|
Overview
Today is my birthday! I've been able to ladder a bit recently since finals ended, so I decided to take a little time out of my week to write a short yet interesting guide on my favorite opening for PvZ. I came up with this all of the below information on my own, so I don't actually know what other players are doing recently, and some may even be doing exactly what I detail here. Just a heads up. This is not a build order, just an opening. I'd define an opening as:
- Opening: The particular portion of a build that involves the earliest stages of the game. Usually lasts only the first few minutes, and is what "sets you up" for the entire game. Openings can often be decoupled with builds and lead into many different mid and late-game scenarios.
The idea is to get a fast Stalker and Zealot and press the early game lings away from your Natural, and follow with a Nexus and two more Gateways, for a 1 Gate Fast Expansion. You must be careful with your Speedling research timing to pull this off!
I love this opening because it puts a presence into the middle of the map, and you can keep this presence throughout the entirety of the game. In the replays section you'll find games where I just outplay my opponents since the very beginning of the game; this opening gives you a good chance to assert skill against your opponent from the get-go.
So why use this rather than a traditional 1 Gate FE? Well I find that this allows me a higher degree movement early on, and I can usually get a free Overlord with the early Stalker, force extra lings, or force and extra Spine Crawler (sometimes all three). This sort of opening over faster Sentries allows me to get ahead of an inferior opponent faster than another build would, in my opinion. I also feel active openings like this are great for those trying to improve, as you really benefit from pushing yourself to multi-task your Stalker/Zealot + Macro.
The Opening
Here is the basic outline in terms of supply in which to order or place what (assuming constant probe production):
- Pylon -> Chrono Nexus twice @100%
- Gateway
- Assimilator
- Pylon
- Cybernetics Core
- Zealot
- @100% Core: Stalker (Chrono'd); WarpGate Research (Chrono'd); Pylon on bottom of ramp
- Sentry (constantly produce Sentries from Gateway until WG research finishes)
- Chrono WarpGate Research
- @400 Minerals: Nexus
- Stop Probe Production
- 2 Gateways at Natural Expansion
- Resume Probe and Pylon Production
- Assimilator (finally)
What this opening lets you do is get out a very fast Zealot + Stalker. You use these two units to assert presence onto the middle of the map, and by anticipating a potential overreaction from your opponent you can enter into the Mid-Game with a very solid lead!
Pylon on Low Ground + Other Sim Cities
There are two different sim-cities that need to be known. The first is the Pylon on low ground. This Pylon is on the low ground at a slightly unusual time; it's early, before your Zealot even finishes. What if lings attack it? Well I'll tell you what, you want lings to attack it. Observe the following pictures:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/J69Uz.png) Zealot + Pylon Unit Sim-City![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/fEig6.png) Common Early Game Unit Sim-City
These two sim-cities will prevent lings from running up your ramp! Since your first Stalker is Chrono'd it will arrive in time to chase lings away with ease. Once you pull your Stalker and Zealot back in time to defend against speedlings (more on this further down), you can put a probe on hold in front of your Stalker to cut it's surface area down, and a Sentry will be just about to finish! This sim-city is perfect for just before or just as the Nexus is placed.
Next is the Gateway placement. Observe:
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/IQ35M.png) Important Low-Ground Sim-City
This sort of Gateway placement allows your Sentries early game to be in range of your ramp in the event of an attempted ling runby, but more importantly protects your units from a ling surround while being in range of the ramp and Probes. There should be one tile of space between your two gateways. It should be noted that this setup is great for Xel'Naga caverns, but for Shattered Temple you should have that single tile of space between the second Gateway and the Nexus.
Your Zealot is covering the front, and a poor player a-moving their lings at your natural will be frustrated as all their lings dance in front of the two Gateways. A single well-placed Force Field will also do the trick in stopping all ling movements around the Nexus through the mineral fields.
It should be noted that after you get 4-5 Sentries + whatever else you warped in, you should move your army into position in your Probe line, or wall entrance such that you won't lose any probes to a quick harass of lings, or fast banelings.
First Zealot + Stalker
You need to know when to return to your Natural Expansion. Speedlings are the real danger. A Zerg opponent can have ling speed finished, at the fastest, 3 minutes and 15 seconds after their first Extractor is placed. Knowing this, you can know when your opponent cannot have Ling Speed. You need to be back before this time hits! If you lose your first Stalker (the Zealot is probably okay to lose, but you really shouldn't unless you get into their natural) it's basically going to be game over.
Most of the time your opponent should do a speedling expand with 14 Extractor and 14 Pool. If this is the case speed will be done around 5 minutes 15 seconds. If you see no Extractors anywhere, Chrono out more Stalkers from your first Gateway instead of Sentries and keep up the Stalker aggression.
The Pressure Worked! I Feel an Allin Coming...
People allin me all the time from falling apart to a couple early Stalkers, or losing an overlord and overmaking lings, or whatever mistake they make early game. So in anticipation of an inevitable allin, you need to be prepared. After your first couple Warpins from your three Gateways and chronoboosts on your Nexuses, you should have enough money to invest into something. Your options are: tech, Gateways, Expansion. I suggest getting a tech structure and two additional Gateways if you feel an allin is coming at about this time. The safest would be a Forge + Cannon, and two more Gateways. This gives you some detection, but also allows you to invest into the later portion of the game with an upgrade.
