I feel like the PvT: 1 Gate FE Into 5 Gate All-In is useless even if I do the build perfectly because 80% or more of the terrans I play do some kind of mine medivac play that hard counters the build...

They don't even need to know it's coming because the vast majority of them do something that hard counters it anyway.

Also, when do terrans ever not go gas first? It's very rare

SatedSC2

England3012 Posts

December 30 2014 21:56 GMT

#66

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Teoita

Italy12246 Posts

December 30 2014 23:04 GMT

#67

Reading mine openings is pretty easy if you scout correctly imo, so you can just not 5gate if you find out you need a robo. The hilarious thing about that build is that if you show them a bunch of stalkers moving out and they scan the gates they start shitting themselves thinking it's blink, get high ground bunkers, move their bio up the ramp...then you just take over their nat with forcefields and win. In fact, that's how Stork beat Flash in Proleague once.

SatedSC2

England3012 Posts

December 31 2014 11:53 GMT

#68

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Heartland

Sweden24602 Posts

December 31 2014 12:14 GMT

#69

Aren't scouted mine openings just free wins if you evac your nat just before they come in, and then have an obs + 3-gates and chronoed stalkers before the gates? Just counter and win after you deflect the attack.

SatedSC2

England3012 Posts

December 31 2014 12:16 GMT

#70

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Heartland

Sweden24602 Posts

December 31 2014 12:40 GMT

#71

On December 31 2014 21:16 SatedSC2 wrote:

Show nested quote +

Not really. If it were that easy to beat Widow Mine openings then I doubt anyone would ever use them.

I meant specifically the hellion, mine, marine medivac drop. You're right in general of course.

SatedSC2

England3012 Posts

December 31 2014 13:10 GMT

#72

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NeThZOR

South Africa7387 Posts

December 31 2014 13:15 GMT

#73

Thanks, now I have some things to try that I haven't thought of.

Icekin

88 Posts

December 31 2014 16:54 GMT

#74

I don't understand double gas openings in PvT
They just get scouted 100% and when terrans see double gas they think about proxy oracle or dt -> they build asap ebay with turrets. In the #prayng to inca build there is even a delayed nexus, it's like telling terrans you are going for tech harass.

Is'nt just a waste of time tryng dt's if you know you get scouted and countered?

Teoita

Italy12246 Posts

December 31 2014 18:37 GMT

#75

Double gas isn't that big of a tell, you can do absolutely anything off of it.

robopork

United States511 Posts

December 31 2014 19:02 GMT

#76

On December 27 2014 10:36 bri9and wrote:
What I want for Christmas is for Protoss to be removed from the game!

Funny, I feel the same way about Terran! But then I just think, "Who's tears would I drink?" and I build more dt's and pray his multitasking will stink.

DuckloadBlackra

225 Posts

January 01 2015 02:50 GMT

#77

On December 31 2014 06:56 SatedSC2 wrote:

Show nested quote +

Well, I do point out in the guide that it doesn't work well if the Terran goes for Widow Mines. However, my ladder experience must be different to yours because I wouldn't say that most Terrans open with Widow Mine pressure. In any case, I used the build earlier today to beat a GM NA Terran so it definitely works.

That's why I said it seems useless, almost every terran opens widow mine. I just gave the build another try for 6 games today and 5 out of 6 games the terran went for widow mine. Lost every one of those.

DnCL

86 Posts

January 01 2015 14:16 GMT

#78

Well that was fun to imagine the games

TelecoM

United States10708 Posts

January 01 2015 21:36 GMT

#79

Thanks for writing this guide, now I can get a lot of free wins on ladder vs Protoss's that think all in is good.

EDIT : What league are you Sated and what league are these builds meant for?