• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 17:15
CEST 23:15
KST 06:15
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun13[ASL21] Ro8 Preview Pt1: Inheritors16[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt2: All Star10Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists22[ASL21] Ro16 Preview Pt1: Fresh Flow9
Community News
RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event8Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results02026 GSL Season 1 Qualifiers25Maestros of the Game 2 announced92026 GSL Tour plans announced15
StarCraft 2
General
Code S Season 1 - RO12 Group A: Rogue, Percival, Solar, Zoun Code S Season 1 (2026) - RO12 Results Team Liquid Map Contest #22 - The Finalists Blizzard Classic Cup @ BlizzCon 2026 - $100k prize pool MaNa leaves Team Liquid
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 5 - Qualifiers and Main Event GSL Code S Season 1 (2026) SC2 INu's Battles#15 <BO.9 2Matches> WardiTV Spring Cup SEL Masters #6 - Solar vs Classic (SC: Evo)
Strategy
Custom Maps
[D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3 [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 523 Firewall Mutation # 522 Flip My Base Mutation # 521 Memorable Boss
Brood War
General
Why there arent any 256x256 pro maps? ASL21 General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion Pros React To: Leta vs Tulbo (ASL S21, Ro.8)
Tourneys
[ASL21] Ro8 Day 2 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2 [BSL22] RO16 Group Stage - 02 - 10 May
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers What's the deal with APM & what's its true value Any training maps people recommend?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Daigo vs Menard Best of 10 Dawn of War IV Diablo IV
Dota 2
The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
G2 just beat GenG in First stand
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas TL Mafia Community Thread Five o'clock TL Mafia
Community
General
European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread 3D technology/software discussion Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion!
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Formula 1 Discussion
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
streaming software Strange computer issues (software) [G] How to Block Livestream Ads
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Sexual Health Of Gamers
TrAiDoS
lurker extra damage testi…
StaticNine
Broowar part 2
qwaykee
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1254 users

The HotS Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 220

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 218 219 220 221 222 367 Next
Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. Do not just ask for build orders.
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
January 08 2014 13:57 GMT
#4381
On January 08 2014 20:02 Teoita wrote:
Btw sc2john, you kinda need storm anyway against anything when there's over 6 medivacs on the field. Archons just don't cut it then imo.


Oh, of course. Storm should never be neglected.
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Extenz
Profile Joined October 2011
Italy822 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-01-09 03:07:01
January 09 2014 02:07 GMT
#4382
how do I defend 11/11 from terran? msc is just not in time ffs

also I suck in pvt, im high masters, pvt is seriously preventing me from taking gm this season, it's ridiculous
Olli
Profile Blog Joined February 2012
Austria24422 Posts
January 09 2014 10:45 GMT
#4383
The key to it is to scout it in time, make a zealot from your gateway and spend chronoboost on stalkers and an early mothership core in time and then microing your heart out with your units and probes, delaying for as long as possible until you have photon overcharge ready. If you can get there without sustaining heavy probe losses you're most likely going to win.
Administrator"Declaring anything a disaster because aLive popped up out of nowhere is just downright silly."
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
January 09 2014 10:59 GMT
#4384
Back in WoL when it was far more popular i had lots of success just walling off my ramp. If he comes for you super quickly it might be tough unless you get your second pylon at your ramp, but other than that it's always worked great for me.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Whitewing
Profile Joined October 2010
United States7483 Posts
January 09 2014 11:50 GMT
#4385
On January 09 2014 11:07 Extenz wrote:
how do I defend 11/11 from terran? msc is just not in time ffs

also I suck in pvt, im high masters, pvt is seriously preventing me from taking gm this season, it's ridiculous


Whether you skip your first zealot or not is a big deal against this. If you skip your zealot without scouting it, you're probably dead. You need to pull probes when the marines try to come up the ramp and force them back, and make sure they can't get a bunker up. You're just trying to buy time until you get a stalker or two out: don't lose the units but if they try to fight you, mineral walk the probes past and surround on the ramp. Losing a few probes is fine. The zealot is just to buy time for the stalkers really. The trick is just to delay with some probes, try to avoid losing them with good micro if you can, don't let a bunker go up, and chronoboost those stalkers.
Strategy"You know I fucking hate the way you play, right?" ~SC2John
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
January 09 2014 15:15 GMT
#4386
On January 09 2014 20:50 Whitewing wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 09 2014 11:07 Extenz wrote:
how do I defend 11/11 from terran? msc is just not in time ffs

also I suck in pvt, im high masters, pvt is seriously preventing me from taking gm this season, it's ridiculous


Whether you skip your first zealot or not is a big deal against this. If you skip your zealot without scouting it, you're probably dead. You need to pull probes when the marines try to come up the ramp and force them back, and make sure they can't get a bunker up. You're just trying to buy time until you get a stalker or two out: don't lose the units but if they try to fight you, mineral walk the probes past and surround on the ramp. Losing a few probes is fine. The zealot is just to buy time for the stalkers really. The trick is just to delay with some probes, try to avoid losing them with good micro if you can, don't let a bunker go up, and chronoboost those stalkers.


