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On September 15 2010 21:40 Scarecrow wrote:
Anyone blaming that third game of idra's on imbalance should get their head checked. His overlord spread was abysmal, one should have been up there to see the hidden expo. 2 geysers extra won the game for the toss.
Certainly, when you get the best positions on one of the best maps for zvp surely it's your own fault.
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I really think hydra's need to be cheaper, maybe 75/50 or 75/25, and moved to tier 1. Roaches should be tier 2 start with range 4 and maybe have a hive upgrade that gives them [(1+ range 1+ armor) might be too good I dunno] or something so they have better late game potential.
Considering the only thing that beat hydras are a LOT of splash (tank/colossus/growth) they don't need to be cheaper.
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On September 15 2010 21:45 SKtheAnathema wrote:
there really should be no imba whining about idra's g2... he got JUKED hardbody. partially due to spying on lotze's bnet build orders. it's not like he didn't have an overlord in the protoss base, either. lotze SHOWED robo,then built a stargate. that was just amazing.
also have to give credit to lotze's forcefield and colossus micro in g3. all that intensity and pressure allowed him to overload idra's brain and get in that sneaky expansion. awesome set! wp'd by both.
Funny enough that T and P wouldnt lose to that because they have tier 1 anti air.
Anyways, IdrA failed in game 3 and deserved to lose. Now Ill put my faith into cool to fight for the swarm.
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Going broodlords was surely a mistake. he could have 3 or 4 ultralisks for nearly the same cost, which would have helped out against those forcefields alot. Also missing the hidden expo was just a big blunder.
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On September 15 2010 22:13 klauz619 wrote:Show nested quote +I really think hydra's need to be cheaper, maybe 75/50 or 75/25, and moved to tier 1. Roaches should be tier 2 start with range 4 and maybe have a hive upgrade that gives them [(1+ range 1+ armor) might be too good I dunno] or something so they have better late game potential. Considering the only thing that beat hydras are a LOT of splash (tank/colossus/growth) they don't need to be cheaper.
2 Marines have more HP and dps than 1 Hydra and cost no gas.
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On September 15 2010 22:15 Philosophy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2010 22:13 klauz619 wrote:I really think hydra's need to be cheaper, maybe 75/50 or 75/25, and moved to tier 1. Roaches should be tier 2 start with range 4 and maybe have a hive upgrade that gives them [(1+ range 1+ armor) might be too good I dunno] or something so they have better late game potential. Considering the only thing that beat hydras are a LOT of splash (tank/colossus/growth) they don't need to be cheaper. 2 Marines have more HP and dps than 1 Hydra and cost no gas.
Yeah but hydras look cooler and shoot spines?
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On September 15 2010 21:40 Scarecrow wrote:
Anyone blaming that third game of idra's on imbalance should get their head checked. His overlord spread was abysmal, one should have been up there to see the hidden expo. 2 geysers extra won the game for the toss.
Yeah it was unfortunate that IdrA was unable to scout that expo, but I do still think there was a bit of imbalance there. I'm not talking like qqnerfeverything imbalance, but just some slight imbalances like forcefield + collosi. In that match, IdrA completely out macro'd the guy. Destroyed his food supply, but guess what. Forcefield negates half your army. He was able to forcefield his way to catch up + sneak the expansion which then ultimately helped him win. To blame the loss specifically on just a hidden expo I don't think is fair to IdrA, because when he was getting that base up, IdrA was still a base ahead of him.. high yield at that. And did I mention IdrA's food/econ/macro crushed his opponents? I mean landslide crushed.
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On September 15 2010 22:15 Philosophy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2010 22:13 klauz619 wrote:I really think hydra's need to be cheaper, maybe 75/50 or 75/25, and moved to tier 1. Roaches should be tier 2 start with range 4 and maybe have a hive upgrade that gives them [(1+ range 1+ armor) might be too good I dunno] or something so they have better late game potential. Considering the only thing that beat hydras are a LOT of splash (tank/colossus/growth) they don't need to be cheaper. 2 Marines have more HP and dps than 1 Hydra and cost no gas.
They also are faster due to stim.. and you can make 2 at a time >_>
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IdrA's weakness again is his lack of scouting. When you know that you're in the lead you HAVE to figure that they opponent is going to try some sort of wonky strategy to get back in, such as trying to double expo / hide expansions / go DTs, or something to get back into the game.
