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Liquid'Tyler vs. IdrA Gosucoaching.com Showmatch - Page 35

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
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bjornkavist
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada1235 Posts
November 03 2010 02:45 GMT
#681
Lol I just get the feeling Nony practiced harder for this than MLG just so he could beat Nony like he did in TSL and backing up his smack on SOTG. gj Tyler!
https://soundcloud.com/bbols
Diamond
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States10796 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-03 02:45:49
November 03 2010 02:45 GMT
#682
Ok so the VOD's have all encoded, some still have to get the HD encoding done but here's the links again:

Here are SPOILER FREE links to the Fileplay VOD's. Some might be lacking HD

[image loading] Liquid`Tyler vs. [image loading] IdrA
+ Show Spoiler +

Game 1
Game 2
Game 3
Game 4
Game 5
Game 6
Game 7

Ballistix Gaming Global Gaming/Esports Marketing Manager - twitter.com/esvdiamond
Kraznaya
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
United States3711 Posts
November 03 2010 02:45 GMT
#683
all of you who are saying idra was hiding strategies are hilarious, idra doesn't have strategies
do you have enough resolve, hero of justice?
SKtheAnathema
Profile Joined September 2010
United States885 Posts
November 03 2010 02:46 GMT
#684
wow, does nony even play sc2? 4-1 is rape :D

good shit
-_-
Profile Blog Joined November 2003
United States7081 Posts
November 03 2010 02:47 GMT
#685
On November 03 2010 11:36 Armathai wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2010 11:26 -_- wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:49 desrow wrote:
i just dont get why all these ****** websites do showmatches and wont even release the replays. Have some advertisement said by a referee at the begening of every replay and you willget more exposure than vods with shitty caster. MAYBE if incontrol casted the showmatch it would of been interesting but now..

User was temp banned for this post.

Even though I banned you for posting like a douchebag I will still reply to you in case there are others who don't get it. There are a lot of reasons why not to release replays one of them is player protection; a replay will show you a lot more than a VOD will. The other is because sponsors need VOD numbers and not replay downloads.



When I hear this, I become very glad Blizzard is controlling the ladder the way they are.

I'm glad Blizzard lets us look at player's build orders in a player's match history. I'm glad they made Blizzcon a ladder tournament, so that professionals would be encouraged to play the ladder. In fact, I hope they further incentivize ladder matches. And I can't wait for Blizzard to start releasing GSL replays. Otherwise, spectators will get screwed while the pros practice privately in custom games.

As for VOD numbers, why not release the replays a week after the games? How many people would skip watching the vods so they could watch the replays later? Certainly not enough to halt the advancement of esports. And I doubt a VOD gets many views after a week. Also, as for replays giving more information than vods, considering you can crossreference a player's BO in his match history with the VOD, how much tactical advantage is really gained.

Replays have always been my favorite part of Starcraft, and this replay hording is deeply frustrating for me. I know the shoutcasters work very hard. I respect them for that, and for their love of the game. But I hate your observing. It's probably not your fault. If you don't have the clicker, you probably won't like the other person's channel choice. But that understanding doesn't make me hate your observing one iota less.

For once, though, Blizzard is on my side. They understand that the masses make them the money. Pros might sustain the life of a game, but they don't need that until they release all their expansions. They'll make sure the game becomes more spectator-centric, and that makes me happy.


Except that going with your logic, there won't be anything worth spectating, and the system will be so ingrained that a month after the expansions are released the scene would be dead. Anyone who started early with BW will tell you that the days without replays were much more interesting! Also quit sitting on a highhorse regarding your personal replay watching, you don't control the camera in any other sports either, find an observer/caster you like and deal with it. It's precisely Blizzard's attitude that is going to ruin the longevity of SC2 compared to BW.




I started early in BW. Some pros will tell you they liked the scene more before replays. I'm not arguing that. But I think replays are an awesome feature, and Blizzard thought the majority of fans felt that way as well.

Regarding camera control in other sports, in other sports nearly all the action can be captured on one screen. What's more, they have much, much better broadcast teams and productions. That's not an insult to esport commentators, but it's just the way it is, and it's the reason why sports commentating is more palatable. Finally, esports is not football. It comes with different expectations. In football, only insiders get to watch game from all the cool camera angles. But football is not starcraft.

