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Used this opener a few times last night in random 4v4 and worked a treat.
The early reapers did some good damage to the mineral line of one player, which then also causes him to play defensively. Generally in 4v4 you don't push out unless everyone is coming, so this may help delay pushes while the attacked player rebuild their econ and sits in defense mode for a bit.
It also caused the other players to move some units to their minerals as wait for potential reapers. Leaving the early expo follow up pretty safe to do. Granted this was only a sample size of 2, but it was fun and I'll keep doing it next time I hit up some 4v4.
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Germany226 Posts
Althoug I haven't watch the replays nor I'm a fan of rushes I think this bo is really interesting, gonna give it a try, thx for posting!
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Great build! I tend to favor the TvT opening that 4k.Warden uses but this is a great use of early mobility to get the eco lead.
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Woah I have come up against this 4x in a row tonight and luckily knew to leave my troops in the mineral line. Gas first banshee seems to really hurt this build because if you fend off the reapers, then suddenly your banshee is able to pick off marines, scvs and even tanks.
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Great build thanks so much - I am looking forward to trying this out soon.
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On July 12 2011 19:52 antz0r wrote:
Woah I have come up against this 4x in a row tonight and luckily knew to leave my troops in the mineral line. Gas first banshee seems to really hurt this build because if you fend off the reapers, then suddenly your banshee is able to pick off marines, scvs and even tanks.
You should check out the youtube video in the OP - when the reapers hit his oppenent's base he see the tach lab starport and immediately drops an engi bay.
By the time the banshee chases the reapers away and heads to his base he is greeted by missile turrets and starports on the way ready to produce vikings.
I agree that if you don't react in time to scouting the incoming banshee, it's gonna hurt but you can prepare for it if you react fast enough.
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I once was completely caught off guard when a Terran player used this build against me, a Protoss. I think you should make a TvP variant of this build. Very creative, by the way.
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I've held this build off all of the 3 times it was used against me.
1 Gas 1/1/1 gets you enough to make marines hellions banshees and a relatively early expo for a good transition into marine tank or mech.
All you gotta do is keep your marines at your mineral line.
If the reapers run away injured chase them down with your hellion. Sure in a fair fight reapers will win but the hellions can just run away. 
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On July 14 2011 08:15 edc wrote:
I once was completely caught off guard when a Terran player used this build against me, a Protoss. I think you should make a TvP variant of this build. Very creative, by the way.
Did you fend it off? If so, how?
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Wouldn't a Stalker in the mineral line do it? Just the same as a Marauder in the mineral line hurts this build in TvT.
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Just used this on ladder a couple of times. It's also, as some have stated, very effective against Zerg. Provided you don't let your Macro slip too much while Micro-ing the Reapers, the economic lead you'll get is outstanding, not to mention the loads of scouting information you receive. This allowed me to execute timing pushes with Marines and Marauders that won games.
Thank you very much for sharing this build.
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Hi Mcrat-
TL:DR: Fending this off and counter-attacking at the right time will put you miles ahead.
I have seen the replay, and have executed the build before to some good success and also lost to it. The main point is that gas first banshee can still do a lot of damage irregardless of the turrets that are up because you use the banshee to bait unupgraded marines and take them all out if possible. This then makes a marine tank push that much stronger if you hit shortly afterwards. You're basically free to do a fair bit of damage with an uncloaked banshee before the viking pops out.
In the four games that I played and won vs the 3 reaper rush, I had spotted the early techlab on the rax so I placed my marines in the mineral line right away. Most likely due to the other opponent's bad reaper control, I nail their reapers without many losses and the banshee heads straight to their base without having to stay and clean up the reapers.
It doesn't matter if the other player has a couple of turrets around the place, the banshee is mostly there to pick off anything possible, from marines, to scvs to supply depots. It might just be us low level golds, but when you are annoying with a banshee the other opponent overreacts and builds 4 turrets in their base, or per base and suddenly they've sunk 200-400 minerals on turrets and you are ahead by that much in army/army making structures.
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On July 14 2011 16:25 antz0r wrote:
Hi Mcrat-
TL:DR: Fending this off and counter-attacking at the right time will put you miles ahead.
I have seen the replay, and have executed the build before to some good success and also lost to it. The main point is that gas first banshee can still do a lot of damage irregardless of the turrets that are up because you use the banshee to bait unupgraded marines and take them all out if possible. This then makes a marine tank push that much stronger if you hit shortly afterwards. You're basically free to do a fair bit of damage with an uncloaked banshee before the viking pops out.
In the four games that I played and won vs the 3 reaper rush, I had spotted the early techlab on the rax so I placed my marines in the mineral line right away. Most likely due to the other opponent's bad reaper control, I nail their reapers without many losses and the banshee heads straight to their base without having to stay and clean up the reapers.