Idra is zerg... how can he not have at least ONE zergling at each expo? O_o
It just seems that he got too cocky when he held of the initial timing attack. Sad to see another Zerg go down (even though I main Terran myself). I'll be rooting for Cool now.
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On September 15 2010 21:40 Scarecrow wrote:
Anyone blaming that third game of idra's on imbalance should get their head checked. His overlord spread was abysmal, one should have been up there to see the hidden expo. 2 geysers extra won the game for the toss.
Imbalance wasn't the only issue at play in the third game, however having lost about 3 or more overlords in the first encounter due to having his overlords spread out might have had something to do with his overlords no longer spreading out as much. That being said, lings all over the map would have helped immensely.
The game was already lost from the first encounter though. Losing a lot of overlords early, losing your 2 geysers, losing mining time and not having done any significant damage against the Protoss opponent meant he was way way behind. The gold expo was probably a risky gamble that he IdrA decided he had to take to even stand a chance of catching up. The protoss player played very well. Had he just walked in sniped 3 overlords and ran away it would have been a small but important victory. That he also harrassed the mineral line as well as take out the geysers made it even worse.
I really think IdrA needs to adapt his playstyle a little to be a bit more aggressive. Nibble at the enemy here and there to try and whittle his army down whenever possible. This is of course easier said than done, Zerg don't have any decent "harrass and retreat" units other than the Mutas which are pretty fragile for 100/100 cost.
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Too bad zerg don't have scanner sweep. Could of seen that void rush coming a minute ahead.
Owell.
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On September 15 2010 21:24 Raevin wrote:Show nested quote +Man, i so wish some mods would go on a banning spree.
It's so disgusting that every thread here becomes a flame/whine thread where every moron states the same things over and over again. I mean come on guys, this is a LR thread, yet one has to search through pages and pages of imba talk to find some posts actually describing the games...
And I'm sure this won't stop unless the mods do some terrible, terrible banning.
People have to realize that this is not the right place for "balance discussion". How much are you helping by calling everyone morons straight out of the gate? People are goddamned upset, i bet even the mods watching these games are disgusted by that Reaper stuff you just saw, whether they play T or not dosent matter, BS is BS Stop with the "dont nerf me bro" posts and contribute to the game and community by actually speaking the truth instead of pushing it under the rug for your own self intrest Something is obviously wrong, and people are upset when they see that and naturally speak out about it.
This is not what live report threads are here for! I myself work whenever the games go live so there is no way for me to see them. I dont care about balance suggestions / discussion in a LR thread!! Raevin is absolutely right. Speaking the truth my ass lol
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Idra </3 Sooo sad 
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2 Marines have more HP and dps than 1 Hydra and cost no gas.
Hydras fire further and only take 1 space.
Hydras aren't affected as much by armor (force field + base armor = 50% reduction in marine dps).
Hydras don't lose half their dps if you do 45 damage to them(unlike 2 marines).
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On September 15 2010 22:34 klauz619 wrote:Hydras fire further and only take 1 space. Hydras aren't affected as much by armor (force field + base armor = 50% reduction in marine dps). Hydras don't lose half their dps if you do 45 damage to them(unlike 2 marines).
Hydras fire further with an upgrade.
Hydras don't have an upgrade to increase their dps for 10 hp, which can be compensated for with another upgrade. (Which you can get BOTH of said upgrades for only 50/50 more)
And if the really dumb and nonsensical conversion of 1 gas = 2 minerals, then it'll be 4 marines to a hydra. Who wins that fight every time?
I'm so mad I slept through my alarm this morning. Who knew IdrA would lose?
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sigh so sad so sad... oh wells, gl in the future idra
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Lol at all the Zerg dreams being shattered. IdrA didn't lose because of imbalance, Lotze just played very good and did whatever necessary to claw his way back into game 3 (and he wasn't THAT far behind). IdrA failed to scout for hidden expansions when he was ahead and paid the price. Overall very well played by both players. Too bad IdrA lost game 2 because he semi blind-countered a build he was expecting Lotze to do.
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I really liked most of todays matches, especially the games by IdrA.
It was exactly what you could read in any forums about idra before, hes brickheaded ,unflexible and vulnerable to mindgames or risky all-ins (and unable to win other than 2:0)
(and pls put all these balance discussion to the straategy forum there are allready like 200 flametreads so pls not in the tourney section too)
All in all a bunch of nice matches.
Lets just hope TLO is fine for his game.
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EPT
