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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. |
On September 12 2011 05:03 ToastieNL wrote:
To make my switch to Random complete, I need to learn to play Terran too.
Now, I'm looking for some (macro- oriented) builds as Terran. They should not be too hard to execute at first, but leave room for improvement!
Do any of you have any suggestions as to what Builds I could try to use for this? I was thinking of:
TvP - 1 Rax no gas FE into 3rax/1fac/1SP+double ups
TvZ - Reactor Hellion into MarineTankHellion (I like to think that 1 Reactor Factory is a really good addition instead of another reactorrax, as blueflame splash rules bigtime vs Zerglings)
TvT - No Idea, I guess both other build work quite well?
Also, I'm looking for a HerO to stalk. Who is a really good, solid Terran Player of whom there's quite a lot of replays around, who is easy to stalk?
Kind regards and thanks in advance,
Toastie
watch vods of demuslim
his last 2 are with commentary even, gold
edit: on his channel twitch.tv/demuslim
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On September 12 2011 05:03 ToastieNL wrote:
To make my switch to Random complete, I need to learn to play Terran too.
Now, I'm looking for some (macro- oriented) builds as Terran. They should not be too hard to execute at first, but leave room for improvement!
Do any of you have any suggestions as to what Builds I could try to use for this? I was thinking of:
TvP - 1 Rax no gas FE into 3rax/1fac/1SP+double ups
TvZ - Reactor Hellion into MarineTankHellion (I like to think that 1 Reactor Factory is a really good addition instead of another reactorrax, as blueflame splash rules bigtime vs Zerglings)
TvT - No Idea, I guess both other build work quite well?
Also, I'm looking for a HerO to stalk. Who is a really good, solid Terran Player of whom there's quite a lot of replays around, who is easy to stalk?
Kind regards and thanks in advance,
Toastie
I don't reallykeep track of replays as much, but my favorite streamers are Trump (http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/Trump), rgnArtist (http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/TeamReign), Sterling(http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/Sterling), and sPsDEBO (http://www.teamliquid.net/video/streams/Debo). I think these guys keep VoDs of their play, but I don't know about replays/replay packs. Artist and Sterling are both GM players.
On September 12 2011 04:45 Maxie wrote:
Gah, TvT isn't going well for me at the moment, all my builds seem to die to early siege tank attacks. If I open blue flame hellions 1-1-1 + expand, I die to siege tanks. If I go bio + expand, I die to siege tanks (I go for combat shields first because of blue flame hellions, if the attack hits before stim im screwed, if it hits after stim I'm ok). I really want to have an early expansion since I'm the most comfortable when on 2-3 bases, and having more bases than my opponent is the way I want to play...
What should I do? My current thought is to be more active with my units, control watchtowers and try to catch him unseiged. I really don't want to open with an early siege tank build myself, I really prefer transitioning into them later on, if at all.
If you're opening with any sort of starport-before-expo, you need to use the starport to scout for tank allins. If you're dropping him, or banshee harassing, you'll see if he's going tanks. Against a tank player, produce a banshee or two and keep your blue flame hellions alive. Use the hellions to kill the marines, or soften them up enough that your banshees can auto-win for you.
If you're going for a bio expand, you'll have some more trouble. If you know he's going for tanks, be active around the map with your bio, and if you can, force him to siege up, then back up, repeat a couple of times without bleeding too many units, until you have stim. If you're lucky you could actually catch him unsieged and kill his tanks, but you can't rely on this. Another thought is flanking-- if you can come from behind and the front/side at the same time, his tanks will be far less effective.
+ Show Spoiler [GSL August spoiler] +
MVP vs TOP game 3 (or 4, whichever one was on bel-shir beach) shows how to fight sieged up siege tanks without using them yourself. Although MVP uses unsieged tanks to fight sieged tanks, the principles are the same with unstimmed bio vs sieged tanks.
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On September 12 2011 05:03 ToastieNL wrote:
To make my switch to Random complete, I need to learn to play Terran too.
Now, I'm looking for some (macro- oriented) builds as Terran. They should not be too hard to execute at first, but leave room for improvement!
