The IPL revs up once again for Season 2, following a successful Season 1 premiere and the momentum from Qualifiers and IPLTV. For an organization that seemed to show little to no interest in competitive gaming, IGN's gigantic move into the ESPORTS scene has been nothing but a successful transition in the eyes of the community. Backed by a titan of the video-games industry and the experience of seasoned community members recruited by IGN, IPL Season 2 should be at the attention of many StarCraft 2 fans as they aim to improve on what was already an extremely solid and impressive first season. Though IPL Season 1 was praised for slick presentation and production, perhaps its only fault was just its genuine game quality overall along with solo caster. However, IPL 2 immediately aims to remedy this situation by having a high-profile and bigger tournament lineup, along with caster co-op with all of the scene's biggest names.
Complexity's new recruit manages to take his spot in IPL2 from the last qualifier, a distinct difference to Diestar who had sat in comfortably ever since qualifier #1. While Minigun has not grabbed a recent tournament win, a strong showing for his team during EG's Master's Cup V included wins over Sen, IdrA, HasuObs, and SjoW. Diestar is extremely active in participating in weekly European cups, snatching up 3 golds and 2 silvers from the 6 weeks leading into July. His recent win over Puzzle in the TL Open #18 demonstrated his grasp on TvP, and Minigun will be on the back foot this time around, as their last meeting ended in Diestar's favor.
mOoNan's TvT stands as his best match-up statistically, but his last 3 tournament TvTs have all ended in losses. Granted it was against the likes of MMA, Hack, and KawaiiRice, but it won't stop Fury on capitalizing on that. On the flip side of things, mOoNan's recent move to Korea can only be beneficially for his already outstanding play, and Fury's last 10 has gone 0-10, losing all but 1 game at Dreamhack Summer 2011. Our only mirror of the day, TvT always has the chance to deliver a long macro game filled with every possible Terran unit.
Vibe bursted onto the scene early April with his run at MLG Dallas, and continues to pursue a place among side top NA Zergs. The Polish Terran recently traded series with IdrA at Homestory Cup, with a side of DIMAGA bo3. Neither player post resounding statistics on their particular matchup, but VIBE's recent quality of opponents simply cannot compare to those were present at Takesen's apartment. With both sides having fantastic practice teammates, it would definitely be the headline TvZ for any matchday, but sadly, not today.
Main Card: IdrA v. Drewbie ZvT: 74-48 | TvZ: 69-48 Last 10: 6-4 both players Head to head record: IdrA 7-4
It was expected that IdrA would start off IPL2, having the champ defend his throne. The undisputed best NA Zerg has had a short run in multiple tournaments as summer began, but coming in as the winner can have a positive effect on his mentality. The two quick games against Tarson at Homestory Cup can be a reoccuring nightmare for any Zergs, however. Let's hope he can think past that and remember all the other EU T he demolished this past month: Kas, Naama, Cloud, merz...The last Zerg drewbie played in a tournament was IdrA over a month ago. He lost. He'll need to find a reason to convince his new team to continue supporting his cause, and sending IdrA to the losers bracket is a mouth-watering treat. Oh yeah, and who can forget this game.
IPL+: A look at the precedence set for competitive StarCraft 2 production
by shindigs
Despite being a video game oriented company, IGN was a very unlikely candidate for providing one of the premiere StarCraft 2 tournaments. While the company's main focus is gaming, many community members are aware that there is a notable difference between competitive gaming and what is covered on mainstream gaming websites.
The IPL poses an interesting case study on how the tournament scene is growing in North America, given its uniqueness in terms of production and model. Looking at South Korea, the current Brood War scene grew from a state that is very similar to the North American scene now - a multitude of organizations that hosted tournaments without much centralization like the MSL or the OSL. The western scene at this point is unique to the Korean scene as they have a multitude of "centralized" huge events - such as MLG, NASL, Dreamhack, IPL, and of course TSL. Unlike Korea, these leagues aren't under an overheard organization like KeSPA in Brood War, and currently the GSL is the reigning SC2 league in Korea.
So where does that leave IPL among the heavy hitters of North America such as MLG and the NASL? The way the IPL produces its product is a unique extreme to the state of how many tournaments are shifting to present their own streams and games. While many tournaments seems to cast their replays live, to avoid stream cheating, the first season of IPL and IPLTV prerecords the cast and sends it off to post production. This is an interesting change on how tournaments are shifting their senses of production - at first many games were to be casted live, then eventually the majority shifted to replays, and now IPL is publicly presenting a different extreme with their own method on taking more time to polish during post production.
