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Active: 479 users

[G] Only Bio in TvZ!

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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forsakeNXE
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany539 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-08-20 01:30:07
June 13 2012 01:41 GMT
#1
Content:
1.0 Introduction
1.1 Why pure Bio in TvZ?
1.1.1 Problems with Marine Tank
1.1.2. What you do different with Bio
1.1.3 Requirements
2.0 Gameplay
2.1 Gameplan
2.2 Opening and Early Game
2.2.1 Introduction
2.2.2 The Build
2.2.3 Explanation
2.3 The Midgame
2.4 The Lategame
3. Scouting
3.1 Introduction
3.2 3-Marine Poke
3.3 Combat Shield Timing
3.4 Medivac Push
4. Units and Tasks
4.1 Marine
4.2 Marauder
4.3 Medivac
4.4 Viking
5.0 Tips and notes
6.0 Closing words
7.0 Replays and VODs
8.0 Changelog


1.0 Introduction

Hey Guys,

my name is forsakeNXE, and i play terran around 850 points + rising master level.

After a break of a few weeks due to diablo 3 and some personal reasons I am now back at SC2 and want to bring you a general guide for pure bio play in TvZ.

I am german and have written this guide in german first so please bear with my english, I will be glad to correct grammar or spelling errors so feel free to correct me.

1.1 Why pure Bio in TvZ?

1.1.1 Problems with Marine Tank

So a lot of you definitely play Marine Tank (+ some medivacs) in TvZ and that’s very solid. But it is also very easy to get in a very defensive position so that moveouts become very difficult and slow. Also it can be risky as a surround on unsieged Tanks often means gg.

But even with a good position Zerg can break it quite easily. My observations also got me to a point where I recognized that like 50% of Tanks do only fire two or three volleys before getting overrunned which is kinda inefficient.

Mostly, though, I feared Broodlord-Transtion . As you get to a point where your tankline is in a good position and you finally cleaned out all the creep Broodlords appear and this makes your whole effort quite useless cause you will have to retreat sooner or later. If Zerg is also spot on with dropdefense while moving the broodlords forward you have basically lost the game if there is no major blunder from Zerg.

As I sidenote: I also struggeled getting Zerg to produce a lot of lings early cause rebuilding your army gives zerg so much time for droning etc.


1.1.2 What you do different with Bio

If you play pure bio with medivac support you have a lot of advantages…

... you are much more mobile.
... you force constant Zergling production.
... you can deny more creep.
... your units scale excellent with upgrades.
... you can counter T3 pretty fast and effectively
... you can expand more flexible behind your pushes.
... Macro feels easier cause you only have to produce MMM out of 2 Buildings.
... you have a lot of mapcontrol all the time.
... Scouting is easy cause Zerg has to bring his units to the front.
... Seeing banelings getting uselesss cause you’re split is too good is plain awesome!

But Bio also has disadvantages…

... very Micro & Macro intensive (!).
... Clumping up and getting hit by banelings and/or fungals means gg

1.1.3 Requirements

After reading this it might be tempting to get into Bio play at once but I strongly recommend this only if you are high diamond or master cause you…

a) Have to produce constantly. A long pause in Medivac and or Rax production means that zerg can overrun you easily.

b) Have to upgrade constantly. It is most important as you trade supply all the time and upgrades will make this trade a lot more efficient for you or the Zerg player if you let this slip. Also you should time attacks by the finishing point of your upgrades like 2/2 or 3/3.

c) Have to split constantly, mostly pre-emptively, if you do not have the micro to split half-decent while macroing you won’t have fun with Bio TvZ. You have to split against banelings very nicely as well as against fungals/Infestors.

d) Have to expand behind your aggression constantly. If you do not do this you won’t be able to afford enough production to keep the pressure up and zerg will overrun you eventually. Your third can be delayed quite significantly though (12-13 min).

e) Have to watch your army constantly. Looking in your base to macro can get your bioball fungaled which basically is gg also you have tob e careful about surrounds.