Do any of you have any suggestions as to what Builds I could try to use for this? I was thinking of:
TvP - 1 Rax no gas FE into 3rax/1fac/1SP+double ups
TvZ - Reactor Hellion into MarineTankHellion (I like to think that 1 Reactor Factory is a really good addition instead of another reactorrax, as blueflame splash rules bigtime vs Zerglings)
TvT - No Idea, I guess both other build work quite well?
Also, I'm looking for a HerO to stalk. Who is a really good, solid Terran Player of whom there's quite a lot of replays around, who is easy to stalk?
Kind regards and thanks in advance,
Toastie
Im not sure about replays but as for Terrans that stream theres:
SlayerSDragon
Trump
Kas
(DeMusliM has started)
Beastyqt
Rainbow
You'll usually one of these guys when on TL, and between them Im sure you can find some replays. I believe qxc has a lot of replay packs and such hanging around since hes quite a popular player.
As for build orders, I do the TVP and TVZ BO you described(sometimes BF opening for TVZ), and for TVT I go reaper expand into bio or a ghost build that delays you expansion but counters almost every terran opener that seeks to do damage.
Its something like:
10 SD
11gas
12rax
15OC
15 marine
16 SD
16 ghost academy
17 tech lab
18 ghost
21 marauder
Add 1 rax and produce marines and push out w/2 ghosts and some marine/marauder. Expand behind it then add starport EBay etc and go for bio. Ghost will snipe bio, plus does extra damage to light units ie hellions and banshees, you can also emp cloaked banshees.
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@Blazinghand, thanks for the advice regarding bio play. Sadly I can't watch the GSL finals since I haven't paid for it (can only watch the first game), but I figured the proper thing to do would be something like that.
However, one game in particular was quite annoying.. I scanned him at 6:20 and saw a starport with tech lab and a factory with a glowing tech lab, so I expected blue flame hellions + Banshee... perhaps a dumb read, but whatever.
I keep my units in my base and put up turrets so that i'd be able to fend off the banshee(s), and once the turrets are up I move down to my nat and get hit by a rather odd marine - tank - banshee - raven attack.. PDD makes marauders worthless, sigh ;/ hit just a moment before stim, too... blargh.
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On September 12 2011 05:46 Maxie wrote:
@Blazinghand, thanks for the advice regarding bio play. Sadly I can't watch the GSL finals since I haven't paid for it (can only watch the first game), but I figured the proper thing to do would be something like that.
However, one game in particular was quite annoying.. I scanned him at 6:20 and saw a starport with tech lab and a factory with a glowing tech lab, so I expected blue flame hellions + Banshee... perhaps a dumb read, but whatever.
I keep my units in my base and put up turrets so that i'd be able to fend off the banshee(s), and once the turrets are up I move down to my nat and get hit by a rather odd marine - tank - banshee - raven attack.. PDD makes marauders worthless, sigh ;/ hit just a moment before stim, to... blargh.
Hm. If you upload the replay I can take a look and try to point out scouting hints to see this sort of thing coming.
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On September 12 2011 05:03 ToastieNL wrote:
To make my switch to Random complete, I need to learn to play Terran too.
Now, I'm looking for some (macro- oriented) builds as Terran. They should not be too hard to execute at first, but leave room for improvement!
Do any of you have any suggestions as to what Builds I could try to use for this? I was thinking of:
TvP - 1 Rax no gas FE into 3rax/1fac/1SP+double ups
TvZ - Reactor Hellion into MarineTankHellion (I like to think that 1 Reactor Factory is a really good addition instead of another reactorrax, as blueflame splash rules bigtime vs Zerglings)
TvT - No Idea, I guess both other build work quite well?
Also, I'm looking for a HerO to stalk. Who is a really good, solid Terran Player of whom there's quite a lot of replays around, who is easy to stalk?
Kind regards and thanks in advance,
Toastie
Halby's upper ups is fairly macro heavy and very straight forward, marine centered and quite flexible.
And it's a basic 2 rax expand vs all races, and thus by default macro oriented.
http://www.youtube.com/user/HalbyStarcraft
On a different note -
TvT is kinda different to what you'd expect though, it comes down to a ground battle and an air battle - you just need to dominate one to win, while not losing the other fully. I suggest you play the matchup a few times, you'll see what I mean. Typically tanks + vikings. 
TvZ is about pressure to disallow droning, you'll have a natural better understanding of that I assume - if you know the zerg side.
