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On October 23 2012 17:55 hobbidude wrote:
What are these "illegal" keybinding. Only things like macro keys are illegal. Changing the input of a key to register as one single other key is fine. I have the menu key (beside the windows key) remapped to be my tab button. It in the perfect place and doesn't require a third party program once set at least with my keyboard.
With the SC2 ingame hotkey editor:
1. you cannot bind abilities (anything on the commandcard) to a key combination
2. you cannot bind attack and build SVC to the same key because PF can attack and can build scvs
We call them illegal because you can achieve them only if you edit the hotkeyfile and not with the sc2 ingame hotkey editor.
On October 13 2012 01:44 evenjn wrote:
Not related to TheCore, but maybe useful to the developers (although I guess they knew it already).
I just found out that by editing the hotkey file in the disk, it's possible to assign conflicting hotkeys. For example, it's possible to assign the same key to attack and to produce SCV. This would be impossible in the editor because the Planetary Fortress (PF) also has the attack command.
However using this setting and pressing the conflicting key results in the PF producing the SCV, not in attacking. This makes it usable, and because you are never going to attack-move the PF there are no major drawbacks in doing this.
Also, you can assign CTRL+A to attack (not that I would want to do that), and other great stuff that would not be possible to do with the software.
I guess it could be useful to assign "dangerous" commands such as Lift, Salvage, Templar's Merge and Baneling's Explode to a CTRL+whatever combination.
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On October 23 2012 18:19 vvacid wrote:
How long does it take to switch from default layout to this? (to get to the same level)
Quote from OP
Frequently Asked Questions:
Before posting a question, please look here to see if you question is already answered.
1. How long does it take to get used to TheCore on average?
It greatly depends on your natural ability to adapt to change, but players often report between the range of 30-100 games for a basic understanding and feel of the layout and 100-200 games for a complete understanding and feel of the layout.
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On October 23 2012 14:03 eS_ToDo wrote:
Or he could just aim an illegal keybind layout for people who want to use it, and one without it for those who don't. Not sure if serious, but wanting every edge doesn't make you a pro, and not every pro will opt to use the illegal hotkey keybind.
No, suggest it for pros more than for casuals. Otherwise there aren't many people that would go for it.
It seems stereotypical, but that's what we have to work with.
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On October 23 2012 18:19 vvacid wrote:
How long does it take to switch from default layout to this? (to get to the same level)
It took me a few hundred games to reach (and exceed) the level of play that I started at. YMMV.
Don't get discouraged when you start out. It feels awkward and clunky in the beginning, but 200 APM is much easier with The Core than it is with the standard layout.
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I regret saying "illegal".. we should call them in another way for marketing purposes, or else someone may be scared. notepad-edited?
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On October 23 2012 14:03 eS_ToDo wrote:
Or he could just aim an illegal keybind layout for people who want to use it, and one without it for those who don't. Not sure if serious, but wanting every edge doesn't make you a pro, and not every pro will opt to use the illegal hotkey keybind.
I think this is a better solution. Of course, it would entail a whole new set of hotkeys, and I know the creators already have a helluva lot on their plates...
Unrelated: 200+ games into TRM, I'm loving the layout, but I'm still accidentally lifting off command centers from time to time. I put CCs and upgrade structures in the same control group, and e.g. sometimes I mean to tab to a factory tech lab to start blue flame research (K) and accidentally lift my command center instead.
I'm thinking about moving the lift off key to something a little further away to avoid this, but not so far that I can't quickly lift a building in an emergency. Maybe 'Y' or 'H'. I'm not sure if other terrans are having this problem, but it might be something to think about!
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Using the word "illegal" to describe these modfications will not only steer people away from TheCore, but more importantly, calling them illegal is not accurate. There is nothing in the ToS that says you cannot use the text file to edit your hotkeys. There is no unfair advantage gained from doing this, because anyone could do this. Lets strive to be accurate here and use a different word. Text file edited is fine.
Editing the text file is a pain in the ass
JDub gave pretty easy examples, so try to see if you can name these abilities without looking:
AWrp
GatherProt
MorphMorphalisk
TimeWarp/Nexus
Not user-friendly. Its definitely possible to figure out, but the majority of people will likely see something like this and say: wtf is AWrp, this doesn't make sense, I'm going to stick with what I've been doing.