Maybe if USA SC broadcasts were as good as Korean ones, I could stand living without replays. But it's not. And my only consolation is that what Blizzard has done so far suggests to me that Blizzard understands my POV.
iNkA
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States206 Posts
November 03 2010 02:56 GMT
#686
On November 03 2010 11:47 -_- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2010 11:36 Armathai wrote:
On November 03 2010 11:26 -_- wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:49 desrow wrote:
i just dont get why all these ****** websites do showmatches and wont even release the replays. Have some advertisement said by a referee at the begening of every replay and you willget more exposure than vods with shitty caster. MAYBE if incontrol casted the showmatch it would of been interesting but now..

User was temp banned for this post.

Even though I banned you for posting like a douchebag I will still reply to you in case there are others who don't get it. There are a lot of reasons why not to release replays one of them is player protection; a replay will show you a lot more than a VOD will. The other is because sponsors need VOD numbers and not replay downloads.



When I hear this, I become very glad Blizzard is controlling the ladder the way they are.

I'm glad Blizzard lets us look at player's build orders in a player's match history. I'm glad they made Blizzcon a ladder tournament, so that professionals would be encouraged to play the ladder. In fact, I hope they further incentivize ladder matches. And I can't wait for Blizzard to start releasing GSL replays. Otherwise, spectators will get screwed while the pros practice privately in custom games.

As for VOD numbers, why not release the replays a week after the games? How many people would skip watching the vods so they could watch the replays later? Certainly not enough to halt the advancement of esports. And I doubt a VOD gets many views after a week. Also, as for replays giving more information than vods, considering you can crossreference a player's BO in his match history with the VOD, how much tactical advantage is really gained.

Replays have always been my favorite part of Starcraft, and this replay hording is deeply frustrating for me. I know the shoutcasters work very hard. I respect them for that, and for their love of the game. But I hate your observing. It's probably not your fault. If you don't have the clicker, you probably won't like the other person's channel choice. But that understanding doesn't make me hate your observing one iota less.

For once, though, Blizzard is on my side. They understand that the masses make them the money. Pros might sustain the life of a game, but they don't need that until they release all their expansions. They'll make sure the game becomes more spectator-centric, and that makes me happy.


Except that going with your logic, there won't be anything worth spectating, and the system will be so ingrained that a month after the expansions are released the scene would be dead. Anyone who started early with BW will tell you that the days without replays were much more interesting! Also quit sitting on a highhorse regarding your personal replay watching, you don't control the camera in any other sports either, find an observer/caster you like and deal with it. It's precisely Blizzard's attitude that is going to ruin the longevity of SC2 compared to BW.




I started early in BW. Some pros will tell you they liked the scene more before replays. I'm not arguing that. But I think replays are an awesome feature, and Blizzard thought the majority of fans felt that way as well.

Regarding camera control in other sports, in other sports nearly all the action can be captured on one screen. What's more, they have much, much better broadcast teams and productions. That's not an insult to esport commentators, but it's just the way it is, and it's the reason why sports commentating is more palatable. Finally, esports is not football. It comes with different expectations. In football, only insiders get to watch game from all the cool camera angles. But football is not starcraft.

Maybe if USA SC broadcasts were as good as Korean ones, I could stand living without replays. But it's not. And my only consolation is that what Blizzard has done so far suggests to me that Blizzard understands my POV.

i think this guy is either joking or 100% arrogant
Kiarip
Profile Joined August 2008
United States1835 Posts
November 03 2010 02:58 GMT
#687
Well, tbh I think that the game would be quite SICK without replays
Gecko
Profile Joined August 2010
United States519 Posts
November 03 2010 03:03 GMT
#688
Thank you so much for the vods they will help my PvZ alot. I really appreciate you guys putting on awesome showmatches .
Kiarip
Profile Joined August 2008
United States1835 Posts
November 03 2010 03:12 GMT
#689
ok I'm watching the games. game 1 and 2 were pretty awkward. Game 3 was blink stalkers, and I'm not sure how it works, but game 4 seemed standard, and I think that Roach/Hydra is the correct response to 5 gate no tech pushes on 2 bases.
Noev
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States1105 Posts
November 03 2010 03:13 GMT
#690
amazing games thanks for doing these guys, hope to see more like it
Pyrthas
Profile Joined March 2007
United States3196 Posts
November 03 2010 03:17 GMT
#691
On November 03 2010 11:45 Kraznaya wrote:
all of you who are saying idra was hiding strategies are hilarious, idra doesn't have strategies
It's true, he never thinks about what he's doing or why he's doing it. That's why he wins so much! Wait, what?
Armathai
Profile Joined October 2007
1023 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-03 03:19:31
November 03 2010 03:17 GMT
#692
On November 03 2010 11:47 -_- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2010 11:36 Armathai wrote:
On November 03 2010 11:26 -_- wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
On November 03 2010 10:49 desrow wrote:
i just dont get why all these ****** websites do showmatches and wont even release the replays. Have some advertisement said by a referee at the begening of every replay and you willget more exposure than vods with shitty caster. MAYBE if incontrol casted the showmatch it would of been interesting but now..