2.0 Gameplay

2.1 Gameplan

You should focus on trading banelings and lings as well as infestors against marines and marauder all the time. Idealy you should have more workers than Zerg has. But to get to this point you have to trade very efficiently and attack a let zerg the freedom to drone hard, if you cannot afford to let him do that. Also splitting is important so that you trade armys in a way that Zerg has not left over much and has to reproduce a lot.

Also you should focus on upgrades and line your timings up with the completion of the upgrades. If you have left 30 seconds on 3/3 wait for it and clear some creep etc.
Another goal is to get a very high medivac count so your units are healed through fungal and negate baneling dmg. Also you should definitely use the retreat option they give you while no infestors are on the field.

Constantly producing, expanding and never getting supply blocked is self explanatory.
In Short: In Zerg’s Face! – Always!


2.2 Opening and Early Game

2.2.1 Introduction

At the moment i play an opening that MKP did versus Stephano at MLG Spring Championship. But you can transition out of 2rax as well as a marauder hellion timing and of course cc first if you are skilled enough to pull it off.

I think that MKP found a very efficient opening to get fast upgrades, be save early and get medivacs recently to build up pressure very fast.


2.2.2 The Build

I want to apologize that I do not give you food numbers but i do not play after such as every game develops in a different way and it is not reliable to trust those numbers. I will do my best but there are only little I can do. If someone wants to add them please feel free I will be glad to insert them here.

Build: (M = Minerals; G = Gas)
@100 M Supply Depot
@150 M Barracks
@ 100% Rax OC, + 1 Marine Cut Marineproduction
@ 400 M Command center (2)
@ 100 M Supply Depot, + constant SCV and Marine Production
@ 300 Minerals 2x Barracks(2) (3)
@ 3 Marines 2x Gas with 2 Guys in each, total of 4 scvs in both gases
@ 25 G TL @ Barracks
@ 100 G Combat Shield
@ Barracks (2)+(3) finished -> Ebay
@ 32 Supply, Supply Depot + constant supply depot production
@ 100 Gas + 1 Infantery Weapon Attack
@ 100 Gas 2 Rectors on Barracks (2)+(3)
@ 70% Combat Shield, move out with Marines
@ 400 Minerals (around 7:10 Minutes) Command Center (3) + 1 SCV in each gas (total of 6 in both) + start 3rd Gas
@ 100 Gas Factory
@ 100 Gas Stim
@ 100 % Factory Starport and Reactor on Factory
@ 10 Minutes Ebay, Armory and 4th Gas
@ 100% Starport, constant Medivac Production
@ 2 Medivacs -> Push out and take Third
@ 10-11 Minutes (4) (5) (6) (7) Barracks
@ 100% Armory start + 2 Infantery Weapon Attack -> continous upgrades
@ 14-16 Minutes Start 4th Command Center

2.2.3 Explanation

Small Advice at the beginning:
If you play that build at master level you need to hit those timings perfectly otherwise you will get crushed. If you hit 30 Seconds to late with your combat shield or / and medivac timing you will be overrunned so keep that in mind.


You open with a 1 rax expo with 1 supplydepot and put down another sd depot after your oc starts scv production and get your second marine after that. You follow this up with 2 rax and 2 gas afterwards with 3 on each gas.

As soon as both rax finished you add a TL at the 3rd rax immediately and get a ebay. As soon as the tech lab is done start combat shield and + 1 Attack as soon as the ebay is done. At around 32 Supply add your 3rd supply depot.

Moveout at 70-80% of Combat Shield (depending on map) with all your marines to the 3rd of Zerg. Start Reactory on the barracks asap as well as your third inbase and the 3rd gas and remember to put one mor scv on both gases in your main. Also start the factory and stim while pushing. Do not forget supply depots and army/scv production.

