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[G] Protoss: Stupid Shit That Works On Ladder - Page 6

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Prev 1 4 5 6 All
Xenomorph
Profile Joined May 2010
United States137 Posts
January 26 2015 00:41 GMT
#101
I agree that the 4-2-2 is good for practising macro because it gives you three well-defined targets to hit and forces you to micro whilst trying to hit them. It will quickly become apparent to lower-level players where their weaknesses lie whilst playing that build, and it's actually the build I use to warm-up against AI whenever I play!


I agree completely. I'm starting to use this in my PvZ games and I'm finding that its works very well in allowing harass with a strong macro build behind it. The prism use also has piqued my interests, and it gave me the realization to return to the unit and use it more often.
Intrepid Traveler
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
January 27 2015 09:46 GMT
#102
--- Nuked ---
AkashSky
Profile Joined May 2014
United States257 Posts
February 04 2015 22:42 GMT
#103
Hey Sated, what is your opinion on delaying the second gas in the 4-2-2 in favor of getting gateways 2 and 3 up faster? I find that if i do it this way, I am able to squeeze out an extra zealot or 2 from the gateway before warp gate finishes.

The end result is pushing with 4 zealots and 2 sentrys while leaving 1 back to fill the wall. Zealots have higher DPS than sentry so its easier to kill zerglings and third bases. 2 Sentries is also enough to trap a queen or 2. I also warp in sentrys while the agression is going on because i tend to float some gas while getting up a robo with cost only 100 gas.

One difficulty I've encountered is against zergs who defend with mass zergling. If I see no roaches i am not comfortable throwing down the second robo because it might be a mutalisk transition. I try to remedy this buy just going for robo bay and pushing again with more zealots and if still no roaches I'll scout with a hallucination and put down stargates if muta. But, I feel behind in my push because the robos are delayed if he ends up making roaches after all.

vhapter
Profile Joined May 2010
Brazil677 Posts
February 05 2015 00:40 GMT
#104
Hey man, I was wondering a couple of things about this Tinman build. Don't you think it's possible to devise a more reliable and economical version of it? I don't know, something along the lines of a 3 stalker rush with a msc, but chronoing wg instead of stalkers 2 and 3?
To live is to fight, to fight is to live!
AkashSky
Profile Joined May 2014
United States257 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-02-05 03:48:05
February 05 2015 03:46 GMT
#105
On February 05 2015 09:40 vhapter wrote:
Hey man, I was wondering a couple of things about this Tinman build. Don't you think it's possible to devise a more reliable and economical version of it? I don't know, something along the lines of a 3 stalker rush with a msc, but chronoing wg instead of stalkers 2 and 3?


I actually tried to do something like this. However, I found it IMPOSSIBLE to get the gas to rush for 3 stalkers and MSC at the same time to get to your opponent in a timely fashion. Essentially, if you don't go for warp gate you are giving defenders advantage to your opponent.

The premise of the build i was trying to do was to rush out 2 stalkers and move out with the 2 stalkers and then warp in 2 more to have 4 total, But I wasn't able to do it.

I did have a version of the tinman where I went for 2 gate warp gate, and a quicker expand, but I found that to be very weak to tech base all in plays. It works wonders against passive robo openings though. [Going against blink was pretty much auto lose if the opponent knew how to micro in the slightest].
vhapter
Profile Joined May 2010
Brazil677 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-02-05 04:12:34
February 05 2015 04:11 GMT
#106
On February 05 2015 12:46 AkashSky wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 05 2015 09:40 vhapter wrote:
Hey man, I was wondering a couple of things about this Tinman build. Don't you think it's possible to devise a more reliable and economical version of it? I don't know, something along the lines of a 3 stalker rush with a msc, but chronoing wg instead of stalkers 2 and 3?