User was temp banned for this post.

Even though I banned you for posting like a douchebag I will still reply to you in case there are others who don't get it. There are a lot of reasons why not to release replays one of them is player protection; a replay will show you a lot more than a VOD will. The other is because sponsors need VOD numbers and not replay downloads.



When I hear this, I become very glad Blizzard is controlling the ladder the way they are.

I'm glad Blizzard lets us look at player's build orders in a player's match history. I'm glad they made Blizzcon a ladder tournament, so that professionals would be encouraged to play the ladder. In fact, I hope they further incentivize ladder matches. And I can't wait for Blizzard to start releasing GSL replays. Otherwise, spectators will get screwed while the pros practice privately in custom games.

As for VOD numbers, why not release the replays a week after the games? How many people would skip watching the vods so they could watch the replays later? Certainly not enough to halt the advancement of esports. And I doubt a VOD gets many views after a week. Also, as for replays giving more information than vods, considering you can crossreference a player's BO in his match history with the VOD, how much tactical advantage is really gained.

Replays have always been my favorite part of Starcraft, and this replay hording is deeply frustrating for me. I know the shoutcasters work very hard. I respect them for that, and for their love of the game. But I hate your observing. It's probably not your fault. If you don't have the clicker, you probably won't like the other person's channel choice. But that understanding doesn't make me hate your observing one iota less.

For once, though, Blizzard is on my side. They understand that the masses make them the money. Pros might sustain the life of a game, but they don't need that until they release all their expansions. They'll make sure the game becomes more spectator-centric, and that makes me happy.


Except that going with your logic, there won't be anything worth spectating, and the system will be so ingrained that a month after the expansions are released the scene would be dead. Anyone who started early with BW will tell you that the days without replays were much more interesting! Also quit sitting on a highhorse regarding your personal replay watching, you don't control the camera in any other sports either, find an observer/caster you like and deal with it. It's precisely Blizzard's attitude that is going to ruin the longevity of SC2 compared to BW.




I started early in BW. Some pros will tell you they liked the scene more before replays. I'm not arguing that. But I think replays are an awesome feature, and Blizzard thought the majority of fans felt that way as well.

Regarding camera control in other sports, in other sports nearly all the action can be captured on one screen. What's more, they have much, much better broadcast teams and productions. That's not an insult to esport commentators, but it's just the way it is, and it's the reason why sports commentating is more palatable. Finally, esports is not football. It comes with different expectations. In football, only insiders get to watch game from all the cool camera angles. But football is not starcraft.

Maybe if USA SC broadcasts were as good as Korean ones, I could stand living without replays. But it's not. And my only consolation is that what Blizzard has done so far suggests to me that Blizzard understands my POV.


E-Sports are sports, SC2 is not football because people like you relegate it to that status. It shouldn't come with different expectations. So instead of pressuring Blizzard into giving more incentives for better Casters/Production teams you support them in denying the longevity of creative game play. English broadcasts could easily be as good if there were paid expert commentators(here is where Bliz could invest) , but instead we're just whining at the people who try their best and beg for the short term relief of replays, while professionals lose incentive to come up with new builds.

Edit:
Everyone who keeps commenting that Idra was hiding his builds for MLG is seriously mistaking the value of that tournament to the 400$ that this match could've brought him, with a lot less variables offered. Not to mention the personal victory that Idra could've achieved.


Looking for ArcticCerebrate formerly from @USEast
LynxKerr
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada173 Posts
November 03 2010 03:19 GMT
#693
Nony is so multifaceted. I love that he can play one of about 10 builds in any given game. Makes for a lot of variety. Normally its hard to be very good at that level this early in a games life by being so diverse, but he seems to be quite good at it right now. His profile doesn't show much practice at all.. I know about all the rumours about him not practicing all that much, but for some reason I just have a hard time believing it given how crisp his build executions are.
Get busy livin', or get busy dyin'
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
November 03 2010 03:19 GMT
#694
Production value speaking, everything we have thus far in E-Sports is very amateur. Cable networks like OGN and MBC run a pretty tight ship, but even then there are technical difficulties because of all the hardware involved, i.e. Flash versus Jaedong power outage final.

