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On October 06 2012 10:44 nilsheam wrote:
make it on top of the ramp as far as determining the boundries? the ramp is neutral. I think having terrain bonuses adds more positioning and fun to the gameplay, so you should try getting it to work properly ^_^
It hasn't been in game for 4 weeks and nobody noticed, so it pretty clearly doesn't add much to the gameplay.
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Comments from an NA Masters:
Regarding high ground, the high ground mechanic is too punishing, its too solid. For FE on oakshire, as toss, you can NEVER bust it with range. Highround play is still encouraged with a percent chance.
It makes turtling way too easy
Mech or turtle strat's burn out too quickly because patches are 1.5 instead of 1.0k. I've had plenty of people feel like they mine out too fast.
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Its obvious people didnt notice. You have to first get used to something so your brain will stat noticing difference. Most of player here have played sc2 much much more than starbow and penalty for atacking high ground is something different. Not lack of it.
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A few pages back, I thought someone (Kabel, I believe) was saying you were looking forward to being able to use the Viper model instead of the Swarm Guardian, but I have to say I think the Swarm Guardian looks fantastic, especially when swivelling on the spot (idle animation), so I hope that the Viper model would only be used if a HotS version of Starbow had that as an additional unit.
I also think Frenzy can be interesting due to how much power it adds to the units, like requiring significantly less banelings to suicide into a nexus, so if the SG is very strong with Dark Swarm and Frenzy, rather than changing the abilities, yo ujust make them more expensive if necessary, so that they are prime targets, like Defilers. You either do it through making them more fragile like Defilers or make each on more expensive but more durable than Defilers (true for them now, I would say, probably better too).
Irradiate works just as well on fliers, the fact they fly simply protects the investment from some of the more cruddy ways to lose your expensive units (siege tanks without you having seen that they were sieged so far away yet still in range of where you were moving).
So I hope that they'll be left with that model, as fliers and that Frenzy is given more time to prove itself (and hope that I didn't miss you removing it in that update >_<). Checking Match Point 1.3, it seems the same but with possible different Hydra speed, Swarm Eggs are back, IT deal 6 instead of 5 and the Fungal Tooltip now says 38 (50 vs armoured), but I'm going to guess that's the UI bug on the NA server as Kabel said was occurring.
You know (and it should be this way), you can cast frenzy on a group of units, load them into overlords and THEN drop them in a base. It sounds exciting to me.
If 50% bonus attack were too strong, you just lower the bonus damage percentage or make it take away 10 of each unit's life (sounds similar to stim but maybe that's not so bad and not actually doubling up on abilities as it is one cast on an area and grants damage rather than attack and movement speed).
It's another spell that encourages the opponent to specific attempt to assassinate those units (snipe is still in as an option too, dealing 50 to psionic unless you've changed it).
On the above note though, on NA at least, Swarm Guardians are not Psionic. This is a mistake, right?
Lurkers can't hold position using either of the old tricks (hold position with overlords or targetting distant buildings; the latter just throws an error message at you instead).
Would you consider adding the Ghost's Hold Fire command to them? It was one of the tactical aspects of Lurkers and it's currently missing.
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On October 04 2012 04:08 Kabel wrote:
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But I don´t consider the Swarm Guardian/Viper to necessarily be a problem as a flying unit. Or rather, I think there are ways to design the unit so it actually becomes a good thing that it flies. It just needs some different tweaking compared to the Defiler.
Plague will probably not effect buildings, since you will be able to move everywhere and Plague the shit out of the enemy base. Furthermore, the damage must not be 300, since the Viper is so mobile. Maybe 100 damage over 50 seconds time? Still enough to screw up an enemy army.
It seems that if plague has to be nerfed to work this slowly it would be a lot less exciting than BW plague, in the same way that BW psi storm is way more terrifying/fun than SC2 storm.
Just a thought, don't know how important this is.
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Does anyone happen to know why can`t I currently create a game on the Breaking Point on EU server?
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So, I'm not 100% positive yet... but I may be able to start playing SC2 again regularly.
We'll find out in a few hours. If everything works out, NA server better start getting scared.
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On October 06 2012 22:42 SmileZerg wrote:
So, I'm not 100% positive yet... but I may be able to start playing SC2 again regularly.
We'll find out in a few hours. If everything works out, NA server better start getting scared.
lol........ dont worry, there will be alot of competition for you.
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*Sigh* Fuck. Nevermind. My cousin's an idiot. My participation will remain on indefinite hold.
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On October 06 2012 12:56 decemberscalm wrote:
Comments from an NA Masters:
Regarding high ground, the high ground mechanic is too punishing, its too solid. For FE on oakshire, as toss, you can NEVER bust it with range. Highround play is still encouraged with a percent chance.
It makes turtling way too easy
Mech or turtle strat's burn out too quickly because patches are 1.5 instead of 1.0k. I've had plenty of people feel like they mine out too fast.
turtle strat's deserve to burn out quickly as it's a shitty way to play and is bound to get punished. you do mine our fast and the main reason is we don't have any tal'darim equivilent maps so most of our matchups are sc2 equivilient of Xel Naga Caverns, 3-4 base play all game end it in 20 mins tops with no real late game transition. Match Point is more most macro map :/ great map but we could still use a larger scale map in the pool.
