I tried this build and in plat league zergs will make a ton of lings and deny my probe plotting those 2-3 pylons. Then they have speed and take down my incoming stalkers. It works if you catch them offgaurd.

Parnass

Germany145 Posts

August 13 2011 11:42 GMT

#43

I just got promoted to plat with this ( was tethering on the brink of plat for a while). PvZ my most hated matchup has become fun again

I think more often than not you can plant the pylons and put down some cannons, by the time he breaks the contain with roaches and spines his econ will be far too behind to catch up if you don't fuck up

Ihsahn

Chile132 Posts

August 13 2011 11:47 GMT

#44

edited: sorry wrong thread :S

ssregitoss

Turkey241 Posts

August 13 2011 14:43 GMT

#45

the problem with this build is mid master zergs always scout with tenth drone which pro gamers dont do.

esc0bar

Canada112 Posts

August 13 2011 15:42 GMT

#46

Wrote your name down to the 7 pool list.

ForeverSleep

Canada920 Posts

August 13 2011 15:56 GMT

#47

On August 13 2011 23:43 ssregitoss wrote:
the problem with this build is mid master zergs always scout with tenth drone which pro gamers dont do.

yes? and how does that matter?

galivet

288 Posts

August 13 2011 16:08 GMT

#48

I'm finding it really frustrating trying this build and haven't won with it yet. every zerg sees that i'm doing something a little nonstandard with the early scout and then just builds an extra queen and more early zerlings. The pylon grid doesn't help with 2 queens and 8 zerlings against 2 zealots, a stalker, and 2 probes.

Must be yet another build that only work in the master/GM metagame where zergs are gentlemanly and generally just don't build early attacking units unless they're hit over the head with a hammer.

infinity.

United States37 Posts

August 13 2011 16:09 GMT

#49

Very interesting and creative, well done.

Farkinator

United States283 Posts

August 13 2011 16:46 GMT

#50

Seems like one hella hard thing to deal with while trying to keep your hatch alive.

I have one question: how does this fare against Zerg players who open speedling expand? the LZgamer replay showed its effectiveness vs that kind of opener, but I'm rather skeptical about this replay demonstrating its effectiveness vs a speedling expand. LzGamer did NOT play optimally in any way shape or form. I'm just worried because this early in the game, forgetting an overlord on 9 and not doing an extractor trick can set Zerg behind. With something like this, I'm worried that it drastically altered his timings. You can already see that his speed was VERY VERY late. Do you happen to have replays of a normally timed sling expand?

Vlare

748 Posts

August 13 2011 18:47 GMT

#51

Any zerg who early scouts and actually checks what building is being warped in will be 100% safe from this. Lings can intercept the probes early and he should be able to get a queen/ enough ling/drone no problem.

I wish the zergs I played against didnt scout so I could get away with stuff like this.

However, if you are lucky enough to not have it scouted and have Z react poorly it puts you in a VERY strong position, so long as you do not over commit up his ramp and die to his all in.

birdkicker

United States752 Posts

August 13 2011 21:41 GMT

#52

hey it's me :o

You were suppose to get ht

Hister

United States89 Posts

August 13 2011 23:40 GMT

#53

On August 14 2011 01:46 Farkinator wrote:
Seems like one hella hard thing to deal with while trying to keep your hatch alive.

I have one question: how does this fare against Zerg players who open speedling expand? the LZgamer replay showed its effectiveness vs that kind of opener, but I'm rather skeptical about this replay demonstrating its effectiveness vs a speedling expand. LzGamer did NOT play optimally in any way shape or form. I'm just worried because this early in the game, forgetting an overlord on 9 and not doing an extractor trick can set Zerg behind. With something like this, I'm worried that it drastically altered his timings. You can already see that his speed was VERY VERY late. Do you happen to have replays of a normally timed sling expand?

I can still block and delay the FE even with speedlings. However I go back to my base and get ready for another timing push rather than try to hold his natural all game. If I've played someone whose seen me do this I basically just fake it and force 20 lings early and get a scout on his gas to see his speed timing so I know when to run.

Slackware

Australia2 Posts

August 14 2011 08:04 GMT

#54

Just wanted to jump on and say thanks! I'm a high platinum Protoss player that has been struggling very badly with PvZ. I always feel like I'm on the back foot, behind from the start. I tried this a few times on the ladder and it works a treat.

I usually kill the hatch and set up a couple cannons as a contain, then expand behind it. Feels really good to not lose every PvZ I play now!

barrykp

Ireland174 Posts

August 14 2011 12:39 GMT

#55

So what is the proper zerg response? And at what point should a zerg realise this is happening?

AFX

United States1 Post

August 14 2011 15:33 GMT

#56

Thank you. I have been practicing this and it is working great

Even when I fail (50%) I can still recover and win.

hocash

United States82 Posts

August 16 2011 07:12 GMT

#57

This is a pretty sick build. They key, I think, is to delay probes after gate completes and chrono out that 1 zealot right away. Never stop chrono until your 2nd zeal is out. Then grab another probe (or 2 if you lost the 1st) and head to zerg base while chrono on the stalker. Throw down a forge, research warpgate. You'll get there and rarely will they have more than 6 lings if not just 2 or 4.

Don't think it's necessary to expand behind this. Just 5 gate for the most part and take it down. Don't skimp on the zealots as they are the key obv to beating a bunch of speedlings as well as keeping your army somewhat bunched up.

Cloudshade

91 Posts

August 16 2011 22:50 GMT

#58

wow this is very interesting! I like how you think on your toes with the pylon wallin to protect your units quite innovative. This is definitely something that will be game changing in pvz because zergs have to be much more weary of just producing only 2-4 lings now if they want a chance to hold this off. But my question to you is, have any zergs held this off before? and if so how did they hold it off? Secondly, you open gateway first on tal darim, so in the case where the zerg goes any pool under 10 pool how do you deal with it? cuz if he goes straight for the pylon that could be a problem I can see that might be quite tough to deal with. Regardless this is a very good timing you've found because I noticed that the expo hatch has just finished in most cases where the zerg CAN'T utilize their fresh expansion. Props to you Hister.

EDIT: oh yea when I ask have zergs held this off before, I mean against zergs who haven't played against you doing this strat before.

Blazinghand

United States25557 Posts

August 16 2011 23:39 GMT

#59

I swear I read this as "Hipster's PvZ Pylon Pressure" and I was thoroughly alarmed. Having read through it, though, I could see how these pylons could help you gain an advantage against a zerg player whose real goal is to get the hatch up and spam only drones and no units.

Cloudshade

91 Posts

August 17 2011 01:57 GMT

#60

On August 12 2011 03:42 pwadoc wrote:
What happens if the zerg anticipates this strategy, and uses their first queen to plant a tumor to deny the pylons?

fortunately, lol the first tumor doesn't spread that fast unless the zerg wants to sac his first inject I don't think thats the solution to stop this strat

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