EPTThe HotS Terran Help Me Thread - Page 260
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. | ||
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Nimix
France1809 Posts
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herMan
Japan2055 Posts
How do I deal with roach hydra viper? I usually go MMM with a few tanks but I just get shredded. | ||
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Infinite976
United States92 Posts
Given the current meta, what's the most effective 1 base all-in vs Zerg? vs Protoss? For TvZ I've heard 11/11 rax, or 3 starport banshee (haven't seen this build).. any other ideas vs Z or P? Thanks in advance. | ||
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Coletrain_
Canada15 Posts
On March 14 2014 16:07 eXeviKK wrote: When you see pro players executing 1 rax reaper FE in tvt, they take one guy out of gas earlier than they do the next. I was wondering when they take the first and second guys out of gas before they start ramping up barracks production. Reference: See Polt's tvp (and many others i'd assume) Thanks guys!  Polt's gas timings when he is going Reaper expand ----> 3 Rax: (Taken from his games vs Hero @ IEM Cologne) 3/3 Gas until he has enough gas for Reaper. 2/3 Gas until 34 Gas, from 34 gas with 1 SCV mining gas you will reach 50 gas as soon as the reaper finishes for your reactor. 1/3 Gas until he starts the third Barracks, and then back to 3/3 in Gas. He then builds the second gas at the same time as he starts his factory, and his third gas when he starts his Starport (with the fourth coming as soon as he can afford it). | ||
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JonyJ
Israel7 Posts
On March 14 2014 20:04 Nimix wrote: Some korean pros only use 2 hotkeys and control click vikings, but I think that still leads to situation where their vikings aren't positioned as well as they could and a 3rd army hotkey is really a good thing. You could try binding ² (or ~ for qwerty users I think) to a control group maybe? Thanks, but I use ~ for all army selection to find lost banshees around the map sometimes. I guess the control click is what I should go for. | ||
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B-rye88
Canada168 Posts
On March 14 2014 13:45 JonyJ wrote: Thank you for the advice, but I am so used to this hotkey setup that I just do VERY badly if I try CC on any other hotkey. I tried setting the "w" key at the "0" control group, for vikings. That didn't work either. On some replays of pro players I noticed that jjakji uses only 2 and 3 for his army. I wonder how does he control this late game situations. My guess is manually but I am really not sure. Any other advice? Grinding out 30 games with a lower win-rate in order to set yourself a more efficient mechanic structure to work from seems worth it to me. | ||
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gmk1998
1 Post
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B-rye88
Canada168 Posts
On March 16 2014 04:10 gmk1998 wrote: Hello community! I have recently made diamond with terran, and i only know 1 build order. It seems to work in all MU, however as more players gotten better i realized how important bos are. I looked into the featured strategy thread, but i could not find any up to date solid play styles/bos on the thread. I believe it's the most lacking compared to the other races. Can someone help me or link me to a thread/blog with this info? TYVM Hey gmk, go ahead and check out the original post in this thread; it contains a list of viable builds for the matchup. | ||
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OatmeeL
United States12 Posts
On March 15 2014 01:24 herMan wrote: When playing against zerg on yeonsu, which third should I take; the forward one edging a cliff or the other base which is tucked in? I personally prefer the tucked in base. In this image: blue = terran rally, red = terran attack path, yellow = zerg counterattack paths, purple = turrets for mutas ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/ICR77XR.jpg) If you take the forward base, the rally to your third is slightly longer. The attack path to the zerg's most sensible attack point is a bit longer than the other. The zerg can also make use of the back path (far left) which means you have to move the clump at your rally to the left a bit to defend because they can't block the front ramp and backdoor at the same time. Also, mutas can hit your third very easily and the abuse the cliff to make your marines unable to chase. It takes a lot of turrets to cover that arc. If you take the tucked in base, the attack path is a little shorter. The only counterattack path to your third can be defended by your rally (righthand blue clump). Mutas can be deflected by 3-4 turrets clumped in the bottom right purple blob (it's way too risky to fly under that clump without vision imo). By the time you take your fourth at the forward base you should have the econ to support 6+ turrets defending that base. Also, it will have a PF at it making that backdoor path less of an issue. Hope this helps, although keep in mind it's just my opinion ^^ On March 15 2014 01:24 herMan wrote: How do I deal with roach hydra viper? I usually go MMM with a few tanks but I just get shredded. I don't have as good of an answer for this, but I recommend totally cutting mines, go 4-5 reactor and 3-4 techlab rax with medivacs, and start adding 2 fac tanks once you have a third saturated. Play defensive, make an arc, and try to sneak dropships out and do damage where there's no spines/spores. Add 6-8 vikings when nearing max to snipe vipers. The goal is to have a 200 vs 200 fight where you have ~8 spread tanks, a few vikings, and a marauder heavy bio army. With a good spread clouds shouldn't do much and you can just overwhelm him before he has a scary enough remax bank. But don't feel too bad about losing to this, roach/hydra is pretty underrated vs terran imo, a lot of it comes down to concave/positioning of tanks. | ||
