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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action. Also, please put some effort into your questions. |
On December 31 2011 05:59 Kyokai wrote:
I'm a plat terran and I'm having a lot of trouble dealing with mass speedlings.
I really like playing bio in TvZ but I always end up dying to mass speedlings and banelings.
Everytime Zerg just overruns my forces and I end up dying really badly.
This always happens at the early game 3 rax push and I lose all my forces.
Then he counterattacks me and I die. Any suggestions?
3rax push is pretty all-in...
also how I when I play Zerg _counters_ that push is to just make lots of lings and making 3-4 banelings to take care of your marines
The Zerg is doing what essentially kills your (semi?) all-in push.
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On December 31 2011 05:59 Kyokai wrote:
I'm a plat terran and I'm having a lot of trouble dealing with mass speedlings.
I really like playing bio in TvZ but I always end up dying to mass speedlings and banelings.
Everytime Zerg just overruns my forces and I end up dying really badly.
This always happens at the early game 3 rax push and I lose all my forces.
Then he counterattacks me and I die. Any suggestions?
If this 3 rax push is off from 1 base its kinda all inish and instead of doing that you should get expansion. if this is how ever 2 base push, get some upgrade/upgrades to make this push stronger, like combat shields or stim, you dont want to wait too much tho.
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On December 30 2011 20:54 saaaa wrote:
hi again,
i want to do my TvZ more flexible than now. I know always play the 2 Fac Reactor Hellion into TMM (Mvp Style) and it works quite nice but i want a build that is more flexible on my scouting infos etc.. for example against protoss i always do a 1rax FE but it depends on the opponents build if I do a 2 MediVac, +1, StimPack, Conc timining push or a 2 ghost timing push.
In fact, i saw that puma followed the 2 Reactor Hellion Push with Thor+BF Hellion but when i should do this...
if my opponent is going for the standard Muta+Ling+Bling?
if my opponent is going for Infestor+Ling?
if my opponent is going for MASS roaches?
if my opponent just build some roaches?
my thoughts till now:
against the muta composition you can play TMM or Thor+BF Hellion but i would say that the second is better..
against Infestor+Ling i would prefer TMM with fast Ghost and Drops
against MASS roaches i really dont know..
against some roaches just play TMM with some maradaur as support?
I'm just plat so be nice please ^^
anyone?
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Whether you want to play Marine/Tanks or pure mech after (double) Reactor Hellions is really up to you. Anyway, if you go double Reactor Hellions, most of the games should be decided by how much damage you did to the Zerg rather than your follow-up... If you want to play mech, get Tanks instead of Thors if he's going mass Roaches.
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I'm wondering if 2 rax is still viable tvz? I'm usually doing reactor hellion expo or 1 rax expo but I want to try out the 2 rax but I heard if the zerg defends well you're so far behind.
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On December 31 2011 06:28 IMoperator wrote:
I'm wondering if 2 rax is still viable tvz?
Well, short answer: yes.
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On December 31 2011 02:56 Blazinghand wrote:
Master T here to say that although 111 can be successful vs nex 1st, in general if u check out a toss thread on 111 their cheif complaint is that they WANT to nex 1st vs 111 but nex 1st is vulnerable to 2rax.
Honestly though a 1 rax gasless fe isnt that far behind nex 1st eco wise so id stick with that.
I don't need to post my level, ranking and point. Just watch Puma doing a 1/1/1 most of the time he still wins even if the toss went for fast nexus.
Maybe you should post your rank ? -.-"
Only if you wait too long before attacking. I've seen ThorZaIN win against Nexus first with 1-1-1; if I remember correctly, he attacked around 8'30 instead of the usual later timing. Of course, if you wait until 10' or 11', you will be crushed.
I didn't say it wasn't successful. Nexus first or 1 gate FE are protosses safest way to stop 1-1-1. The fact I even have to say this statement here, is mind boggling. Look in any protoss thread about 1-1-1. Every answer is 1 gate FE, cut at 40 probes, mass units. Or, nexus first.
