EPTThe HotS Zerg Help Me Thread - Page 41
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A_Scarecrow
Australia721 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On April 23 2013 14:39 A_Scarecrow wrote: lately been versing alot of 2 base collosis blink stalker into 3rd builds on diamond kr and us. not sure what to do to counter it tried muta ling but gets counters too easily by their micro. so is roach SH or hydra better or better micro? Roach/hydra/swarmhost pwns any 2 base colossi all in. I have only lost vs a 2 base colosso build once and that's because I attacked into the small choke by the rocks on akilon lol. | ||
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A_Scarecrow
Australia721 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On April 23 2013 14:50 A_Scarecrow wrote: ah ok was told not to go roach hydra against it awhile ago guess i was told wrong lol No you don't want to go roach/hydra but 12-14 swarmhost and roach/hydra. Pure roach/hydra is not going to work. | ||
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A_Scarecrow
Australia721 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On April 23 2013 15:03 A_Scarecrow wrote: ok thanks! btw meching turtling terran is corruptor better if they go bcs than hydra? i went hyra Sh crushed his army but he kill most of my force and then he went into raven bcs. No well you should have vipers. Corruptors are good vs bc's but if he's going bc/raven/viking corruptors aren't as good and I prefer heavy hydra with viper for abudct. | ||
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Stition
United States19 Posts
My early drone micro isn't the best, but in my tests an 11 overpool is better in every way to later pool first openings. I played protoss in season 1 and just got back into sc2 for hots, so I apologize if there have been advances since the early threads here on TL that extensively tested the pool first openings, and would like to know if there is something I'm missing with these builds. | ||
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MtSShark
Germany2 Posts
I am a Mid-Masters Zerg (EU) and I have big problems with mech-terrans right now. I had some really frustrating games where i played SH's/Roach/Hydra, Roach/Hydra drops, Muta/Ling/Ultra or even Roach/Hydra/Viper which is probably the best answer to mech right now. I have one extremely weird game (http://drop.sc/326852) in which I played Roach/Hydra/Viper against a (in my opinion) very bad, passive and slow mech-terran. There was no scouting and/or aggression until the 13 min mark on the terrans side and he just maxed on Tanks, Hellbats and some safety-mines. In my eyes I macroed up pretty pretty well and I had as few units as possible always... still I had no great macro advantage and I do not really know why. The mistakes on my side I see were definetely: - some micro fails during the very last fight with the vipers - expanding at around 12:30 instead of producing mass units - not making mutalisks to harass him (but how can I possibly know whether he goes Thor, mines, tanks or whatever - he can just add some mines if I go Muta, can't he??) I made some Lings early on to be safe against Reaper / other aggression and the spine to safely drone up. Hopefully some of you can help me with this replay and in general mech in HotS. | ||
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Uni1987
Netherlands642 Posts
I've seen a lot of people post about how to play ZvZ without mutas. I've been using this strat lately and the more I practice it, the more effective it is getting. I am 1k masters in EU. Excuse me for the sloppyness but I am kind off learning it myself. Although learning, my winrate ZvZ: 63% at the moment. http://ggtracker.com/matches/2874583 (Download button is in the top right) Let me know what you think  | ||
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Henk
Netherlands578 Posts
On April 23 2013 21:52 MtSShark wrote: Hey Community, I am a Mid-Masters Zerg (EU) and I have big problems with mech-terrans right now. I had some really frustrating games where i played SH's/Roach/Hydra, Roach/Hydra drops, Muta/Ling/Ultra or even Roach/Hydra/Viper which is probably the best answer to mech right now. I have one extremely weird game (http://drop.sc/326852) in which I played Roach/Hydra/Viper against a (in my opinion) very bad, passive and slow mech-terran. There was no scouting and/or aggression until the 13 min mark on the terrans side and he just maxed on Tanks, Hellbats and some safety-mines. In my eyes I macroed up pretty pretty well and I had as few units as possible always... still I had no great macro advantage and I do not really know why. The mistakes on my side I see were definetely: - some micro fails during the very last fight with the vipers - expanding at around 12:30 instead of producing mass units - not making mutalisks to harass him (but how can I possibly know whether he goes Thor, mines, tanks or whatever - he can just add some mines if I go Muta, can't he??) I made some Lings early on to be safe against Reaper / other aggression and the spine to safely drone up. Hopefully some of you can help me with this replay and in general mech in HotS. I'll take a look. (Mid-masters as well). I'll edit this when I'm done. Edit: First big, no wait, huge problem: 3rd base is WAYYYY too late. vs a simple rax expand I like to get mine when my 3rd and 4th queen are something like halfway done. So your eco is in shambles the entire game (You start mining there at like 11-12 min, with 28 or so drones at once.. 12 drones too many, and since you aren't getting a 4th just don't drone that hard.) and then he pushes with 170 supply vs your 140. Yes, you kept your money low the entire game, but that's because you barely had any money to spend. So yeah. Earlier third. | ||