The NASL does this as well, but due to their format they must do post production in a shorter amount of time. IPL2 may have been played out, but everything is currently being tweaked for post production. The greatest benefit of this method is obviously seen during each cast of the IPL - the product is superb. The IPL could easily schedule their announcements to give them ample time to produce their content, but it is not misleading if their intentions were never to broadcast it "live".
An immediate concern of this method is that it just sucks out the "live" excitement that much more. Though I'll admit the shiny production makes up for a lot of it, it is extremely hard to make predictions on the bracket for discussions sake because it's hard to pinpoint when these players actually played the game, and as such makes some match previews seem a bit artificial under all the excess "make up" of post production.
It's hard to blame IPL too much for focusing so much on post production - there are many more valid reasons to stick with this model for at least a few more seasons. First of all, the experience of IGN lies in video production, not running live tournaments or broadcasts. They have a few awesome community members under their belt ready to assist them with their expertise, but the IPL seems focused on not spreading themselves too thin, which has been great for IPL since it has left the community wanting more. Sticking to their focus on post production keeps them in a comfort zone which makes it good for them as well as the spectators who witness a very polished product.
Well granted, the west doesn't need to mimic a Korean model of any sort, but is apparent that IPL is here to stay as the ones leading the charge. The IPL's focus on post production and the fact that it was branched from a mainstream video games organization sets a lot of amazing precedence for western ESPORTS, and it should be very interesting to see how they begin to tweak their model as time goes on. Live IPL in an IGN studio? LAN qualifiers in your home town? It's exciting to see where an organization like IPL can expand to when the main core IGN truly sees where ESPORTS is headed and begins backing it with their own resources.
We sat down with the head of IGN eSports division/VP of engineering David Ting to talk about his vision of the IPL franchise. (Note: interviews were conducted weeks earlier.)
At this stage, how is IPL2 looking? Is everything on schedule? Did everything turn out the way you had planned it to be?
Absolutely. I think that by looking at the overall big picture, I am an engineer by trade, so when I enter these initiatives, I don’t look to optimize simply the short term, but to value the input/output in engineering terms. Looking at the input, we had over 500 players that signed up and over half the grandmasters. We’re happy to be able to bring the prize pool to the player, facilitating and building an economy for passionate gamers (like myself) and fueling their career. We’re also ramping up an internal production team and from what I’ve seen thus far, it has been amazing and we’re looking forward to the community feedback to build our product better.
Going a little deeper into the prize pool aspect of things, the first season had a prize pool of $5,000, and quickly multiplied tenfold. Is this an indicator of your success, or was it already on your checklist when you started?
I had planned this all along. The experimental IPL1 gave us data points that gave the green light to proceed. We actually could go higher than $50,000, and I would not be surprised if IGN pays out more than $1,000,000 in prize money within the next 12 months.
In season 1, we mainly saw North American invitees, and season 2 included qualifying players from Europe. Are Asian invites on the way for season 3?
Definitely. Season 3, I want to do it gradually. Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players. What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game. In IPL3, we will definitely invite a small pool of Asian players, and try our best to avoid a sweep.
As of right now, IPL is strictly an online tournament. Are plans underway to make future IPLs a live event?
Yes. We are working really hard right now to accommodate the financial needs to create a physical event. My philosophy (going back to the engineering aspect of things) has always been one where I would always like to do things in a way where we limit our liability, and at the same time, not build something that’s subpar in excellence, since it undermines the IGN reputation. We will take a cautious approach towards the matter, and hopefully it will come to fruition sometime this year.
On the spectrum of things, MLG has triumphed over its competitors in North America in the live event field, and IPL as hail as the king of online production. With NASL a compromise between the two, where do you think the sweet spot is? Would creating a live event hurt IPL instead?
Thus far, we have not been able to collect the necessary data points to find out where the optimal operating point is. My intent is to test the entire range, and observe the scene’s reaction. On the business level, I believe what GOM does can be surpassed. Looking at NASL and MLG would not be the right way to calibrate the target for this organization. An ESPORTS aspiration has always been a comparison to a league similar to the NFL, and mine lies somewhere in between those two organizations.
Branching off from IPL, would you consider a similar venture for another franchise (game)?
