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[G] iEchoic's 2fact2port TvT - Page 18

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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iEchoic
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States1776 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-09 07:23:01
February 09 2011 07:22 GMT
#341
Yep, as Day[9] mentioned, the build will be featured on the daily tomorrow, so make sure to tune in if you want to check it out, should be fun.
vileEchoic -- clanvile.com
DoctorDan
Profile Joined November 2010
United States8 Posts
February 09 2011 07:57 GMT
#342
Day[9] eh? Cannot wait for the "analysis".

Get ready to try and combat lots of abortive attempts at this then...guess I'll brush up on my early Thor pressure?

3-1 with it tonight, lots of cheese accusations.
Youth is wasted on the young.
valheru
Profile Joined January 2011
Australia966 Posts
February 09 2011 08:18 GMT
#343
Sweet! Day[9]! Will he just be examaining how it works or improvements or what? Are any specifics mentioned?
I reject your reality and substitute my own
FoFo
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands207 Posts
February 09 2011 13:02 GMT
#344
oh god so just as i find this, all the other T's will start trying it at the same time? T.T
"we must avoid balancing SC2 by making everything suck equally hard."
dunc
Profile Joined November 2010
Netherlands1105 Posts
February 09 2011 13:05 GMT
#345
On February 09 2011 17:18 valheru wrote:
Sweet! Day[9]! Will he just be examaining how it works or improvements or what? Are any specifics mentioned?


It's friendday Wednesday, iEchoic will be on the show with Day9 and I assume he'll be explaining things thoroughly and both of them analysing it etc.
REM.ca
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada354 Posts
February 09 2011 13:27 GMT
#346
Ouh, iEchoic on Friendsday Wednesday! I love it!
I have a palm permanently stuck to my face yo.
Synystyr
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1446 Posts
February 09 2011 13:30 GMT
#347
Congrats on getting onto the Day9 daily! Finally getting the recognition you deserve with this build can't wait to hear it analyzed! I'll definitely be tuning in. Great job!
Sky Terran TvP V2.0: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=355839
Tianx
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States1196 Posts
February 09 2011 13:31 GMT
#348
Swoot, nice job getting on the Daily! I'll be sure to tune in, I'm very interested to see how this fares against opponents that know it's coming.
Intrigue: "as i've said to many others your troubles in life may be directly correlated to your dirty protoss icon"
Antisocialmunky
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States5912 Posts
February 09 2011 14:02 GMT
#349
Congrats dude, this build is awesome and you deserve being on the Daily.
[゚n゚] SSSSssssssSSsss ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Marine/Raven Guide:http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=163605
CrayonKing
Profile Joined August 2010
Cambodia124 Posts
February 09 2011 14:02 GMT
#350
Hey been experimenting with this build and its def challenging... (im abt 3100 masters T) Im executing it half ass and still putting up a decent fight againts 3k + T masters so its looking good.

Only issue ive run into so far is quick cloak banshees ( gas before rax build). Depending on base distance it hits the time your medivac is almost done...which leaves you only one option and that is to hellion drop him...often tricky depending on how he defends because you must do more damage in the time ur raven + viking comes out.

Another issue which i guess is avoidable is containment (tank + turret contain) is pretty much impossible to get out of. but this should never happen if you engage as hes moving out with proper map control, i just need more practice : (

Also timing of expasion is really important...most standard T builds have their 2nd building if not close to being done by the time your hellions hit. Assuming you do a somewhat significant damange what do you do here?

Do you expand yourself after ur drop or do you for an all in push considering he will be spending most of his resources on SCVS?

THANKS !
HuggyBear
Profile Joined November 2010
Australia377 Posts
February 09 2011 14:04 GMT
#351
The OP's right. This is hard to pull off. Mostly the Air dominance.

Can't wait for the Daily tom to check it out =)
"Sleeping with SeLeCT is Standard. Once you've slept with Day9 everything else is just ..." - CatZ
VashTS
Profile Joined September 2010
United States1675 Posts
February 09 2011 14:53 GMT
#352
What would you do against 3rax pressure, with 2 Tech Labs and a Reactor? Seems like Banshees simply won't be enough in the early game, and Marausers laugh at Hellions.

Just askin because I really have no idea.
VashTS; 330; Random -- Ranked #9 Pokemon Video Game Player in the World in 2009
Synystyr
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States1446 Posts
February 09 2011 15:19 GMT
#353
On February 09 2011 23:53 VashTS wrote:
What would you do against 3rax pressure, with 2 Tech Labs and a Reactor? Seems like Banshees simply won't be enough in the early game, and Marausers laugh at Hellions.

Just askin because I really have no idea.


