• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 01:19
CEST 07:19
KST 14:19
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Code S RO4 & Finals Preview: herO, Rogue, Classic, GuMiho0TL Team Map Contest #5: Presented by Monster Energy4Code S RO8 Preview: herO, Zoun, Bunny, Classic7Code S RO8 Preview: Rogue, GuMiho, Solar, Maru3BGE Stara Zagora 2025: Info & Preview27
Community News
Firefly suspended by EWC, replaced by Lancer2Classic & herO RO8 Interviews: "I think it’s time to teach [Rogue] a lesson."2Rogue & GuMiho RO8 interviews: "Lifting that trophy would be a testament to all I’ve had to overcome over the years and how far I’ve come on this journey.8Code S RO8 Results + RO4 Bracket (2025 Season 2)14BGE Stara Zagora 2025 - Replay Pack2
StarCraft 2
General
Firefly suspended by EWC, replaced by Lancer Jim claims he and Firefly were involved in match-fixing How herO can make history in the Code S S2 finals Rogue & GuMiho RO8 interviews: "Lifting that trophy would be a testament to all I’ve had to overcome over the years and how far I’ve come on this journey. Code S RO8 Results + RO4 Bracket (2025 Season 2)
Tourneys
[GSL 2025] Code S: Season 2 - Semi Finals & Finals WardiTV Mondays Sparkling Tuna Cup - Weekly Open Tournament $3,500 WardiTV European League 2025 Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] Darkgrid Layout Simple Questions Simple Answers [G] PvT Cheese: 13 Gate Proxy Robo
Custom Maps
[UMS] Zillion Zerglings
External Content
Mutation # 478 Instant Karma Mutation # 477 Slow and Steady Mutation # 476 Charnel House Mutation # 475 Hard Target
Brood War
General
ASL20 Preliminary Maps BW General Discussion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ Recent recommended BW games FlaSh Witnesses SCV Pull Off the Impossible vs Shu
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [BSL 2v2] ProLeague Season 3 - Friday 21:00 CET Small VOD Thread 2.0 [BSL20] ProLeague Bracket Stage - Day 4
Strategy
I am doing this better than progamers do. [G] How to get started on ladder as a new Z player
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Nintendo Switch Thread Beyond All Reason What do you want from future RTS games?
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine US Politics Mega-thread UK Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Vape Nation Thread
Fan Clubs
SKT1 Classic Fan Club! Maru Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
Korean Music Discussion [Manga] One Piece
Sports
Formula 1 Discussion 2024 - 2025 Football Thread NHL Playoffs 2024 TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
A Better Routine For Progame…
TrAiDoS
StarCraft improvement
iopq
Heero Yuy & the Tax…
KrillinFromwales
I was completely wrong ab…
jameswatts
Need Your Help/Advice
Glider
Trip to the Zoo
micronesia
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 33207 users

[D] ZvP is there a counter to protoss deathball - Page 3

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 All
Negative Zero
Profile Joined January 2011
United States63 Posts
February 03 2011 22:38 GMT
#41
It seems like, from what has been said in this thread, that the best plan is to use Corruptors (and maybe Roaches to eat Stalker/VR fire while the Corruptors work their magic) to remove the Colossi from the battle, and then just Baneling the ball away, be it with drops or with just throwing them at the ball. Baneling drops are very potent because Overlords have a lower threat priority than attacking units, and once the banelings are dropped on the ball it doesn't matter if they die because they'll explode on the ball anyway.

When you get to lategame, and you have enough money that you can make any units you want, you should not underestimate the supply efficiency of Banelings. If you lose 10 Roaches, then that frees up 20 supply, which can be 40 Banelings. 40 Banelings are a lot more dangerous than 10 Roaches, especially to a ball of units.
ThaneKrios
Profile Joined December 2010
46 Posts
February 03 2011 23:00 GMT
#42
I always hold the protoss on 2 bases using ling/muta and while I pressure him I try to mass muta with some lings
BlasiuS
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States2405 Posts
February 03 2011 23:02 GMT
#43
On February 04 2011 04:59 TNine wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2011 05:15 roymarthyup wrote:
http://www.gamereplays.org/starcraft2/replays.php?game=33&show=details&id=185887