Yup. I’m working on the second one right now. Right now, it’s not a good idea to distract our team until we can do Starcraft right. So until I am completely convinced, it won’t be published anytime soon. Being an enthusiast myself, I would also hope for game publishers to actively participate and help push ESPORTS in the right direction.
After David, we had the men behind IPL share with us some tidbits behind their incredible project: Alex Conn, Taylor "Painuser" Parsons, Alex "HDStarcraft" Do, Kevin "CatsPajamas" Knocke, Josh "AskJoshy" Sutherland joins us for some Q&A.
At this stage, how is IPL2 looking? Is everything on schedule? Did everything turn out the way you had planned it to be?
Alex Conn: Yeah, everything is looking very good so far, all the players have been really responsive to us. Everyone is really excited about the tournament and we’re working really close to a lot of the team management to bring you a fantastic tournament.
CatsPajamas: We broke 10k viewers for one of our qualifiers and and overall it’s a positive response.
PainUser: I got some of the pro players giving me positive feedback about the casters as well!
Did any of the qualifiers stand out for you guys? Any surprises or household names that fell through?
A: Well, that’s always the interesting thing about qualifiers. The number one surprise to me was definitely vileState, who to me, is a really really underrated player. You might doubt whether he had an easy qualifying bracket or not, but he blew through his seeding matches and it was ridiculous. He’s young so I think he’s a force to be reckoned with in the future.
C: There were some heartbreaks as well, I remember Socke on the verge of qualifiying three times, and finally (phew) qualifying on the last round.
A: Same with Cloud, actually.
PU: Oh yeah. *laughs* What a nail biter.
You guys went through a lot of casters who are not part of your main roster during the qualifiers. Any plans to incorporate them into the main event?
A: It was always broadcasted to them as being strictly qualifier casters. Basically, what we wanted to do was reach out to the lesser-known casters, and give them a chance to promote themselves because they truly deserve the recognition for their work in the community. So in exchange for helping them getting their names out there, we were assured quality casts, and I would say that is definitely a fair trade.
PainUser, ever since your commentating career has taken off, it has come as a detriment to your progaming aspirations. Do you think at some point you will be able to turn it around?
PU: It really depends on the way the scene goes. My “progaming career” was basically me living off of my team salary which isn’t highly sustainable, and tournament winnings were scarce. At this point, I would only really consider a few players in NA that are actual progamers based on their income from playing. As far as what IGN offered me, it was a huge opportunity that I just couldn’t pass up. I miss playing a lot, but as of right now, IPL is my main thing. I guess playing vicariously through casting would be sufficient for now, plus it’s a lot less pressure just casting *laughs*.
HDStarcraft, you were always regarded as the pioneer for SC2 shoutcasting, are your ventures with IPL propelling that or are you taking your career in a different direction?
HD: I feel that my casting career can be further propelled on a platform such as IGN. While there are a few familiar faces within the Korean scene that everyone grown to love, I feel that the North American scene regarding casters can still be grown and foster and I want to be on that ship when it takes off.
PU: To touch on that, I feel that Korea is dominated in a way by their own casters, and Tastosis is the face of the GSL. No matter where they go or what other tournaments they promote, everyone will see them and brand them as the leading casters for GSL. Here at IPL, we three are given a rare opportunity to build our own brand along with IPL, and I think it gives us a slight advantage in terms of promotion.
Cats, what are some of the factors that have helped you along the way from becoming your average commentator to a household name?
Well, I definitely have had some help along the way. I will give a shoutout to TotalBiscuit, though. I first started posting stuff on Reddit, and one of the first replies came from him. It basically said, “Wow, you have an amazing voice and a horrible microphone”. After that, he helped me acquire some new equipment and carry out promotional endeavors. Aside from that, I really attribute everything to my drive to succeed. Putting in 80 hours a week, casting for 5-10 people for period of 3-4 months eventually paid off.
Josh, now that you're a full-timer at IGN, how will that affect your projects with complexity? What marketing methods will you be employing to help IPL reach new audiences?
J: I hope not! I hope that I will be able to stay on with complexity and do everything like I used to. Granted that my time is now limited, but when I am able to, I will still continue to cast and such now as more of a hobby. I definitely look forward to traveling to live events now that they've acquired some new players. In regards to marketing, we're working on new content to appease a wider variety of gamers. Aside from the large SC2 communities, there are various other websites that have potential SC2 interest that we can reach out to, and I find that the most difficult challenge lies between satisfying hardcore fans who often have low tolerance, and being considerate of the novice players as well.