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PinheadXXXXXX
United States897 Posts
On March 16 2014 05:37 OatmeeL wrote: I personally prefer the tucked in base. In this image: blue = terran rally, red = terran attack path, yellow = zerg counterattack paths, purple = turrets for mutas If you take the forward base, the rally to your third is slightly longer. The attack path to the zerg's most sensible attack point is a bit longer than the other. The zerg can also make use of the back path (far left) which means you have to move the clump at your rally to the left a bit to defend because they can't block the front ramp and backdoor at the same time. Also, mutas can hit your third very easily and the abuse the cliff to make your marines unable to chase. It takes a lot of turrets to cover that arc. If you take the tucked in base, the attack path is a little shorter. The only counterattack path to your third can be defended by your rally (righthand blue clump). Mutas can be deflected by 3-4 turrets clumped in the bottom right purple blob (it's way too risky to fly under that clump without vision imo). By the time you take your fourth at the forward base you should have the econ to support 6+ turrets defending that base. Also, it will have a PF at it making that backdoor path less of an issue. Hope this helps, although keep in mind it's just my opinion ^^ This is a great diagram. However, I think it's important to note that if you take the forward third, although you do have to build a lot of turrets, they cover a section of your main so you can build less turrets there. I think that base gives you better coverage vs. mutas in general, especially in terms of protecting production. | ||
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SoleSteeler
Canada5450 Posts
 I need to learn mech... I really like the thought of bio though. I just can't figure it out. I'm so damn slow. I turn 29 next week but I'm in the best shape of my life so I'll never buy it's a physical thing.  Just getting really frustrated playing terran... | ||
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Nimix
France1809 Posts
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ZenithM
France15952 Posts
On March 16 2014 08:42 PinheadXXXXXX wrote: This is a great diagram. However, I think it's important to note that if you take the forward third, although you do have to build a lot of turrets, they cover a section of your main so you can build less turrets there. I think that base gives you better coverage vs. mutas in general, especially in terms of protecting production. Also, for the two attack paths, the longer one assaults a zerg base from the high ground, while the shorter one assaults one from a low ground. Not a huge difference, but I personally like having the high ground advantage. | ||
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Tzuborg
Norway171 Posts
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BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
On March 17 2014 12:13 Tzuborg wrote: So what am I supposed to do once I've scouted an in base proxy gate? Throw up more racks? And how do I defend mass reapers in TvT? God, the ladder feels so extremely cheesy these days, so annoying. Can't get any TvPs or TvTs to go past like the 8 minute mark... There's 2 responses to scouting in base proxy gate, the safer way and the gosu micro way. The gosu micro way is to make raxes, first one on 11 second one on 11-13 and slap a bunker down between your mineral line and the gateway, pull 5-7 scvs and micro them against the first zealot, pulling each scv out before the zealot gets the 3rd slice in. If your micro is sufficiently gosu you'll win easily (see Bomber vs Has g2 on habitation station from WCS America recently). The safer way is to pull 5-6 scvs and attack each gateway before the zealot finishes, trying to optimise for mining time (a protoss will not make a zealot from a gateway that's about to die, he'll probably spend thsoe mins on more probes and gateways). You might not be able to fit in a barracks against this and certainly not a real time but if he can't ever make a zealot you won't need one. The safer way doesn't really put you all that much ahead, if at all, but it's safe! | ||
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Pursuit_
United States1330 Posts
