EPTPvZ simple cheese with ~80% w/r in high masters - Page 7
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Lorch
Germany3692 Posts
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Lephex
Germany153 Posts
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Truedot
444 Posts
On September 14 2011 20:50 iNkopwnz wrote: k ill ask u a question, why cheeses exist? and to ur question my answer is simple, if u train with pros ull become good faster than when ur training with ur lvl ppl the training is true,. However mastering the fundamentals all separately is also a true method of getting better faster. | ||
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Truedot
444 Posts
Im referring to drone drilling vs pylons. | ||
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OhMyGawd
United States264 Posts
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meadbert
United States681 Posts
On September 15 2011 03:39 DiaBoLuS wrote: ehm... 1 queen destorys the pylon with your placement, speedlings runby, gg oO if you reinforce your wall more and more, they can simply nydus out of it - you will be tons behind. i dont like that crap, just idra will lose to it because of his ragequit abilties. The Nydus is very expensive. If you include Lair, which you might not want otherwise, then you are investing 800 resources into Nydus. The whole point of the Nydus is to ignore the pylon wall, so if his pylons hang around to count as supply then he is down whatever he spent in cannons while you are down 800 going for your Nydus. | ||
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JackDragon
525 Posts
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The Final Boss
United States1839 Posts
On September 14 2011 18:18 Koshi wrote: Yeah, that "amazing" dronedrill is bullshit. I have practiced it with a friend and even if you do it almost perfectly you lose a ton of time and they can simply put a gateway and cancel it. Once the cannon is up you can't do anything anymore. Best thing to do for zerg is to 9 scout himself, if protoss wallins you with 3 pylons just go rofl and expand on another main. Pretty easy win from there  .Best thing would be for Blizzard to realize that their map pool is absolute garbage and should really change it. I don't want to play close positions Shattered Temple ever again. It's just not fun (not going to even get into balance, I play Terran so it's not really a balance issue haha). But my real question to the OP is, how is this new? "Standard" PvZ used to be 2 pylons at the bottom of their ramp, and this doesn't appear to be anything new other than adding an extra pylon. What is the point of your entire topic again? You're talking about a pointless build that does absolutely nothing. It's not new (any thing that involves blocking the bottom of a Zergs ramp is far from new, let's be honest), you'll never be able to utilize it in a tournament setting or even a Bo just as a cheese that you do, and it doesn't improve your mechanics. Frankly, I fail to see any meaning to your entire post. I read the entire thing, but the only thing that is remotely "new" is that you mention building Gateways behind your pylons to negate the effects of drone-drilling (which, if you're only using the Gateway to block, you should know that a Cybernetics Core makes a better wall (costs the same, has lower build time, and 100 more health in shields and hitpoints). What I find rather hilarious about your post is that you try to sound like you're helping out everybody who has trouble with PvZ, when really all you're doing is teaching them a way to succeed on ladder until they hit a certain point. You could teach a Terran how to do the 3 Rax Supply Drop All-in or teach a Zerg how to 6 pool vs Z and P or Baneling Bust vs T. If they manage to execute the build with maximum efficiency, then yes, they will do very well on ladder; but at a certain point, your "cure" to their problem, is going to stop working. They're going to start playing players who have better mechanics, better game sense, and who have earned their spot in a league by beating cheesy strategies like that. If a person knows a single build that works well against an unsuspecting opponent, eventually, they will lose with it. They will find themselves playing a person who knows how to beat it, and they will. And when that happens, they're going to be at the exact same level of PvZ that they were at before, where they can't beat Zergs. I don't want to sound like I'm flaming, but rather I'd just really like to hear what you have to say about it. Is there something I'm missing? I don't think that there is anything new about your strategy and I want to know what you have to say to defend it and your post's merits. On September 15 2011 06:08 Truedot wrote: Don't you guys see the issue with the game where you have to abuse a mechanic in an unintended way to beat an unintended consequence of how buildings/blocking works, in order to have a "normal" game? Im referring to drone drilling vs pylons. Isn't that the beauty of StarCraft though? People innovating and finding new ways to be more efficient. The Drone Drill is no more an "Unintended Mechanic" then say putting your first 8 SCVs on the close mineral patches, or having your worker escape a surround by mineral walking? What on Earth is wrong with any of those things. When players come up with new ways to solve problems, that's a great thing to do. How can you honestly be against drone drilling when the person who came up with it instead of doing what many players do (I know I do it haha) and complain about imbalance. No, instead he went and found a way to beat the cheese. That's miraculous in my eyes, and it's what makes StarCraft the best video game there is. | ||
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Truedot
444 Posts
On September 15 2011 06:24 meadbert wrote: The Nydus is very expensive. If you include Lair, which you might not want otherwise, then you are investing 800 resources into Nydus. The whole point of the Nydus is to ignore the pylon wall, so if his pylons hang around to count as supply then he is down whatever he spent in cannons while you are down 800 going for your Nydus. the answer is pretty simple. with your roach all in with nydus, you attack the pylons and then place nydus, have the pylons killed off, and then jump right into nydus and attack his base. because then he's heavily supply blocked and cant make defense units. | ||
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People_0f_Color
177 Posts
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Dephy
Lithuania163 Posts
On September 15 2011 06:00 Lephex wrote: This doesent even work well in High Gold..... Iam doin this kind of stuff pretty often versus Zerg and they just go mass raoches from there or banelings and Speedling and iam dead its prolly cuz you pretty bad(no disrespect given), cheezes like that work's all the way to Top Gm...... But its not like they will help your game at all, but it will help you get to high rating, so you can play the good ppl. | ||
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Glon
United States569 Posts
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Antithesis
Germany1240 Posts
On September 15 2011 06:50 Glon wrote: ... this is a shit build. a zerg canceling speed and getting out 6 fast banelings will A. kil your pylons before you put down the gateways and B. leave you with 0 tech and not even able to make nexus Do you have a replay of this? | ||
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Zrana
United Kingdom698 Posts
On September 14 2011 18:28 dicex wrote: Brilliant strategy, thanks for working out the strategic details. Really shows why you are a high masters protoss. Indeed, this is the kind of protoss build that shows it really is the race that takes the most skill! | ||
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crbox
Canada1180 Posts
Then people wonder why there's (almost) no good toss at the pro level... | ||
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MormonWithoutACause
United States94 Posts
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Matiz_pl
Poland163 Posts
 Any tips? I'm doing 1 drone patrol at 2:15 min mark cuz i figured its the timing when it should come usually. It hurts my eco a bit, any other ideas how to prevent it? I pretty much feel once the ramp is walled its over, i've played vs much worse protoss players but they managed to do it and i was behind for the whole game if i try to macro | ||
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TolEranceNA
Canada434 Posts
On September 15 2011 06:57 Zrana wrote: Indeed, this is the kind of protoss build that shows it really is the race that takes the most skill! Your logic is flawless my friend. | ||
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Irishladdie
United States8 Posts
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McGuire72
Canada140 Posts
On September 15 2011 02:30 iNkopwnz wrote: what i was trying to say is that i came up with this 'on the run', as in i just improvised - it worked - i tried it again - and it worked like a charm. i didnt go and search for some 'pvz cheezes' on the forums rofl u understand that i dont watch or play enough sc2 ? u dont even know who i am and yet u judge me, wtf is wrong with u? Ok, well congratulations on discovering the cannon rush/pylon block strategy. Sorry I don't know who you are; apparently, you aren't anyone important. Keep a look out for my new and exciting 7 roach rush cheese that I invented-- the thread will be coming soon. Zergs: Pool first, patrol drone on ramp, play standard. Don't complain about this or question "why" one might do it. People will do it because, if not prepared for properly, it can be devastating. So, prepare for it and EXPECT it vs. and forge-first protoss. To quote Deezer... EZ. | ||
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