As soon as you get to the 3rd of zerg combat shield should be finished. Now move behind the minerals and take out as much zerglings as possible and if you can try to get the cancel / kill on the hatchery. Also scouting is important here, more down below.
If you kill/deny the hatchery occasionally go in front of zergs base to scan and kill creep and retreat back home, if you get chased back of in a corner and trade efficiently.

Leave one marine at the watchtower when you get a free ride home and one at the 3rd of Zerg to see if he re-expands.

By now you should have +1 Attack done, Stim half way thorugh and the starport almost done which leads us to the midgame.


2.3 The Midgame

Watch your minimap if you can expect an all-in (if he do not retake his third) or if he retake the third and prepare for one or the other.

Around 10:30 your medivacs should hit the field, stim, combat shield and +1 attack should be done and +1 Armor half way through. Build another ebay and armory while you move out with the medivacs take your third, scan ahead to spot for banelings and traps.

Rally your reinforcements to your home and not to your front to minimize loses. Also keep upgrading and production all the time etc. Queue Conc-Shells and rally your medivacs on your existing ones. Start a forth around 14-15 Minutes Minutes or when you can freely afford it which should be around that time.

By then infestors should be out. So its most important to save your medivacs to outheal fungal and minimize dmg from zerg units. Split as best as you can and start trading.

It becomes important to add production, supply depots and medivacs marines and marauder as well as upgrades. Try to line your attacks up with your upgrades if possible for maximum efficiency.

This phase can be very long and should be the point where you can finish zerg of sooner or later. Trade all the time, save your medivacs and expand behind your aggression.
If that is not the case we go to the lategame.

2.4 The Lategame

Zerg refuses to die even if you poke and prode all the time and trade as much as possible and now broodlords or ultralisks hit the field? Guess what! You have an answer: Marines and Marauder.

If you see ultralisks you can just slam down 6-7 techlabs while keeping zerg back with drops, pump 2 rounds marauder and see them just disappear in no time.

If you see broodlords stimmed marines (3/3 at this time) are amazingly effective, also you can add on 3-4 starports if needed and drop like crazy due to your insane medivac count. Also make sure to snipe infestors with marauders. Mostly Zerg won’t have enough stuff to back t3 units up effectifly and you should be able to crush this big investment cost efficiently. Also try to drop the hive to rest zergs tech which is pretty easily done with 2 dropships.

Generally speaking if you let a Zerg get 20 corruptors, 15 Broodlords 10 Infestor + Lings and Blings you haven’t been active enough.


3. Scouting

3.1 Introduction

By doing several pushes you can gather intelligence and tell what zerg wants to do. You can even do that without scanning as everything has to be at his front to defend vs your constant pushing. By having that much of a rax production and the ability to throw down techlabs etc. you can react to anything that zerg throws at you.

3.2 3-Marine Poke

Grab your first three marines and move them to a watch tower to see one of two possible options:

a. 2-4 Lings
Zergs first scouting lings which means eco focus and no big threat most likely.

b. 6+ Linge
6 lings are the normal "pressure“ response for a 1rax expo but get outmicroed by the amount of marines you have. If you see more than 6 lings retreat and build 2 bunkers.

3.3 Combat Shield Timing

With your combat shield timing you can run into 3 different events:

a. Roaches
From time to time zerg goes roach to play against bio. This is best case scenario for us. Just throw down one or two more barracks depending on the amount of roaches you see and pump marauders, you always have the option to produce marines if he goes back to lings keep that in mind!

b. Mass lings
This means most likely that you get all-in'd soon. Immediately retreat and throw down 3-4 bunker if you see no 3rd taken by that time. If you are not able to facecheck use a scan. If there is third base these lings are most likely a over reaction to your first moveout.
If there is an all-in to come build 4+ bunkers behind your wall pre split your marines and start producing marauders to put them in front to take baneling hits. Fill your bunker with 1 or 4 marines as you like and pull scvs to rebuild the wall and repair. Close gaps in your wall asap and never stop producing. Once Medivacs are out you should be save. Also you can build a tech lab on the factory and try getting out a tank which I would not really recommend as siege is far away.

