On May 25 2011 07:24 GGFluffBunny wrote: Whats sup everyone, GGFluffBunny here from Team Good Guys. www.team-GG.com. Ive been doing this build, and i have been winning with it, went up from my bronze league into high silver rank 4, i am now fighintg gold/plat level people and winning/loosing them acordingly, i found a new strat that i use when you do the bottom wall off. the Wall off is really suseptable to attack and is really annoying when your making your Rax and they start killing your SCV and it dosent move at all, you see it just die and if you lower your depot they can run in. I have been doing 2 different builds, so far, 3 rax all in. and a 6 rax mass marine push.
Hmm, which build to do ... the one that someone got to grandmasters-level MMR with ... or the one created by a silver player who can't get out of silver. Such a hard decision!
On May 25 2011 07:24 GGFluffBunny wrote: Whats sup everyone, GGFluffBunny here from Team Good Guys. www.team-GG.com. Ive been doing this build, and i have been winning with it, went up from my bronze league into high silver rank 4, i am now fighintg gold/plat level people and winning/loosing them acordingly, i found a new strat that i use when you do the bottom wall off. the Wall off is really suseptable to attack and is really annoying when your making your Rax and they start killing your SCV and it dosent move at all, you see it just die and if you lower your depot they can run in. I have been doing 2 different builds, so far, 3 rax all in. and a 6 rax mass marine push.
Hmm, which build to do ... the one that someone got to grandmasters-level MMR with ... or the one created by a silver player who can't get out of silver. Such a hard decision!
6rax is a very old build that has it's own theread if you search a bit. It is quite different from this build as you fake fast expansion but instead build a buttload of rines. It was not created by some silver player and iirc TLO has done it recently. I have no idea if it can take you to GM level without any skill tho. I kinda doubt that, but dont diss a build because you dont know anything about it.
On May 26 2011 09:15 Eatme wrote: 6rax is a very old build that has it's own theread if you search a bit. It is quite different from this build as you fake fast expansion but instead build a buttload of rines. It was not created by some silver player and iirc TLO has done it recently. I have no idea if it can take you to GM level without any skill tho. I kinda doubt that, but dont diss a build because you dont know anything about it.
People were doing megarax type stuff back in beta, it's way easier to deal with than something like this which hits at a timing where most races (especially protoss) have basically nothing.
Also if you read his version of it you basically mine 1000 minerals while building absolutely 0 units and being at 19/19 supply, sounds like a good way to die to any fast roach or fast stalker pressure to me.
Just faced this today in Diamond TvP. I want to thank this thread - because of the info here, I was able to scout and recognize this build and defend it easily by chronoboosting sentries.
I'll probably be recording a short cast of that replay to demonstrate what I did to defend it. It really comes down to correctly identifying the build and making nonstop sentries. Cut the army in 3rds as it comes up the ramp, or just lock them out forever while making stuff. Terran's not mining, he's 100% all-in. It was a very easy to execute defense for anyone in any league.
Edit: Here's the video on how to scout and defend against this build as Protoss:
Hey I was trying out this build just a few minutes ago when I ran into 2 problems. Protoss: Infinite Forcefields before I could reach him. Do I just go home and play from significantly behind or what? Terran: Reactored hellions + a wall Do I just hope he doesn't micro well with the wall vs my marines of same range and lesser speed? Replays: http://drop.sc/11417 http://drop.sc/11418
On May 27 2011 03:30 tosog wrote: Hey I was trying out this build just a few minutes ago when I ran into 2 problems. Protoss: Infinite Forcefields before I could reach him. Do I just go home and play from significantly behind or what? Terran: Reactored hellions + a wall Do I just hope he doesn't micro well with the wall vs my marines of same range and lesser speed? Replays: http://drop.sc/11417 http://drop.sc/11418
Hey,
Both of these replays are BO losses.
First replay vs terran, he goes for a stupid team league BO. No marine, factory/rax swap. With an scv or anything else you could have blocked the swap and won.
Second replay vs protoss, he just assumes you are going to marine all-in (he probably reads TL) and hard counters hit blindly. If you had gone for 1 rax expand, you would have been ahead by a lot.
Not really much you can do Keep in mind this is a cheese/all in, so if they react properly, you will lose without being able to do anything.
On May 26 2011 04:13 drgonzhere wrote: Thanks asshole my ladder rank went down 10 spots because of your fucking build. This really makes the game fun for everyone promoting this cheesy shit Now players with no skill have a build that kills me if i dont prepare for it, as well as something to hide behind and make fucking banshees. You truly are the biggest douche on these forums and make laddering not fun for everyone but terran. I dont even care if i get banned for this shit it was worth it.
On May 26 2011 04:13 drgonzhere wrote: Thanks asshole my ladder rank went down 10 spots because of your fucking build. This really makes the game fun for everyone promoting this cheesy shit Now players with no skill have a build that kills me if i dont prepare for it, as well as something to hide behind and make fucking banshees. You truly are the biggest douche on these forums and make laddering not fun for everyone but terran. I dont even care if i get banned for this shit it was worth it.
Sometimes I just wish I had a report button...
Got you covered.
