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On November 02 2013 07:55 chairmobile wrote:
what do I do to counter mass blink stalker + immortal? Muta falls easily, zerglings melt before they can even start dps'ing, and ultras get owned by immortals. BL seems a little shaky given the mobility of mass blink stalker - they'll just snipe my bases 2 at a time while i can't engage. What unit comp is good?
The best comp against this kind of army is zerglings and hydra with a few roaches to help tank. The lings you want to get around the back and sorround all of the protoss army and prevernt them from running away, the rest you want to be inbetween the protoss army and your bases. If he has alot of immortals then you never really want to go ultra because of the dps that they have against them but you want to get crackings and range upgrade for hydra to take them out easily, if the protoss is smart they will tech out of this into zealot sentry collosus and then you have to make a tech switch to roach hydra viper or corruptor. Of course you should always tech to hive against a toss in order to pressure their bases with mutalisk.
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On November 05 2013 01:17 Insoleet wrote:Show nested quote +On November 05 2013 00:54 b0ub0u wrote:On November 05 2013 00:47 icezar wrote:
Hi,
I cannot deal with bio mine for the love of God. It absolutly distroys me.
I am Plat, I was Diamond until this season.
I have like 70% win rate against Z and P and 15% against T.
If T tries anything else i just crush it. (2 rax, banschee mech etc.)
I tried ling bane muta but i think i do not have the micro, swarmhost are horribe against it.
Now i try to go hydra because it outranges the mines and hope i do not die until i get broodlords.
I feel like you have to go muta or hydra because you need to kill the medivacs but i hold the pushes one after another until a lucky mine shot and i am dead :-(
I have the EXACT same issue. Now Plat but I was Diamond before too. Good winrate against Z and P but I have 30% against T because of the mines. There is always a couple of mines that I didn`t see and BOOM here come the lucky mine shot and I am dead. I was told by some people to try to cripple the T economy early on with a roache timing that it may help out. But for me I am just waiting for the patch that hopefully will make the mine a little bit easier to play against. Well, just play patiently. The key is : defend, defend, defend, muta, defend, defend, defend. 3 spines + 1 spore on the front. Counter attack with lings only, some banes if you need to break something. Always have overseers with you. Once you got 20-30 muta, you can start to attack (30 muta in the main terran base are scary you know :D) When you want to push to the terran base, always make sure that you cleaned the mines on your creep.
Thirty muta is a bit much... also its best to be aggresive towards a terran to not allow them to build up to much, once you get a few muta its good to just poke at their mineral line or take out attatchments to their buildings to slow production
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been struggling against toss going phoenix into colossus voidray, stalker comp. I just cant seem to get the right comp to counter I have tried everything and lately just not working. Went from 80% wr to 40% in about a week from running into this comp more and more on kr ladder. Any suggestions?
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Roach, hydra, viper works really well against this since they wont have much gas to get templar out in time when they produce colossus and stargate units. You can hit a timing with 2-3 vipers, 20-25 hydras, 80 drones and the rest of your supply roachs between 13-14 minutes depending on how hard you droned up. When you are maxed you should prepare your transition for templar; swarmhost/broodlord/ultra/(infestor) depending on what you prefer and what you go up against.
You can go with double Upgrades once you start hydra production to hit with 1/1 or go for an earlier evolution chamber and hit with +2 ranged.
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On November 08 2013 20:55 zerge wrote:
Roach, hydra, viper works really well against this since they wont have much gas to get templar out in time when they produce colossus and stargate units. You can hit a timing with 2-3 vipers, 20-25 hydras, 80 drones and the rest of your supply roachs between 13-14 minutes depending on how hard you droned up. When you are maxed you should prepare your transition for templar; swarmhost/broodlord/ultra/(infestor) depending on what you prefer and what you go up against.
You can go with double Upgrades once you start hydra production to hit with 1/1 or go for an earlier evolution chamber and hit with +2 ranged.
This actually seems like quite a good timing attack, at first I was thinking it would be pretty crap but the timing is a nice window when they will not have many units out due to them teching to skytoss which areoud 15 mins would be when they have a dangerous amount of units out. For this attack to work, would you be able to attack earlier with a largely hydra based army with not vipers and then re-enforce with roaches. However a problem I see is if they pretend to go skytoss and just get out a pheonix to harass then tech straight to robo, the attack would fail
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Roach, hydra or hydra ling are completly different timings you would have to attack much earlier and to potentially take out their third. The success of these timings do heavily depend on what your oponent does and which map is played. Roach, hydra, viper workes on any map and does well against any build with voidrays and/or collossus if they dont tech to templar right after one stargate/robo. Thats why i recommended it to him, phoenix into voidray collossus delays templar quite a bit and you will be able to deny his fourth base while trading even or in your favour.