That being said, It may be possible to make a "Pro" version of the layout with the disclaimer that you will need to learn how to edit the text file if you want to customize your layout. Personally, I'll have my probe on G and chrono on R. As well as my BuildAdvanced on Shift+A (A is build basic for me). Also, I'll have my hatchery abilities on Ctrl+key and maybe some other things as well. For now, lets go with the assumption that there will be two versions (so we'll be at 96 layouts now). One will be TheCore and the other will be TheCore Pro.
Questions:
What other things can we optimize with TheCore Pro?
Any suggestions for names other than "Pro"?
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You know, before delving into the text file editing, I try and contact major tournament organizations to see if they'd condone using such a layout. It would be a pain in the ass to have to make The Core Pro only to have it be disallowed in tournaments.
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On October 24 2012 02:15 poeticEnnui wrote:
You know, before delving into the text file editing, I try and contact major tournament organizations to see if they'd condone using such a layout. It would be a pain in the ass to have to make The Core Pro only to have it be disallowed in tournaments.
Good point.
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MLG Rules are here: http://www.majorleaguegaming.com/news/starcraft-2-rules-and-settings
These are the relevant ones:
1. Players must bring their own mouse, keyboard, headsets, and mouse pad. Players must use the PC and Monitor provided by MLG.
6. Players may not use 3rd party Add-ons.
11. All interface changes must be supervised by a Starcraft 2 Referee or the Starcraft 2 Tournament Director.
So it depends on whether they'll let you go in and change the game files on the computer. Definitely worth checking with MLG directly.
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On October 24 2012 01:24 JaKaTaK wrote:
Using the word "illegal" to describe these modfications will not only steer people away from TheCore, but more importantly, calling them illegal is not accurate. There is nothing in the ToS that says you cannot use the text file to edit your hotkeys. There is no unfair advantage gained from doing this, because anyone could do this. Lets strive to be accurate here and use a different word. Text file edited is fine.
Editing the text file is a pain in the ass
JDub gave pretty easy examples, so try to see if you can name these abilities without looking:
AWrp
GatherProt
MorphMorphalisk
TimeWarp/Nexus
Not user-friendly. Its definitely possible to figure out, but the majority of people will likely see something like this and say: wtf is AWrp, this doesn't make sense, I'm going to stick with what I've been doing.
That being said, It may be possible to make a "Pro" version of the layout with the disclaimer that you will need to learn how to edit the text file if you want to customize your layout. Personally, I'll have my probe on G and chrono on R. As well as my BuildAdvanced on Shift+A (A is build basic for me). Also, I'll have my hatchery abilities on Ctrl+key and maybe some other things as well. For now, lets go with the assumption that there will be two versions (so we'll be at 96 layouts now). One will be TheCore and the other will be TheCore Pro.
Questions:
What other things can we optimize with TheCore Pro?
Any suggestions for names other than "Pro"?
AWrp is Templar merge, GatherProt is the Probe's gather command, MorphMorphalisk is unfair because it seems to be missing it's slash-and-user, and TimeWarp/Nexus is Chrono. Nevertheless, despite my ability to determine them, I can safely assume that the majority can't, coming from the responses I've seen. We're in agreement there now.
I was about to say that Shift+A for Adv Build had a contradiction with building multiple buildings, but on second thought I guess not. Nice find. Hatch abilities on Ctrl seems to have no downsides as well.
As for TheCore Pro, there should be less other-race support where it inhibits efficiency, such as Probe on I. (Whether text-edited keybinds are patched out or not) The exception would be the Random layouts, of course. Other than that, I can't think of much else atm.
And the name is fine.
On October 24 2012 02:15 poeticEnnui wrote:
You know, before delving into the text file editing, I try and contact major tournament organizations to see if they'd condone using such a layout. It would be a pain in the ass to have to make The Core Pro only to have it be disallowed in tournaments.
I'm doubtful about this topic. If a tournament doesn't want to allow TheCore Pro, they won't want to allow TheCore.
EDIT: Well, I was close enough about Gather. With the info after MorphMorphalisk, /Queen, and with the previous knowledge that spawn Creep Tumor is a ridiculously easy one, I might have figured out it was Inject.