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Veriol
Czech Republic502 Posts
On April 23 2013 20:24 Stition wrote: I have a question about blind pool first openings in ZvT or ZvP. I see a lot of 14 or 15 pool blind even in pro games and am pretty sure 11 overpool is better economically and in larva than either of these and is better at dealing with proxies or punishing CC or Nexus first. My early drone micro isn't the best, but in my tests an 11 overpool is better in every way to later pool first openings. I played protoss in season 1 and just got back into sc2 for hots, so I apologize if there have been advances since the early threads here on TL that extensively tested the pool first openings, and would like to know if there is something I'm missing with these builds. 11overpool is only better if you are planning to stay on 2base for longer period of time. 14/15pool openers are way more macro oriented because they give you "smooth" eco. You can say 11overpool is better beucase earlier queens = more larvae. But you need to realise that you cant spend it IF you plan going 3rd base somewhat early (around 6minutes at latest). 6 minutes into the game also happen to be the time where 14/15 pools will catch up the 11pool. 11pool = better for early larva(more drones early) = 2base friendly 15pool = better for early resources mined = fast 3rd friendly | ||
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MstrJinbo
United States1251 Posts
On April 23 2013 20:24 Stition wrote: I have a question about blind pool first openings in ZvT or ZvP. I see a lot of 14 or 15 pool blind even in pro games and am pretty sure 11 overpool is better economically and in larva than either of these and is better at dealing with proxies or punishing CC or Nexus first. My early drone micro isn't the best, but in my tests an 11 overpool is better in every way to later pool first openings. I played protoss in season 1 and just got back into sc2 for hots, so I apologize if there have been advances since the early threads here on TL that extensively tested the pool first openings, and would like to know if there is something I'm missing with these builds. They were never economically better builds. Larva generation at the 6 min mark is similar to some hatch first builds due to a fast queen, but it lags behind harvested minerals. | ||
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d07.RiV
Russian Federation50 Posts
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StillRooney
Sweden106 Posts
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d07.RiV
Russian Federation50 Posts
In ZvZ, what's the best way to hold a one-base ling/bling allin if you went 15pool 16 hatch? If they go pure speedling I usually hold with no problem but when they mix in banelings I fail pretty hard. Any tips? A spine or two and a wall. No need to actually block yourself off with evos, something like ramp-queen-b.nest-queen-hatchery is enough to force banes to go around your hatchery, though its not as good vs lings. When he's trying to break through, try to micro your spines to snipe banes. | ||
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CamoDaz
United Kingdom19 Posts
Thanks in advance. | ||
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A_Scarecrow
Australia721 Posts
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blade55555
United States17423 Posts
On April 24 2013 15:30 A_Scarecrow wrote: been trying to push into masters on us and i did great yesterday in wins but today ive had 6 losses in a row, 5 to 3 base turtling robo/collosis players and 1 to a wm+mmm masters players. i just cant seem to win against the robo toss players tried sh and roach hydra viper but they had high templars and collosis by 16mins ready. and i tried muta but they just counter attack im sorry if im being a pain this is the first forum ive asked for help but atm im just falling apart to collosis builds from masters players. It comes down to control with sh/hydra/viper/ultra vs templar/colossi. You should be adding in ultralisks as well if it gets to that late game stage. If he is going pure ground no air (no voids no tempests, etc) then make some broodlords with vipers for blinding cloud and ultra as backup :D | ||
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kyllinghest
Norway1607 Posts
On April 24 2013 10:22 CamoDaz wrote: I'm Plat (EU) and In ZvT I have been using ling/bane/muta vs bio since the start of HotS. Lately i'm running into people who just build blind missile turrets a lot and I feel I cannot get the most out of mutas. Is roach/hydra strong enough to use compared to ling/bane/muta? If so what is a standard roach/hydra opening? Thanks in advance. Well if he is building missile turrets he is not building attacking units with those minerals, so thats a start! Use mutas mainly to control the pace of the game, and to stay safe from drops. Don't worry too much if he is turreting up his base, thats costly for him. Roach/Hydra is a viable composition, but in my opinion it doesn't get strong before you get vipers/infestors. When I go for this composition I like to do a standard roach opening! | ||
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loginn
France815 Posts
http://drop.sc/327111 Thanks. BTW I'm top 15 master if it matters to you. | ||
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