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In BW was 5 drone rule:
The "5 Drone Rule": Once Zerg knows how many Hatcheries to build, the next question is how many Drones to build. A rule of thumb is roughly five drones per Hatchery. For a Hatchery to constantly pump Zerglings, 3 Drones on Minerals are required. To constantly pump Hydras, the Zerg player will need 5 Drones on Minerals and 2 Drones on Gas per Hatchery. Mutas require 5 Drones on Minerals and 3 Drones on gas per Hatchery. Thus, in a typical game, it is a good rule of thumb to plan for 5 Drones per Hatchery.
How many drones per hatchery i need in sc2 to constantly pump zergling/baneling, roach/hydra, zergling/muta?
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why don't you just figure it out yourself? 8 drones in sc2 = 5 drones in sc1
assuming that larvae comes out at 15 seconds and spawn larvae comes out at 40 seconds (guessing, but should be close to the exact time) so pretty much
5 drone rule >> 16 drone rule
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well 25 per hatch is plenty saturation
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30 per hatch. If there are drones zig-zagging between the mineral patches, you are ok. You can easily maynard them to the next expansion.
By the way, that's simply 3 drones per mineral patch and 3 per geyser, if you find you need to adjust the drone count for gold bases.
If you want to maximize income without overdroning, you can go 2 per mineral patch, 3 on gas, which adds up to 22 drones per hatchery.
However you will have no capacity for morphing buildings or maynarding drones to expansions without having to reproduce drones.
I think in the end it all comes down to personal preference. Just go with what you like best.
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On February 05 2011 14:37 Exchange wrote:In BW was 5 drone rule: Show nested quote +The "5 Drone Rule": Once Zerg knows how many Hatcheries to build, the next question is how many Drones to build. A rule of thumb is roughly five drones per Hatchery. For a Hatchery to constantly pump Zerglings, 3 Drones on Minerals are required. To constantly pump Hydras, the Zerg player will need 5 Drones on Minerals and 2 Drones on Gas per Hatchery. Mutas require 5 Drones on Minerals and 3 Drones on gas per Hatchery. Thus, in a typical game, it is a good rule of thumb to plan for 5 Drones per Hatchery. How many drones per hatchery i need in sc2 to constantly pump zergling/baneling, roach/hydra, zergling/muta?
You want 3 per gas and 2 per patch ideally, since it's generally easier for you to take extra bases (i.e. the +1 base mantra in zvt/p)
So, that's ~22 per base. You can box them periodically and see how many you get (should be 20 as 2 will be in geyser) and as long as you're close to that, you're in good shape.
Obviously if you're forced to 2-base for an inordinate period of time (or even 1-base) you'll want to fully saturate (30)
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Just about 16 drones at every mineral line + additional ones for gas seems to be the most common ammount amongst the higher level players like ret/idra.
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queen+hatch is ~8 larvae per minute in reality (theoretical:10), 8 pair lings cost 400. This equals ~9..10 drones.
Drone is ~.7 per second = ~40..45 minerals per minute.
3 drones on gas is ~120 gas/minute so constant roach = 8 * 75 mins + 8*25 gas ~ 15 drones on mins + 5 on gas. Supply is not factored in, so given that there are slightly more larvae if you inject and spend perfectly and you need ovies, go with 16+6 drones for constant roaches (8..10 per minute)..
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Zig zagging drones = saturated for me. So anything about 17 (1 zigzagging drone at 17 lol)
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How are 2 drones per mineral patch maximizing mineral income? I was under the assumption it was 3 per patch: 1 drone is harvesting, 1 is retuning mineral to hatch, the 3rd is on his way back from the hatch. That way you always have 1 drone actually chewing up minerals, whereas with 2 drones there will be a small gap in time where no drone is harvesting.
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Your goal is to stay one base ahead of terran/toss so unless you get a billion drones and no army, you cant fully saturate all your bases.
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the OP did not ask for saturation but how many drones are required for constant unit production guys
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there was a thread dealing with exactly this a while ago.
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On February 05 2011 18:56 Schnullerbacke13 wrote:
the OP did not ask for saturation but how many drones are required for constant unit production guys
Ya.. but it doesn't work like that for zerg. Terran/protoss have set numbers like 4 gates 1 base or w/e, but not zerg. Larva and constantly adjusting unit composition mess that all up. There is no answer to his question.
Only time this would make sense is in a very specific and early timing attack for a certain number of roaches/lings w/e.
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actually, you only need 16-18 drones for minerals depending on distance, and 6 on the two gases, so it'd be 22-24
for constantly pumping roach/ling, you'd need two bases full of mineral saturation, and two-three gases depending on how many roaches
for constant roach/hydra, it'd be 2-3 full mineral saturations, 4-5 gases depending on the ratio
for muta/ling, you'd need only 2 mineral sat. and 5-6 gas, maybe more
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On February 05 2011 18:26 dejavue wrote:
30 per hatch. If there are drones zig-zagging between the mineral patches, you are ok. You can easily maynard them to the next expansion.
By the way, that's simply 3 drones per mineral patch and 3 per geyser, if you find you need to adjust the drone count for gold bases.
If you want to maximize income without overdroning, you can go 2 per mineral patch, 3 on gas, which adds up to 22 drones per hatchery.
However you will have no capacity for morphing buildings or maynarding drones to expansions without having to reproduce drones.
I think in the end it all comes down to personal preference. Just go with what you like best.