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On October 24 2012 03:54 Thunderflesh wrote:MLG Rules are here: http://www.majorleaguegaming.com/news/starcraft-2-rules-and-settingsThese are the relevant ones: Show nested quote +1. Players must bring their own mouse, keyboard, headsets, and mouse pad. Players must use the PC and Monitor provided by MLG.
6. Players may not use 3rd party Add-ons.
11. All interface changes must be supervised by a Starcraft 2 Referee or the Starcraft 2 Tournament Director.
So it depends on whether they'll let you go in and change the game files on the computer. Definitely worth checking with MLG directly.
Assuming you are using your own account, though, you don't have to change any game files. Your hotkey set-up will automatically be downloaded when you log in.
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On October 24 2012 04:00 JDub wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 03:54 Thunderflesh wrote:MLG Rules are here: http://www.majorleaguegaming.com/news/starcraft-2-rules-and-settingsThese are the relevant ones: 1. Players must bring their own mouse, keyboard, headsets, and mouse pad. Players must use the PC and Monitor provided by MLG.
6. Players may not use 3rd party Add-ons.
11. All interface changes must be supervised by a Starcraft 2 Referee or the Starcraft 2 Tournament Director.
So it depends on whether they'll let you go in and change the game files on the computer. Definitely worth checking with MLG directly. Assuming you are using your own account, though, you don't have to change any game files. Your hotkey set-up will automatically be downloaded when you log in.
You ninja'd me before I even started typing my response. 
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On October 24 2012 04:00 Antylamon wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 01:24 JaKaTaK wrote:
Using the word "illegal" to describe these modfications will not only steer people away from TheCore, but more importantly, calling them illegal is not accurate. There is nothing in the ToS that says you cannot use the text file to edit your hotkeys. There is no unfair advantage gained from doing this, because anyone could do this. Lets strive to be accurate here and use a different word. Text file edited is fine.
Editing the text file is a pain in the ass
JDub gave pretty easy examples, so try to see if you can name these abilities without looking:
AWrp
GatherProt
MorphMorphalisk
TimeWarp/Nexus
Not user-friendly. Its definitely possible to figure out, but the majority of people will likely see something like this and say: wtf is AWrp, this doesn't make sense, I'm going to stick with what I've been doing.
That being said, It may be possible to make a "Pro" version of the layout with the disclaimer that you will need to learn how to edit the text file if you want to customize your layout. Personally, I'll have my probe on G and chrono on R. As well as my BuildAdvanced on Shift+A (A is build basic for me). Also, I'll have my hatchery abilities on Ctrl+key and maybe some other things as well. For now, lets go with the assumption that there will be two versions (so we'll be at 96 layouts now). One will be TheCore and the other will be TheCore Pro.
Questions:
What other things can we optimize with TheCore Pro?
Any suggestions for names other than "Pro"? AWrp is Templar merge, GatherProt is the Probe's gather command, MorphMorphalisk is unfair because it seems to be missing it's slash-and-user, and TimeWarp/Nexus is Chrono. Nevertheless, despite my ability to determine them, I can safely assume that the majority can't, coming from the responses I've seen. We're in agreement there now. When I was asking before about my example of the Viper commands, the question was rhetorical. I know what they are, Jak knows what they are, the whole point is that they are not immediately obvious, and editing the text file is sure as hell not as easy as using the in-game interface.
Moreover, GatherProt is not just the Probe's gather command, it's the gather command for all workers. MorphMorphalisk is "pathetically easy", it's obviously larva inject. Some other gems: the load and unload commands for all transports are BunkerLoad and BunkerUnloadAll, the only other unit carrier commands which are different are CommandCenterLoad and CommandCenterUnloadAll. The enable cloak command for ghosts and banshees is called CloakOnBanshee. Swarm hosts have their own, separate burrow commands (all other zerg units share the same burrow).
Sorry, I just found it annoying that you answered my rhetorical question, that was just designed to show that you can't just ctrl+f your viper ability and edit it easily, and dismissed the idea that maybe the hotkey files are not user-friendly. By default, Blizzard only puts commands that differ from their default keybinds in the .SC2Hotkeys file anyway. I had to manually add every command (so I'm very familiar with the annoyingly different ones) to the seed hotkey files (*LM) to get my remapper to work.