In replays, sure you can view everything you want at your own discretion. This is a huge problem with inexperienced observers. I doubt -_- was joking as there is a lot of truth in what he said. When replays were first introduced, a lot of the top players cringed at the thought of it and now many have grown to accept it as a valid tool for improving, meh.
backtoback
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada1276 Posts
November 03 2010 03:22 GMT
#695
On November 02 2010 13:39 iCCup.Diamond wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2010 13:08 Newbistic wrote:
Who are going to be casting these matches?


Looks like Raelcun and Makh, just waiting on Makh to confirm.

Does anyone else kind of see this as fitting for the same day Boxer vs. Nada is going down? 2 Korean BW legends and 2 BW Foreign legends, but all in SCII !

Also mandatory poll for a match like this:
Poll: Who will end up winning from this TSL 2 rematch?

IdrA - : 4-1 (74)
 
25%

IdrA - : 4-0 (49)
 
17%

IdrA - : 4-2 (47)
 
16%

Liquid`Tyler - 4-1 (33)
 
11%

Liquid`Tyler - 4-3 (33)
 
11%

Liquid`Tyler- 4-0 (29)
 
10%

Liquid`Tyler - 4-2 (20)
 
7%

IdrA - : 4-3 (11)
 
4%

296 total votes

Your vote: Who will end up winning from this TSL 2 rematch?

(Vote): Liquid`Tyler- 4-0
(Vote): Liquid`Tyler - 4-1
(Vote): Liquid`Tyler - 4-2
(Vote): Liquid`Tyler - 4-3
(Vote): IdrA - : 4-0
(Vote): IdrA - : 4-1
(Vote): IdrA - : 4-2
(Vote): IdrA - : 4-3






lol? grats tyler! hope you go to GSL!!!
MatiNO
Profile Joined May 2010
Australia327 Posts
November 03 2010 03:28 GMT
#696
gg idra fans. NONY FIGHTING!
Redmark
Profile Joined March 2010
Canada2129 Posts
November 03 2010 03:31 GMT
#697
So I didn't watch, but basically Idra failed to scout the entire series and got punished for it?
next you're going to tell me that HDStarcraft 6pools him twice and sends him to losers, he's got to do better than that.
zerglingsfolife
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States1694 Posts
November 03 2010 03:35 GMT
#698
The degradation of SC2 live report threads is really bad. TL is better than this. Every other post is bashing either a player or fans. Pathetic.
Night gathers, and now my watch begins. It shall not end until my death. I shall take no wife, hold no lands, father no children. I shall wear no crown and win no glory. I shall live and die at my post. I am the sword in the darkness.
QuothTheRaven
Profile Joined December 2008
United States5524 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-11-03 03:48:22
November 03 2010 03:38 GMT
#699
On November 03 2010 10:56 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 03 2010 10:49 desrow wrote:
i just dont get why all these ****** websites do showmatches and wont even release the replays. Have some advertisement said by a referee at the begening of every replay and you willget more exposure than vods with shitty caster. MAYBE if incontrol casted the showmatch it would of been interesting but now..

User was temp banned for this post.

Even though I banned you for posting like a douchebag I will still reply to you in case there are others who don't get it. There are a lot of reasons why not to release replays one of them is player protection; a replay will show you a lot more than a VOD will. The other is because sponsors need VOD numbers and not replay downloads.

This was very true in BW, but in SC2 most casters leave the production observer tool open almost all game long, which makes it trivially easy to copy every little detail off a build order--with or without the replay. Having an in-game clock above the minimap makes it so you can even sync them up game-time without too much effort.

Moreover, you can also see a player's hotkeys along the bottom of the screen whenever a caster has their forces selected, so a VOD won't even hide that. And if the caster happened to not have the production tab open for some odd reason, you can still check their match history for the exact BO and timings.


Wanting your VODs to get hits for sponsors, though, is still a perfectly legitimate reason to hold on to the replays.
. . . nevermore
Mastermind
Profile Blog Joined April 2008
Canada7096 Posts
November 03 2010 03:49 GMT
#700
Just finished watching the series. Great play by Idra. I really hope Nony can continue with the success and put on an impressive performance at MLG. He showed he has the skills to take the whole tournament.
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