EPTAnyway infestor anti air = the vikings would have won out anyway. Seriously sloppy play by Nestea. It wasn't a final stand it was surrender with a flair.
Blizzcon and GSL Finals - Polar Opposites - Page 9
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thepuppyassassin
900 Posts
Anyway infestor anti air = the vikings would have won out anyway. Seriously sloppy play by Nestea. It wasn't a final stand it was surrender with a flair. | ||
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HypernovA
Canada556 Posts
On October 27 2011 14:30 Myrddraal wrote: Dude, are you serious? For one fungal is not instant, it does move quite fast, but similar to storm where if you know where it is going to land you can move away and you can avoid some of the area if not the whole thing. Snipe is different once it has been fired it does not miss. So quit making your own unfounded QQ statements. Secondly it really isn't that hard to mass snipe, just hold down the snipe button and spam click, sure it is definitely more efficient for someone like MVP who has better mouse precision but it's not hard to pull off. Thirdly, this "Furthermore, the concept that a zerg should be able to 1a victory every game is just saddening." unless you are talking about the opinons of other users, this was not implied at all in the write up. What was stated in this situation was that "MVP had finished his preparations..." and Ghosts counter pretty much everything Zerg, especially slow, gas-heavy, low HP, end-game biological units., which is NOT the same thing at all and does not even complain that Nesteas attack failed, it simply states what happened. So quit trying to put down the writers by putting false arguments that you have pulled out of nowhere. If you want to challenge the writers for the articles on a site like Team Liquid that does so much for the community, at least do them the respect of making valid arguments. Couple of points wrong with this. Try and mass snipe. It's very clear you play Protoss or Zerg and have never tried to mass snipe. The A requirements are extremely high. And really, TL is no place for balance discussion even Less so in news written by staff. Regular members get banned for that. Sigh, kinda sucks having a player based with a large percentage that plays Zerg. | ||
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kslghost
246 Posts
Additionally, there was essentially no room for additional streams. The only even possible method to cast another game would have been on the DirectTV stream only, as, if you've never been to Blizzcon before, the place is stuffed. In the end, it's about Blizzard featuring their products and generating hype about their games, with tournament coverage being a secondary draw. MLG is all about the games, and that's what allows it to survive, despite its relatively paltry prize pools. I don't even understand why people would complain about gaps in scheduling either - what if a match set went epic-style? Scheduling is tight. And before you say that there are so many people watching these games in the crowd, it must be a huge draw - in the two Blizzcons I have gone to, being able to sit down, relax, and watch SC2 feels so good, no matter which no names might be playing. Fact is, if Blizzard wanted to feature a tournament and sell stream tickets, they could have just invited like 12 Koreans and the 4 most popular foreigners like Huk and Idra and it would have been a lot more fun for us, but would accomplish little for Blizzard. Finally, I did find that there was too much complaining about balance stemming from an unusual final game. General opinion at Blizzcon and from many people on these boards is that Nestea didn't play particularly well. The thing is Nestea has never defeated MVP in the GSL, so why would that change here? I mean, he did 2-0 MVP in the winners bracket final, but that still wasn't an elimination match. Fact is, MVP is better than Nestea, head-to-head, at least based on the results we've been given so far. Don't forget, Nestea has never even lost to anyone else in GSL Code S outside of group stages. And even then, who knows what would have happened if Nestea actually had played closer to a "perfect" game instead of spending like 10 banelings on each 8 marine drop. In the end, drawing conclusions about balance from a single game of pretty unusual circumstance is relatively pointless. When we really look at it, MVP has a really strong style against Nestea's play style, especially considering late game TvZ on that map. If I would conclude anything from the game, it would be more about map balance than race balance. | ||
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MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
kinda silly to call ghosts imba when on other maps its so different. but even so, kinda silly go talk about snipe being imba in general as most times we see broodlord corruptor infestor roll through in the lategame. just reminds me of the biased people watching me. when i win with massghost late game vs zerg they call ghost imba and when i use mass broodlord spine crawler infestor corruptor they say that is imba. can you please just leave balance out of the topic? maybe talk about how good mvp was instead of giving all credits to his unit zvt is no balance problem here. its just a very very few amounts of maps that are silly in situations. for example shakuras is silly late game, aswell as shattered temple being silly early and late game. but really on the avarage maps u play zvt is really fine, and mass ghost is not really something terran can just pull out of their hat. you need massive economy and production to do something like this | ||
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Myrddraal
Australia937 Posts
On October 27 2011 21:08 HypernovA wrote: Couple of points wrong with this. Try and mass snipe. It's very clear you play Protoss or Zerg and have never tried to mass snipe. The A requirements are extremely high. And really, TL is no place for balance discussion even Less so in news written by staff. Regular members get banned for that. Sigh, kinda sucks having a player based with a large percentage that plays Zerg. While I don't 1v1 as Terran I play team games as random, so I have some experience as Terran, and believe it or not, I have played around with mass Ghosts before. Since you posted this I started to doubt myself as it was quite a while ago. However I just tried it out again, and yes I do still find it easy to mass snipe. I'm not saying I could do it as well as MVP by any means but I still don't see what the big deal is. | ||