I'm glad this build was posted so that I can know to prepare for it, good thread, thank you for posting it.
On May 26 2011 04:13 drgonzhere wrote: Thanks asshole my ladder rank went down 10 spots because of your fucking build. This really makes the game fun for everyone promoting this cheesy shit Now players with no skill have a build that kills me if i dont prepare for it, as well as something to hide behind and make fucking banshees. You truly are the biggest douche on these forums and make laddering not fun for everyone but terran. I dont even care if i get banned for this shit it was worth it.
Sometimes I just wish I had a report button...
Got you covered.
I'm glad this build was posted so that I can know to prepare for it, good thread, thank you for posting it.
yea me too. I lost to it 3 times in a row the first 3 times I saw it, but now it's easy to counter once you see it.
On May 27 2011 03:30 tosog wrote: Hey I was trying out this build just a few minutes ago when I ran into 2 problems. Protoss: Infinite Forcefields before I could reach him. Do I just go home and play from significantly behind or what? Terran: Reactored hellions + a wall Do I just hope he doesn't micro well with the wall vs my marines of same range and lesser speed? Replays: http://drop.sc/11417 http://drop.sc/11418
I think you waited too long before you launched the attacks...he has enough hellions 4 minutes into the game to decimate your force...
I'm a low platinum zerg/random player, strongest with zerg, and about a high gold with toss, and low gold with terran. After reading this, I decided to take a crack at the build for a handful of games, to see if it's a viable way to quickly end games when I random into Terran (If only I could downvote a race and random between Protoss and Zerg, right?).
Now, I'm by no means a good player, but from my experience with this build, I would say it's not viable at all TvT. I don't doubt for a second that it's powerful against Zerg and especially Protoss, though.
Additionally, it seems that at the platinum/high gold level the metagame's already shifted to defend against this all-in. Twice, while executing it against a terran, it got hard-countered by a depot-rax-bunker wall off, which is certainly something I rarely used to see. And when I say hard-countered, I mean BLIND hard-countered.
On the other hand, I could probably shave a good 30 seconds off of my timing, just by getting used to the build order and improving my mechanics, and do well when I don't get blind-countered TvT.
My question is, if you scout that the all-in got countered by a bunker, or a handful of cannons or spine crawlers or the like, is there a transition you use before pulling the SCVs, or do you just kind of take a crack at it and hope for the longshot?
Additionally, I'm wondering if anybody else has had a similar experience with the metagame shifting to counter this strat as a precaution.
This build is really easy to hold off as terran. People learned to stop walling on the low ground, cancel gas etc.. to try and hide it. I was mid iechoic opening when it hit me and all it took was 3 marines in a bunker and a red flame hellion to crush it. idk i might just make a blind bunker from now on cause I lost the last time I opened iechoic and got all inned close positions metal
o really???? doesn't look like the same build......... giekos own is stronger
ya rly he low ground wall-ins he supply drops the only difference is he makes an scv or 2 after orbital and he delays his 2 barracks are you kidding geiko copied this we must expose the build copier
I played 2v2 yesterday and defended this as zerg almost alone(both of opponents were rushing with this build), I told my friend that all-in was coming so he tought cannon wall-in would hold it, but it was actually too late so i were alone. Enemies micro were horrible but still holded. And I knew they lost all their workers so I didn't pay too much attention to my macro, just defending.
So there's a replay how effective banelings are against 3rax (never played against this build before because gold guys don't cheese this well) http://replayfu.com/r/cbLfhm
On May 28 2011 01:05 maex wrote: I played 2v2 yesterday and defended this as zerg almost alone(both of opponents were rushing with this build), I told my friend that all-in was coming so he tought cannon wall-in would hold it, but it was actually too late so i were alone. Enemies micro were horrible but still holded. And I knew they lost all their workers so I didn't pay too much attention to my macro, just defending.
So there's a replay how effective banelings are against 3rax (never played against this build before because gold guys don't cheese this well) http://replayfu.com/r/cbLfhm
Alright, I just watched the replay, good job for defending against it, but here are my criticisms of your replay. Both of the two players a) messed up the build and b) had extremely poor micro for a micro-intensive all-in
a) The whole point of the supply depot and barracks is to deny scouting, clearly both players do not know the building placement in order to block off the ramp with only those two buildings, hence throwing down a second at the bottom of the ramp. As well as messed up the timing of the 2nd and 3rd Barracks, thus making their marines later. (And having fewer marines in general because of that), and when the moved out, they moved out late, therefore giving more than sufficient time for the cannons to delay for your banelings.
b) They didn't pull their SCVs at the same time they were moving out their units, as well they simply a moved, I saw no stutter stepping, nor good placement of SCVs to tank damage. And it took a while before they even realized to take out the sole pylon powering the cannons (that were warping it). They wasted a lot of time unnecessarily there.
After the two players messed up that all-in, I don't understand why you allowed them to attempt building up again. And as you stated, the cannons were too late, had they hit even earlier (when the build is meant to hit), very few things can save you, mostly well placed spines (placed because you had gotten the scout off and can easily anticipate it) and getting a good surround with lings.
EPT