Expand afterwards, gather your army and maybe wait for some upgrades to move out and finish the job.

Keep in mind that you most likely do not have stim but combat shield (which means marines take 2 baneling hits) so pre split your marines.

c. Few lings and an expansion
Zerg has droned very hard according to the current metagame and not produced mutch units. You should be able to do huge dmg with you combatshield push if you abuse terrain. If you think you can take out his third do it!


3.4 Medivac Push

You can encounter one of 4 possible events:

a. Mass & only Ling
Stop marauder production and add more rax. Also build a techlab at the factory, start blue flame and add hellions later. Dropping is relatively effective but be aware that marines get exponationally better so delay your push expand and mass up marines. Once you get a good number move out and start trading.

b. Roaches
You should have scouted roaches earlier and have no problems. Just be aware if the switch to lings is coming and switch to more marines by then. Also look at the upgrades on the roaches to see if it he wants to stay on roaches or not. Add more or less marauder depending on the roach count.

c. Mutalisks
Likely scenario. Zerg will invest a lot of gas into mutalisks and won’t have enough to get a good number of banelings and infestors to stop you efficiently keep pressuring non stop to force mutas into a fight, build a few turrets in your mineral line and likely flight passes (like 5 at most at all) and win by keeping up the pressure.

d. (Infestor) Baneling Ling
This is by far the most effective combination to play versus bio. Stay on one rax with tl and add another techlab once infestors are out. Always presplit even if you do not see the zerg swarm yet, snipe infestors with marauders and get marauders in front to absorb baneling hits. Split your marines behind that and try not to stack up your medivacs on your army to avoid fungals on them. If there are no infestors yet use the free retreat option that medivacs give you. Do never ever fight in choke points or clump up cause one fungal with baneling hits at this point can mean instant gg.
From there on zerg should be forced to show you everything in front of your army in order to defend so you can react quickly enough.

4. Units and Tasks

4.1 Marine
Cheap and only anti-air unit except of vikings. It is most important that the most dps comes from these little bad guys so you need A LOT of them in order to kill zerglings and banelings. Always prioritise them and do never stop producing them. The better the upgrades the better the marines, 3/3 Marines are quite good Splitting is really important here, too!

4.2 Marauder
Marauder have a lot of HP and cost gas and are used to slow units while kitting which becomes less important the longer the match goes on.
It is important that marauders are in front of the marines to absorb baneling hits.
Also you should use small marauder squads to take out Infestors very fast (4-5 hits -> kill). This is really important especially in late game scenarios to take away the effectiveness of ultralisks and broodlords.

4.3 Medivacs
Our most important unit! The higher the medivac count the more our bio stays alive. It heals up fungals so they do not kill our units anymore and make baneling splash weaker due to healing too. Your goal should be to have at least 20-25 medivacs. Als they make Marauders pretty hard to take down. If you lose a huge chunk consider getting a second starport to ramp the production of these up again. That should not be needed if you constantly produce out of one starport.

4.4 Vikings
Normaly you should not build vikings cause you need those medivacs alot. But if you traded badly and will face blroodlords it might be no bad idea to throw down a few starports to get rid of them. But consider that you are behind in upgrades by a lot which is the same for tanks etc. so I recommend getting a lot of medivacs instead and drop like crazy.

5.0 Tips and notes

A few small tips and things to think about:

# Naked Barracks – Building Addons costs time in which you cannot produce marines and makes switching to a lot of techlab barracks for ultralisks difficult. So I recommend to not build them and get naked rax instead. Also you can use them to wall of certain parts of the map, too.

# Marauder : Marine Ratio – Do always only get one techlab barracks and only get a second one for infestors and maybe more only in case of roaches, marines are really more important than marauders!