heres a replay where i just beat a protoss deathball

my opponent was clearly under my skill level, but at the end of the game he opted for a deathball of tons of collossi, stalkers, and some zealot/sentry

in many ways, a protoss deathball can be considered better with just collossi instead of collossi/voidray

for example, void rays do not benefit from ground upgrades that help collosis, but stalkers do. also 1 stalker is 50gas and can beat a 100gas mutalisk where a void ray costs 150gas and is weaker pound for pound against mutalisks. and not to mention protoss must get double upgrades to upgrade is VR's where the stalkers automatically benefit from the collossi upgrades

that shows why stalkers are arguably better than void rays for anti air.

next, collossi cost 50 more gas and 50 more minerals than a void ray and are much better at anti-ground. in fact collossi are MASSIVELY SUPERIOR than a void ray against ground units and only costs 50 more minerals and 50 more gas. This means it is not a stupid idea at all to just get a collossi deathball instead of a VR/collossi deathball

anyway, in the replay i clearly was much more skilled than my opponent but ultimate my opponent tried to attack me with a collossi/gateway army that was relatively equal to my army in cost, and i decimated him in every attack


i believe what mainly let me win was i was abusing the power of the roach. the roach is hard to kill even for collossi and roaches just roflstomp all the zealots and start working on the stalkers and roaches build in less than 30 seconds so you can reup a massive reinforcement quickly

next, i slowly made my way to brood lords and it seems a brood lord / roach / mutalisk / queen army is capable of competing with protoss lategame army



Void Rays are really strong against Roaches, which is really the entire reason they are in the protoss deathball. Roaches are also really supply ineffecient, so not too good for 200/200 armies.


agree here, against a good zerg who masses roaches, protoss is forced to get either immortals or void rays, most protoss nowadays choose void rays. They fly (can't be hit by roaches), they are faster than immortals, and they can hit air & ground.

If you were able to abuse roach all game and protoss never got immortals or void rays, the protoss didn't respond properly.
next week on Everybody Loves HypnoToad:
DiaBoLuS
Profile Joined September 2010
Germany1638 Posts
February 03 2011 23:12 GMT
#44
mutas > corrupter vs stalker void. keep that in mind.

if he starts with phenix harass, go for corruptors to counter that. he wont build too many more phenix normally. followup with massmutas [he wont HT tech anyway].

should work - but the P deathball will in most cases be stronger anyway in 200 vs 200

-->
1) zerg has to end the game earlier (hard 3 base push or anything) or do hard, unexpected harassments
2) or you gotta have such an superior economy, that you are at 200/200 again when the toss is still at like ~150-160.

therefore try to avoid fights near your own base and its you to choose the battlefield [wide, open space] if possible.
European Ranking: http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?topic_id=182293
clever_us
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States329 Posts
February 23 2011 17:13 GMT
#45
What do you guys think about mass spine crawler? They don't get split up by force field, they don't take gas... but on the other hand they can get in the way of your other units, right? I just imagine that your creep spread could be pretty sick with a lot of queens vs deathball.... might as well sink some mins into a bunch of spines out in the middle of the map, no?
glhf <3
Farmerz
Profile Joined January 2011
39 Posts
February 23 2011 19:17 GMT
#46
Counter 1) Baneling drops (only with better econony recommended, but that shouldn't be the problem)
Counter 2) alot of corrupters
Counter 3) mass muta / lings (fails badly vs storm tho, so only in mid game recommended)
wildcard_
Profile Joined February 2011
United States1 Post
February 23 2011 19:38 GMT
#47
As an added note, remaxing on Ultras when the P only has Stalkers remaining (Corruptors wiped our VRs/Colos) is really mean. I've lost a few games because of it.
I have not yet begun to fight
Neivler
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Norway911 Posts
February 23 2011 19:48 GMT
#48
On February 03 2011 03:13 kcdc wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 03 2011 01:23 MangoTango wrote:
On February 02 2011 05:24 Adeeler wrote:
Aim to overkill with Corruptors to wipe out his collusus & voidray count.


