EPTIt was really great build, and I used it even in the beginig of HotS. You have to make some adjustments to afford early Mothership core, and Stalker instead of second Zealot, becouse of Reaper, so your first attack hits little bit later...
The HotS Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 304
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w3c.TruE
Czech Republic1055 Posts
It was really great build, and I used it even in the beginig of HotS. You have to make some adjustments to afford early Mothership core, and Stalker instead of second Zealot, becouse of Reaper, so your first attack hits little bit later... | ||
Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
Feels very much like something MC would've done in WoL. That's because he invented that build in WoL and won a GSL with it  Does anyone have any VODs or replays of people going for 4 Gate pressure in PvT?] I think Stork killed Flash with it once. I think these days if you're going to pressure in PvT you might as well do some kind of light blink timing, which is way more deceiving than just making gates without tech. If you want to go with heavier pressure than what parting does, either copy some of the variants in the Parting article i wrote (there's a committed 3gate timing in there) or look at Zest's IEM replays, he went 4gate blink a bunch of times. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Xinzoe
Korea (South)2373 Posts
On October 30 2014 21:50 SatedSC2 wrote: It's actually ridiculously successful considering how boneheaded and basic it is. It shocks me sometimes how many Bunkers you can get through at ~8:00 with only Gateway units and good Forcefields. Anyway... I guess for the Stork build that you mean this: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/444810-gg-wp-1-stork-vs-flash Not sure if that's strong if your opponent can scout (which they can on most current maps because they're stupidly good for Reapers) but I can try it out. haha that game was disappointing. Flashs reaper control was horrible in that game. He also didnt build a bunker since he expected some tech opening from stork with 2 gas. But like u said the maps are good for reapers which means good for blink also. Highly recommend some blink play like others mentioned. Im currently averaging close to 70% pvt this season using exclusively partings build. Its one of those builds that seam unbeatable and uncounterable by terran with good execution. | ||
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DinoMight
United States3725 Posts
On October 31 2014 01:06 Xinzoe wrote: But like u said the maps are good for reapers which means good for blink also. Actually, the maps are good for Reapers but TERRIBLE for Blink. It's kind of amazing how Blizzard managed to do that actually. The Stalkers can blink in, but once they blink out, they have such a long path to take to the other place they want to be that the Terran army has ample time to get back in position. | ||
ZeromuS
Canada13389 Posts
On October 31 2014 02:29 DinoMight wrote: Actually, the maps are good for Reapers but TERRIBLE for Blink. It's kind of amazing how Blizzard managed to do that actually. The Stalkers can blink in, but once they blink out, they have such a long path to take to the other place they want to be that the Terran army has ample time to get back in position. That was a very deliberate choice a lot of mapmakers made, and also one that we were really careful to keep in mind when looking at the TLMC maps. We were looking for maps that would be blink all in unfriendly and encourage Terran drops. Then with the Terran buffs alongside the map changes, Terran is really doing well. I'm glad Terrans aren't effectively extinct right now. | ||
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[PkF] Wire
France24204 Posts
On November 03 2014 02:28 ZeromuS wrote: That was a very deliberate choice a lot of mapmakers made, and also one that we were really careful to keep in mind when looking at the TLMC maps. We were looking for maps that would be blink all in unfriendly and encourage Terran drops. Then with the Terran buffs alongside the map changes, Terran is really doing well. I'm glad Terrans aren't effectively extinct right now. I'm glad too but map changes + buffs were definitely too much. The buffs to T and nerfs to P were MUCH needed, but maps like Nimbus or Catallena should just not exist. | ||
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ZeromuS
Canada13389 Posts
On November 03 2014 03:03 [PkF] Wire wrote: I'm glad too but map changes + buffs were definitely too much. The buffs to T and nerfs to P were MUCH needed, but maps like Nimbus or Catallena should just not exist. Nimbus is good for phoenix collossus play though. The Chinese Protoss do it a lot to make up for map difficulty. | ||
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vhapter
Brazil677 Posts
On November 03 2014 03:03 [PkF] Wire wrote: I'm glad too but map changes + buffs were definitely too much. The buffs to T and nerfs to P were MUCH needed, but maps like Nimbus or Catallena should just not exist. Nimbus is a pretty interesting map. I don't particularly like it, but it's definitely playable. Catallena... I don't like it, but I get feeling most of the players who complain about it are those who refuse to make a few observers and spread pylons around the map for map vision. I was baffled to see Stardust play against MMA on Catallena yesterday - he had very poor map vision and kept on making his forge behind his mineral line. That's a terrible location for important tech structures, no wonder it got sniped multiple times. If you play a standard colossus style like him with poor tech structure placement, and keep all your units together without map vision to spot drops at all, I think you're in for some trouble. | ||
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vhapter
Brazil677 Posts
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AkashSky
