 1-base play. they did specifically say they prefer faster games in SC2 to the 45 minute pro BW battles. it is not in their interest to give Gom more freedom. they regret letting BW proleagues get away with it and are now suing them. they specifically chose Gom to give the rights to pro SC2 because they knew they would have direct influence with Gom but not with Kespa/MBC/OGN. the original question was you will not see custom maps in the GSL until after the 2nd expansion. You are making less and less sense the more you talk. As it's apparent you aren't going to be convinced, I'm not going to bother. | ||
Beyonder
Netherlands15103 Posts
On November 05 2010 06:24 syllogism wrote: Hahah right, maybe you should look at some of the patch notes. Even that aside, you make absolutely no sense. They basically nerfed all the early game rushing strategies (which is why P is nerfed so much): zealots, reapers, fast warpgates, etc. They want macro games, or at least games that reach the mid stage of the game. In other news, Foxer is a really deserving finalist. Seems like a great guy and a real character. I would love to see his TvZ, but I cannot cheer against Boxer. Perhaps Boxer can play Z ;D | ||
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adeezy
United States1428 Posts
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Moragon
United States355 Posts
On November 05 2010 07:12 adeezy wrote: SlayersBoxeR just needs to change it up and use hellions as an attacking unit to counter these mass marines. He can try, but no other counters have worked against it so far. We know foxer can micro the hell out of his marines, hellions would probably only be hitting 1-2 at a time. | ||
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adeezy
United States1428 Posts
On November 05 2010 07:22 Moragon wrote: He can try, but no other counters have worked against it so far. We know foxer can micro the hell out of his marines, hellions would probably only be hitting 1-2 at a time. As far as I can tell no one has really tried to counter it, Hopetorture last night just tried to go along with his usual strategies but he needed to do something different. Even if hellions would only be hitting one at a time, they to avoiding that is not letting the marines get into a concave and attacking them when they are grouped up. an effective hellion hits 2-3 marines especially with blue flames it would be very effective. Since Hellions are all minerals he could just have some siege tanks or banshees to be the support or any other gas heavy unit. | ||
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jalstar
United States8198 Posts
Foxer was very good about making just enough marauders to kill ITR's tanks every time ITR went tank-heavy. During that last game when Foxer didn't fast-expand he made vikings because he knew he wouldn't have enough marines to effectively deal with banshees. It's not that Foxer hasn't lost because no one's found a way to exploit his one-dimensional play, it's because he's found ways to exploit everyone else's one-dimensional play. Foxer adapts more than any other player I've seen, it's just that his adaptations are more subtle because they don't involve complete tech switches, just changing the support for his marines or deciding whether to push or drop. | ||
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hitman133
United States1425 Posts
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