EPT[Opinion/IPL4] Much Ado About Nothing - Page 10
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Sanguinarius
United States3427 Posts
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Holytornados
United States1022 Posts
[B] At an event where sc2 was getting demolished by LoL tournament ( sad day ). To be fair, Riot does a fantastic job of hyping events like these by focusing the stream directly into the game itself. Before you can even play you get an entirely different homepage trying to make you go watch the pros play. Combine that with a larger player base and you get more views. I think Blizzard should try something like this personally. | ||
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obsKura
Ireland1061 Posts
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Jealous
10339 Posts
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Larsin
Netherlands162 Posts
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Antoine
United States7481 Posts
Nicely written ^^ | ||
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SCST
Mexico1609 Posts
The truth is very simple: the vast majority of people who watch these foreign tournaments prefer to see a foreigner player, not Korean vs Korean. This is because the audience feels a connection with the foreigner personalities, i.e. people they can relate to personally. There will always be a few people who enjoy the K vs. K games more, but they an astounding minority in this type of tournament. | ||
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On April 21 2012 04:13 farside604 wrote: I think alot of good points were brought up here especially that the foreigner invites had not been selected properly. I mean IPL 1 and 2 were a long time ago and really shouldn't have any bearing on current tournaments. The Koreans certainly wouldn't invite Fruitdealer to a trounament just cause he won the first GSL event. yeah, but how do u pick and choose who gets in, and who does not? for example whitera and idra. you need those guys due to an almost guaranteed set of numbers to float up your tourney(and please the sponsors). the issue at hand is, how you pick and choose between the 'name-brand' people versus the relatively unknowns. | ||
CosmicSpiral
United States15275 Posts
On April 21 2012 04:05 pullarius1 wrote: Hey all, I don't usually try to piggyback on front page posts, but a did a mathy breakdown of the IPL4 field for ESFI here: http://esfiworld.com/feature/flexner-stat-corner-ipl-4s-stacked-field. A similar issue that I have been pondering is how down people get on foreigners in Code S. I heard a lot of pooh-poohing of NaNiwa at the beginning of this season, saying as a foreigner he would of course do terribly. Actually, non-Koreans have pretty solidly outperformed what you would expect EVEN IF the standard of success was as high as "Code S Caliber." Even after Huk, Sen, and Idra washed out in so short a time, Foreigners still had a winning record in Code S, and had a slightly better than 50% chance of getting through each stage. Jinro and Idra's games from a year ago do not count towards people's current perceptions of how foreigners would perform in Code S. | ||
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asongdotnet
United States1060 Posts
That said, I definitely enjoyed most of the games. Interacting with the pro's is always a lot of fun, and having the GSTL was the cherry on top (regame and all). I've definitely become a fan of ST after that weekend, especially Squirtle and Parting | ||
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On April 21 2012 04:49 CosmicSpiral wrote: Jinro and Idra's games from a year ago do not count towards people's current perceptions of how foreigners would perform in Code S. What you are saying is absolutely correct. however there is an emotional attachment to the days of IdrA vs Jinro. I for me seriously miss those days. It was awesome and I loved seeing it...I bet you that many, many others pine for those glory days and want them to come back. | ||
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fishjie
United States1519 Posts
On April 21 2012 04:44 SCST wrote: The truth is very simple: the vast majority of people who watch these foreign tournaments prefer to see a foreigner player, not Korean vs Korean. This is because the audience feels a connection with the foreigner personalities, i.e. people they can relate to personally. based on what? i'd like to see a poll on this because i don't buy it. i just want to see the best play. i'm a fan of some foreigners because they have entertaining personalities, but if they can't compete at the highest level, then who cares. | ||
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coverpunch
United States2093 Posts
The truth is very simple: the vast majority of people who watch these foreign tournaments prefer to see a foreigner player, not Korean vs Korean. This is because the audience feels a connection with the foreigner personalities, i.e. people they can relate to personally. There will always be a few people who enjoy the K vs. K games more, but they an astounding minority in this type of tournament. Completely disagree. I think people want to see the best matches possible. It's very much like tennis, where the most exciting matches and most unexpected surprises might be happening off in the boonies, but most fans want to see the highest quality matches so the top seeds always play on Center Court. You're just using 20/20 hindsight if you say you'd rather have watched Scarlett vs Terious on the main stage rather than MarineKing vs Stephano. There were a lot of interesting things being played out on the main stage too, just no particularly huge surprises in the end. And it's worth pointing out that the open bracket also didn't have any huge surprises in the end result. | ||
