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On November 01 2010 06:01 ffdestiny wrote:
And team of tier1 units takes down all of Lz's tier 3 units; doesn't matter how many he kills, what he does, or even what he makes. Gotta suck to lose to a macro mechanic and not actual skill.
you say this and not realize that zerglings can only reach their full potential at t3, so obviously they should be viable against lz's marauders + thors (which are somewhat countered by lings)
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On November 01 2010 06:01 ffdestiny wrote:
And team of tier1 units takes down all of Lz's tier 3 units; doesn't matter how many he kills, what he does, or even what he makes. Gotta suck to lose to a macro mechanic and not actual skill.
LZ made nothing but marauders and Thors, both of which are hardcountered by mass lings.
What the fuck did you expect to happen? Don't cry imba when he does bullshit like that.
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On November 01 2010 06:03 MrCon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 05:59 I_Love_Bacon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ As opposed to.... making marines and the zerg switches to more banelings instead? I'm not complaining about balance, but I haven't seen any terran pull off a viable late game strat against zerg if they have the eco to just throw ling/muta/bling into a terran army yet. If you make marine you can replenish your army as fast as the zerg player, with 10 reactored raxes. Then is the zerg you wasted his gaz and larvas to kill your mineral only army. Then you spend your gas as you like to counter what the zer gis doing. Here we had the opposite : zerg is doing minerals only units, trading them for gas heave marauders and thors, that sux balls against lings. So zerg can use his gaz to tech to whatever he wants. Seems lz is playing like 1.1.1 and 1.1.2 never happened 
This is so wrong.
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If LZ got the blueflame up early, that midgame push would have been so SO much more tougher.
Edit: All this talk makes me think that this MSI notebook is really freaking awesome. Its too bad I already have a near brand new laptop. Else I would definitely go for it. Intel i-7? Surround sound? Hell yeah.
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As opposed to.... making marines and the zerg switches to more banelings instead? I'm not complaining about balance, but I haven't seen any terran pull off a viable late game strat against zerg if they have the eco to just throw ling/muta/bling into a terran army yet.
Hmmm... get hellions? What do you want with Marauders if there isn't even a Roach Warren? He added igniter hellions extremely late while slush was massing zerglings over the whole game. Igniter Hellions shut down mass ling play pretty hardcore, no matter the upgrades on the lings. Or perhaps add a few Tanks?
Marauders really only are good vs. Roaches and to snipe expansions. Against Ling/Muta it's the last unit you wanna build.
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On November 01 2010 06:00 Tachion wrote:
I'm surprised he didn't make tanks giving the ridic amount of ling/baneling every game :/
same I don't see how thors are effective unless you're pushing on close positions or you are facing lots of mutalisks(which he never was). He army was always way less mobile and wasn't even that powerful. He gave slush so much time each game too.
I still like his mass thor style. At least he has his own style, not many do. Just don't think calling zerg OP is necessary. GG's by both players and I hope the finals is pretty epic. Also hope the Idra games are good.
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On November 01 2010 06:04 HwangjaeTerran wrote:
MSI - Men Speak Inglish?
hahahaha, so true xD
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So... where the fuck were the tanks from LZ?
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On November 01 2010 06:02 Corrupted wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:01 MrCon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:59 Corrupted wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ lol...you say that like it matters what he does. I don't understand. Isn't the game based on the fact that what you are doing matters ? Not when you can trade armies (losing the battle actually), then instantly re-inforce with 70 units.
Remember 70 lings sounds impressive, but its 35 supply worth of units. Lz had multiple factories and rax. Theoretically he could have easily put 35 supply worth of units into production at the same time.
The thing about the last game is that Slush chose the right position to engage the terran army at 200 200. Max armies should go in the terran's favor (if he has been upgrading at the same rate as the zerg army). But Slush engaged lzgamer when he was trying to go up the ramp to the fifth, leaving units definitely out of place.
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On November 01 2010 06:04 ffdestiny wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:03 MrCon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:59 I_Love_Bacon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ As opposed to.... making marines and the zerg switches to more banelings instead? I'm not complaining about balance, but I haven't seen any terran pull off a viable late game strat against zerg if they have the eco to just throw ling/muta/bling into a terran army yet. If you make marine you can replenish your army as fast as the zerg player, with 10 reactored raxes. Then is the zerg you wasted his gaz and larvas to kill your mineral only army. Then you spend your gas as you like to counter what the zer gis doing. Here we had the opposite : zerg is doing minerals only units, trading them for gas heave marauders and thors, that sux balls against lings. So zerg can use his gaz to tech to whatever he wants. Seems lz is playing like 1.1.1 and 1.1.2 never happened This is so wrong.