Maybe just keep the mines back defensively and keep producing mines and medivacs off naked fact / port after I swap the rax onto the tech labs? Worth making a viking to zone out the MsC since the vision nerf? Thanks in advance for your thoughts! edit: On March 16 2014 21:01 SoleSteeler wrote: I think I should just accept the fact that I'm too slow to play bio... I can't split worth a damn vs. banelings or storm. I play random and my P and Z are both around ~60-65% all time on ladder but my terran is like 25%. I need to learn mech... I really like the thought of bio though. I just can't figure it out. I'm so damn slow. I turn 29 next week but I'm in the best shape of my life so I'll never buy it's a physical thing. Just getting really frustrated playing terran... As suggested before, check your mouse DPI, if it's above ~1200 I really reccommend trying to get it close to your resolution (i.e. 1080p try to get between 800-1200, 720p try 600-800 ect, as low as you can comfortably go), this will really help mouse accuracy as it greatly improves your margin of error. I went from 1800 DPI to 800 DPI on a 1080p screen and while it took me awhile to get used to the transition made it so much easier to precisely select individual units and make accurate boxes. Otherwise, I feel like Terran engagements have the highest skillcap in learning what to do and how to do it. If you watch streams at all, the next time you watch a Terran stream try to just pay attention to how they engage and try to think about why they did what they did and how well it worked. In the heat of the moment when you see Banelings barreling down on your bio or High Templar moving forward to storm, a lot of the time your reaction is to try to run your whole army away and then split, but this can actually be the worst possible response a lot of the time because it means a significant portion of your army's time is spent not attacking while getting attacked. Also remember to try getting your army as wide as possible when splitting / engaging to maximize your concave, not deep. | ||
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BEARDiaguz
Australia2362 Posts
To anyone using Reaper Fe -> 1/1/1 mine drop vs Protoss, what do you think is the best way to respond to Blink after Expansion when you dont scout out the Twilight after expansion in time to forgo the mine production? I've been thinking about trying this build out and I've thought of a response I like to every common Protoss opening except this one. I feel like going tanks after 1-2 mines wont be enough to hold both my main and my natural, and if I'm on one base with tanks when my opponent already expanded the contain will put me too far behind, and I dont think my bio count is going to be enough when blink hits ~8 minutes. I dont think I could reliably scout out the Twilight after expansion in time to forgo the mine drop either. Maybe just keep the mines back defensively and keep producing mines and medivacs off naked fact / port after I swap the rax onto the tech labs? Worth making a viking to zone out the MsC since the vision nerf? Thanks in advance for your thoughts! Lose. Blink stalker builds are favoured vs reaper mine drop. You can make tanks if the map isn't heavy rain/yeonsu/deadalus point since there's a reasonable chance you won't be stretched too far around main and natural. You can drop mines in his mineral lines and it'll probably work if he hasn't scouted your factory (if he has he'll counter it so don't do the drop). But you're going to struggle a ton to stop any aggression and if you have made siege tanks then, well, grats you've made a fucking terrible unit. Just throw up bunkers in time, add tanks and hope the protoss is retarded and something nice happens. And if you've gone reaper mine drop on the maps I mentioned above then God have mercy on your soul, cuz the protoss won't. | ||
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Pursuit_
United States1330 Posts
On March 17 2014 16:41 ROOTiaguz wrote: Lose. Blink stalker builds are favoured vs reaper mine drop. You can make tanks if the map isn't heavy rain/yeonsu/deadalus point since there's a reasonable chance you won't be stretched too far around main and natural. You can drop mines in his mineral lines and it'll probably work if he hasn't scouted your factory (if he has he'll counter it so don't do the drop). But you're going to struggle a ton to stop any aggression and if you have made siege tanks then, well, grats you've made a fucking terrible unit. Just throw up bunkers in time, add tanks and hope the protoss is retarded and something nice happens. And if you've gone reaper mine drop on the maps I mentioned above then God have mercy on your soul, cuz the protoss won't. Hmm okay thank you for your thoughts, I really appreciate it and I'm a huge fan of yours iaguz! Blink after expand being so common and the threat of second pylon proxy stargate have been my reasons for avoiding using the Reaper FE -> 1/1/1 Mine Drop until now but I think I still want to experiment with it for awhile. Jjakji vs sOs didn't exactly inspire any confidence either but I really just need a break from opening reaper -> 2/3 rax every TvP. I'll probably end up just using it on Habitation / Frost. | ||
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Ryndika
1489 Posts
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Nimix
France1809 Posts
And then even if you turtle and defend, by the time you get stim you realize he took an early 3rd and has storm and colossi and you're dead anyway :D That's the worse with blink openers, it's so hard to know what you're exactly facing... I kind of like the idea of making a viking to push the MSC back, but the dps probably wouldn't be enough to prevent blink ins, and it would prevent you to counter drop a mine, so I'm not sure it's worth it. | ||
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