EPTIts just up to the zerg player to see your forge with a drone scout or just have an overlord over his hatchery and to not let you do it..
HuK's PvZ Style - Page 3
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Ryze
Canada234 Posts
Its just up to the zerg player to see your forge with a drone scout or just have an overlord over his hatchery and to not let you do it.. | ||
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ChineseWife
United States373 Posts
I wouldn't try to look at this as a build order but rather just note what huk sees and how he reacts to it. If you forge first and dont expand vs a pool first zerg, you are setting yourself really far behind unless you are going for a 1 base allin with a +1 timing attack | ||
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freetgy
1720 Posts
or you would have wasted money of 2 Gateways into useless canons. | ||
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jarrydesque
584 Posts
Totally OT now but how do you tell the difference between a Speedling expand and a Roach Rush. I normally hide my Probe and suicide it in to try see a Warren but is there a way to tell with the initial build timings? | ||
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Shifft
Canada1085 Posts
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Buruguduy
Philippines238 Posts
On February 09 2011 18:15 Shifft wrote: HuK used to do this a lot on his stream, but it like didn't even make sense how well it worked. He would drop the first pylon in plain view of the Z and still get his fucking cannons up every single time. Did the Z hatch before pool? if yes, the canon will go up no matter what | ||
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eth3n
718 Posts
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jnkw
Canada347 Posts
On February 09 2011 16:47 FloWoIF wrote: This build looks interesting from a zergs pov but what if the serf goes guitars a reach build because it means you have expanded due to scouting the spawning pool. Plus your probe should die before the roach warren is scouted. Nevertheless it looks like a very well thought out build especially for a 14 hatch great delay time. What?? | ||
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andy186
Australia1058 Posts
Its not a new pvz style and its not even new for huk. It is a very common strat. Also when you say it slows down hatch by 100 seconds and is much better than the pylon block but now its costing you 400 minerals instead of 100 for a bit extra time maybe even less if thye dont even cancel at all. Its only effective if the cannons finish or they cancel the hatch but the zerg can probably stop both from happening | ||
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whowahuh
United States184 Posts
On February 09 2011 18:15 Shifft wrote: HuK used to do this a lot on his stream, but it like didn't even make sense how well it worked. He would drop the first pylon in plain view of the Z and still get his fucking cannons up every single time. Having a second probe to either distract drones pulled off the line or allow pylons/cannons to be built in two places at once helps with this strategy a ton. Might be stating the obvious, but clicking probes to mineral patches is an absolute MUST since the zerg will obviously be looking to surround trap the probes. | ||
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Bellygareth
France512 Posts
Forge first only means two things: - Forge expo - cannon rush Forge expo is usually easy to tell from the positioning of the structures. If that's not obvious you should hurry and find that scouting probe. I usually scout quite early (drone arrives when the first building is warping), so it gives time to prepare. My conclusion right now is that it's not a solid "build" at all. Besides I'm not sure it's "standard" even for Huk. I noticed that while laddering he sometimes release some steam by cannon rushing / 4 warpgating / cheesing in any sort. | ||
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Arcanefrost
Belgium1257 Posts
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Fabious
France17 Posts
I use this build since 2 or 3 months Oo I saw HuK on his stream doing that 1 month ago (on LT) but i can assure you that's not a new build or a "huk" build. | ||
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Markwerf
Netherlands3728 Posts
If all goes well you cancel the hatchery but you as protoss pay quite a hefy cost: - 1 or 2 cannons you cancel directly after hatch cancel = 75 minerals - the cannon and pylon you leave up = 250 minerals - a cannon you are FORCED to make at home for fear of zerg pushing back directly = 150 minerals - a 2nd probe send over to secure the cannons getting up = at least 50 minerals. Total about 525 minerals The proper response to this as zerg imo is: - build a 3rd hatchery at another expo after your pool straight away when the cannons are being put down (if you are sure you are not able to take them down.). - cancel the hatch just before it's about to finish, making sure to let the toss get at least 1 cannon up. - get the 2nd queen quite fast at your main and start spreading creep towards your expansion, which will be further away obviously. - go relatively fast roaches afterwards, toss goes very late gas and techs late with a forge first opening so they will have problems countering roaches early on. Roaches are also the only safe tier 1 option against a 4 gate +1 attack push, against which lings die hard. If they chose to cannon expand after their opening roaches will also be the best way to threaten them into making more cannons. Roaches are also best to take out the cannon and pylon he left behind at your natural, if you do so with lings you are bound to lose at least 4 lings whereas with 4 roaches it is easy to take out the cannon without losses. As long as you get another base up quickly (without having that cannoned as well) you should be in a good spot, as protoss is invested more in canceling your hatch then you lost. | ||
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W2
United States1177 Posts
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Keshuan
Germany18 Posts
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Tsabo
Russian Federation266 Posts
For example: All the while, be keeping an eye on their expansion/pool timing, if they are going for pool first, go the the expo, and wait for the drone. As soon as the drone starts building the hatch, it will lose vision, make sure there are no overlords around. If there are, get far out of vision range. This is bullshit you can not cannon rush a pool -> hatch. As seen it the video huk doesnt even try to do it. | ||
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AnodyneSea
Jamaica757 Posts
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sc2pal
Poland624 Posts
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Liquid`Nazgul
22427 Posts
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