Yes, because Corruptors fight Void Rays so efficiently right?

Right?

(Hint: Void Rays absolutely SMASH Corruptors).


This is flat out wrong. Void vs corruptor is pretty even. If you have more cost in corruptors, you'll beat the voids. And collosi drain so much gas, that if you commit to air, P won't have gas to contest your air superiority.


My problem there is not that I cant get more air units, but the stalkers are good against the corruptors and with the voids you really have to overkill a lot on the air to kill his air/collosus units. I just cant get that corruptor number to be perfect
I pwn noobs
Chaosvuistje
Profile Joined April 2010
Netherlands2581 Posts
February 23 2011 20:01 GMT
#49
On February 24 2011 02:13 gROOT.clever wrote:
What do you guys think about mass spine crawler? They don't get split up by force field, they don't take gas... but on the other hand they can get in the way of your other units, right? I just imagine that your creep spread could be pretty sick with a lot of queens vs deathball.... might as well sink some mins into a bunch of spines out in the middle of the map, no?


Spinecrawlers are great! They are very effective against gateway units.
But they aren't the solution to the deathball. Sure, they help against the gateway portion. But you would rather want the minerals for your remaxing army than into spinecrawlers which are outranged by collosus and don't hit voidrays.

I have no problem with dealing with protoss balls when they move out to engage me before they hit their 200/200 ball. My +2 roaches and +2 baneling bombs deal with them reasonably well, while my queens deal with the voidrays ( sort of, I mean, if he has massive amounts of voidrays something went wrong on my scouting ).

However I have no answer to a turtling protoss that gets a quick 3rd base up. Simcities that so that there is really only one major attack path. While harrassing with a phoenix squad that basically keeps my scouting to a minimum and makes him always know my unit composition. A fortified protoss position is simply too hard of a nut to crack for me using anything but broodlord tech. Collosus sitting behind a building/forcefield wall while taking minimum damage are so cost effective that I almost never find a good time to engage it. So I will be following this discussion a lot. .
Prev 1 2 3 All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 5h 41m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Nina 231
NeuroSwarm 227
StarCraft: Brood War
PianO 440
Leta 288
Noble 11
BeSt 6
Dota 2
monkeys_forever907
League of Legends
JimRising 664
Counter-Strike
Stewie2K1069
Heroes of the Storm
Khaldor160
Other Games
C9.Mang01299
WinterStarcraft441
Maynarde80
Mew2King48
RuFF_SC215
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Secondary Stream3611
Other Games
gamesdonequick472
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH285
• Hupsaiya 81
• Sammyuel 14
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• Azhi_Dahaki131
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Rush1121
Other Games
• Shiphtur322
Upcoming Events
Wardi Open
5h 41m
Replay Cast
18h 41m
Replay Cast
1d 4h
RSL Revival
1d 4h
Cure vs Percival
ByuN vs Spirit
PiGosaur Monday
1d 18h
RSL Revival
2 days
herO vs sOs
Zoun vs Clem
Replay Cast
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Serral vs SHIN
Solar vs Cham
Replay Cast
3 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
4 days
Reynor vs Scarlett
ShoWTimE vs Classic
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
4 days
SC Evo League
5 days
Circuito Brasileiro de…
5 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2025-06-11
2025 GSL S2
Heroes 10 EU

Ongoing

JPL Season 2
BSL 2v2 Season 3
BSL Season 20
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 2
NPSL S3
Rose Open S1
CSL 17: 2025 SUMMER
Copa Latinoamericana 4
Murky Cup #2
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025
PGL Astana 2025
Asian Champions League '25
BLAST Rivals Spring 2025
MESA Nomadic Masters
CCT Season 2 Global Finals
IEM Melbourne 2025
YaLLa Compass Qatar 2025
PGL Bucharest 2025

Upcoming

CSLPRO Last Chance 2025
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
K-Championship
SEL Season 2 Championship
Esports World Cup 2025
HSC XXVII
Championship of Russia 2025
BLAST Open Fall 2025
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.