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hmm ill try it tomorrow just annoying when toss double expand (13-14min usually) turtle and pump out a lot of colossi.
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On November 06 2013 18:13 SSeoni wrote:
Hey guys, just a short question. How do you counter Protoss when he get's a very fast third like 6, 6:30 or maybe 7?
Do you flood lings or wait til you have hydras to do a ling timing attack? or flood roaches to kill his third?
I have no response to that but instead letting them having their 3rd base up easily.
Master Zerg here. You can respond in a variety of ways. I find that being aggressive with zerg can be risky, so I will often be greedy myself.
I would stress the importance of being good at macro if you take the passive reaction. Don't get supply capped, and saturate your bases and get upgrades going. If you are good at macro then take the passive route. If you aren't, then I would suggest a roach ling attack.
If the expo is as early as 6:30 then waiting for hydra could take too long and you wont have enough to deal with cannons + nexus overcharge and other units. If he has a voidray out, it shouldn't be enough to save the base. But I would recommend just being greedy yourself in response to the early expo.
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On November 08 2013 19:19 A_Scarecrow wrote:
been struggling against toss going phoenix into colossus voidray, stalker comp. I just cant seem to get the right comp to counter I have tried everything and lately just not working. Went from 80% wr to 40% in about a week from running into this comp more and more on kr ladder. Any suggestions?
Pheonix opener should be weak enough to allow you to build up a good economy, or to punish with hydra. A good comp against colossus voidray stalker is roach hydra viper. It's a good comp for head on engagements.
If you want, send me a replay and I can give you specific help. Masters Zerg.
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ill try roach hydra viper again. if I run into trouble ill send replay last toss match I won was going fast upgraded ling corruptor infester and only reason I won was cause he didn't now how to counter it rofl
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At what population do you drone scout if you want to see the fast b2 or the timing push. Pls tell me for every matchup. Thx ^^
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On November 09 2013 10:14 typhoonn wrote:
At what population do you drone scout if you want to see the fast b2 or the timing push. Pls tell me for every matchup. Thx ^^
Only drone scout in zvt at 1:00 mark. Look in common 2 rax locations on the way to his base. Check gas and get out.
QUESTION:
In a ling bling muta vs roach hydra situation, how should you micro in a fight? Roaches and hydras both overkill so I assume targetting banes is bad? Should you split the hydras? Make sure the roach wall is complete? Should you kite?
Of course I know to engage in chokes.
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On November 09 2013 10:14 typhoonn wrote:
At what population do you drone scout if you want to see the fast b2 or the timing push. Pls tell me for every matchup. Thx ^^
I scout at 14 supply, every matchup. Keep the drone alive as long as possible. What's "b2" and "timing push"?
14 is soon enough to catch proxies before they happen, and you aren't very much economy.
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At the pro level, it's only common to drone scout for ZvT.
Scout when the 10th drone spawn if you suspect proxies.
Scout once you have built the 13th drone if you are heading directly to the enemy base to check his tech.
If rax gas -> reaper opening = get your pool latest by 16(and before gas since you drone scouted)
If cc first you could go 3 hatch or gas pool
If u cant find anything immediately throw down your pool and pull a drone to scout your nat at around 2:45(11 rax completes at about 2:38)
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Hi guys!! Plat zerg here! When I play vs Terran or Zerg I know what compositions make but against Toss I don't know what composition use how standard. I'd like to use roach/hydra and attack his third but usually FF + colossus melt my army. Mutas are very weak and lings too. What is your standard army composition against Toss? Thanks in advanced
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I used to have a 100% win rate against Terrans at Platinum/Diamond level until HoTS. I got HoTS only a couple days ago. I won my first 4 placement matches but I lost the last one to a Bio-Mine Terran. Then I got put into Silver (wth?).
Since then, I have faced only Terrans and they all go Bio-Mine and I just lose. I remember that thread: "Where have all the Terrans gone?". Well they are back and they are coming out of the woodwork like demons from the Bible, Widow Mines and everything -_-
How do I overcome this?