Ok, think what you want, and don't explain if you want.
Just watch GSL, you won't see WINNING terran masses stupid thors and marauders against zerg.
Some make thors, but they mass marines with that and add tanks.
Making marauders against zerg (except making 4 or 5 to tank banes) is retarded. Massing marauders is worse.
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slush is almost always going mutas first even though he should know that lz loves thors :S
same with machine vs. huk.. mutas all the way even though it made no sense..
seems like all the easy wins with muta/bling/ling have really limited their playstyles >.>
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I only caught the end of that game but why the hell did I see marauders on the field? No wonder Idra disses Lz so hard.
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On November 01 2010 06:01 MrCon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 05:59 Corrupted wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ lol...you say that like it matters what he does. I don't understand. Isn't the game based on the fact that what you are doing matters ?
I'm pretty sure you understand what he says. He implies that marines wouldn't be viable as slush would just go banelings.
But lz really could've gone blue flame hellions, and even try tanks or maybe heavy air play.
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wow there's actually 10.5k viewers ? I hadn't seen that lol, pretty nice !
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On November 01 2010 06:08 wrgrbl wrote:
I only caught the end of that game but why the hell did I see marauders on the field? No wonder Idra disses Lz so hard.
Marauders AND thors, such incredible unit synergy against non armored units right there
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On November 01 2010 06:05 Skuller wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:02 Corrupted wrote:On November 01 2010 06:01 MrCon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:59 Corrupted wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ lol...you say that like it matters what he does. I don't understand. Isn't the game based on the fact that what you are doing matters ? Not when you can trade armies (losing the battle actually), then instantly re-inforce with 70 units. Remember 70 lings sounds impressive, but its 35 supply worth of units. Lz had multiple factories and rax. Theoretically he could have easily put 35 supply worth of units into production at the same time. The thing about the last game is that Slush chose the right position to engage the terran army at 200 200. Max armies should go in the terran's favor (if he has been upgrading at the same rate as the zerg army). But Slush engaged lzgamer when he was trying to go up the ramp to the fifth, leaving units definitely out of place.
People underestimate (apparently), how expensive and slow it is to mass units out of factories.
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On November 01 2010 06:04 Wayem wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:02 Talin wrote:
HuK has to win this so he can mothership rush IdrA. xD rofl... can't imagine the BM if he manages to win with this :o
IdrA: you're really good at making motherships
HuK: thanks
IdrA: very useful talent to have
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On November 01 2010 06:07 MrCon wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:04 ffdestiny wrote:On November 01 2010 06:03 MrCon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:59 I_Love_Bacon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ As opposed to.... making marines and the zerg switches to more banelings instead? I'm not complaining about balance, but I haven't seen any terran pull off a viable late game strat against zerg if they have the eco to just throw ling/muta/bling into a terran army yet. If you make marine you can replenish your army as fast as the zerg player, with 10 reactored raxes. Then is the zerg you wasted his gaz and larvas to kill your mineral only army. Then you spend your gas as you like to counter what the zer gis doing. Here we had the opposite : zerg is doing minerals only units, trading them for gas heave marauders and thors, that sux balls against lings. So zerg can use his gaz to tech to whatever he wants. Seems lz is playing like 1.1.1 and 1.1.2 never happened This is so wrong. Ok, think what you want, and don't explain if you want. Just watch GSL, you won't see WINNING terran masses stupid thors and marauders against zerg. Some make thors, but they mass marines with that and add tanks. Making marauders against zerg (except making 4 or 5 to tank banes) is retarded. Massing marauders is worse.
Yeah stupid Thors, man, they're just so weak against Z, I totally agree.
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On November 01 2010 06:08 cocosoft wrote:Show nested quote +On November 01 2010 06:01 MrCon wrote:On November 01 2010 05:59 Corrupted wrote:On November 01 2010 05:58 MrCon wrote:
thors and marauders against mass lings, lz is a terran caricature :/ lol...you say that like it matters what he does. I don't understand. Isn't the game based on the fact that what you are doing matters ? I'm pretty sure you understand what he says. He implies that marines wouldn't be viable as slush would just go banelings. But lz really could've gone blue flame hellions, and even try tanks or maybe heavy air play.
But you WANT banelings. Banelings are gas and larva heavy ! Good marine split/micro make marine "good" against banes. (by "good" I mean they will waste a lot of ressources to kill your cheap and quick made marines)
It's the same spirit than SK Terran in SC1. It's like terran in sc1 said "oh, they have lurkers, I can't make marine". The thing is with marines you can outmacro the zerg. And out map control him.
I know it's counter intuitive, that's why so much terrans are strugling against zerg nowadays.
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EPT