It's not like 1-1-1 is suicide against 14/15/16nexus or 1 gate FE, it's just a harder road.
Hate to be what guy? The guy who uses his superior knowledge and experience to correct someone else's misinformation? I love that guy! I'm pretty sure most people like the guy who corrects people in a non-condescending manner...
Be that guy Jeffrey, and be proud of it.
Much love, my man. Recently, as I've been trolling/practicing in the diamond+ channel, I've gotten like 1-3 people a day actually responding and asking me questions on BNET about my TL posts. Not a single person yet has had a negative thing to say, and actually thank me for good posts.. It's very refreshing, and this too only makes it feel worthwhile. Thank you.
I'm wondering if 2 rax is still viable tvz? I'm usually doing reactor hellion expo or 1 rax expo but I want to try out the 2 rax but I heard if the zerg defends well you're so far behind.
Yes, the 11/11 or 10/10 proxy is much easier on zergs to stop if they scout it. If they don't, there's issues. But with drone pulls early and general drop a spine asap kind of tactics make it harder. The 12/13 or 12/14, or delayed 12/12(same time) are more economic and can still pose an offensive stance, while still expoing early. And, if they don't react at all well, you can still win with ease.
I don't need to post my level, ranking and point. Just watch Puma doing a 1/1/1 most of the time he still wins even if the toss went for fast nexus.
Maybe you should post your rank ? -.-"
My rank is shit. I haven't played on my name (iamjeffrey) in on ladder this season. My smurf is like 25-1 right now about to be in masters. However, I can post you a slew of replays of games I've won and you can see the play level. I'm slow, bad at micro, bad at macro, yet I draw/win against low GMs and top 8 masters on a consistent basis. Just search my name on drop.sc or gamereplays.org, friend.
I don't see how it's offensive to ask for peoples rank, in general, and points. Or hell, just a link to your account. If you're asking for advice, 9 times out of 10 a only stream watcher sub diamond player THINKS they know the game through in through as they live/play vicariously through their favorite streamer. It's shitty to say, and I know I will get flak for it, but advice is better from a more experienced PLAYER. Sure, a all streamer watcher silver play can know more intricate timings, but they can only suggest things they saw, timings they saw. They don't understand what goes into the strategy on a macro/micro level. Pick it apart as you will, it's just my opinion. Because some of this advice, and people saying random timings is such a joke. The 11:30 mutas guy...really? Just one example, but it's frustrating. People will have habitual errors if they take sub optimal advice.
Oh, and watching someone do a strategy that is their niche, and doing said strategy against a strategy that is MEANT to stop/not insta lose to 1-1-1 (nexus first/1gatefe) is a poor example of why it can still work.
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Hi there. I main Zerg but sometimes off-race as Terran.
Suppose I'm doing a no-gas FE (he scouts no gas, so he'll likely assume either that or 2 racks with one proxied or 3 rax scv all-in) against a hatch/gas/pool Zerg (and, because I scouted him late, I haven't scouted his gas timing, all I saw what the hatch) and don't want to burn a scan to find out if he's baneling-busting me. How many bunkers should I make/what should I do to be blindly safe against it? Or should I really burn that scan (I'm guessing around the 5:30-6:00 mark)?
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On December 31 2011 06:03 Roynalf wrote:Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 05:59 Kyokai wrote:
I'm a plat terran and I'm having a lot of trouble dealing with mass speedlings.
I really like playing bio in TvZ but I always end up dying to mass speedlings and banelings.
Everytime Zerg just overruns my forces and I end up dying really badly.
This always happens at the early game 3 rax push and I lose all my forces.
Then he counterattacks me and I die. Any suggestions? If this 3 rax push is off from 1 base its kinda all inish and instead of doing that you should get expansion. if this is how ever 2 base push, get some upgrade/upgrades to make this push stronger, like combat shields or stim, you dont want to wait too much tho.
ty!