# Tanks & Mech – not useful due to the lack of upgrades one or two defensive tanks or some hellions for massling strats can be good but i’d still recommend to stick to bio.

# Drop play: yes or no? It depends! You can do both and it is definitly viable. I do not do it cause i think the main point is to trade army over and over again to force more army instead of tech and drones. The most army is killed by huge engagements and there a medivac with 8 marines can turn the tide! Also dropping takes even more apm away from you then you have to use anyway. If you have spare apm feel free to do it but I would recommend to not do it.

# Focus Strucure - If you drop really focus on those evolution chambers to get ahead in upgrades.

# Walloff like this: http://img696.imageshack.us/img696/7939/screenshot2012061616322.jpg

# Expansion Timings: Expand rapidly! Take your third around 10 Minutes with your push, get a 4th around 15 Minutes and keep on expanding very rapidly around the map. Also add alot of Barracks if you float minerals.

6.0 Closing words

Wow, that was alot more than I intended to write but I really hope it helps you and I am very greatful for corrections of all sort as well as tips and additions and of course for some positive responses. I will try to keep it updated as much as possible.

7.0 Replays und VODs

German Video Guide:
Part 1:

Part 2:

Part 3:


Newest Replays all vs masters:

http://drop.sc/234704 vs Rank 9 Master
http://drop.sc/234703 vs Rank 19 Master
http://drop.sc/234894 vs Rank 22 Master
http://drop.sc/234701 vs Rank 24 Master
http://drop.sc/234699 vs Rank 26 Master
http://drop.sc/226787 vs Rank 42 Master (highly recommended to see agressive play (upgrades are lacking))
http://drop.sc/234702 vs Rank 88 Master


Allin defense:

http://drop.sc/208631
http://drop.sc/208633
http://drop.sc/208634
http://drop.sc/208635

Old Replays:
http://drop.sc/208953 vs top8 master (first reactor to early)
http://drop.sc/212926 vs highdia
http://drop.sc/195914 vs highdia
http://drop.sc/195933 vs master
http://drop.sc/195938 vs master
http://drop.sc/195919 vs highdia
http://drop.sc/195916 vs highdia
http://drop.sc/195913 2 Base Bust vs highdia
http://drop.sc/198802 vs middia
http://drop.sc/198803 vs highdia
http://tv.majorleaguegaming.com/events/17-spring-championship#1423/1483/1;90122 MKP vs. Stephano @ MLG Spring Championship
Some other mkp games you can google. If you have any vods or replays that might fit in here leave a comment!

8.0 Changelog

07-08-2012 - Added another replay
06-08-2012 - Adjusted Build Order for better readability, added bunch of master replays, adjusted build order explanation
02-07-2012 - added new build order + new replays
16-06-2012 - Walloff under tips, +2 Reps
13-06-2012 - created the guide

(c) by me =) do not copy this please! You may link to it but never copy it anywhere without my permission!
Let's learn together!
ster
Profile Joined April 2011
Netherlands94 Posts
June 13 2012 01:44 GMT
#2
Used to do the same thing pretty often when I promoted to masters. But I must say it's much harder to pull off when you're playing against zergs that know what they're doing. But it's the most fun style, though!
IamTheArchitect
Profile Joined June 2011
United States46 Posts
June 13 2012 02:15 GMT
#3
Solid guide!

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting frustrated with the general ineffectiveness of tanks in this matchup. I feel like unless you're taking advantage of some terrain feature (high ground, choke, etc.) tanks simply aren't cost-efficient and greatly slow down your pushes in a matchup where you need to be attacking constantly to keep the zerg player spending larva on zerglings rather than better units.