Classic vs. Fantasy on Newkirk Precinct:

StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
Mantaza
Profile Joined January 2011
Germany87 Posts
January 10 2014 01:16 GMT
#4387
how do i counter muta switches... just lost a game because of that shit... i killd his army and fup remax on mutas and i die even tho i had 3 stargates-.-
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
January 10 2014 01:38 GMT
#4388
On January 10 2014 10:16 Mantaza wrote:
how do i counter muta switches... just lost a game because of that shit... i killd his army and fup remax on mutas and i die even tho i had 3 stargates-.-


To be honest, you really just have to be really on top of your scouting and reads in order to deal with the mass muta switch.

On December 21 2013 09:33 SC2John wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 21 2013 08:09 Teoita wrote:
On December 21 2013 06:48 DinoMight wrote:
On December 21 2013 05:17 Teoita wrote:
Ok, assume you do a 9/10 minute push and trade efficiently or even fairly well. You back off, tech up to your aoe...and he still has all the time in the world to go muta against which you don't have a stargate.

If you are going to go robo you can't just push once, you need to attack almost CONSTANTLY if you want to catch mutas (or accept that youwill end up in a base trade). A good example of this is nony's builds when he does go 3base robo, but then tries to hit a super fast 3base timing with blink/immortal. When he plays more passive his only response to muta is to baserace, which i personally HATE as a situation in general. Up to each player of course. Nony's level of play might not be the highest anymore, but i feel like it's a good enough example for this situation.


Oh yeah. I try to play almost like TvZ where it's nonstop attacking and prevent the Z from teching. I'll attack, do some damage, recall out as soon as my positioning is compromised, then gather up some more units and go again. Warp Prism harass, etc.

He can still go Muta, but what this style does is you will see the Muta trickle out, rather than allowing him to just make 40 at once. IMO surprise Muta = instant death in most cases. But if you see him going Muta you have enough time to respond.



Yeah that's fine, i play similarly sometimes. I found that if he gets up a significant number of hydras or a few swarm hosts your pushes stop being effective because you just need tech to deal with that.


One thing I've noticed is that zerg will generally ALWAYS do the muta switch off the back of either 1) roach/hydra where they can snipe your phoenixes or 2) after trading a big ultra-based ground army. Of course, it's always possible for it to happen at random times, but the most obvious times are still when the zerg player has forced you to invest too much into robo tech.

StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
CrazyPieGuy
Profile Joined March 2012
United States41 Posts
January 10 2014 02:06 GMT
#4389
If the zerg has a massive bank, you can't have a big engagement unless you completely decimate his army and lose basically nothing. You have to slowly pick things off and force him to make the switch at a speed you can keep up with.
Yes
insitelol
Profile Joined August 2012
845 Posts
January 10 2014 09:01 GMT
#4390
Every now and then an infamous "omg mass muta" question is asked in this thread =) I used to be one of these people. So i want to share my wisdom with all new humble protosses. The answer is very simple: there is no answer.
Less is more.
Gamlet
Profile Joined December 2012
Ukraine336 Posts
January 10 2014 09:28 GMT
#4391
Mass muta so easy for phoenixes with range.
Kiev
EsportsJohn
Profile Blog Joined June 2012
United States4883 Posts
January 10 2014 09:33 GMT
#4392
On January 10 2014 18:28 Gamlet wrote:
Mass muta so easy for phoenixes with range.


And then the 6 ultras walk into your natural....

Wouldn't it be nice if like 4 phoenixes could work together and lift an ultralisk?
StrategyAllyssa Grey <3<3
insitelol
Profile Joined August 2012
845 Posts
January 10 2014 09:47 GMT
#4393
On January 10 2014 18:28 Gamlet wrote:
Mass muta so easy for phoenixes with range.