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On December 31 2011 06:13 saaaa wrote:Show nested quote +On December 30 2011 20:54 saaaa wrote:
hi again,
i want to do my TvZ more flexible than now. I know always play the 2 Fac Reactor Hellion into TMM (Mvp Style) and it works quite nice but i want a build that is more flexible on my scouting infos etc.. for example against protoss i always do a 1rax FE but it depends on the opponents build if I do a 2 MediVac, +1, StimPack, Conc timining push or a 2 ghost timing push.
In fact, i saw that puma followed the 2 Reactor Hellion Push with Thor+BF Hellion but when i should do this...
if my opponent is going for the standard Muta+Ling+Bling?
if my opponent is going for Infestor+Ling?
if my opponent is going for MASS roaches?
if my opponent just build some roaches?
my thoughts till now:
against the muta composition you can play TMM or Thor+BF Hellion but i would say that the second is better..
against Infestor+Ling i would prefer TMM with fast Ghost and Drops
against MASS roaches i really dont know..
against some roaches just play TMM with some maradaur as support?
I'm just plat so be nice please ^^ anyone?
1 by 1:
1) Against muta-ling-bling both can work indeed, but it is map dependant. Mech favors maps with narrow chokes that don't surround easily, and I'd say on more open maps it's still viable but TMM starts to win out. Another downside of mech is the (very) late game, since mech loses quite a bit of it's power once you get a sufficient number of broodlords (or roaches).
2) Infestor ling (if you see it coming early) is extremely vulnerable to BFH + marine pushes. Hit right before the infestors should come out. Start off with a 2 rax for some pressure, expand behind it, add another rax, add double gas and get a double fact (1 lab for BF), hit when BF is done with 6-8 hellions and 20+ marines. Another option is adding an early 2nd factory to simply crank out more tanks, they do deal with both infestors and lings very well.
3) Mass roach get's shutdown by standard tank marine medivac with upgrades, at some point even marines kill roaches cost-effectively. Add in marauders and you'll be in even better shape.
4) I'm not sure what you mean with some roaches, but the way I see it there's 2 options: Early defensive roaches as added security against hellions or early aggressive roaches. In the first case, be happy he delayed his build by getting roaches and proceed with a tank + marine + medivac timing, which will be slightly stronger and you can delay it a little because mutas will be later). If there's aggressive roaches, your options depend entirely on what you're capable of building at that point in time. A single marauder in a bunker works wonders, as does an early tank.
Overall, I wouldn't switch out of reactored hellion openers tho, because they are incredibly versatile as it is. You can mix in a 2 rax when you feel like it, especially on smaller maps, but overall there aren't many builds that are as economically balanced as reactored hellions, yet still allow you to pressure.
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On December 31 2011 04:38 GuiRao wrote:Hi, I'm having trouble with Protoss. Here's the replay, if anyone can tell me what things i did wrong and what could have done better. Basically the game went even and at the engage i lost too many units (even tho i had superior army value). http://sc2rep.com/replays/download?id=16995
Can anyone help me with this? Thanks.
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Can anyone give me a run down of some basic TvT openings?
I'm a Diamond Terran, and in TvT i open 1 rax expo into 3 rax pumping marines/stim, which gives me a lot of trouble against certain builds.
I just don't really know any good openings. I generally macro every game and feel cloaked banshee sucks, and i'm not a huge fan of hellion drops. Outside of that i feel my only option is 1 rax expo.
Any advice on some basic openings i can try to work on?
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On December 31 2011 07:40 Derez wrote:Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 06:13 saaaa wrote:On December 30 2011 20:54 saaaa wrote:
hi again,
i want to do my TvZ more flexible than now. I know always play the 2 Fac Reactor Hellion into TMM (Mvp Style) and it works quite nice but i want a build that is more flexible on my scouting infos etc.. for example against protoss i always do a 1rax FE but it depends on the opponents build if I do a 2 MediVac, +1, StimPack, Conc timining push or a 2 ghost timing push.