TvP - again, if you know toss it's a bit easier but this is my weakest matchup so I won't say much here 
Edit: Huge thanks to Blazinghand for his efforts and help proving to be extremely helpful. Having a (few) unsieged tanks ready to move out vs toss made a massive difference.
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Just one question:
if zerg gets 20-25+ mutas on a big map, is it auto-lose for terran?
- you can't kill mutas with marines because they just run away if see more than 10 marines
- less than 3 thors are useless because of magic box
- turrets are useless against 25 mutas
- if you mass vikings against mutas it is GG because of zerglings and banelings
I have a lot of problems with mass muta on Typhon Peaks... just can't defend against mutas on this shitty map...
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On September 12 2011 05:47 Blazinghand wrote:
[
Hm. If you upload the replay I can take a look and try to point out scouting hints to see this sort of thing coming.
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-231121.jpg)
Looking at the replay kinda hurts, if I had looked at the full duration of the scan I would've seen a Raven - instead I just looked at it briefly and assumed Banshee. Also I got supplyblocked (54/54) as well as messed up the build (got gas too early + some other stuff), wohoo.
I feel like the ~300 minerals I invested in engi bay + turrets really hurt when I had to fight, and I really should've had my units positioned better. Also a bit build order loss I feel...
Edit:
@ Aiurr: if they do magic box against thor marine medivac they'll lose a lot of mutas. Especially if you have good upgrades.
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On September 12 2011 06:00 Maxie wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 05:47 Blazinghand wrote:
[
Hm. If you upload the replay I can take a look and try to point out scouting hints to see this sort of thing coming. Looking at the replay kinda hurts, if I had looked at the full duration of the scan I would've seen a Raven - instead I just looked at it briefly and assumed Banshee. Also I got supplyblocked (54/54) as well as messed up the build (got gas too early + some other stuff), wohoo. I feel like the ~300 minerals I invested in engi bay + turrets really hurt when I had to fight, and I really should've had my units positioned better. Also a bit build order loss I feel... Edit: @ Aiurr: if they do magic box against thor marine medivac they'll lose a lot of mutas. Especially if you have good upgrades.
So, this one is a tough scout. Here's a coaching video I made while reviewing your replay:
http://www.twitch.tv/blazinghand/b/294850072
And here's a non-comprehensive summary of my findings:
Build order: fine
Macro: better than his
Scouting: mostly ok, except you couldn't tell that a tank allin was coming.
Scouting Solutions:
1) contest xel'naga towers - you saw he was going for a tech factory play. Was it tanks or hellions? if it's tanks, that's why you didn't see any with your scan. if it's hellions, your 6:30 scan would have seen them, except if they were at xel'naga tower. Send a marine to either claim tower or die to a hellion, giving you information.
2) minimap awareness - change colors to ally/enemy mode so that when he does that marine scout/poke, you know what's up
3) scouting with minimal information-- what does a 3 marine scout mean?
It's not a 1 marine scout-- clearly he's got stuff there. also he's not a bio player, since you saw tech lab factory and starport-- so those marines are accompanied by something.
What are they with? Probably starport units like banshees, ravens, etc. or just banshees.
What else are they with? something from a tech lab factory that researches in TvT. That means: blue flame hellions OR siege tanks. You know it's not hellions, because if he had hellions, he'd poke/scout with those since they're faster-- they'd naturally be at the front of his army anyways
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@ Aiurr: if they do magic box against thor marine medivac they'll lose a lot of mutas. Especially if you have good upgrades.
No they do not magic box. They just leave marines and thors to lings and banelings and go kill half of my base where I don't have thors and marines. I'd need a flying muta counter or build like 30 turrets all over the map.
I think I'll have to get bunkers with +2 armor upgrade on this map... I don't see me winning otherwise.
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hi again, i was wondering what is the standard game plan against a standard robo opening/ robo expanding protoss? like when to attack, what composition, what opening etc. Im having trouble in tcp now but i know my tvz and tvt matchup pretty well because of this three (thank you)
EDIT: What do i do against the protoss death ball! (someone help me please!)
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=264470¤tpage=4
This shit
Wat do?
Someone suggested 3 rax ghost 9-10 minute push to counter this as it comes around the same time, but then thats also an all in.
