On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
On April 11 2013 23:38 smashlloyd20 wrote: For all the relentless Demuslim fans: this is why he didn't get a seed. He's not from America and he's not in the top 8 of non Americans in WCS America.
Also Lowely missing from EU is a travesty. He has every possible qualification to get in. Feast probably should be in there but most of his recent success has come from tournaments that Blizzard probably didn't look at (ATC, etc.).
Agreed on Lowely, but completely disagree on the point with DeMuslim. If you watched his stream recently, you would be able to see that he very, very clearly is in the top 8 in America. He's been almost even with Polt in TvT, destroying gowswer and stephano very consistently in TvZ and seeing that his micro is what he self-assesses to be his best aspect of his play, his TvP is obviously very good as this is heavily micro-based.
There is absolutely no justification for the majority of the players on that list being selected over DeMuslim.
Fortunately, I think he will be good enough to come through the 'Korean' qualifiers - but the fact that he has to in the first place is just a joke.
16 invites are probably based on results of WCS NA. The extra 8 are: Ryung,HerO,Violet,Polt,mOOnGLaDe,Sen,NesTea,Snute Which of these players has been beforming worse than DeMuslim in recent tourneys?
The first 16 are definitely not based on WCS NA, otherwise Ostojiy(who got 7th at WCS NA) would have been invited. I see no reason why Demuslim is excluded from the 16 NA invites, he's different from the last 8 in that he already lives in America. And he is significantly better than some of the NA players who got invites.
Demuslim should definitely have gotten a seed over guys like IdrA, Suppy, and others like Hellokitty, Minigun, theognis Capoch, Maker.
Quote from http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=407158 : "16 of the 24 invites are going to North Americans, the remaining 8 invitations are going to people who are not North American. That could be both Europeans and Koreans. The last 8 spots are coming from online qualifiers. That's your 32 for this season."
The system seems reasonable, and a nice middleground between all-qualifiers and 32 NA people. Most of NA list is equivalent of WCS results - maybe Ostojiy turned his invite down or they checked his HoTS ladder results ( he is not even in top200 masters in NA ladder currently ).
Anyway since DeMuslim is from EU you should focus on his results compared to the other 8 non-NA invites.
Except Demuslim isn't from EU, he's from NA? If he was from EU, he'd be living in Europe and going to European tournaments. I thought the whole point of WCS was to have a scene local to each continent.
As is discussed on every single thread about WCS, eventually we're going to have a GSL-style offline tournament for a full round of 32. When this happens, everyone will have to live in KR/NA/EU for their respective tournaments. If Demu entered the EU tournament, he would eventually have to leave that tournament and enter the challenger division in NA because his long term plans are to stay in the US.
It's really dumb to base these invites on citizenship instead of residency because the whole point of this system is to get a more robust NA-based scene. The nationalities of the players shouldn't matter, but their residence should. If you live in NA, play for an NA team, participate in NA tournaments, and practice on NA ladder, then you're a NA player. It's not that hard. (Note: for the purposes of this classification, I'd also call Polt an NA player)
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Polt should count as an NA player for these purposes. All interviews with Blizzard staff have said that they want Koreans moving to NA and taking their team house structure with them. Based on this, shouldn't the tournaments encourage Koreans to move to NA?
On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
On April 10 2013 18:07 Fionn wrote: Players like HyuN, MC, and TaeJa* who are/were qualified for this season of Code S will be able to play the qualifiers for Season 1 of NA/EU, but will only be able to advance as far as the Challenger League. (ie. they will be able to secure qualification for the season 2 premier league of NA/EU, but won't be able to play in the season 1 premier league of NA/EU). [Players don't have to forfeit their Code S spots to do this.]
The now released player lists are for the Premier league.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Yeah, Demuslim clearly got screwed over because he did not have all the information about how the invites were going to be chosen before he picked a region. It seems like everything is based on WCS 2012, MGL and GSL performance. I am not even sure if his standing in NASL was even factored into the decision.
This is to be expected in some way, but there are clearly players who have done less, had worse results and are less proven that were invited. There may have been no way for Demuslim to be invited in the current system, but we all would accept it better if we knew that before hand.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Unless teams have GPS trackers logging their movement, there is no solid basis to claim who has been where for how long. And imagine the outcry when the NA ladder was a significant factor of inviting people.
Demuslim just got screwed by the system that blizzard deemed "least bad" ( all invitation based systems are bad in my book). In addition of complaining about it emotionally people should at least add a rational alternative.
Im sad that he didnt make it, but i cannot think of any other invitation system that would not create even more drama.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Unless teams have GPS trackers logging their movement, there is no solid basis to claim who has been where for how long. And imagine the outcry when the NA ladder was a significant factor of inviting people.
Demuslim just got screwed by the system that blizzard deemed "least bad" ( all invitation based systems are bad in my book). In addition of complaining about it emotionally people should at least add a rational alternative.