United States257 Posts
Whats the gas timing so you have exactly 100 as cyber core finishes to start MSC? | ||
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playa
United States1284 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
On November 04 2014 15:31 AkashSky wrote: What's the most economic version of the 1gate Fast expand? Whats the gas timing so you have exactly 100 as cyber core finishes to start MSC? The most economic would probably be some gassless build, but i guess that really doesnt count. A standard one gas msc expand (basically just go 13 gate, 14 gas etc etc, and make your nexus before your second pylon/second gas/msc/stalker/warpgate) is probably what you are looking for. You can generally get the nexus before the msc safely (except in pvp of course). On November 04 2014 15:43 playa wrote: Given that one can't comment on the true nature of the swarm host, I'm thinking about learning all-ins... Is there any kind of consensus on what the most effective all-in(s) is? I personally like all-ins that have a void ray or two, but I never see any of those. I think the two strongest all-ins are the santrain (basically do the san 4gate and follow up with an immortal allin, it's in the book of bullshit), as well as the 3base 7-8gate that was extremely common in proleague this season. Just do a standard 3gate forge opening, take your third like you're going 3base blink, but do not add a twilight council or robo, and instead push with 7-8gates and +1 weapons. Void ray all-ins aren't very common because, well, there isn't much else you can do after straight up rushing a void ray, so eh. I suppose you could try some oldschool 7gate void ray stuff. The only thing that currently would be similar to that is doing an oracle/void ray opener, then going into 3base blink and committing to the attack. And yeah, refrain from balance whining. It's seriously pointless -.- | ||
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TokO
Norway577 Posts
On November 04 2014 15:43 playa wrote: Given that one can't comment on the true nature of the swarm host, I'm thinking about learning all-ins... Is there any kind of consensus on what the most effective all-in(s) is? I personally like all-ins that have a void ray or two, but I never see any of those. Not exactly an all-in, but you could always pull out the Alicia modification of the VR 4gate build. Where you get like 4 of them with +1 air weapons. The initial push is exactly the same with 1-2 rallied VR and zealots, and then you come back like a minute later with 4 Void Rays and MsC to snipe the main and tech with possibility of recall. I'm not sure if it would work on your level, but I think it's a nice build. | ||
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playa
United States1284 Posts
On November 04 2014 17:22 TokO wrote: Not exactly an all-in, but you could always pull out the Alicia modification of the VR 4gate build. Where you get like 4 of them with +1 air weapons. The initial push is exactly the same with 1-2 rallied VR and zealots, and then you come back like a minute later with 4 Void Rays and MsC to snipe the main and tech with possibility of recall. I'm not sure if it would work on your level, but I think it's a nice build. That sounds funky. I forgot about Alicia. I'm open to anything that doesn't involve swarm hosts. Good work. Thanks. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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playa
United States1284 Posts
On November 04 2014 17:38 SatedSC2 wrote: First of all, it's hard to all-in on big maps so veto those if you're looking to all-in most efficiently. Here are some of my favourite PvZ all-ins: Immortal/Sentry (Overgrowth): http://ggtracker.com/matches/5514577 Arium's Blink Stalker All-In: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/464575-ariums-8-gate-blink-stalker-pvz Sangate -> Immortal/Sentry: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/439454-sc2-notes-the-sangate-pvz 222: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/sc2-strategy/416819-the-2-2-2-strategy-spotlight I also like proxy Dark Templar rushes on certain maps. I wrote a bit about that in the PvZ scouting thread: EDIT: A note on Arium's Blink Stalker all-in. Under no circumstances do you need 8 Gateways. I don't even think you need 7 if your chronoboosts and warp-ins are on time, but it can be hard to keep up properly whilst microing Blink Stalkers. It's a really good all-in though and I've had a lot of success with it. Thanks. I agree about big maps. As the biggest DT fan out there, I've given up on opening with DT's in P vs Z. I've seen some doing the proxy DT's. I've been completely turned off by DT's in that matchup. I've been looking for something that is kind of inherently strong, in the sense that even if they know you will do it, it's still tough to stop. I like to watch Arium play and he is so imbalanced with that blink build. Unfortunately, I rarely/never open with blink in P vs P or any matchup, so I'd probably lose with that at every level. It's crazy how much their cost effectiveness varies with skill. It would probably take forever to execute anywhere near the same level. I've tried immortal sentry a few times. But, when parting stops doing it, you know it's time to stop doing it The immortal, zealot seemed interesting, though. Haven't tried yet. I think I tried the 222 and it was a nightmare, lol. I think my timing was off... | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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Teoita
Italy12246 Posts
Kinda makes me want to try going Sangate -> Dark Templar... Funny how you mention it, i call that the tasteless build 2.0 and it's actually a thing. I usually follow it up with a blink all-in for maximum gayness. | ||
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SatedSC2
England3012 Posts
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