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On October 24 2012 04:15 JDub wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 04:00 Antylamon wrote:On October 24 2012 01:24 JaKaTaK wrote:
Using the word "illegal" to describe these modfications will not only steer people away from TheCore, but more importantly, calling them illegal is not accurate. There is nothing in the ToS that says you cannot use the text file to edit your hotkeys. There is no unfair advantage gained from doing this, because anyone could do this. Lets strive to be accurate here and use a different word. Text file edited is fine.
Editing the text file is a pain in the ass
JDub gave pretty easy examples, so try to see if you can name these abilities without looking:
AWrp
GatherProt
MorphMorphalisk
TimeWarp/Nexus
Not user-friendly. Its definitely possible to figure out, but the majority of people will likely see something like this and say: wtf is AWrp, this doesn't make sense, I'm going to stick with what I've been doing.
That being said, It may be possible to make a "Pro" version of the layout with the disclaimer that you will need to learn how to edit the text file if you want to customize your layout. Personally, I'll have my probe on G and chrono on R. As well as my BuildAdvanced on Shift+A (A is build basic for me). Also, I'll have my hatchery abilities on Ctrl+key and maybe some other things as well. For now, lets go with the assumption that there will be two versions (so we'll be at 96 layouts now). One will be TheCore and the other will be TheCore Pro.
Questions:
What other things can we optimize with TheCore Pro?
Any suggestions for names other than "Pro"? AWrp is Templar merge, GatherProt is the Probe's gather command, MorphMorphalisk is unfair because it seems to be missing it's slash-and-user, and TimeWarp/Nexus is Chrono. Nevertheless, despite my ability to determine them, I can safely assume that the majority can't, coming from the responses I've seen. We're in agreement there now. + Show Spoiler +When I was asking before about my example of the Viper commands, the question was rhetorical. I know what they are, Jak knows what they are, the whole point is that they are not immediately obvious, and editing the text file is sure as hell not as easy as using the in-game interface.
Moreover, GatherProt is not just the Probe's gather command, it's the gather command for all workers. MorphMorphalisk is "pathetically easy", it's obviously larva inject. Some other gems: the load and unload commands for all transports are BunkerLoad and BunkerUnloadAll, the only other unit carrier commands which are different are CommandCenterLoad and CommandCenterUnloadAll. The enable cloak command for ghosts and banshees is called CloakOnBanshee. Swarm hosts have their own, separate burrow commands (all other zerg units share the same burrow).
Sorry, I just found it annoying that you answered my rhetorical question, that was just designed to show that you can't just ctrl+f your viper ability and edit it easily, and dismissed the idea that maybe the hotkey files are not user-friendly. By default, Blizzard only puts commands that differ from their default keybinds in the .SC2Hotkeys file anyway. I had to manually add every command (so I'm very familiar with the annoyingly different ones) to the seed hotkey files (*LM) to get my remapper to work.
You were acting stuck-up. That's why I answered your question, even though I knew it was rhetorical.
My point on the Viper commands and the Flyer Upgrades was that I thought it was immediately obvious to everyone else. After a bit of thought, which I used after seeing some more replies, it's a bit stupid to think that way.
Besides, I don't have to know them by heart. Seeing the user of the ability and the key which is used gives me an effective means of finding out what it is. Any doubts and a Ctrl+F clears everything up. GatherProt would have given me a doubt if I knew for certain that there wasn't a slash after it, so I would have Ctrl+F'd gather and found nothing. Same deal with Load and Unload, Cloak, and Swarm Host burrow.
Apology accepted. It seemed like you were trying to make a fool of me on top of you seeming stuck-up.
Just stop quizzing me and we'll actually make some progress.
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Guys, lets not fight, we're all on the same team here. I doubt JDub meant to seem stuck up. Probably just frustrated because he spent many hours making the program work and you called part of the work to make that program "pathetically easy" which is insulting. Antylamon responded to JDub being frustrated by getting frustrated and it created a spiral of doom and decay for all! Let's unspiral and continue looking for new ways we can utilize text editing for a faster more ergonomic layout.
