EPT
Not whining about imbalance, I just enjoy watching Zerg games more than Terran or Protoss.
[GSL] Open S1 - Ro32 Day 1 - Page 88
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Sliver
United States402 Posts
Not whining about imbalance, I just enjoy watching Zerg games more than Terran or Protoss. | ||
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sleepingdog
Austria6145 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:32 tackklee wrote: But the first game was just frustrating to watch. Zerg should have clearly won, by the amount of advantage he barely managed to muscle over. Sure he pre-emptively attacked, but his larger army shouldn't have been obliterated in 2 seconds. zerg lost his spire which pretty much destroyed all the timings for more effective muta-harassments; therefore maka could take the gold and get a crazy economy; it doesn't matter if maka made some poor battle-choices because his economy was just "that" much better; at the point where zerg dominated he was merely "regaining" the previously lost ground; afterwards he just sacrificed his army, I mean, that's the obvious disadvantage you have if you play with mass-air vs mass-anti-air....you have to pick your battles carefully don't see why maka shouldn't have deserved winning this one, indeed, game 1 really showed that he is an extraordinary player; in game 2 maka admittedly didn't do anything else that an "average pro-gamer" couldn't do either | ||
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Shikyo
Finland33997 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:37 Qikz wrote: Personally, I'm not sure why the zerg player kept trying to expand there. He knew as soon as there were a decent amount of reapers, he was going to die. Why didn't he try and hold out in his main, rather than trying to chase the reapers away to expand? The 5rax reaper build gets an expansion at around 30 supply and Terran will be 2 bases vs 1 and we all know how that goes | ||
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Hikari
1914 Posts
The same can be said to every single air unit. 1 banshee > 1 queen (and can come faster than a vr), can cloak too! If you are not prepared for AA, you lose. If you are not prepared for cloak (even burrowed roaches), you lose. Void rays are actually a lot weaker than you think. Void rays are very expensive, and teching straight to them is a big risk due to the large investment. Lotze gambled on the habit that idra rarely does any rush/early attack. They do not have range advantage as corruptors and vikings - so using them against BCs/Broodlord is always a risk of them getting shot down. Yamoto 1 shot a voidray, denying the supposedly protoss counter to BCs. I think the problem lies more on zerg's lack of AA besides the queen until t2. Queens do fine but you need several to be effective (power goes up exponentially because of transfuse) - something not a lot of people will blindly do. Hydras and mutas are fine against other air units but a spire takes an eternity to build (and is so soft) while hydras are crippled off creep and dies to any sort of aoe (tanks, colo, storm) (hydras also "need" that range upgrade). | ||
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zimms
Austria561 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:24 Raevin wrote: How much are you helping by calling everyone morons straight out of the gate? People are goddamned upset, i bet even the mods watching these games are disgusted by that Reaper stuff you just saw, whether they play T or not dosent matter, BS is BS Stop with the "dont nerf me bro" posts and contribute to the game and community by actually speaking the truth instead of pushing it under the rug for your own self intrest Something is obviously wrong, and people are upset when they see that and naturally speak out about it. Yes, I agree that I shouldn't have used the word 'morons'. But I think you didn't quite get what i wanted to say with that post (probably my fault). I don't like the reapers either, nor the marauders or any other units/abilities that just feel too strong. I didn't want to say that T is fine and that there is no need for a balance patch. What I tried to say is, that we already have quite some threads concerning that issue. And guess what, I don't even play T in SC2. | ||
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MRMultiBryn
Sweden78 Posts
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Scarecrow
Korea (South)9172 Posts
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Sanguinarius
United States3427 Posts
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Fa1nT
United States3423 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:39 Hikari wrote: @voidrays: The same can be said to every single air unit. 1 banshee > 1 queen (and can come faster than a vr), can cloak too! If you are not prepared for AA, you lose. If you are not prepared for cloak (even burrowed roaches), you lose. Void rays are actually a lot weaker than you think. Void rays are very expensive, and teching straight to them is a big risk due to the large investment. Lotze gambled on the habit that idra rarely does any rush/early attack. They do not have range advantage as corruptors and vikings - so using them against BCs/Broodlord is always a risk of them getting shot down. Yamoto 1 shot a voidray, denying the supposedly protoss counter to BCs. I think the problem lies more on zerg's lack of AA besides the queen until t2. Queens do fine but you need several to be effective (power goes up exponentially because of transfuse) - something not a lot of people will blindly do. Hydras and mutas are fine against other air units but a spire takes an eternity to build (and is so soft) while hydras are crippled off creep and dies to any sort of aoe (tanks, colo, storm) (hydras also "need" that range upgrade). A lot of people want hydra and roach to switch tiers. | ||