Waxangel
United States33360 Posts
On October 27 2011 22:29 MorroW wrote: ofcourse turteling is gonna seem better when u have maps like shakuras. setting up any form of defense in the center of that map u will make it look it "imba" to casual viewers. kinda silly to call ghosts imba when on other maps its so different. but even so, kinda silly go talk about snipe being imba in general as most times we see broodlord corruptor infestor roll through in the lategame. just reminds me of the biased people watching me. when i win with massghost late game vs zerg they call ghost imba and when i use mass broodlord spine crawler infestor corruptor they say that is imba. can you please just leave balance out of the topic? maybe talk about how good mvp was instead of giving all credits to his unit zvt is no balance problem here. its just a very very few amounts of maps that are silly in situations. for example shakuras is silly late game, aswell as shattered temple being silly early and late game. but really on the avarage maps u play zvt is really fine, and mass ghost is not really something terran can just pull out of their hat. you need massive economy and production to do something like this doesn't that make you happy metal is back in the map pool :D | ||
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silentblob
Great Britain40 Posts
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silentblob
Great Britain40 Posts
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pewpew444
United States121 Posts
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JusticeSC
Canada18 Posts
Any thoughts? | ||
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ArchDC
Malaysia1996 Posts
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Flamingo777
United States1190 Posts
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Raambo11
United States828 Posts
On October 27 2011 18:41 thepuppyassassin wrote: Nestea didn't bring 5 or overseers with him the last engagement. Not only would that the overseers tanked a good amount of damage if target fired. A single wave of broodlings would've taken out a good 3rd of MVP's ghosts, before they could snipe again, and I feel that's a conservative estimate. 24 broods... that's no joke. Anyway infestor anti air = the vikings would have won out anyway. Seriously sloppy play by Nestea. It wasn't a final stand it was surrender with a flair. Yeah been meaning to say this somewhere myself, though I doubt anybody would listen. Ghosts can only spam snipe for 30 seconds straight if there cloaked and the opponent has no vision. Nestea coulda made like 50 overseers (literally) and gone with that. 20+ broods insta kills like 20 ghosts and that woulda been that. Nice write up but I resent the balance statements. | ||
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Madera
Sweden2672 Posts
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bqm
94 Posts
OK try to walk 120 or 200 banelings into middle of the map where there is a siege tank line + 2 PF off creep as well....... and see what happen lol, even if he can remax ling banelings 10 times not 3 times like you said..... or do you think MVP did not clear creeps in the middle of the map? what can nestea do in that game at the very late, he try to do the doom drop, people said it do no damage and a waste drop. Of course he have to do something, he try to drop them on top of tank + ghost but he did not expect them to be snipe that fast, or he try to gamble on MVP snipe ability. OK some of you guys heard Destiny whine about anyone could win that game. But Dimaga and Huk also said that what Nestea did and his thought process in that game is normal, and Do you think Dimaga opinion < than Destiny???? Dont forget Nestea Infestor get EMPed, not Snipe alone. Ultralisks are sucked vs Ghosts. what else can he do? mutas suck vs ghosts? Ling banelings vs tank + pf ROLF. roach hydra? hahahahahahaha what is left of Zerg can beat that army??? Infestor + Broodlords alone lose to 2 ability of ghosts (Snipe +EMP) People saying he bank 15k, but with only 5k gas how many time can you remax with a late game army?????? MVP have the same gas as him but lower minerals. he can still mine from 6 bases while nestea get drop and nuke everywhere. Game is not fixed, people are completely stupid or try to be SMART ass when assume game was fixed. | ||
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tQWannaBe
Canada133 Posts
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itkovian
United States1763 Posts
I hadn't really watched many of Nestea's games before the blizzcon final, but it is obvious that he is highly regarded as the best zerg, and I'm not going to disagree. But I was really disappointed with the blizzcon games I watched and I feel like he could have played that last game A LOT better. That's why i think its unfair to make any kind of balance judgement based on that game. It was like two different caliber players fighting against eachother. Anyways, I appreciate the write up, but I don't think its fair to speculate on the OPness of ghosts based on that final blizzcon game. I like write-ups on tournaments better without balance discussion anyway  | ||
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LoCaD
Germany1634 Posts
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G3nXsiS
United States656 Posts
As for prize money, korean progamers have said it over and over again. They don't play for money, they play for pride. So regardless of whether or not they split the money as long as they win the trophy they really don't care. | ||
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OPL3SA2
United States378 Posts
Also, when you say that Fungal Growth can be dodged, what do you mean? it's an instant cast with a pretty long range, so when you say it can be dodged, you're talking about fungal growthing an area out of range , and by the time the FG goes off, the army isn't there any more. That seems more like sloppy play than expert 'dodging'. Just my two pennies. Also keep in mind PSI storm can do a maxiumum for 4350 damage for 75 energy and snipe can do a maximum of 45 damage for 25 energy. | ||
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