It doesn't matter if the other player has a couple of turrets around the place, the banshee is mostly there to pick off anything possible, from marines, to scvs to supply depots. It might just be us low level golds, but when you are annoying with a banshee the other opponent overreacts and builds 4 turrets in their base, or per base and suddenly they've sunk 200-400 minerals on turrets and you are ahead by that much in army/army making structures.
The idea is allow to your opponent to spread their marines. Usually with gas first build my success rate is higher due to the lower count of marines.
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Sorry for bumping this, but there is something I have noticed.
After running this opening several times as well as watching your replays, I have noticed most people spread marines on the cliff after they know you are going reapers. Thus, when your reapers approach the cliff, marines get free shots and are sometimes even able to kill a reaper before you get a chance to retaliate (and losing a reaper really weakens the opening since it's no longer 1shot). The solution to this I believe is to scan the higher ground before moving up. This allows you to see the units waiting for you, and if they are marines/scvs, you can attack them from the low ground before they even get to retaliate (reaper range>marine range). Yes, it is an early scan (after 1st mule), but it gives your reapers much more survivability and ability to harass. Yes, it won't help much against marauder openings. But, it will prevent you losing your reapers to marines just because of the high ground.
Later on, you can also float a rax to the cliff for vision 
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this worked so freakin well for 2 games
since that, my last 6 tvts were against 3 raxx conc first, or 6 raxx allin, i go nuts as if they would know "hey this guy is doin 3 reaper rush" .....
anway, nice strat, i just don´t think it can beat conc first 3 raxx or (4 into) 6 raxxallin
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Nice strat dude, thanks for post it.
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I haven't lost a single TvT literally after I started to open with this build. I go 3 reapers, expand, then bio (i really hate tanks because I have no positioning), Works all the way up to masters, as soon as you kill the 3~ marines you have free reign over his base and often kill like 10 workers. Fantastic opening and gives you a huge eco advantage with the expo and worker killing
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Well, I know that this is an old "thread", but after a few weeks (months?), I've reached the conclusion that, at my plat-diamond level, this is the only alternative to the "I rush to tank-marine composition". As such, this is a worthy tread!
So, what about the refinements?
- If you do the build as indicated, then there's no way you can hide what you're doing to your opponent (especially the second barracks at 14)
- If you wall (bad in TvT), you can't do it with your depot + 2 barracks, because your opponent will see even more when he'll poke.
- So usually, I've adapted a bit the build : hide the second barracks you do at 14. The scouting worker shouldn't see anything strange (OC is still later), then wall(bad, I know) with a second depot. Go contest the Xel'naga tower with your marine 15 seconds before your 3rd reaper pop.
On September 05 2011 12:08 101toss wrote:Sorry for bumping this, but there is something I have noticed. After running this opening several times as well as watching your replays, I have noticed most people spread marines on the cliff after they know you are going reapers. Thus, when your reapers approach the cliff, marines get free shots and are sometimes even able to kill a reaper before you get a chance to retaliate (and losing a reaper really weakens the opening since it's no longer 1shot). The solution to this I believe is to scan the higher ground before moving up. This allows you to see the units waiting for you, and if they are marines/scvs, you can attack them from the low ground before they even get to retaliate (reaper range>marine range). Yes, it is an early scan (after 1st mule), but it gives your reapers much more survivability and ability to harass. Yes, it won't help much against marauder openings. But, it will prevent you losing your reapers to marines just because of the high ground. Later on, you can also float a rax to the cliff for vision
- The problem is that a wasted scan is veeery bad... Do a bit of mind game! Show your reapers (when you have only one), then scan the high ground when your 3 reapers are closing. If it works (marines waiting), you have an overwhelming advantage.
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I refined the build order just a little bit since then, when I get the chance I'll edit.
Wall off at 14 supply
15 reaper
15 oc
I sometimes rush at 5 reapers instead of 3.
To be frank, not a standard solid build, but fun to execute and making players qq is always a plus.
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On November 16 2011 01:32 PrideTV wrote:
I refined the build order just a little bit since then, when I get the chance I'll edit.
Wall off at 14 supply
15 reaper
15 oc
I sometimes rush at 5 reapers instead of 3.
To be frank, not a standard solid build, but fun to execute and making players qq is always a plus.
Nice!
I'd be really interested in what you saw was bad, how you fixed it, and why it's not a solid build! The only thing I don't like is the higher I get (this means diamond ><) the less damage I usually do against good players. But I get map control and a relatively fast expand, so I'm happy!
On the other hand, this build works real fine in TvP, stalkers are a nuisance, but sentries are worthy targets that die in exactly 2 volleys of 3 shots =) It's always good to snipe the first sentries as they're the ones with the most energy in the end.
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EPT