So I love the idea of all-bio TvZ. It's true that splitting is extremely important when playing bio, but I still think on the whole bio is easier than marine-tank micro-wise. After all, you still have to split with marine tank, and you also have to worry about siegeing at the right time, leapfrogging, etc, which can get very APM intensive when you're trying to hit a timing quickly.
Concordantly while your first question may seem the most pertinent, you may or may not realize it is also that most irrelevant.
dynwar7
Profile Joined May 2011
1983 Posts
June 13 2012 02:21 GMT
#4
I made a discussion about this here

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=344113

Nice guide to be honest. I love how its macro and micro intensive lol I think its an advantage

So, do you have that particular replay of MKP vs stephano game 3 at Cloud Kingdom? Would love to see it.

Regarding the imbalance, hilarious to see Zergs defending themselves....
Fencar
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States2694 Posts
June 13 2012 02:31 GMT
#5
Very nice guide! :D

You may want to make it so that you can click stuff in the index, shown here: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=336805#anchor
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
9-BiT
Profile Blog Joined January 2012
United States1089 Posts
June 13 2012 03:22 GMT
#6
Holy shit this is amazing, I was just sad that I didn't know how to play bio tvz

"If you kill/denie the hatchery occasionally go in front of zergs base to scan and kill creep and retreat back home, if you get chased back of in a croner and trade efficiently."
*deny
*corner

What do you think about late game MMM raven when the BL tech comes out? I have a very hard time, even though marines are supposed to be great against BL. thanks again!
kwark_uk: @father_sc learn to play maybe?
Fencar
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States2694 Posts
June 13 2012 05:38 GMT
#7
On June 13 2012 12:22 9-BiT wrote:
Holy shit this is amazing, I was just sad that I didn't know how to play bio tvz

"If you kill/denie the hatchery occasionally go in front of zergs base to scan and kill creep and retreat back home, if you get chased back of in a croner and trade efficiently."
*deny
*corner

What do you think about late game MMM raven when the BL tech comes out? I have a very hard time, even though marines are supposed to be great against BL. thanks again!

You can definitely add 2-3 starports with techlabs and go for Ravens if you scout a Hive coming up. You have to make sure that you get some Ravens before he has BL tech out, since he can mass produce it so quickly if he has the money.
This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
jorder247
Profile Joined October 2010
United States10 Posts
June 13 2012 05:54 GMT
#8
Cool guide. I've been looking for a new tvz. This sounds really interesting. I'm going to try this on ladder tomorrow.
iSmoke
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada34 Posts
June 13 2012 06:07 GMT
#9
very concise, i cant wait to try this style in my plat league :D
Be the change you want to see in the world
Yoshi Kirishima
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States10328 Posts
June 13 2012 06:34 GMT
#10
nice, this guide is well timed

good job! well organized and all!
Mid-master streaming MECH ONLY + commentary www.twitch.tv/yoshikirishima +++ "If all-in fails, all-in again."
hersenen
Profile Joined November 2011
Belize176 Posts
June 13 2012 06:39 GMT
#11
Hey thanks man, whenever I try bio in TvZ I get crushed but this guide is going to help so much.

Only suggestion is maybe add some MKP reps of him going bio?
zeratul_jf
Profile Joined October 2011
United States808 Posts
June 13 2012 06:48 GMT
#12
the only time bio fails me is when i forget to have my army split. One good fungal = gg so always make sure to have ur army split even if its just sitting around while you are macroing
padfoota
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Taiwan1571 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-13 07:59:55
June 13 2012 07:55 GMT
#13
On June 13 2012 10:41 Enemyy wrote:
1.0 Introduction
If Zerg is also spot on with dropdefense while moving the bloords forward you have basically lost the game if t


On June 13 2012 10:41 Enemyy wrote:
1.0 Introduction
If Zerg is also spot on with dropdefense while moving the bloords forward you have basically lost the game if t