In fact, i saw that puma followed the 2 Reactor Hellion Push with Thor+BF Hellion but when i should do this...
if my opponent is going for the standard Muta+Ling+Bling?
if my opponent is going for Infestor+Ling?
if my opponent is going for MASS roaches?
if my opponent just build some roaches?
my thoughts till now:
against the muta composition you can play TMM or Thor+BF Hellion but i would say that the second is better..
against Infestor+Ling i would prefer TMM with fast Ghost and Drops
against MASS roaches i really dont know..
against some roaches just play TMM with some maradaur as support?
I'm just plat so be nice please ^^ anyone? 1 by 1: 1) Against muta-ling-bling both can work indeed, but it is map dependant. Mech favors maps with narrow chokes that don't surround easily, and I'd say on more open maps it's still viable but TMM starts to win out. Another downside of mech is the (very) late game, since mech loses quite a bit of it's power once you get a sufficient number of broodlords (or roaches). 2) Infestor ling (if you see it coming early) is extremely vulnerable to BFH + marine pushes. Hit right before the infestors should come out. Start off with a 2 rax for some pressure, expand behind it, add another rax, add double gas and get a double fact (1 lab for BF), hit when BF is done with 6-8 hellions and 20+ marines. Another option is adding an early 2nd factory to simply crank out more tanks, they do deal with both infestors and lings very well. 3) Mass roach get's shutdown by standard tank marine medivac with upgrades, at some point even marines kill roaches cost-effectively. Add in marauders and you'll be in even better shape. 4) I'm not sure what you mean with some roaches, but the way I see it there's 2 options: Early defensive roaches as added security against hellions or early aggressive roaches. In the first case, be happy he delayed his build by getting roaches and proceed with a tank + marine + medivac timing, which will be slightly stronger and you can delay it a little because mutas will be later). If there's aggressive roaches, your options depend entirely on what you're capable of building at that point in time. A single marauder in a bunker works wonders, as does an early tank. Overall, I wouldn't switch out of reactored hellion openers tho, because they are incredibly versatile as it is. You can mix in a 2 rax when you feel like it, especially on smaller maps, but overall there aren't many builds that are as economically balanced as reactored hellions, yet still allow you to pressure.
1) ok i get it
2) and should i follow up my 2 fac reactor hellion push with Thor+BF Hellion or with TMM?
3) with mass roaches i mean only roaches with upgrades.. they crush the TMM in the early stages because siege tanks are maybe nice against in high numbers but if i only have 2-3 they crush me and i have to go defensive
4) with this option is mean just a couple more than the initial defensive roaches but not only like option 3
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+ Show Spoiler +On December 31 2011 04:48 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 02:42 GzStrom wrote:
Anecdotal evidence of a game a pro used 1 build vs another and won means very little besides 'its possible', 1/1/1 tends to come down to control mostly & puma is a 1/1/1 god. Most masters toss players I know consider nexus 1st to be very good vs 1/1/1 It's a matter of timing. Attacking too late = freelose. Attacking earlier than expected with Bunkers and Tanks with Siege Mode (instead of delaying it) can definitely work. Your opponent will have to get at least 2 Obs because of Banshees (he has to assume Cloak, otherwise he might lose straightaway), which will delay his Immortals, which should allow you to establish a good Bunker push on his natural. Then it comes down to micro, etc. Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 03:07 spbelky wrote:
What are the best ways of correctly identifying an aggressive (all in or not) "6gate"? as opposed to just an expanding toss who has six gateways... and perhaps a tech structure somewhere my scouts/scans have missed.