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Paladia
802 Posts
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On April 21 2012 04:44 SCST wrote: Good article, right on the money imo. IPL4 had some good possibilities, but was a huge let down due to poor streaming and technical difficulties. Ignoring the games that the audience wanted to see was (hopefully) a mistake that IPL will not make again. The truth is very simple: the vast majority of people who watch these foreign tournaments prefer to see a foreigner player, not Korean vs Korean. This is because the audience feels a connection with the foreigner personalities, i.e. people they can relate to personally. There will always be a few people who enjoy the K vs. K games more, but they an astounding minority in this type of tournament. honestly if you want to guarantee a tourney where there is nothing but foreigners in the televised matches...then you have to host a non-korean tourney, period. or you have to drastically jury-rig the match-ups so that you guarantee that all the Koreans face each other in the Open brackets, knock each other out - then by doing that, you limit the number of Koreans drastically. Why not just change the format entirely and just do foreigner vs foreigner match-ups, a la invitationals? For example: Stephano IdrA Jinro Whitera Naniwa Huk ...the list should just comprise of all the big name brand foreigners that people just plain WANT TO SEE. Make the matchups comprised out of every possible combination between the superstars, and do it that way. Then determine who gets what later. Seriously the key here is asking the community "who do you WANT to see", and make it happen based on the community demand. Have something...a poll..just something. Figure out the favorites, the underdogs, who/what the dream matches would be, and make it happen. | ||
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Paladia
802 Posts
On April 21 2012 06:04 D_K_night wrote: Why not just change the format entirely and just do foreigner vs foreigner match-ups, a la invitationals? For example: Stephano IdrA Jinro Whitera Naniwa Huk ...the list should just comprise of all the big name brand foreigners that people just plain WANT TO SEE. Make the matchups comprised out of every possible combination between the superstars, and do it that way. Then determine who gets what later. Because the thing people want to see the most isn't foreigner vs foreigner. It is Korean vs Foreigner (and the foreigner winning). At least half of the people in the group stage should have been foreigners. Hardly any were foreigners now and out of the three that got seeded into the group stage, one isn't amongst the top of the foreign scene (white-ra) and the other is probably not even amongst the top of the lackluster NA scene (Idra). | ||
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Madars
Latvia166 Posts
If I am no mistaken then there were 34 Koreans in open brackets, so I don't see the "overwhelming math". But I agree, that for a non-korean to win 3+ Koreans to get out into group stage, it would take more than just luck, but a miracle. | ||
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oxxo
988 Posts
I don't get this whole obsession with rationalizing and scheming for 'foreigner pride'. Instead of talking about how to change tournament formats/seeds or to exclude Koreans or to put quotas... why not talk about how to bring up foreigner skill level? It'd be a whole lot more productive. | ||
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D_K_night
Canada615 Posts
On April 21 2012 06:11 Paladia wrote: Because the thing people want to see the most isn't foreigner vs foreigner. It is Korean vs Foreigner (and the foreigner winning). At least half of the people in the group stage should have been foreigners. Hardly any were foreigners now and out of the three that got seeded into the group stage, one isn't amongst the top of the foreign scene (white-ra) and the other is probably not even amongst the top of the lackluster NA scene (Idra). OK fair enough. I believe they key there is the following things: - the underdog story will always be, the most compelling story and the most emotional one for the viewers - people are bored of always so many koreans - if this is true - that people want in truth, to see foreigner vs korean(with foreigner ultimately winning), then how do we all but guarantee that situation? If you recall Squirtle versus Alive - Squirtle had to beat Alive TWICE to earn the crown(but with Alive ultimately winning, he only needed to beat Squirtle in one series). and yes i saw too, how incredible exhausted Squirtle was, having to fight through Nestea, and beat Alive in one match, AND having to beat Alive again!? And meanwhile Alive just sipped his drink and took his crown. I believe we have set the precedent though. The matchup can be easily setup, and explained - the Korean would have to beat the Foreigner in two sets, but the Foreigner would only need to win one. This would not be perceived as "unfair" to the audience, if you do the following: Showing a video montage of the foreigner's heartfelt struggle to make it to where he is today...interviews of him really, really wanting this more than anything in the world...then you cut to a video of the korean having the good life...lots of victories he's already earned...the interview of him saying arrogantly "yeah this tourney will be easy, I already know I'm gonna win". All that will set the stage...set the emotional expectations...the crowd now WANTING the foreigner to win...feeling his hopes and dreams... Can you imagine the crowd screaming and roaring when the foreigner wins? That's how you revitalize it. | ||
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