On June 13 2012 10:41 Enemyy wrote:
bloords


BLOOOOORDS
BLOOOOOORDS


OH GOD THE FUCKING BLOORDS ARE COMING

ABANDON THE SIEGE LINES

BLOOOOOOOORDS!!!SHITSHITSHIT



+ Show Spoiler +
Seriously though, Im thinking back to the time when I was asking if bio only was viable and getting yelled at by people because "Terran = siege tank, siege tank = terran" "If you dont use siege tanks you should just switch race" "Seriously? Just use siege tanks" etc etc etc and from fucking teamliquid nonetheless too. Really glad to see its poking its head out more and more now, although I must say bio only is super tiring and shouldnt be used over and over game after game X_X unless you are some serious gamer


+ Show Spoiler +
Thank you for the BLOOORDS
Stop procrastinating
maracuja
Profile Joined November 2011
Germany22 Posts
June 13 2012 08:20 GMT
#14
I think in the current metagame bio is a valid option in ZvT, because it is strong vs the typical infestor-based compositions.
That is because infestors can not kill medivacs efficiently an you build up a huge flock of medivacs overtime. As the fights become smaller every marine has it`s own medivac, resulting in very efficient trades for the terran.
I think the weakness of this composition is the old muta/ling/bane army. This is because mutas can clean up the medivacs everytime and deny any drops. As long as the zerg keeps up with the upgrades and terran does not have insane splitting, ling/bane should beat pure bio anytime.
TRpredator
Profile Joined March 2012
Russian Federation101 Posts
June 13 2012 08:20 GMT
#15
it s a solid style in early and mid-game however it fails in late game bec ultra fungal banel overpower it too easily. Tried to play several times but as soos as T3 unit appears it fails. I prefer going for Byunprime(Ghostkingprime) style: he has composition of marine, marad, bf hellion, thor and medv
padfoota
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Taiwan1571 Posts
June 13 2012 08:47 GMT
#16
On June 13 2012 17:20 TRpredator wrote:
it s a solid style in early and mid-game however it fails in late game bec ultra fungal banel overpower it too easily. Tried to play several times but as soos as T3 unit appears it fails. I prefer going for Byunprime(Ghostkingprime) style: he has composition of marine, marad, bf hellion, thor and medv


Dawg. What style from terran doesnt get overpowered by fungal ultra broodlord easily?. If you are saying ultra bane infestor style mmm with ghosts eat it hard. Infestors = no real map control and relies heavily on lings to control the map, which means by the time the mother fucker has ultras out, you should have at least 10 rax to supply and dump him. 3/3 Marine marauders with good split and control shits all over ultra bane infestor, and any amount of good ghost play means its just a fricken meat wall now that you can kite and shoot down. In fact MMM became useful BECAUSE of infestors style. Its the broodlords thats hard to counter, not the ultras
Stop procrastinating
maddogmcgee
Profile Joined January 2011
Australia105 Posts
June 13 2012 09:36 GMT
#17
When I see this build i'm so happy, because I can 2-3 base ling bane all in for the free win. Its hard to split marines, marauders and workers in a space constricted base at the same time. Obviously its possible to stop the bane all in......but in diamond no one seems to.
and he whispered, never more
forsakeNXE
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany539 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-06-13 10:30:39
June 13 2012 09:41 GMT
#18
Hey guys!

Thanks for all the feedback =)

I have fixed those typing errors thanks alot for pointing them out - dat bloord! :D

Also i have added a link to the vod of the mkp vs stephano game @ mlg spring championship. I might look into older mkp games to see if he did this build at another time ( i have watched quite a view but do not remember seeing it before).

Also i will add anchors soon.

