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On January 08 2012 11:48 RhapsodyZ wrote:
When should I get my macro hatch? I am plat zerg but I have no idea when or in what situations I should get it.
Someone can probably give a more qualified answer, but as someone who offraces zerg, I'll say you can get a macro hatch whenever you know you need it for your macro. Look at your games, figure out at what point you have trouble spending your money (when you tech a certain path, when your opponent does something, when you get gasses etc.), and then you can learn when you need a macro hatch.
Personally, if I'm going for a standard game, I like getting a macro hatch after a third base, but you can also get a macro hatch on 2 bases if you intend to go all-in with a certain attack and need the extra larvae.
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How come when i see pros in XvP matchup, where (x) is going for an all in, drop, harass, ,defending a cannon rush or going for a base race situation. they never ( i never see it) them go straight for the pylons?
this is a Bronze league question ^
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On January 08 2012 12:29 J0llybally wrote:
How come when i see pros in XvP matchup, where (x) is going for an all in, drop, harass, ,defending a cannon rush or going for a base race situation. they never ( i never see it) them go straight for the pylons?
this is a Bronze league question ^
it depends on how he positions his buildings and if killing pylons will do more long term damage than stalling his tech by killing a robo or forge. most importantly it's about being able to pick up and run as quickly as possible.
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On January 08 2012 12:29 J0llybally wrote:
How come when i see pros in XvP matchup, where (x) is going for an all in, drop, harass, ,defending a cannon rush or going for a base race situation. they never ( i never see it) them go straight for the pylons?
this is a Bronze league question ^
For defending the cannon rush (I'm going to talk about pvp specifically here), you must go for the cannons as they are constructing, because cannons are more expensive, have less hp, and build slower than pylons. If you try to defend a cannon rush by attacking the pylons, the cannon rusher will just build more pylons, which are cheap and build quickly. On the other hand, if you can spot a cannon as it starts warping in, only 3 probes per cannon is enough to kill it before it finishes warping in. You should have more than enough probes to take care of all warping in pylons while your first zealot comes out. Once a zealot is out, and he doesn't have any cannons completed, preventing any more cannons from finishing is pretty easy, and you will be far ahead.
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How does map editor work?
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In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp?
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On January 08 2012 17:49 whoyou wrote:
How does map editor work?
Mate, that is in no way a SIMPLE question. Read the OP.
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On January 08 2012 17:49 whoyou wrote:
How does map editor work?
You select things and plop them down.
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On January 08 2012 17:55 Sockso wrote:
In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp?
P :First pylon next to your nexus. Pylon scout. Scout 6 pool. Get forge. Get 2 cannons smartly placed in/behind your mineral line.
Z: Get 10 pool (also works with 14 pool, but against ZZ you usually want an early pool), when your opponent scouts 6 pool, get 2 spines.
When lings come surround your cannons/spines with hold position workers.
Tech to DTs or voidrays and win the game.
When facing early cheese like this, don't worry about overmaking defenses. Teams who do this are either playing random, or bad, or on tilt. In all cases, beating them in the late game should be relatively easy.
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On January 08 2012 16:02 thenexusp wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 12:29 J0llybally wrote:
How come when i see pros in XvP matchup, where (x) is going for an all in, drop, harass, ,defending a cannon rush or going for a base race situation. they never ( i never see it) them go straight for the pylons?
this is a Bronze league question ^ For defending the cannon rush (I'm going to talk about pvp specifically here), you must go for the cannons as they are constructing, because cannons are more expensive, have less hp, and build slower than pylons. If you try to defend a cannon rush by attacking the pylons, the cannon rusher will just build more pylons, which are cheap and build quickly. On the other hand, if you can spot a cannon as it starts warping in, only 3 probes per cannon is enough to kill it before it finishes warping in. You should have more than enough probes to take care of all warping in pylons while your first zealot comes out. Once a zealot is out, and he doesn't have any cannons completed, preventing any more cannons from finishing is pretty easy, and you will be far ahead.
And as far as harrassment goes, there are generally higher-priority targets such as tech structures and probes that need to be killed first. Usually, it goes probes > Tech (depending which tech) > pylons > gateways. If there are two or more pylons powering something, you're better off killing the thing they're powering, because its worth more and will take longer to rebuild than a pylon.