On maps like Antiga and Shakuras I actually often opt for an earlier third base or fast Tech off of just 3 Gateways due to the narrow choke protecting me from Allins. This is something to consider. On maps with a wider natural such as Xel'Naga you will likely need to opt for more Gateways before anything if your opponent is not taking their third base.
In order to tell if the opponent is going to allin you or not, the best way is to get fast Hallucination and look for a third base. No third base means they are making units. If you feel confident, like I usually try to be, you can scout around the map with a probe or lone Zealot movements in search of a third base -this cuts the cost of Hallucination granting you 100 Vespene leave.
Follow Up
I usually like to follow this opening up with more map presence during the early to mid game transition. This will likely force Spines + Roach/Ling and let you keep their Drone count out of ridiculous ranges. From then on the sky is the limit! Just be sure not to be too passive, and don't blindly billow all the across the map with a rabble of Gateway units.
The time in which you should have the resources to invest in your next move should be after a couple Warpins from your three Gates and chronoboosts on your Nexus. Your options are: tech, more Gateways, or Expansion. Any can work depending on the situation. For instance you can tech and try to punish the Zerg's third and lack of tech, or expand and use defender's advantage against a mid-game allin.
Replay Pack:
- http://drop.sc/packs/391 - 3 Replays
- http://drop.sc/76362 - Loss vs allin followup; playing way too greedy by attacking rocks, and overprobing + teching at the same time.
- Please post up replays of trying out this opening! Discussion from examples and interaction with the original post by example is a great way to help create a quality thread. I'll post replays you submit to this list!
|
Happy Birthday! Nice looking guide too.
|
Happy birthday! Get some more videos up on the youtube channel... love your content!
|
2 questions,
Firstly, your wall off doesnt protect your probes at the natural, isnt a wall off from ramp to nexus better? youll lose 2-3 probes before you can get over there.
Secondly, what is the advantage of this over a 2 gas expand? i would personally prefer the extra sentries and extra sentry energy. What is so worth sacrificing that energy and sentry count for?
|
On December 19 2011 14:23 L3g3nd_ wrote:
2 questions,
Firstly, your wall off doesnt protect your probes at the natural, isnt a wall off from ramp to nexus better? youll lose 2-3 probes before you can get over there.
Secondly, what is the advantage of this over a 2 gas expand? i would personally prefer the extra sentries and extra sentry energy. What is so worth sacrificing that energy and sentry count for?
Good questions. By the time your probes are down there you'd want to move your army slightly away from that tiny gap and more towards the entrance where things are vulnerable. I'm sure I do this instinctively in the replays.
Secondly, re-read the Introduction section, I answered why one might use this over slightly earlier sentries.
|
When it the optimal time to throw down a forge for upgrades and cannons at the natural (against roach/ling all ins)?
|
On December 19 2011 14:32 Jackal888 wrote:
When it the optimal time to throw down a forge for upgrades and cannons at the natural (against roach/ling all ins)?
I'd say after you get 2 rounds of warpins + chrono off on your Nexuses. This is the time when the resources come in to invest in such a thing.
|
Nice guide, I like your unique take on building placement at the natural. My question is how soon after the 2nd and 3rd gate do you typically get your forge?
|
On December 19 2011 14:36 stokes17 wrote:
Nice guide, I like your unique take on building placement at the natural. My question is how soon after the 2nd and 3rd gate do you typically get your forge?
I just added another section about "I feel an allin coming" that answers that. Good question!
|
This is a great build, and I think Protoss should do this more often than FFE. Personally,as a masters zerg player, I think 1 base openings like 1/3gate expand are much harder than FFE because I can't grab a third, especially on blizzard maps. This is just my opinion though, and from the zerg side, so I'm sure protoss have a reason to do what they do, but I think it puts the zerg in an uncomfortable spot where it's 2 base vs 2 base and they can't really get a third without massing lots of units first.
I would just like to add, that as protoss you need to scout zerg with a probe when planning on doing this build, and if you see Zerg went 14/14, then you can't do it, and you must resort to 5:30 expo 3 gate sentry expand instead. I'm not sure on the [i]exact/i] timings of it, but I'm pretty sure any gas before 16 supply also means you can't do it. I think if gas is after 18 supply you are safe to do this, since speed won't be out in time.
|
Hmm. What are the significant advantages this brings over other builds? Does the expo get up quick than a normal 1gate expo? Do you think it's better than other PvZ fe options (1gate, 2gate stargate, 3gate)?
|
On December 19 2011 14:40 Belial88 wrote:
This is a great build, and I think Protoss should do this more often than FFE. Personally,as a masters zerg player, I think 1 base openings like 1/3gate expand are much harder than FFE because I can't grab a third, especially on blizzard maps. This is just my opinion though, and from the zerg side, so I'm sure protoss have a reason to do what they do, but I think it puts the zerg in an uncomfortable spot where it's 2 base vs 2 base and they can't really get a third without massing lots of units first.