About the Raven Transition: It is definitly a good possibility but the better the zerg the more you have to trade armywise and the more minerals you need. You almost never sit on 200 supply for a long time to build up those minerals and if you do add more barracks
But if you add some more gases you should be able to stockpile alot very quickly and can transition into Raven. If anyone have a nice replay to show this transition out of pure bio feel free to post it =)

About t3 once more:
Ultralisks are really no problem. Of course they eat your bio if you get fungaled while you are clumped up but that is no different than getting baneling instead in the midgame. All about preemptive splitting and some kitting to negate those fungals. As mentioned before due to the nacked rax you can almost instantly switch to massive marauder production to kill ultras soo quickly

Broodlords are a bigger problem but none to worry about that much cause normally zerg lacks the units to back them up. Also you can drop every base instantly with filled medivacs and try to kill the greater spire, too where marauder shine alot!
Also you are much more efficent with dropping cause you upgrade fast and tanks are not that helpful in that scenario as well. Finally you can also instantly throw down some starports and start crazy viking production cause you should be in the lead be then.

If Zerg gets a huge army with proper backup you haven't been agressive and active enough on the map and did not deny bases properly.

If you have any questions etc. let me know

Edit:

On June 13 2012 18:36 maddogmcgee wrote:
When I see this build i'm so happy, because I can 2-3 base ling bane all in for the free win. Its hard to split marines, marauders and workers in a space constricted base at the same time. Obviously its possible to stop the bane all in......but in diamond no one seems to.


I feel like you are right about the effectivness auf baneling allins but i had no chance to practice against that (i feel like the one i have the replay of is executed badly and of course scouted. Will be very hard but doable i think.
Let's learn together!
padfoota
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Taiwan1571 Posts
June 13 2012 10:23 GMT
#19
On June 13 2012 18:41 Enemyy wrote:
Hey guys!

Thanks for all the feedback =)

I have fixed those typiny errors thanks alot for pointing them out - dat bloord! :D

Also i have added a link to the vod of the mkp vs stephano game @ mlg spring championship. I might look into older mkp games to see if he did this build at another time ( i have watched quite a view but do not remember seeing it before).

Also i will add anchors soon.

About the Raven Transition: It is definitly a good possibility but the better the zerg the more you have to trade armywhise and the more minerals you need. You almost never sit on 200 supply for a long time to build up those minerals and if you do add more barracks
But if you add some more gases you should be able to stockpile alot very quickly and can transition into Raven. If anyone have a nice replay to show this transition out of pure bio feel free to post it =)

About t3 once more:
Ultralisks are really no problem. Of course they eat your bio if you get fungaled while you are cumped up but that is no different than getting baneling instead in the midgame. All about preemptive splitting and some kitting to negate those fungals. As mentioned before due to the nacked rax you can almost instantly switch to massive marauder production to kill ultras soo quickly

Broodlords are a bigger problem but none to worry about that much cause normally zerg lacks the units to back them up. Also you can drop everybase instantly with filled medivacs and try to kill the greater spire, too where marauder shine alot!
Also you are much more efficent with dropping cause you upgrade fast and tanks are not that helpful in that scenario as well. Finally you can also instantly throw down some starports and start crazy viking production cause you should be in the lead be then.

If Zerg gets a huge army with proper backup you haven't been agressive and active enough on the map and did not deny bases properly.

If you have any questions etc. let me know

Edit:

Show nested quote +
On June 13 2012 18:36 maddogmcgee wrote:
When I see this build i'm so happy, because I can 2-3 base ling bane all in for the free win. Its hard to split marines, marauders and workers in a space constricted base at the same time. Obviously its possible to stop the bane all in......but in diamond no one seems to.


I feel like you are right about the effectivness auf baneling allins but i had no chance to practice against that (i feel like the one i have the replay of is executed badly and of course scouted. Will be very hard but doable i think.


My experience is mostly against Roach baneling allins - so Im not sure on the difference. Marauders shit on this so bad :/

I do imagine that without hellions or some kind of AoE itll be rather hard to hold off a 2-3 base baneling allin, but its not like we just let them get there. Its not a turtle style, bio.
Stop procrastinating
kinsky
Profile Joined November 2010
Germany368 Posts
June 13 2012 12:50 GMT
#20
cool guide!! thx german fellow!! since i was promoted to master recently, i need some builds from now on i guess^^
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