EPT[D] TvP Cheese rush overpowered? - Page 5
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Pulimuli
Sweden2766 Posts
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
On March 14 2010 10:53 IdrA wrote: all t rushes are really really strong now, for some reason blizz seems to think that a good way to balance a matchup is to let one race have overpowered allins and give the other race a dominant late game. I don't think protoss has a dominant late game at all, and perhaps this is a really strong allin, but it's probably a matter of learning how to scout it early enough to respond without being forced into a certain opening. Perhaps it's because I use mech T that love to drive the game into lategame where I feel I have a massive advantage. I do agree that bio is complete trash past earlygame, so perhaps this is what you're referring to? In any case, as protoss I'd move out with that first stalker if I didn't scout gas on terran, since it's almost a sure sign of an allin. (If I get blocked out I'd be looking for rax addon). Those early stalkers can probably be micro'd all the way back to your base for a decent amount of damage/major delay to the allin. I think that'd be enough time to prepare what you need to deflect it. I haven't been playing protoss so perhaps I'm not aware of how hard this actually is to stop, but I feel like that'd help tremendously. | ||
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imBLIND
United States2626 Posts
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
On March 14 2010 11:26 imBLIND wrote: You can't rly blame terrans for cheesing like this. We're just sick and tired of dealing with immortals and collosi... That's the saddest shit I've ever read. "We're not good enough to learn how to play, so we cheese instead." Get good and stop making all terrans look bad. I'm so tired of seeing this kind of talk on these forums. To avoid double posting: On another note I did just test this myself, somehow managing to get sc2 to run on my laptop (though it was like 3 fps lol). I played with my friend who isn't a terran player, but it's not that hard to execute this... I didn't even micro past casting guardian shield and I dismantled this strategy so hard with 1 gate core. It's a bad allin and easily scoutable. This is how you scout it: -2 rax with no gas is almost 100% this allin. I don't know any build that exists that's 2 rax no gas. -1 rax with gas but no factory, addon, ebay, or anything gas related (he probably is proxying that 2nd rax somewhere, or proxing a fact somewhere too, in which case you should still play safe) -2 rax with gas but doesn't put scvs ON gas (why get gas when you're going allin?) These things are completely suspicious and I think give away the allin. I'm not sure what all the variations/fakes of this there are, but I doubt you'll be blindsided if you know what to look for. As for stopping it: Sentry immediately, 2nd gate, pull probes when he shows up (chrono your gates) and just get sentries as much as you can. Sentries rape marines so hard it's not funny, and they're pretty good vs everything so if he's an idiot and doing something weird you didn't waste all that money. I'll play it a few more times when I'm back at school on my desktop and stream it and upload replays if I get the time. | ||
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Zoler
Sweden6339 Posts
On March 14 2010 10:53 IdrA wrote: that works, you can also use the hit bars to see what side the scv is on which makes it easier all t rushes are really really strong now, for some reason blizz seems to think that a good way to balance a matchup is to let one race have overpowered allins and give the other race a dominant late game. its so wierd seeing u hate on terran :O | ||
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fadeless
38 Posts
Done this on bnet first time. Instant win - - | ||
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Rothbardian
United States497 Posts
On March 14 2010 13:13 fadeless wrote: whoa Done this on bnet first time. Instant win - - No shit. Most Cheese wins you the game......when your opponent has no idea it's coming. I've lost to a few proxy Protoss who send their probe immediately to my base before I even scout. So naturally, now I just scout my base when I play against Protoss. Haven't lost to it since. /sigh | ||
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EmeraldSparks
United States1451 Posts
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
On March 14 2010 13:32 EmeraldSparks wrote: the fact that the only two people saying the cheese is easy to counter are the guy who said pvp warpgates is easy to counter and the guy who said his build stomped all bio, all the time, forever only make me more confident that this is actually a problem The fact that I played a game vs this with a laptop that can barely even load up sc2 in the first place and won means it's a horrible allin. Also I switched to terran, but my protoss vs bio is undefeated. | ||
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EmeraldSparks
United States1451 Posts
On March 14 2010 13:34 Floophead_III wrote: The fact that I played a game vs this with a laptop that can barely even load up sc2 in the first place and won means it's a horrible allin. Also I switched to terran, but my protoss vs bio is undefeated. I'm pretty sure you tested it out, got stomped by Zatic build several times in a row, then grudgingly conceded that your build did not, in fact, stomp all bio, all the time, as you had previously claimed, and then the thread was closed because you had spent four pages claiming that you could stomp Zatic easy. | ||
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
Regardless, we're getting off topic. The point is that this rush only works right now because nobody has any clue it's coming. Proper scouting and knowing that it exists means you can correctly prepare. Pretty much all you have to do is as soon as you scout 2 rax no gas just start adding gates/pumping snowglobes. I think people lose to this also because they don't know to pull all their probes. You're facing like 12 scvs. Pull some damn probes. | ||
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Rothbardian
United States497 Posts
If you scout you will win. If you don't you will lose. That is the way of all cheese. | ||
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Floophead_III
United States1832 Posts
On March 14 2010 13:47 Rothbardian wrote: If you scout you will win. If you don't you will lose. That is the way of all cheese. Amen. | ||
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Meta
United States6226 Posts
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Mente
United States288 Posts
I have to admit it is pretty easy to roflstomp unsuspecting protoss with this builds. Even with 3 gates up and several "snow globes" i still roll over the toss. Then again just out of pure disgust with the build I rarely go it unless I lost the previous game and am nerd raging. | ||
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Dromar
United States2145 Posts
 , but how strong are cannons at stopping this? Is there any possibility of a forge FE and just go 2base vs 2base? Or do marines overwhelm cannons too easily? | ||
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Mente
United States288 Posts
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ShineShineBear
United States62 Posts
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Inschato
Canada1349 Posts
On March 14 2010 14:04 Meta wrote: Clearly they must re-establish the shield battery. The least used building ever does have it's niche in stopping all-ins. Tempest's 36 kill goon comes to mind. Maybe if they added the shield recharge spell to the nexus, it might give protoss some question of whether to chrono boost to get more units in, or recharge to save current units? | ||
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Mente
United States288 Posts
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