In base races and all-ins, it doesn't really matter what you target first outside of specific situations where its better to go for certain tech structures, but pylons are a higher priority target in these situations because supply blocks become critically important.
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On January 08 2012 17:55 Sockso wrote:
In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp?
You will not be able to wall in time in that situation. You won't be able to have a zealot. You'll need to both of you pull workers and micro as hard as you can. If you ally was going for an aggressive pool opener (9 or earlier) just try to stall until his 6 lings pop, then engage with the lings + 8 workers, and micro back hurt workers.
On large maps, if you went for a 10 gate, you may be able to chrono out a zealot, but basically you're pulling probes no matter what. It will help in this sort of situation to be coordinated with your ally via teamspeak, ventrilo, or skype.
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On January 08 2012 19:28 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 17:55 Sockso wrote:
In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp? You will not be able to wall in time in that situation. You won't be able to have a zealot. You'll need to both of you pull workers and micro as hard as you can. If you ally was going for an aggressive pool opener (9 or earlier) just try to stall until his 6 lings pop, then engage with the lings + 8 workers, and micro back hurt workers. On large maps, if you went for a 10 gate, you may be able to chrono out a zealot, but basically you're pulling probes no matter what. It will help in this sort of situation to be coordinated with your ally via teamspeak, ventrilo, or skype.
I don't agree that you can defend double 6 pool without static defense. Lings + 8 workers will not win vs 16+ lings. Also if your ally pulls probes to help you, you will lose a lot of econ anyways, probably much more then the econ loss from getting a couple of cannons up.
If you opened with some sort of agressive 10 gate though, it's indeed better to chrono out zealots and micro between your mineral patches.
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On January 08 2012 19:36 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 19:28 Blazinghand wrote:On January 08 2012 17:55 Sockso wrote:
In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp? You will not be able to wall in time in that situation. You won't be able to have a zealot. You'll need to both of you pull workers and micro as hard as you can. If you ally was going for an aggressive pool opener (9 or earlier) just try to stall until his 6 lings pop, then engage with the lings + 8 workers, and micro back hurt workers. On large maps, if you went for a 10 gate, you may be able to chrono out a zealot, but basically you're pulling probes no matter what. It will help in this sort of situation to be coordinated with your ally via teamspeak, ventrilo, or skype. I don't agree that you can defend double 6 pool without static defense. Lings + 8 workers will not win vs 16+ lings. Also if your ally pulls probes to help you, you will lose a lot of econ anyways, probably much more then the econ loss from getting a couple of cannons up.
Would it then be a reasonable response to always forge first against ZZ as PZ? the Z in PZ will rarely be able to cover a ramp with a crawler, so you'll have to cannon your own min line it seems.
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watching the pro's zerg players streaming a lot of them in the beginning force the drone to an already mining mineral , kinda making the drone dance, question is why do they do this?
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On January 08 2012 20:39 sPlosH wrote:
watching the pro's zerg players streaming a lot of them in the beginning force the drone to an already mining mineral , kinda making the drone dance, question is why do they do this?
they want to have workers mining from the closer mineral patches. this gives you slightly more income.
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On January 08 2012 20:55 Blazinghand wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 20:39 sPlosH wrote:
watching the pro's zerg players streaming a lot of them in the beginning force the drone to an already mining mineral , kinda making the drone dance, question is why do they do this? they want to have workers mining from the closer mineral patches. this gives you slightly more income.
I thought that was the case too, but then most of the time its not, its like they are already two or three drones mining a single mineral they send the drone to that particular mineral and the drone kinda dances since its not able to mine from that particular saturated mineral
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Sry, don't have the patience to scroll through 520 pages to check if it has been asked before:
Q: I really want to know a strong, tested and experienced unit composition PvZ vs Broodlords. I as Protoss
have a hard time dealing with 10+ broodlords, blinkstalkers don't work because they have lings+fungal growth.
Mothership comes always too late for me. Any good unit composition?
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On January 08 2012 21:41 Protoss-Bah wrote:
Sry, don't have the patience to scroll through 520 pages to check if it has been asked before:
Q: I really want to know a strong, tested and experienced unit composition PvZ vs Broodlords. I as Protoss
have a hard time dealing with 10+ broodlords, blinkstalkers don't work because they have lings+fungal growth.