I must say I was never interested in heavy macro play. I play an aggressive style of Zerg opting to bust by 7:30 or do 2 base timing pushes. But now, although I am rusty since I last played in January, anytime I try to bust I lose a good portion of my force to WM. By the time I realize what is going on I am way behind - he typically arrives at my base several minutes later with 3-2 and an impossible number of Bio.
Please help.
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There are many feasible compositions for ZvP.
Roach ling - commonly used to hold off all kinds of 2 base all ins.
Hydra ling - can be used to be aggresive towards a stargate opener. Will have to tech switch to muta/hive during your attack.
Roach hydra corrupter/viper - standard composition to deal with stargate-> collo. Will need to attack as soon as you are maxed with viper or corrupter to deal with collosus. Can transition into broodlords once you have traded since hive is already available.
Ling infestor into Ultra + some hydras - Good composition, but your opening is quite different and susceptible to 2 base all ins if you cannot defend well. Creep spread and queen transfuses is essential. Have to attack as soon as Ultras spawn so that the immortal count doesnt go too high.
Muta ling - Normally as a surprise tech switch after being able to trade with the protoss army.
Muta/ling/corrupter - Double spire upgrades, using corrupter to zone out the inevitable chrono-ed double stargate pheonixes.
Swarmhost/hydra or corrupter/viper/infestor/queens - Ultimate composition in certain maps that has limited pathways. Greatly helped by static D and creep spread.
That's all my personal opinion though . Hope it helps
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On November 11 2013 20:53 NarAliya wrote:
I used to have a 100% win rate against Terrans at Platinum/Diamond level until HoTS. I got HoTS only a couple days ago. I won my first 4 placement matches but I lost the last one to a Bio-Mine Terran. Then I got put into Silver (wth?).
Since then, I have faced only Terrans and they all go Bio-Mine and I just lose. I remember that thread: "Where have all the Terrans gone?". Well they are back and they are coming out of the woodwork like demons from the Bible, Widow Mines and everything -_-
How do I overcome this?
I must say I was never interested in heavy macro play. I play an aggressive style of Zerg opting to bust by 7:30 or do 2 base timing pushes. But now, although I am rusty since I last played in January, anytime I try to bust I lose a good portion of my force to WM. By the time I realize what is going on I am way behind - he typically arrives at my base several minutes later with 3-2 and an impossible number of Bio.
Please help.
You could try to play some kind of roach hydra comp and overwhelm Terran at around 12 minutes with a massive dps burst when you hit 2-2 with roach speed and both Hydra upgrades. This composition will work even in master, but be careful vs drops.
It requires less micro than ling bling muta or ling roaches vs WM. You also need a few speed overseers to kill the mines.
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On November 11 2013 22:27 loginn wrote:Show nested quote +On November 11 2013 20:53 NarAliya wrote:
I used to have a 100% win rate against Terrans at Platinum/Diamond level until HoTS. I got HoTS only a couple days ago. I won my first 4 placement matches but I lost the last one to a Bio-Mine Terran. Then I got put into Silver (wth?).
Since then, I have faced only Terrans and they all go Bio-Mine and I just lose. I remember that thread: "Where have all the Terrans gone?". Well they are back and they are coming out of the woodwork like demons from the Bible, Widow Mines and everything -_-
How do I overcome this?
I must say I was never interested in heavy macro play. I play an aggressive style of Zerg opting to bust by 7:30 or do 2 base timing pushes. But now, although I am rusty since I last played in January, anytime I try to bust I lose a good portion of my force to WM. By the time I realize what is going on I am way behind - he typically arrives at my base several minutes later with 3-2 and an impossible number of Bio.
Please help. You could try to play some kind of roach hydra comp and overwhelm Terran at around 12 minutes with a massive dps burst when you hit 2-2 with roach speed and both Hydra upgrades. This composition will work even in master, but be careful vs drops. It requires less micro than ling bling muta or ling roaches vs WM. You also need a few speed overseers to kill the mines.
Ok.
Now how to I overcome WM if I want to bust (almost 90% of the time) before Lair finishes? Do I just send 1 ling up to test the ground or what? What if he has WM behind the Supply Depot/Barracks at the top of the ramp? Macro'ing to Roach/Hydra is easy enough, but I'm really not interested in waiting to make an attack all the way at 12 minutes. I like dealing damage as early as possible without leaving me very behind.
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hi guys!! which is the actual standars openings un ZvZ? Im diamond, and won almost 75% terrans and toss, but loss 75% zerg, i think my bos are wrong...
Scout timings? what may I to look for?
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EPT