You want to engage with your hellions first to kill the marines, and then use the banshees to clean the marauders up. The ideal situation is to keep your hellions at the top of your ramp, and when he starts to push up the ramp, use your hellions to burn all of the marines that are clumped up there, pull back and send your banshees in to clean up. This works amazingly especially is he stims because his marines die to 2 hellions. It's actually very very easy to win vs 3 Rax.
Sky Terran TvP V2.0: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=355839
Kipsate
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands45349 Posts
February 09 2011 15:44 GMT
#354
I have a question about upgrades, at which point do you think you should get these?I noticed that you got your armories up very late on the first replay and did not start upgrades(Game was over anyway) but you didn't get armories till very late. How viable do you think +armor on hellions is vs marines or how powerfull +ship weapons is on banshees?
WriterXiao8~~
Ilfirin
Profile Joined November 2010
United States102 Posts
February 09 2011 17:01 GMT
#355
I like this build a lot, thanks iEchoic. First of all, to all the haters, yes, it's based on harass. But guess what geniuses-the whole Terran race is! What other race has 3 units that are generally considered harass units? It's an integral part of the terran race, and should be treated as such. But this build is great, I've been using it in 1s and 2s, vs terran and zerg, and I love the mobility, harass, map control, and flexibility it offers. Hellions are a ton of fun, I don't generall need to bother with tanks anymore, and it gets you air superiority while allowing your ground units to run around mostly uncontested (whats gonna keep up with the hellions anyways?).

I have to say though, late mid game, I start pumping thors out of the fact with the tech lab. It makes pushing down expos/defended locations much easier, and the building is already up, and can be spared, whereas at that point my tech lab'd port is still making shees.

Either way, mad props on the builds and furthering the state of the game/metagame man!
Chaosvuistje
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands2581 Posts
February 09 2011 18:04 GMT
#356
Amazing, congratulations on the daily . Well deserved.

I would love seeing this build in tournaments, a much more exciting play than the regular tank viking bussiness.
Duka08
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
3391 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-09 18:13:07
February 09 2011 18:10 GMT
#357
Grats on doing the Daily! Excited to hear the discussion and your breakdown of any questions and comments he may have. Based on your OP for this build and your others, you always seem to have all your outs covered, with replays to back it up. I like that. Interested to see the daily.

I've been watching most of the replays involved with this for the past couple days when I have time, and I'd really like to try it. It's a unique composition that often feels scrappy because you rely so heavily on your air units yet have so few for a while, and it still seems to do so well and deflect pressure as well as apply it. I love big groups of hellions, and I always have, they just have never felt like they do as much as I'd like them to, other than pokes and harass. This build really gives them a purpose, almost a giant meatshield of a ball, and once anti-air units are destroyed, the air force mops up the rest. Unique, and effective, rather than overpowering. Excited to try it out.

Also, would like to comment on what I feel is my favorite part of the build - starport production and specifically, vikings. I love that you are almost always producing vikings out of ONLY one starport, often with a tech lab or no addon, NEVER reactor, yet over time you amass a huge number. It's such a solid and refreshing feel compared to how so many TvT's seem with reactor ports SPAMMING vikings mindlessly because you need to be ahead / catch up. The same goes for banshees to a degree, everything is sporadic and scrappy at first, for the first few minutes after starports are made. However, if you play smart and don't lose any units, the "critical mass" feel of vikings and banshees comes up fast, even though the production is almost always ONLY out of one starport for each unit type. Just constant, steady production (hellions too!) leading to almost shocking balls of units that feel solid and robust to produce, rather than "if I need a critical mass of X unit I should start spamming it as much as possible out of many facilities or reactored facilities"! This solid, systematic feel of the build is so fun and gives the feel of SO much flexibility and safety, knowing that your production is consistent and will get you exactly where you need to go, BUT with any information on your opponent can still be tweaked in a heartbeat!
Daystar
Profile Joined February 2011
United Kingdom33 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-09 18:28:34
February 09 2011 18:27 GMT
#358
Thread is 18 pages long so forgive me if i do not read every page to get teh answer i need

After coming back to terran after a short stint trying out Toss, i thought i would give this build a try, needless to say i lost to a terran going 2 rax marine push on 7 mins.

With only 2 marines and 1 helion, how do you thwart his attack?

I "should" have had a bunker up sooner no doubt, is a repaired bunker the only defense really early game?
Dalavita
Profile Joined August 2010
Sweden1113 Posts
February 09 2011 18:33 GMT
#359
I think I saw you doing this build in a stream one or two days ago. It was pretty impressive to see, but I can really see it dying to mass vikings and marauders.

Hell, not even mass vikings, just enough to kill your banshees.

Regardless, I really liked the build, and I'll integrate it into my gameplay whenever I can. I have in fact been wondering why more people haven't gone full air as Terran before.
NarutO
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Germany18839 Posts
February 09 2011 18:42 GMT
#360
Hey, I didn't try your build nor did I encouter your build. I'm playing around on EU in masters 3400-3600 atm so my question to you. Shouldn't a massive bio force hardcounter your build? Hellions are good and deal good AoE, but I think if you have enough Marine/Marauder/Medivac with a good spread your hellions and banshees won't put a scratch on such an army.

CommentatorPolt | MMA | Jjakji | BoxeR | NaDa | MVP | MKP ... truly inspiring.
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