I would just like to add, that as protoss you need to scout zerg with a probe when planning on doing this build, and if you see Zerg went 14/14, then you can't do it, and you must resort to 5:30 expo 3 gate sentry expand instead. I'm not sure on the [i]exact/i] timings of it, but I'm pretty sure any gas before 16 supply also means you can't do it. I think if gas is after 18 supply you are safe to do this, since speed won't be out in time.
I seem to do fine against 14/14 speedling expand O_o
On December 19 2011 15:26 Oreo7 wrote:
Hmm. What are the significant advantages this brings over other builds? Does the expo get up quick than a normal 1gate expo? Do you think it's better than other PvZ fe options (1gate, 2gate stargate, 3gate)?
3 more probes on Minerals, thus earlier buildings on low ground, fast first Stalker.
|
I like the overall build and how it utilizes sim city to prevent ling runbys. One thing I've noticed though is that in all of the replays, following the build, you are kind of flying blind for quite some time. Do you not think that hallucination is at least worth the investment to research? This is obviously outside of the scope of the guide since you are trying to share an opening and not an overall game plan, but I personally find myself lost when opening gateway first PvZ unless I'm using huarg's mothership build. So this is a nice new opening comparing to constantly passively one gate expanding.
Thanks again for the guide and happy cake day.
|
On December 19 2011 15:46 CaptainHaz wrote:
I like the overall build and how it utilizes sim city to prevent ling runbys. One thing I've noticed though is that in all of the replays, following the build, you are kind of flying blind for quite some time. Do you not think that hallucination is at least worth the investment to research? This is obviously outside of the scope of the guide since you are trying to share an opening and not an overall game plan, but I personally find myself lost when opening gateway first PvZ unless I'm using huarg's mothership build. So this is a nice new opening comparing to constantly passively one gate expanding.
Thanks again for the guide and happy cake day.
Well I was really ahead in those games, so it didn't really matter if I actually had vision across the map or not. Trust me none of the movements were blind. Counting enemy units you see, noticing movement patterns, anticipating decision making -a lot of stuff goes on behind the scenes that comes from experience.
Thanks for all the happy b-days!
|
What time does your nexus go down? I believe a 'standard' 1 gate sentry expand throws down the nexus at 4:30 (maybe 5:00? Although I don't think so... pretty sure it's 4:30 at quickest).
I'd love to see how you hold against someone who goes 14/14 ling all-in. can you provide a replay, or we can do it online (belial.869).
I think there were a few games of... i believe leenock against some protoss on crossfire. I think it was naniwa on the 6oclock, losing very frustratingly, to leenock at 12, on that map. like one of his first gsl games.
I suppose if you wait on the nexus, like throw it down at 6:00 or 5:30 instead, you might be able to get it up. I think that's just a 1 gate expand that's delayed. I think a 3 gate sentry expand would be more economic than a 6:00 1 gate expand?
Maybe the key difference is when you are cutting probes. If you are placing a good sim city with those 2 gates, with cut probe production, maybe it works?
But I just took it as fact, based on experience and vods i've seen, that you can't 1 gate expand vs 14/14 or speedling openings in general. From what I understand, you'll both have 3 units out against 1 and 3 gate expands, but the difference is with 1 gate expand you wno't be warping in those 3 critical next units to deal with the mass lings from denying the nexus.
|
Happy bday, Cecil, nice guide but I did want to ask: do you prefer this opening to a forge fast expand and why? I like the 1gate expand better myself but a lot of people have been telling me to ffe with a rationale of it being better economically.
|
nice strat, i have been using such aswell on maps where FFE is tricky and ppl go gassless expo, as you said you get alooottt of all ins because noobies making to much lings =]
well written and happy birthday 
|
Forgive my laziness - I'm unable to view the replays so if this is somehow answered in one of them, my apologizes.
How would this fare against a 11overpool/18hatching Zerg? I feel like if they see you place the pylon and then chase away the 2-4 lings with a stalker, they're going to send in an overlord. If the overlord sees everything the subsequent roach pressure and follow-up lings would at worst make you cancel the nexus and lose those 2 gates, putting you pretty behind. If the overlord doesn't see anything well you're in the clear I suppose. 
|
1 gas and a stalker plus warp gate, do you have to wait till your second hundred gas to get a sentry, with sentries ariving so late can any form of pressure such as seven roach rush, any banling play (u have pics of xel, im thinking of nestea game where he comes in from back path). but it just seems scary to me to not have a forge or high sentry count with a fast expand. happy bday btw
|
Happy Bday Cecil! I've been a follower of all your guides and I think they are great for any Protoss player, both new and experienced! This is somewhat out of the guide but can you explain:
1. Why you setup your buildings at your ramp like that where your Pylon is exposed? Just curious why you don't go for the traditional Gateway/CC Wall-off.
2. Is there a case where you wouldn't use this build (besides obviously 6 pools and the like where you see early pressure like that coming. Would you favor doing something else if you see something like 15 Hatch or an 11 Pool?
Thank you again all your help and keep up the good work!
|
|
|
|
|
|
WCS