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CruelZeratul
Germany4588 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:39 Hikari wrote: @voidrays: The same can be said to every single air unit. 1 banshee > 1 queen (and can come faster than a vr), can cloak too! If you are not prepared for AA, you lose. If you are not prepared for cloak (even burrowed roaches), you lose. Void rays are actually a lot weaker than you think. Void rays are very expensive, and teching straight to them is a big risk due to the large investment. Lotze gambled on the habit that idra rarely does any rush/early attack. They do not have range advantage as corruptors and vikings - so using them against BCs/Broodlord is always a risk of them getting shot down. Yamoto 1 shot a voidray, denying the supposedly protoss counter to BCs. I think the problem lies more on zerg's lack of AA besides the queen until t2. Queens do fine but you need several to be effective (power goes up exponentially because of transfuse) - something not a lot of people will blindly do. Hydras and mutas are fine against other air units but a spire takes an eternity to build (and is so soft) while hydras are crippled off creep and dies to any sort of aoe (tanks, colo, storm) (hydras also "need" that range upgrade). Banshees don't instantly kill buildings and even if they are in your base and the Queen is dead there is a chance to get a new one in time, and if your on two bases there should at least be one still alive. | ||
Somi
Pakistan123 Posts
EU: NO Zerg in Top 10 KR: 2 Zergs in Top 10. [Note: These two zergs have insanely more games relative to people around there ranks] USA: 1 Zerg in Top 20 EU: 2 Zergs in Top 20 KR:5 Zergs in Top 20. Creeps are being killed and the swarm grows weaker :< | ||
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SKtheAnathema
United States885 Posts
also have to give credit to lotze's forcefield and colossus micro in g3. all that intensity and pressure allowed him to overload idra's brain and get in that sneaky expansion. awesome set! wp'd by both. | ||
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Ghad
Norway2551 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:35 Ajsbear wrote: With that being said, looking at this thread and others I wonder: What will it take for "us" to say "Hey that Terran player really deserved to win". Still yet to see the community NOT whine like crazy whenever a Zerg loses to Terran, no matter how the match played out. If the Zerg wins, he wins because he is lucky and/or God, if Terran wins it is because he plays Terran. As a zerg player, I will say that much of zerg play in the tournament has not been that impressive, and most of the defeats have probably been to better players. Doesn't mean that the game and maps are not full of issues. | ||
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pyro19
6575 Posts
As haypro said , The Zerg units are all counter units.One unit is Good against A specific one in the enemy race , but equally weaker against any other.You have to consistently keep changing your build, Plus Hydra and Roach have to switch tiers.Zerg has no Anti air Units in Early game . | ||
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figq
12519 Posts
Bottom line: Strong players knocked out of a tournament (especially Bo3/Bo1-stages) are still strong. Eventually it will matter much more who can get a higher winning rate over time. | ||
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StarStruck
25339 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:45 SKtheAnathema wrote: there really should be no imba whining about idra's g2... he got JUKED hardbody. partially due to spying on lotze's bnet build orders. it's not like he didn't have an overlord in the protoss base, either. lotze SHOWED robo,then built a stargate. that was just amazing. also have to give credit to lotze's forcefield and colossus micro in g3. all that intensity and pressure allowed him to overload idra's brain and get in that sneaky expansion. awesome set! wp'd by both. That's one of the oldest tricks in the book. You shouldn't have high expectations out of IdrA when it comes to tournament play. :/ | ||
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DminusTerran
Canada1337 Posts
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amorpheus
Bulgaria2144 Posts
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Shatter
United States1401 Posts
On September 15 2010 21:37 Qikz wrote: Because the Terran would of had expo up before him. And that is pretty much game for Zerg unless he can do some miracle plays. He was pretty much committed to getting that hatch up asap because he got bunker rushed/delayed earlier. Personally, I'm not sure why the zerg player kept trying to expand there. He knew as soon as there were a decent amount of reapers, he was going to die. Why didn't he try and hold out in his main, rather than trying to chase the reapers away to expand? | ||
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teamsolid
Canada3668 Posts
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