Expanding on that question, what is to stop the Protoss from just having 6 gateways, proxy pylons on the map, applying a little bit of pressure, but in reality be teching behind it. Meanwhile I've thrown up quite a few bunkers and kept scvs at the ready for his 6gate. At what point should I know that he isn't actually "6gating" me and what is the best response? This is definitely tricky, but here are some signs: 1. Army composition: Mostly Zealots/Sentries by early game; he has to build up his energy count since Forcefields and Guardian Shield are the key in his push. Since he invests his gas in Sentries and takes late gases on his natural, he will have few or no Stalkers before he moves out to try to kill you (e. g. MC vs MVP on TDA @ MLG Providence). 2. Late gases on the natural (perhaps around 8'30), fewer Probes than usual (they will cut Probes around 40). I may add 3. no Robo and thefore no Immortal and no Observer; though noticing the lack of those units is definitely tricky, especially for the Observer, it's an additional sign. (Besides, from what I watched, Protoss are very often on 5GR when they go Colossi, not 6GR.) Knowing if he will commit or not comes down to: a) your scouting — e. g. have a Marine somewhere around the map to check if he's going a third, or have your Factory float over his base to see if he went double Forge and Council behind his pressure, etc. b) his degree of agressivity; basically, if he's all-in, he will not wait too long before trying to kill you. Sure, he may pick bunkers and retreat while warping additional rounds of whatever he needs, but as time should be against him he will not wait too long. If he's pressuring for too long, it should mean he's teching something behind his 6-gate. There should be a SaSe vs SeleCT game @ DreamHack Winter (?) showing this. Show nested quote +I can easily win vs a protoss using cheesy tactics or midgame timings, but whenever i get into the lategame (20+ warpgates) and the 2 deathballs collide, i can take the deathball out, but then i get struck by 20 warpgate reinforcements.
Is there anything i can do in TvP lategame? the toss simply outproduces me, even when i'm on 16raxes and more... Have a heavily-defended position in which you can retreat. This is the most important thing. If you don't have PF/bunkers/etc. to fall back on, retard warp-ins will kill you even if you have many Barracks. Build additional Ghost Academies, get Cloak if you don't alreavy have it and start nuking his expands/tech/Warpgates. Build macro OCs and progressively get rid of some of your SCVs so you have a bigger army size than him.
Wow you give really good advises ! Im really impressed, this helps me a lot (and im high masters) 
Can anyone give me a run down of some basic TvT openings?
I'm a Diamond Terran, and in TvT i open 1 rax expo into 3 rax pumping marines/stim, which gives me a lot of trouble against certain builds.
I just don't really know any good openings. I generally macro every game and feel cloaked banshee sucks, and i'm not a huge fan of hellion drops. Outside of that i feel my only option is 1 rax expo.
Any advice on some basic openings i can try to work on?
Cloaked banshee is not bad, if you work on your micro, you can do a lot of damage. Also :
Hellion/Marine/Medivac push -> Very strong, allows you to apply pressure, then expand, then tech in a little time. Try to drop and attack his wall (if he has). You can either immediately expand, or take 2nd gas, build tech lab on Starport while pressure and go Banshee.
There is reaper expand too, or just Reactored Rax and Siege Tanks to expand. In diamond I recommend these builds, aswell as Banshee opening.
If you want to allin on some TvT's, you can do a Tank/Marine/banshee push on one base, just do a banshee opening and then pump out marines and tanks. Push at 10min, with ~6 scvs ( I won Funkay with that).
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On December 31 2011 10:34 Nightshake wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On December 31 2011 04:48 TheDwf wrote:Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 02:42 GzStrom wrote:
Anecdotal evidence of a game a pro used 1 build vs another and won means very little besides 'its possible', 1/1/1 tends to come down to control mostly & puma is a 1/1/1 god. Most masters toss players I know consider nexus 1st to be very good vs 1/1/1 It's a matter of timing. Attacking too late = freelose. Attacking earlier than expected with Bunkers and Tanks with Siege Mode (instead of delaying it) can definitely work. Your opponent will have to get at least 2 Obs because of Banshees (he has to assume Cloak, otherwise he might lose straightaway), which will delay his Immortals, which should allow you to establish a good Bunker push on his natural. Then it comes down to micro, etc. Show nested quote +On December 31 2011 03:07 spbelky wrote:
What are the best ways of correctly identifying an aggressive (all in or not) "6gate"? as opposed to just an expanding toss who has six gateways... and perhaps a tech structure somewhere my scouts/scans have missed.