Im thinking stimmedprobe's million man marine build which would work well with constant pressure as long as you manage to get ghosts soon? but the +1 armor GS zealots will make mince meat out of marines :/
I am aware that BF hellion openers will easily shut this down as the toss moves out with sentries and zealots mainly with immortals (easy targets for BF) but with the BF nerf coming i dont think its as viable anymore.
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I thought i would make a post here instead of making a new thread so..
I am a SEA trueblu terran currently in platinum 1v1 and i wanted some thoughts on the way i play
A year ago when i started starcraft, I embedded the control group order of 1-main cc, 2-raxs, 3-factory 4-starport/units, 5 natural, 6 3rd expo, 7&8 units
I thought it was absolutely normal until my friend was watching me play and noted that even though i play decently, i have the most retarded control groups which look awkward
My questions are:
What control groups do you guys use?
Is it fine continuing with my 'retarded' control groups or should i change?
Is there a end-all be-all set of control groups?
I have tried changing a few times and i found it to be the most awkward experience ever
Any opinions will be valued, cheers
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Is a 1rax/1fac marauder-hellion expand any good against P?
Usually have expo started at ~7 mins at the nat, with conc shell researched and a reactor on the factory... has been working pretty well in high gold/low plat, but if its not going to work further up i don't want to keep using it :o
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On September 12 2011 14:28 liub wrote:
I thought i would make a post here instead of making a new thread so..
I am a SEA trueblu terran currently in platinum 1v1 and i wanted some thoughts on the way i play
A year ago when i started starcraft, I embedded the control group order of 1-main cc, 2-raxs, 3-factory 4-starport/units, 5 natural, 6 3rd expo, 7&8 units
I thought it was absolutely normal until my friend was watching me play and noted that even though i play decently, i have the most retarded control groups which look awkward
My questions are:
What control groups do you guys use?
Is it fine continuing with my 'retarded' control groups or should i change?
Is there a end-all be-all set of control groups?
I have tried changing a few times and i found it to be the most awkward experience ever
Any opinions will be valued, cheers
1) I use 1-3 for units, 4 for CCs, 5 for raxes, 6 for facts, 7 for starports, and 8 and 9 are for my e.bay and my armory. 8 and 9 are bound to my 4th and 5th mouse buttons. Im not a high level player, but that seems to be what a lot of people so.
2) I would change to something more efficient. It'll be weird at first, but its worth it.
3) Not necessarily, but there are some that are better than others.
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On September 12 2011 14:48 Censor wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 14:28 liub wrote:
I thought i would make a post here instead of making a new thread so..
I am a SEA trueblu terran currently in platinum 1v1 and i wanted some thoughts on the way i play
A year ago when i started starcraft, I embedded the control group order of 1-main cc, 2-raxs, 3-factory 4-starport/units, 5 natural, 6 3rd expo, 7&8 units
I thought it was absolutely normal until my friend was watching me play and noted that even though i play decently, i have the most retarded control groups which look awkward
My questions are:
What control groups do you guys use?
Is it fine continuing with my 'retarded' control groups or should i change?
Is there a end-all be-all set of control groups?
I have tried changing a few times and i found it to be the most awkward experience ever
Any opinions will be valued, cheers 1) I use 1-3 for units, 4 for CCs, 5 for raxes, 6 for facts, 7 for starports, and 8 and 9 are for my e.bay and my armory. 8 and 9 are bound to my 4th and 5th mouse buttons. Im not a high level player, but that seems to be what a lot of people so. 2) I would change to something more efficient. It'll be weird at first, but its worth it. 3) Not necessarily, but there are some that are better than others.
thanks for the advice
i never even thought of putting upgrades under a group! (would just dbl tap main cc to get to ebay and armory)
guess i'll have to tough it out for a while then
EDIT: Actually got another question; how come all the cc's are under one group?
i.e. what happens if you're moving a cc and you press s to make an scv when under the cc ctrl group.. isn't that a bit troublesome
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On September 12 2011 14:28 liub wrote:
I thought i would make a post here instead of making a new thread so..
I am a SEA trueblu terran currently in platinum 1v1 and i wanted some thoughts on the way i play
A year ago when i started starcraft, I embedded the control group order of 1-main cc, 2-raxs, 3-factory 4-starport/units, 5 natural, 6 3rd expo, 7&8 units
I thought it was absolutely normal until my friend was watching me play and noted that even though i play decently, i have the most retarded control groups which look awkward
My questions are:
What control groups do you guys use?