I actually tried to do something like this. However, I found it IMPOSSIBLE to get the gas to rush for 3 stalkers and MSC at the same time to get to your opponent in a timely fashion. Essentially, if you don't go for warp gate you are giving defenders advantage to your opponent.

The premise of the build i was trying to do was to rush out 2 stalkers and move out with the 2 stalkers and then warp in 2 more to have 4 total, But I wasn't able to do it.

I did have a version of the tinman where I went for 2 gate warp gate, and a quicker expand, but I found that to be very weak to tech base all in plays. It works wonders against passive robo openings though. [Going against blink was pretty much auto lose if the opponent knew how to micro in the slightest].
I don't think wg done at 5:45 + 3 stalker and a msc is bad (3 gate timing with robo behind it). Your stalkers come out at about 5:10 if you don't chrono them. Actually, I think Duckdeok did this build all the time, but I think his wg finished at 6:00. But if you don't chrono your msc or stalkers, wg finished earlier than that. No gas problems whatsoever here. You're probably not managing your gas properly.
To live is to fight, to fight is to live!
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
February 05 2015 09:59 GMT
#107
--- Nuked ---
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-02-05 12:50:42
February 05 2015 12:49 GMT
#108
--- Nuked ---
iMrising
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States1099 Posts
February 05 2015 18:25 GMT
#109
Is the gate-gate-gate opening still viable in the current map pool? Specifically Overgrowth, Vaani Research Station, and (especially) Secret Springs since all of their walloffs are small, and their rush distances are relatively short. (not vaani though)
$O$ | soO
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
February 05 2015 21:07 GMT
#110
--- Nuked ---
iMrising
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
United States1099 Posts
February 07 2015 19:50 GMT
#111
You also gave responses upon scouting spire, but how would you know that the zerg is making mutas, and not corruptors? Do you estimate how much gas they have based on their army composition?
$O$ | soO
SatedSC2
Profile Blog Joined March 2014
England3012 Posts
Last Edited: 2015-02-07 20:32:38
February 07 2015 20:28 GMT
#112
--- Nuked ---
WOLFGEIST
Profile Joined April 2015
4 Posts
April 25 2015 20:49 GMT
#113
Bump.

Practicing the 4-2-2 lately. Love the concept of the build (early pressure to dictate the pace, feints, timings). I love builds like this, that are so perfectly crafted where each step has a specific purpose. I was curious, Sated, do you have any updates on the build, more replays, etc? I've watched all the ones you posted multiple times.
AkashSky
Profile Joined May 2014
United States257 Posts
April 26 2015 03:01 GMT
#114
On April 26 2015 05:49 WOLFGEIST wrote:
Bump.

Practicing the 4-2-2 lately. Love the concept of the build (early pressure to dictate the pace, feints, timings). I love builds like this, that are so perfectly crafted where each step has a specific purpose. I was curious, Sated, do you have any updates on the build, more replays, etc? I've watched all the ones you posted multiple times.



Well, im not sated, but I've been doing the 4-2-2 for quite some time now on ladder. I have found that a more efficient version of it, (at least on 2 player maps) is to open like this.
9pylon (near main nexus)
13 gateway, positioned in some manner to create a 1 hex slit for your zealot in case of early pool.
15 pylon at natural to make a wall=> scout with this probe.
If you see a hatchery first, or no zerglings being made, go straight into natural nexus before making a zealot. Then, take double gas and then go cyber core then another pylon before starting the zealot.

After that, you essentially converge into the 4-2-2 with a later warp gate timing, but significantly larger economy which allows for a stronger gateway attack along with a faster immortal and collosus timing.

On 4 player maps i just do the regular 4-2-2.
WOLFGEIST
Profile Joined April 2015
4 Posts
April 26 2015 13:21 GMT
#115
Ah, nice. Thanks for the input.
Nuloh1
Profile Joined July 2015
1 Post
July 25 2015 00:33 GMT
#116
What's with drop.sc? I'd love to see these replays but drop.sc is always down.
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