Time for a poll!
If you use TheCore, please answer this poll.
Poll: Do you use TheCoreYes, I am in the Gold League. (405) 19% Yes, I am in the Platinum League. (320) 15% Yes, I am in the Silver League. (288) 13% Yes, I am in the Diamond League. (270) 13% Yes, I am in the Bronze League. (231) 11% Yes, I am a pro/semi-pro player. (192) 9% Yes, I am in the Master's League. (167) 8% Yes, I am in the Practice League. (163) 8% Yes, I am in the Grand Master's League. (124) 6% 2160 total votes Your vote: Do you use TheCore (Vote): Yes, I am a pro/semi-pro player.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Grand Master's League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Master's League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Diamond League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Platinum League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Gold League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Silver League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Bronze League.
(Vote): Yes, I am in the Practice League.
If you are in the Master's League or above, please send me a PM with your information so we can have a list of confirmed high level users.
Thanks :D
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On October 24 2012 05:50 JaKaTaK wrote:
Guys, lets not fight, we're all on the same team here. I doubt JDub meant to seem stuck up. Probably just frustrated because he spent many hours making the program work and you called part of the work to make that program "pathetically easy" which is insulting. Antylamon responded to JDub being frustrated by getting frustrated and it created a spiral of doom and decay for all! Let's unspiral and continue looking for new ways we can utilize text editing for a faster more ergonomic layout. I think that sums up what happened pretty nicely. Also, 1 confirmed Masters league player here. Also AHGL Season 2 champion. Epic fighting!!
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On October 24 2012 06:00 JDub wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 05:50 JaKaTaK wrote:
Guys, lets not fight, we're all on the same team here. I doubt JDub meant to seem stuck up. Probably just frustrated because he spent many hours making the program work and you called part of the work to make that program "pathetically easy" which is insulting. Antylamon responded to JDub being frustrated by getting frustrated and it created a spiral of doom and decay for all! Let's unspiral and continue looking for new ways we can utilize text editing for a faster more ergonomic layout. I think that sums up what happened pretty nicely. Also, 1 confirmed Masters league player here. Also AHGL Season 2 champion. Epic fighting!!
can i get cho battle.net profile link plz?
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On October 24 2012 05:50 JaKaTaK wrote:
Guys, lets not fight, we're all on the same team here. I doubt JDub meant to seem stuck up. Probably just frustrated because he spent many hours making the program work and you called part of the work to make that program "pathetically easy" which is insulting. Antylamon responded to JDub being frustrated by getting frustrated and it created a spiral of doom and decay for all! Let's unspiral and continue looking for new ways we can utilize text editing for a faster more ergonomic layout.
I recognized that even when I typed my replies. Who knows why I posted them. :/
@Poll I don't know what my league is since I'm going through TheLevels against the AI, but I voted Diamond since that's what I was most recently.
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On October 24 2012 06:13 JaKaTaK wrote:Show nested quote +On October 24 2012 06:00 JDub wrote:On October 24 2012 05:50 JaKaTaK wrote:
Guys, lets not fight, we're all on the same team here. I doubt JDub meant to seem stuck up. Probably just frustrated because he spent many hours making the program work and you called part of the work to make that program "pathetically easy" which is insulting. Antylamon responded to JDub being frustrated by getting frustrated and it created a spiral of doom and decay for all! Let's unspiral and continue looking for new ways we can utilize text editing for a faster more ergonomic layout. I think that sums up what happened pretty nicely. Also, 1 confirmed Masters league player here. Also AHGL Season 2 champion. Epic fighting!! can i get cho battle.net profile link plz?
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/profile/943279/1/JDub/
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Suggestion and question:
For "TheCore Pro," maybe something like "TheCore Deluxe" or something along those lines, since "Pro" might be intimidating to new users/new players. Or if you don't want to make it sound super cheesy, you could use some sort of letter/letter combination like various car makers do to denote a higher-end version of a production car. Mustang GT, Camaro SS, R/T Charger, you get the point. Just my two cents.
Aaaand question: what are the wrist support/glove thingies you wear in the intro video called? My google-fu is sadly failing me right now. 
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EPT
