Well, I wouldn't go as far as to say its a great/viable composition but it might be a good place to start. Vikings demolish BCs but Vikings are not as 'durable' in the TvT matchup. That is they aren't as survivable so they must be constantly replaced. You should check out iEchoic's thread if you want something different that is concrete that works and transitions to BCs.

Otherwise, go fire up the 4v4 and see if the composition actually works late game. If it does, try to figure out how to get there in 1 vs 1.

nalgene

Canada2153 Posts

February 02 2011 14:51 GMT

#22

Build turrets ( +1 range +2 armor ) +durable materials add ravens + marines + tanks +14 scvs+3medivacs+ a few bcs?

ravens/bcs kill vikings decently ( scan first though: you can precast all the yamatos on them to start and drop 2 pdd to block the initial 2 volleys )

10 bcs 4000/3000 + X? = 27 vikings = 4050/2025 +X?
they just need some marines/turrets in the back to run to after casting spells and out of mana and the vikings can't do anything about it ( vikings only have 0 armor without upgrades, so the least marines do = 6 + they stim and out run the vikings/kills them really quick if they chase the bcs/ravens )

As long as the bcs have equal ups to the vikings, they only do 22 per shot ( 25 shots required ), but if you have 14+scvs...

it's possible to nuke a tank line/force them to run away if need be

xciLe

Norway213 Posts

February 02 2011 15:19 GMT

#23

cattlefruisers are good in TvT. but make sure that you have enought viking support, because 1 viking can kite a BC to death.

Skank

United States329 Posts

February 02 2011 16:54 GMT

#24

On February 02 2011 05:53 zhouzhou wrote:
Too expensive and takes way too long to get. Better off just getting cloaked banshees if the purpose is to kill ground units.

Made me rofl. "Cloaked" banshees end up costing almost as much as your first BC, and take almost as long. Furthermore, the opponent is bound to have marines to fend them off, and you won't force any unnecessary vikings. Since Yamato cannon is ridiculously useful in TvT (if their viking count is low, you can even snipe vikings with it and A-move through their tank line), and cloak makes no difference once late game hits for Terran (3+ orbitals makes cloaking useless), BC's are going to become more useful. You need something big to break tank lines, something unexpected that comes with a shock value, and BC's bring just that.

danielsan

Romania399 Posts

February 02 2011 18:01 GMT

#25

Imo BCs are useful only when they are massed (?4+) and not revealed, catching you off guard. But this drastic tech switch rarely goes unnoticed.

mothergoose729

United States666 Posts

February 02 2011 18:41 GMT

#26

You should check out jinro vs MarineKingPrime in the round of 16. Jinro tech switched in the late game to battle cruisers and it worked fairly well. I think i watched another game of him playing a tvt in the gsl and he went for banshees instead. I don't play terran, but I think cloaked banshees to snipe tanks and win positioning games might be better. Either option is certainly viable.

Sv1

United States204 Posts

February 02 2011 19:22 GMT

#27

You'll have to forgive my skepticism when I see something like thor/tank/bc. Is this a NR20min game?

I want to support battlecruisers as much as the next person, but honestly, how do you hide that tech for that long unless you're on 3+ starports (with techlabs mind you) and you haven't been scouted. We all know that air dominance is pretty much the key to TvT. So it's in any terran's best interest to at least get some air forces and have the production available to increase if needed, it's not as if we can't produce 4 food from a starport at a time.

Additionally, turrets do wonders vs bcs. Just hopping on unit tester (and of course this is all in a vaccuum) in 1v1 situations:
(Battlecruiser has no armor or weapon upgrades)

1 turret brings a bc to 352/550 by itself before destruction
1 turret with +2 armor brings bc to 298/550
1 turret with +2 armor and +range brings bc to 280/550

Combine this with seige tanks, the bc offers some help to break a seige/viking/turret line but you still need a ton of other stuff to chew through it.

I think I understand blizzard's take on the bc as oppose to carrier/bl. A strong front line warship that can support its army. On open battlegrounds it might be a bit better, but assaulting a base I think it has a tougher time. This is of course provided you've completely surprised your opponent with more than 1 (which I think is unlikely) and somehow managed to get a way better econ without being contested by your opponent.

0c3LoT

Canada162 Posts

February 02 2011 19:34 GMT

#28

I like to make 1 BC and then never make one again in TvT MMM games.

link0

United States1071 Posts

February 02 2011 22:03 GMT

#29

BC's actually get owned by marines since BIO is usually far more upgraded than air. Blizzard needs to un-nerf the slowest, most useless unit in the game.

MadChem

Germany218 Posts

February 02 2011 22:17 GMT

#30

You can use an early BC to trick your opponent...
I did it for the day9 bc funday quite a lot. Rush to an bc, if your opponent is not likely to rush you (from scouting information) and attack early with them (may be a timing attack with thor), then switch to tank/thor. Dont let your bc's die if you cant kill your enemy and retreate. Many player will now start making a big number of vikings. You miht lose your air advantage, but now you have most of the times a ground advantage for another push...
Might be a bit cheesy with out scouting, but works quite n1 and throws many opponents of guard.
Download my replaypack for a build order and watch the BC funday replays...
[url blocked]

fant0m

964 Posts

February 03 2011 06:26 GMT

#31

Honestly I feel like mass marines beats BCs.

Especially since someone going MMM will have much more mobility than someone going... Viking/Tank/BC is what I'm seeing in this thread.

You will get dropped on, you will lose expansions, and you won't be able to keep up with MMM/Viking.

And when you do get out, you'll probably face like 50-100 stimmed, combat shields, +2/2 or more marines, with medivacs. That takes out BCs pretty damn quick. Especially since they aren't going anywhere.

Ever since the ground attack nerf, BCs don't really roast marines any more, especially with armor upgrades.

Whitewing

United States7483 Posts

February 03 2011 07:08 GMT

#32

If you get armor upgrades for your battlecruisers, they become extraordinarily hard to kill. I believe it's a base armor of 3, so with 3 upgrades that's 6 armor. Against a player who is using marines for anti-air support (or thors) they can easily trash them. Add to the fact that yamato cannon one shots a viking and your enemy will need a good number of vikings to beat your battlecruisers.

KoKoRo

United States186 Posts

February 03 2011 07:11 GMT

#33

If you're going bio and you want air you may as well get banshees, I play Bio Mech and against pure bio players I get banshees and hellions with my normal TvT mix.