High ground is punishing but its strength is defense over offense. You can deny high ground psition to someone who is trying to get high ground offensively against you. For breaking someones defense on the high ground trying to run up and bust the ramp is going to result in your army being whiped. Gotta force the defenders hand by adding siege air units (carrier, broodlord) and drop play. Theres ways of cracking a tight defense, just not always easily.
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Hey Kabel, do you think it is possible to try to test my map under starbow mod?
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We've had 7-10 people on NA all day long, and still 8 people here at 12:22 AM.
Good to see all the new faces guys 
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On October 07 2012 04:58 Rukis wrote:
Hey Kabel, do you think it is possible to try to test my map under starbow mod?
since kabel hasn't answered yet, I will answer with what I think he would have said:
the MOD is public so you can download it, add it as a dependency to your map and upload any map you want. you can even edit the mod to have your very own version of it if you wish.
obviously, give credit where credit is due though.
I believe that is what kabel has said to similar requests.
I think it might be good to include a version ID somewhere in the name though, so people can see if it is an outdated version in the future.
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@ Publishing your own maps with Starbow
I would actually not like if people published their own maps together with Starbow. The reason for this is that it is still updated a lot and sometimes people do not update their maps at the same pace. This means that when a new players searches for Starbow, there will be both be old and new versions of Starbow online.
I´ve had this scenario on EU before, where players published their own maps with Starbow. When I uploaded the patch for the "official" Starbow maps, they sometimes did not bother to add the latest changes to their maps. This made it confusing for newer players, to know what map contained the latest version.
Instead, if anyone has a map they think would fit well with Starbow, please PM me about it and it might be added to the map pool. I have a few maps already people have sent me that will probably be included in the map pool soon. (Once the MOD gets a bit more complete, I will start to focus much more on getting a better map pool. But I keep it at only 3-5 maps now because it makes it much easier to update.)
...
Anyways, finally I have a new update up for EU and NA. (Its been sent to decemberscalm as we speak)
This patch includes some small changes to the Zerg spells and some other important stats changes. Since I have been so busy the last couple of days, I haven´t done anything fancy to Zerg. But I decided its time to change the Hydra damage and some other crucial things so I managed to get an update up today atleast.
Below I will give you all a brief summary of the most important changes.
Infestors remain as they are, except that Fungal Growth deals no damage. Instead if slows movement and attack speed by 75% for 6 seconds.
Swarm Guardian has Dark Swarm and Plague. Dark Swarm covers a smaller area now and Plague deals only 100 damage over time, instead of 300 in BW. (Since it is a flying unit) I also tried to add some form of Consume ability, but I did not get it to work properly. So I maybe add it in a later update, when I have more time to fix it.
Again, this might not be the optimal Zerg solution. I want to give it a try to see how Plague works on Swarm Guardian and how useful Fungal Growth is without dealing damage. There was some other good Zerg spell ideas in the thread, but many of them required a lot of work. Unfortunatly I do not have time to try anything of that right now.
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Some changes in stats:
Duality charge upgrade now costs 200/200 and gives +2 range to Stalkers. (Earlier it costed 100/100 and gave +1 range)
This means that Stalkers can outrange bunkers. This will be a way for Protoss to apply pressure vs Terran early, without going for an all in.Furthermore, since the Protoss upgrade is now so costly, it becomes an important tech option in all match ups. (Earlier all Protosses just got it as fast as possible since it was so cheap and it barely delayed any other tech.)
As a compensation, Terran can defend by getting +1 range upgrade for marines (costs 100/100 and has a faster resarch time than Duality Charge) or get Siege tanks or Spider mines. Stim pack upgrade also has a bit faster research time, to make Terran bio able to pressure a bit earlier.
Turrets costs 75 minerals but deals less damage. The reason for this is to encouarge Terran to built Turrets out on the battlefield. Terran often have a hard time defending vs a Reaver drop + warp in. Its so hard to cover the crucial locations with Turrets. Since they are a bit cheaper now, Terran will be able to defend a bit better. (Lots of PvT ended as soon as the Reaver landed and the first wave of warped in units started running amok in the Terran base.. )
Hydralisks deal 6 dmg vs everything and +4 damage vs armored units. Furthermore, they deal 8 dmg vs all NON-armored air units, like Wraiths, Corsairs and Mutalisks.
And some minor changes and adjustments.
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All of this is based on games I´ve observed on EU and the solutions have been discussed with mostly master players, like Danko etc. So they are not completely out of the blue. But as usual, if stuff do not work as intended or other problems arises, things can be adjusted more. Like always ^^
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I´m online on EU now if anyone wanna play. Join the Starbow chat channel as usual
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Infestors remain as they are, except that Fungal Growth deals no damage. Instead if slows movement and attack speed by 75% for 6 seconds.
Why so high value? It denies micro basically same as complete movement disable and makes units dps laughable. 33% would be enough to make this spell worth casting. Maybe slowing turning rate so slowed units will be even more prone to flanks.
Everything else seems fine.
Are you online? Im gonna be soon, so we can play if you want :d
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I think if Ensare was any less you would rarely see it. Without fungal doing damage you're going to see a lot less infestors on the map now, maybe some for IT harass that's about.
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A big problem with having people upload their own maps, the map pool establishes how the game plays.
BW was almost entirely balanced by maps.
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what do you people mean when you say IT ?
"maybe some for IT harass that's about"
que?
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EPT