Is it fine continuing with my 'retarded' control groups or should i change?
Is there a end-all be-all set of control groups?
I have tried changing a few times and i found it to be the most awkward experience ever
Any opinions will be valued, cheers
#1) My typical hotkeys look something along the lines of
1- Ground army. Includes MMM, Thors, Hellions if I'm playing iEchoic-style TvT
2- Tanks.. sometimes Ghosts
3- Air army. Vikings, Banshees, Dropships
4- All CC's
5- All Barracks
6- All Factories
7- All Starports
0- Drops, Ravens, Ghosts (bound to ` key)
F2- Main base
F3- Natural
F4- Third
and so forth
I don't really use 8 or 9 cuz CTRL+8/9 is impossible to do with one hand and then it's a long reach. Maybe I should try binding them to my mouse buttons too.
#2) IMO if you play fine with your current hotkey setup then no need to change it. Perhaps you should try one of the more common hotkeys (similar to mine and above poster) and see if you like them better. Some also like to bind all their production to one hotkey and tab through.
#3) Not really.. personal preference
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On September 12 2011 15:19 Vestrel wrote:Show nested quote +On September 12 2011 14:28 liub wrote:
I thought i would make a post here instead of making a new thread so..
I am a SEA trueblu terran currently in platinum 1v1 and i wanted some thoughts on the way i play
A year ago when i started starcraft, I embedded the control group order of 1-main cc, 2-raxs, 3-factory 4-starport/units, 5 natural, 6 3rd expo, 7&8 units
I thought it was absolutely normal until my friend was watching me play and noted that even though i play decently, i have the most retarded control groups which look awkward
My questions are:
What control groups do you guys use?
Is it fine continuing with my 'retarded' control groups or should i change?
Is there a end-all be-all set of control groups?
I have tried changing a few times and i found it to be the most awkward experience ever
Any opinions will be valued, cheers #1) My typical hotkeys look something along the lines of 1- Ground army. Includes MMM, Thors, Hellions if I'm playing iEchoic-style TvT 2- Tanks.. sometimes Ghosts 3- Air army. Vikings, Banshees, Dropships 4- All CC's 5- All Barracks 6- All Factories 7- All Starports 0- Drops, Ravens, Ghosts (bound to ` key) F2- Main base F3- Natural F4- Third and so forth I don't really use 8 or 9 cuz CTRL+8/9 is impossible to do with one hand and then it's a long reach. Maybe I should try binding them to my mouse buttons too. #2) IMO if you play fine with your current hotkey setup then no need to change it. Perhaps you should try one of the more common hotkeys (similar to mine and above poster) and see if you like them better. Some also like to bind all their production to one hotkey and tab through. #3) Not really.. personal preference
thanks mate!
Yes i do play rather comfortably, but I just find that at times my set of control groups poses a lot of limitations to my play.. I guess it's what i get for trying to be indie and such.
No pain no gain, so i guess i'll force my fingers to learn
Gosh i envy the muscle memory of you blokes
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Blazinghand
United States25550 Posts
On September 12 2011 14:47 Active.815 wrote:
Is a 1rax/1fac marauder-hellion expand any good against P?
Usually have expo started at ~7 mins at the nat, with conc shell researched and a reactor on the factory... has been working pretty well in high gold/low plat, but if its not going to work further up i don't want to keep using it :o
It's okay, but it's really really vulnerable to a stargate allin (especially with a hidden/proxied stargate). If it weren't for this vulnerability it would be quite strong. I've done marauder/hellion compositions, and in the early game they're fine, but as protoss techs up they get access to units that are good against both (void rays, FF-supported colossi, storms).
I've seen it done as an allin, which is pretty fun, but if you do it as a regular play, keep a sharp eye open for void rays.
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TvP zealot HT archon
1. Do I really need that much apm to dodge storms while emping, while stutter stepping?
2. Do I emp all the units or spam emp on the archons/templars?
3. Do I run away from the storms or try to run into the HTs so they are obliged to storm themselves or is that a bad idea since i need to stutter step micro
4. Do I treat archons and templars like colo balls so that means I should focus fire every archon,HT in range first?
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EPT