Zerg should never have fully saturated base after the 15 minute mark. Of the 24 drones on a 8 mineral patch base, 16 are mining at maximum efficiency the other 8 are not, not even close. Since a zerg should have at least 4 bases by late-mid game having 120 drones to "Fully saturate" would be preposterous and further weaken the already weak 200/200 zerg army (at least vs Protoss).
As a protoss player, if you keep your mineral "saturated" then you'll be hard pressed to get either an economic OR an army advantage! Keep the number of drones to be around 1.5-2.5 drones per patch, and have enough patches that doing so is cost efficient!
The way lategame PvZ is going nowadays the Zerg player ends up with a diminishing drone count after the 300 food push, and need their drones to be mining at maximum efficiency to compete with even a Protoss who is 1, or in some cases, 2 bases behind.
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United States22883 Posts
Everyone except the first responder, Chickenlips and Choiboi missed the purpose of this thread (and probably didn't read the OP.)
He's not asking how many drones to make. He's asking how many drones to make in order to supply a constant stream of ______ unit.
Chickenlips, does that calculator do constant production for each larva spawned? It says you need 13 drones to produce 2 zerglings, but that seems high.
Also, you can't include extra gasses so it's kind of useless for higher tech stuff.
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United States22883 Posts
On February 05 2011 19:36 Bosu wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:56 Schnullerbacke13 wrote:
the OP did not ask for saturation but how many drones are required for constant unit production guys Ya.. but it doesn't work like that for zerg. Terran/protoss have set numbers like 4 gates 1 base or w/e, but not zerg. Larva and constantly adjusting unit composition mess that all up. There is no answer to his question. Only time this would make sense is in a very specific and early timing attack for a certain number of roaches/lings w/e.
It's useful for both timing attacks and tech switches. It's also extremely helpful for ZvZ since you never want more drones than necessary, and your comps usually only contain 1 or 2 types of units.
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On February 05 2011 18:43 Bayyne wrote:
How are 2 drones per mineral patch maximizing mineral income? I was under the assumption it was 3 per patch: 1 drone is harvesting, 1 is retuning mineral to hatch, the 3rd is on his way back from the hatch. That way you always have 1 drone actually chewing up minerals, whereas with 2 drones there will be a small gap in time where no drone is harvesting.
There is a cut point at 2 drones per min patch, where Each additional drone is as efficient at gathering minerals as the last till you reach 16, past 16 they still add income but at a lesser rate, past 24 they add nothing.
Most of the posters here are sort of in the play style of macro first then spam what you can, the OP wants to reverse engineer how many drones per hatch for a specific unit composition, which has it's merits if you're looking to do a timing push/be aggressive
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Ya guys please read the OP before posting. I have wondered this often myself when going ling/muta vs toss cause I want to get the correct numbers of drones before I start pumping mutas. Idk what it actually best, but off of two bases I find that 18 drones on mins and 12 drones on gas is more than enough to constantly pump mutas. idk about mutaling though. i guess that depends on how many lings you want to make.
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On February 05 2011 18:43 Bayyne wrote:
How are 2 drones per mineral patch maximizing mineral income?
Its not maximizing, but its the most efficient saturation, with 2 workers per patch theres only like half a second that its not being mine, having a drone to cover half a second mining time its a complete waste. Try it urself, start a custom game and use only 3 drones and try to get them to mine the same patch, it doesnt work unless they are far from the hatch.
To OP, there is no rules set like that yet in this game, i guess you can do them urself with a little maths involve and a lot of testing. I found that 33 drones 16-6 8-3 is good enough to keep up 2 hatch constantly producing roaches, +1 attack and roach speed. Obviously strats like these are pretty all in since in order to do damage, your damaging ur economy by not getting more workers, yet if you dont grosely lose the battle and get to do some dmg like killing probes or something like that you can easily make a 10 drone round, and start recovering.
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On February 06 2011 01:36 ShatterZer0 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 18:26 dejavue wrote:
30 per hatch. If there are drones zig-zagging between the mineral patches, you are ok. You can easily maynard them to the next expansion.
By the way, that's simply 3 drones per mineral patch and 3 per geyser, if you find you need to adjust the drone count for gold bases.
If you want to maximize income without overdroning, you can go 2 per mineral patch, 3 on gas, which adds up to 22 drones per hatchery.
However you will have no capacity for morphing buildings or maynarding drones to expansions without having to reproduce drones.
I think in the end it all comes down to personal preference. Just go with what you like best.
Zerg should never have fully saturated base after the 15 minute mark. Of the 24 drones on a 8 mineral patch base, 16 are mining at maximum efficiency the other 8 are not, not even close. Since a zerg should have at least 4 bases by late-mid game having 120 drones to "Fully saturate" would be preposterous and further weaken the already weak 200/200 zerg army (at least vs Protoss). As a protoss player, if you keep your mineral "saturated" then you'll be hard pressed to get either an economic OR an army advantage! Keep the number of drones to be around 1.5-2.5 drones per patch, and have enough patches that doing so is cost efficient! The way lategame PvZ is going nowadays the Zerg player ends up with a diminishing drone count after the 300 food push, and need their drones to be mining at maximum efficiency to compete with even a Protoss who is 1, or in some cases, 2 bases behind.
Sorry, I was not entirely clear on that. My point is not to rush to 30 drones asap, but if you produce 30 drones for your first two bases, you will not have to produce new ones for your third.
If you can, squeeze in some drones here and there and when your third is about to hatch you simply mainard the drones.
Sure you "lose" some minerals before that but you will be from "third base just morphing" to "fully saturated (mineral wise) base" in 1 second like this, giving the Zerg the sudden economy boost that everyone loves so much.
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EPT