Expanding on that question, what is to stop the Protoss from just having 6 gateways, proxy pylons on the map, applying a little bit of pressure, but in reality be teching behind it. Meanwhile I've thrown up quite a few bunkers and kept scvs at the ready for his 6gate. At what point should I know that he isn't actually "6gating" me and what is the best response? This is definitely tricky, but here are some signs: 1. Army composition: Mostly Zealots/Sentries by early game; he has to build up his energy count since Forcefields and Guardian Shield are the key in his push. Since he invests his gas in Sentries and takes late gases on his natural, he will have few or no Stalkers before he moves out to try to kill you (e. g. MC vs MVP on TDA @ MLG Providence). 2. Late gases on the natural (perhaps around 8'30), fewer Probes than usual (they will cut Probes around 40). I may add 3. no Robo and thefore no Immortal and no Observer; though noticing the lack of those units is definitely tricky, especially for the Observer, it's an additional sign. (Besides, from what I watched, Protoss are very often on 5GR when they go Colossi, not 6GR.) Knowing if he will commit or not comes down to: a) your scouting — e. g. have a Marine somewhere around the map to check if he's going a third, or have your Factory float over his base to see if he went double Forge and Council behind his pressure, etc. b) his degree of agressivity; basically, if he's all-in, he will not wait too long before trying to kill you. Sure, he may pick bunkers and retreat while warping additional rounds of whatever he needs, but as time should be against him he will not wait too long. If he's pressuring for too long, it should mean he's teching something behind his 6-gate. There should be a SaSe vs SeleCT game @ DreamHack Winter (?) showing this. Show nested quote +I can easily win vs a protoss using cheesy tactics or midgame timings, but whenever i get into the lategame (20+ warpgates) and the 2 deathballs collide, i can take the deathball out, but then i get struck by 20 warpgate reinforcements.
Is there anything i can do in TvP lategame? the toss simply outproduces me, even when i'm on 16raxes and more... Have a heavily-defended position in which you can retreat. This is the most important thing. If you don't have PF/bunkers/etc. to fall back on, retard warp-ins will kill you even if you have many Barracks. Build additional Ghost Academies, get Cloak if you don't alreavy have it and start nuking his expands/tech/Warpgates. Build macro OCs and progressively get rid of some of your SCVs so you have a bigger army size than him. Wow you give really good advises ! Im really impressed, this helps me a lot (and im high masters) Show nested quote +
Can anyone give me a run down of some basic TvT openings?
I'm a Diamond Terran, and in TvT i open 1 rax expo into 3 rax pumping marines/stim, which gives me a lot of trouble against certain builds.
I just don't really know any good openings. I generally macro every game and feel cloaked banshee sucks, and i'm not a huge fan of hellion drops. Outside of that i feel my only option is 1 rax expo.
Any advice on some basic openings i can try to work on?
Cloaked banshee is not bad, if you work on your micro, you can do a lot of damage. Also : Hellion/Marine/Medivac push -> Very strong, allows you to apply pressure, then expand, then tech in a little time. Try to drop and attack his wall (if he has). You can either immediately expand, or take 2nd gas, build tech lab on Starport while pressure and go Banshee. There is reaper expand too, or just Reactored Rax and Siege Tanks to expand. In diamond I recommend these builds, aswell as Banshee opening. If you want to allin on some TvT's, you can do a Tank/Marine/banshee push on one base, just do a banshee opening and then pump out marines and tanks. Push at 10min, with ~6 scvs ( I won Funkay with that).
Thanks for these. I'm generally a very passive player and my micro is pretty terrible, so i suppose i really should practice more micro intensive stuff.
TvT is weird for me because there is no real "standard" build, just whatever you feel like doing in the moment. Its been tough for me to get used to since i switched to Terran.