Im sad that he didnt make it, but i cannot think of any other invitation system that would not create even more drama.
It's pretty easy to determine residencies. Just show a copy of a lease/utility bill, etc. That's how it's done for every local legal entity in the U.S. I'm sure Polt has a lease for an apartment, and I'm guessing EG has some documentation showing that Demuslim's residency is at the EG lair.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Unless teams have GPS trackers logging their movement, there is no solid basis to claim who has been where for how long. And imagine the outcry when the NA ladder was a significant factor of inviting people.
Demuslim just got screwed by the system that blizzard deemed "least bad" ( all invitation based systems are bad in my book). In addition of complaining about it emotionally people should at least add a rational alternative.
Im sad that he didnt make it, but i cannot think of any other invitation system that would not create even more drama.
It's pretty easy to determine residencies. Just show a copy of a lease/utility bill, etc. That's how it's done for every local legal entity in the U.S. I'm sure Polt has a lease for an apartment, and I'm guessing EG has some documentation showing that Demuslim's residency is at the EG lair.
Or tax records, or his stream that is on several times a week. Or the work visa he paid lawyers to get to allow him to be employed by EG and stay in the US. That last one is really the silver bullet in this issue.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Unless teams have GPS trackers logging their movement, there is no solid basis to claim who has been where for how long. And imagine the outcry when the NA ladder was a significant factor of inviting people.
Demuslim just got screwed by the system that blizzard deemed "least bad" ( all invitation based systems are bad in my book). In addition of complaining about it emotionally people should at least add a rational alternative.
Im sad that he didnt make it, but i cannot think of any other invitation system that would not create even more drama.
It's pretty easy to determine residencies. Just show a copy of a lease/utility bill, etc. That's how it's done for every local legal entity in the U.S. I'm sure Polt has a lease for an apartment, and I'm guessing EG has some documentation showing that Demuslim's residency is at the EG lair.
We dont know that for sure, there might be similar documentation for lot of people who visit US often for the weekend tournaments.
On April 12 2013 01:11 Zygno wrote: To count Demuslim as a non NA-player is pretty dumb, because he's been living in the US for about one year or so
In that case they probably would have to count Polt and Violet NA players too... and perhaps JYP/Puma still have the same sort of visas Demuslim has or whatever paperwork the "NA-player" definiton has to be based upon.
Well, but he is actually really living there. Puma/JYP both live in Korea and were just a short amount of time in the US. Not sure about Violet and Polt. Also Demuslim has been playing purely one the NA-Server in the last few seasons and is constantly top 3, every season.
Unless teams have GPS trackers logging their movement, there is no solid basis to claim who has been where for how long. And imagine the outcry when the NA ladder was a significant factor of inviting people.
Demuslim just got screwed by the system that blizzard deemed "least bad" ( all invitation based systems are bad in my book). In addition of complaining about it emotionally people should at least add a rational alternative.
Im sad that he didnt make it, but i cannot think of any other invitation system that would not create even more drama.
It's pretty easy to determine residencies. Just show a copy of a lease/utility bill, etc. That's how it's done for every local legal entity in the U.S. I'm sure Polt has a lease for an apartment, and I'm guessing EG has some documentation showing that Demuslim's residency is at the EG lair.
We dont know that for sure, there might be similar documentation for lot of people who visit US often for the weekend tournaments.
I think the government issued work visa pretty much does it. Or the tax records and the fact that he is on EG's pay role as an employee in the US. But all of this is over the top, because you can just ask the team owners and they will tell you where he lives. Unless they are willing to commit fraud just to get him into the NA league, which isn't really worth it IMO.
On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
Can you link? I can't find this.
That made me laugh. Hard.
...? People are fucking confusing. Did you think he was kidding? He gave links above...
On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
Gotta say, taeja's responses are hilarious: picking america because his wrists need a break, calling out unknown gm players on NA, planning to "get revenge" on a company he hates more than ever.
On April 12 2013 00:20 Clefairy wrote: From TaeJa's interview lol:
Why did you choose America for your WCS region?
I needed a bit of a break because of my wrist and I could give up Code S for that. That's why I chose America.
What did you think of the invite list for America?
Even unknown players received seeds. So I'm planning on making Blizzard regret it with my games. I already hated Blizzard but now I hate them even more.
Why did you come to dislike Blizzard?
I think they don't care about the players as much as Riot Games.
Gotta say, taeja's responses are hilarious: picking america because his wrists need a break, calling out unknown gm players on NA, planning to "get revenge" on a company he hates more than ever.
Taeja's main gripe about not being in premier league for WCS NA is unfounded. Taeja appears on WCS korea list for season 1. How could he also appear on WCS NA list for season 1 as well? That would mean he's on two lists at the same time and would be playing in 2 regions at the same time. If he advanced far in gsl then he would be playing both gsl and wcs NA at the same time. Of course this isn't allowed and people leaving code s after this season need to compete for spots in season 2 of other regions.
EPT