5 wild corruptors appear.
Less is more.
Extenz
Profile Joined October 2011
Italy822 Posts
January 10 2014 11:21 GMT
#4394
whenever I see mutas in my base I dont give a fuck and take all my army and cannon/archon/core up the third and go for the base trade
insitelol
Profile Joined August 2012
845 Posts
January 10 2014 11:25 GMT
#4395
On January 10 2014 20:21 Extenz wrote:
whenever I see mutas in my base I dont give a fuck and take all my army and cannon/archon/core up the third and go for the base trade

Ye. Pretty much the same here. But i usually lose in the base trade. I'd say i win only if i was far far ahead in the game anywayz.
Less is more.
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
January 10 2014 11:49 GMT
#4396
On January 10 2014 20:21 Extenz wrote:
whenever I see mutas in my base I dont give a fuck and take all my army and cannon/archon/core up the third and go for the base trade


Yeah if you are totally caught off guard that's your best shot. I personally fucking hate playing in that spot.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Extenz
Profile Joined October 2011
Italy822 Posts
January 10 2014 11:58 GMT
#4397
On January 10 2014 20:25 insitelol wrote:
Show nested quote +
On January 10 2014 20:21 Extenz wrote:
whenever I see mutas in my base I dont give a fuck and take all my army and cannon/archon/core up the third and go for the base trade

Ye. Pretty much the same here. But i usually lose in the base trade. I'd say i win only if i was far far ahead in the game anywayz.

sometimes the zerg is retarded and will engage your army cause he thinks he will lose the base trade and then I just win ( I play void templar)
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
January 10 2014 12:11 GMT
#4398
Btw extenz i've been meaning to ask you forever, do you play for any italian clan like bsg, osc etc?
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Harreh
Profile Joined September 2013
90 Posts
January 10 2014 12:42 GMT
#4399
How to defend early ling attacks from a gateway expand? I'm not sure how to know it's coming.. I think that is my main issue. I'm just chillin', sorting out my wall and suddenly lings happen. I guess what I need to see is the zerg's gas and react by getting the wall up asap and assume the worse?
Extenz
Profile Joined October 2011
Italy822 Posts
January 10 2014 12:59 GMT
#4400
On January 10 2014 21:42 Harreh wrote:
How to defend early ling attacks from a gateway expand? I'm not sure how to know it's coming.. I think that is my main issue. I'm just chillin', sorting out my wall and suddenly lings happen. I guess what I need to see is the zerg's gas and react by getting the wall up asap and assume the worse?

if you scout early speedling just take a 3 gate stargate expand walling, I've seen patience do it succesfully on his stream, then you can pressure with zealot sentry and eventually recall back.
Prev 1 218 219 220 221 222 367 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
BSL
19:00
RO16 Group A
eOnzErG vs OyAjiLIVE!
Doodle vs cavapoo
ZZZero.O212
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
PiGStarcraft258
JuggernautJason114
Ketroc 84
StarCraft: Brood War
ZZZero.O 212
Hyuk 168
Dewaltoss 86
Dota 2
monkeys_forever563
League of Legends
Doublelift2888
JimRising 298
Counter-Strike
fl0m6764
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor253
Other Games
tarik_tv9280
Grubby5441
summit1g3832
FrodaN1186
ArmadaUGS129
elazer88
Hui .85
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick1254
BasetradeTV334
StarCraft 2
angryscii 104
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream78
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 20 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• printf 73
• StrangeGG 70
• Hupsaiya 49
• musti20045 11
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• sooper7s
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• RayReign 12
• HerbMon 10
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
• BSLYoutube
Dota 2
• WagamamaTV832
Counter-Strike
• imaqtpie1202
• Shiphtur219
Other Games
• tFFMrPink 18
Upcoming Events
Replay Cast
2h 45m
RSL Revival
12h 45m
herO vs TriGGeR
NightMare vs Solar
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
16h 45m
BSL
21h 45m
IPSL
21h 45m
eOnzErG vs TBD
G5 vs Nesh
Patches Events
1d 2h
Replay Cast
1d 11h
Wardi Open
1d 12h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 12h
Jaedong vs Light
Monday Night Weeklies
1d 18h
[ Show More ]
Replay Cast
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
Afreeca Starleague
2 days
Snow vs Flash
WardiTV Invitational
2 days
GSL
3 days
Classic vs Cure
Maru vs Rogue
GSL
4 days
SHIN vs Zoun
ByuN vs herO
OSC
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
Escore
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
WardiTV Invitational
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
SHIN vs Bunny
ByuN vs Shameless
WardiTV Invitational
6 days
BSL
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S2: W5
WardiTV TLMC #16
Nations Cup 2026

Ongoing

BSL Season 22
ASL Season 21
CSL 2026 SPRING (S20)
IPSL Spring 2026
KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 2
KK 2v2 League Season 1
Acropolis #4
SCTL 2026 Spring
RSL Revival: Season 5
2026 GSL S1
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026

Upcoming

BSL 22 Non-Korean Championship
CSLAN 4
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Maestros of the Game 2
2026 GSL S2
Stake Ranked Episode 3
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.