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Ok, so my TvZ is severely suffering right now, and it's only against muta players. My question is, exactly how do you wrestle back map control from mass muta players while playing the marine/tank style? I mean, every time, their mutas stroll in, kill all my turrets, couple of scvs, run from my marines with minimal casualties, then expand like no tomorrow, while I'm stuck on three base.
D: halp plz
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On January 01 2012 00:52 deathtrance wrote:
Ok, so my TvZ is severely suffering right now, and it's only against muta players. My question is, exactly how do you wrestle back map control from mass muta players while playing the marine/tank style? I mean, every time, their mutas stroll in, kill all my turrets, couple of scvs, run from my marines with minimal casualties, then expand like no tomorrow, while I'm stuck on three base.
D: halp plz
So, the thing is, you can't really have map control while the opponent has a significant number of mutas. So, what you need to do is both make sure that when you are in your base, you are adequately defended so you can minimize damage (good marine spread appropriate for the number of mutas, thors if he gets more than about 10-15, good zoning with your turrets (basically that means placing more turrets in places that are good outside attack angles, and using marines to cover the middle space).
However, perhaps more importantly, you need to try to make the muta player use his mutas to actually fight you. If your opponent invests 1000 gas into 10 mutas at the 11:00 mark, his useful fighting army will be smaller. This means you can push out -- make sure you save a couple scans so you can move out and avoid flanks, then go and see if you can siege up in a good spot, around a third if he has one or near his natural if he's 2 basing. Most of the time, the muta player will need to bring back his mutas to help try to pick off tanks and stray marines, and this means he's not harassing your base. Build CC's at your main, then move out, then try to secure the next base, whether that's a 3rd, 4th, etc.
Also, at some point you should be doing drops. They are harder when mutas are out, but you should still do them. If you fly past an overlord or scouting zergling, kill it so that future drops are more likely to be successful. Also, if your marine ups are good, you can usually bring a muta or two down with you, so the drops are not totally useless.
Dropping, then moving out, then expanding, and then repeating is kind of the idea of TvZ. It's more important to do this well when mutas are out than infestors, which will tax your micro more but are easier to plan against because they are slow.
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On January 01 2012 00:52 deathtrance wrote:
Ok, so my TvZ is severely suffering right now, and it's only against muta players. My question is, exactly how do you wrestle back map control from mass muta players while playing the marine/tank style? I mean, every time, their mutas stroll in, kill all my turrets, couple of scvs, run from my marines with minimal casualties, then expand like no tomorrow, while I'm stuck on three base.
D: halp plz
I was getting pwned by mutas for a good month or two. I just had to tweak my build a little bit (I go mech). One of the things I did was to get upgrades for the turrets, the +1 range and +2 armor. This might be harder for you to do since you have bio to upgrade, but I feel its total worth it to get these, the turrets do more damage and last a lot longer. When I'm ready to push I just build turrets in the necessary places and roll out. I am getting use to seeing zergs suicide their mutas because they have no idea that I have hardcore bad ass turrets.
I would like to know what other people think about these upgrades and if they get them as well.
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On January 01 2012 00:52 deathtrance wrote:
Ok, so my TvZ is severely suffering right now, and it's only against muta players. My question is, exactly how do you wrestle back map control from mass muta players while playing the marine/tank style? I mean, every time, their mutas stroll in, kill all my turrets, couple of scvs, run from my marines with minimal casualties, then expand like no tomorrow, while I'm stuck on three base.
D: halp plz
Midgame TvZ is kinda like PvT, you just sit back on 3 base making your ultimate terran army while defending harassment and then you just take your 200/200 army and splat them.
This doesn't mean you aren't doing some harassment of your own, but you should have plenty of marines back at base to defend mutas.
Don't worry if zerg has an extra base, they are allowed to because your army is more efficient than theirs.
Their mutas can't be everywhere at once. if all they kill is a couple of turrets and a couple of SCV for a couple of mutas, that is nothing to worry about. Meanwhile that medivac drop you sent out is safe in the knowledge that the mutas are elsewhere.
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EPT