Mothership comes always too late for me. Any good unit composition?
As a mid master protoss i try to go for this maxed army unitcomp against alot of broodlord, roach and infestors. 3-4 colossus that can clear broodlings and do damage to ground. 4-5 hightemplars for feedback on infestors and storm, and rest blink stalkers. Blink under the broodlord and focus fire them. This is a very gas intense unit comp and you might have to much minerals for it to be worth. But i usually harass alot with zealots, so i lose minerals from there..
I guess mothership is good aswell, i don't really use it.
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On January 08 2012 21:41 Protoss-Bah wrote:
Sry, don't have the patience to scroll through 520 pages to check if it has been asked before:
Q: I really want to know a strong, tested and experienced unit composition PvZ vs Broodlords. I as Protoss
have a hard time dealing with 10+ broodlords, blinkstalkers don't work because they have lings+fungal growth.
Mothership comes always too late for me. Any good unit composition?
Not really a simple question, you need to show your replay because there's no reason for a zerg to have 10 broodlords and you not have a mothership (or at least for the zerg to have any economy behind it, as if you don't have any tech beyond blink stalkers you should have been able to take out some bases).
Best composition would be an air army but of course you'll probably have a lot of blink stalkers/templar/archon and no gas to magically get air. Mothership shouldn't come too late though, 10 broodlords is a lot of money and if he got to them with you not getting a mothership yet (staying on blink stalkers) you were being too passive. Mothership + archon + blink stalker + some collusi/templar does fine with a vortex. Add on some voids if you can afford it.
EDIT:
On January 08 2012 19:36 Geiko wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 19:28 Blazinghand wrote:On January 08 2012 17:55 Sockso wrote:
In a 2v2, PZvZZ, how do we defend an double 6 or pool on a map with a large ramp? You will not be able to wall in time in that situation. You won't be able to have a zealot. You'll need to both of you pull workers and micro as hard as you can. If you ally was going for an aggressive pool opener (9 or earlier) just try to stall until his 6 lings pop, then engage with the lings + 8 workers, and micro back hurt workers. On large maps, if you went for a 10 gate, you may be able to chrono out a zealot, but basically you're pulling probes no matter what. It will help in this sort of situation to be coordinated with your ally via teamspeak, ventrilo, or skype. I don't agree that you can defend double 6 pool without static defense. Lings + 8 workers will not win vs 16+ lings. Also if your ally pulls probes to help you, you will lose a lot of econ anyways, probably much more then the econ loss from getting a couple of cannons up. If you opened with some sort of agressive 10 gate though, it's indeed better to chrono out zealots and micro between your mineral patches.
As zerg vs double zerg in PZ team, you'd better open up with a 10pool just to not die to early pools (you can with 14 it's just annoying cause your Toss ally will have nothing to help). For Toss you should open 10gate vs ZZ too, because opening with 2 defensive cannons while your ally has 10 pool (e.g. your ally isn't going toward any good tech) sucks imo. Your DT's will be so late and so predictable, and the your zerg ally off a 10pool doesn't exactly have a sick economy compared to the 6pools. By going forge you give up any aggressive options so you're stuck with your Zerg ally ready for aggression (and with 9 drones) and you not. You can't really drone off a 10pool either without a massive advantage.
I think your best bet is to have your 10pool ally keep making lings (which will make sure your zerg opponents have to keep making their own lings if they want to expand, and it's kind of the only thing you can do off a 10pool) and toss go for dts off the zerg keeping map control with speedlings.
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On January 08 2012 21:06 sPlosH wrote:Show nested quote +On January 08 2012 20:55 Blazinghand wrote:On January 08 2012 20:39 sPlosH wrote:
watching the pro's zerg players streaming a lot of them in the beginning force the drone to an already mining mineral , kinda making the drone dance, question is why do they do this? they want to have workers mining from the closer mineral patches. this gives you slightly more income. I thought that was the case too, but then most of the time its not, its like they are already two or three drones mining a single mineral they send the drone to that particular mineral and the drone kinda dances since its not able to mine from that particular saturated mineral
It's for what happens after the dancing  The drone now has a shorter distance to travel in subsequent cycles.
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EPT