In IPL1, you guys opted for a comic book artist portrayal of the players instead of the traditional camera time. What made you decide to do that? Were you inspired by EVER OSL 2007?
A: It’s funny that you mentioned that, because we looked over at old BW Korean intros, and that one is one that definitely stands out. Props to Wellplayed for helping us make that fantastic. For season 2, we won’t be keeping that same theme for every tournament, we want to keep it new and fresh.
With all the pairs of casters, is there a reason why DJWheat was chosen to solo cast?
A: Our original goal for IPL2 was always dual-cast. The problem is that we feel the replay desyncing issue was not acceptable for a high quality production setting, so everyone that is dual-casting are casting side-by-side behing a monitor. Unfortunately, there was no other caster near DJWheat, but we cannot not include the godfather of ESPORTS. So while we could not find another caster for Wheat to cast alongside with, having Wheat’s presence on the team is a unanimous decision within the team.
Looking at the finalized bracket right now, do you have any favorites in mind?
Cats: I’ve been a White-Ra fanboy for a while so I’m definitely pulling for him!
HD: I like White-ra as well, he is looking extremely strong right now.
PU: IdrA. I have no love for the Zerg nor the Protoss *laughs*, but IdrA is our season one champ, did great at the last MLG, and been switching up his playstyle. BratOK is also someone I’m cheering on, he has such crisp and precise build orders.
Cats: He has such ridiculous transitions.
PU: Yup, so clean.
Alex: I’m not allowed to have favorites . But, I’ll always be cheering for my old ROOT guys!
Well, that’s all the questions I have for today, thank you for your time and I hope IPL2 is a great success!
"What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game. In IPL3, we will definitely invite a small pool of Asian players, and try our best to avoid a sweep."
reads as: affirmative action for being American/Western despite not working as hard as some players.
On July 14 2011 17:23 coopa523 wrote: "Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players."
Wtf lol? What does being an American patriot have to do with anything? Why would he feel like he has to say that? Weird sentence to me.
Probably because of the debate about them not allowing Koreans into their league and all that.
Personally, nothing against IPL, I love their production and their enthusiasm but I find it very hard to follow their league (Second season at least feels very lengthy, first one seemed more compact).
That being said now that we're down to the main event I'll be more inclined to watch :D Hoping IdrA can take the title again, Excited to see more of Nerchio!
Also would be curious to know what kind of issues IGN had hosting the whole thing as it's online (NASL had their issues with walkovers etc, and scheduling for certain time zones being horrible i.e. Koreans + Sen having to get up very early to play)
IPL's stance on Koreans is really disappointing because with all of the other tournaments including them the match quality is just not going to be the same...but nevertheless IPL has had good coverage and I'm certainly glad we're past the years of qualifiers, zzzzz.
I'm most excited to hear TotalBiscuit and dApollo cast together, every time they do they are just so goddamn hilarious.
I had planned this all along. The experimental IPL1 gave us data points that gave the green light to proceed. We actually could go higher than $50,000, and I would not be surprised if IGN pays out more than $1,000,000 in prize money within the next 12 months.
Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
I like to think of this league as the Nintendo Wii of StarCraft II tournaments. All of us here are already SCII fans, and can thusly see games like PuMa MC for what they are, amazing shows. However, we are the Xbox 360/PS3 players. They are trying to catch more of a casual market.
I guess it is like soccer or football. It's not popular in the US though it is crazy popular in the entire rest of the world. If NA players keep getting owned by Koreans, maybe the market won't find a wider base of followers than gamers. If NA keeps losing, NA stops caring. Of course, that is not to say SCII fans would stop caring, but if you are trying to catch a wider audience, it is probably easier to do it with people you can correlate with, first. That guy speaks English, I speak English. Go that guy!!! Once they are caught in the storm of show, then viewers, if they so choose, can start catching up on the GSL, MLGs, DHs, TSLs, etc. And if they choose to watch NA only tournaments, the matches won't be world class, but that doesn't mean they won't have excitement of their own. Back when I lived in Toledo, OH I would go watch same AA baseball. I'm not a baseball fan, and the players aren't the best players in the world, but it was still an exciting show. So no Koreans, fine, don't expect the best games, just find what excitement you can, and go catch up on the GSL for some clutch games.
Though IPL Season 1 was praised for slick presentation and production, perhaps its only fault was just its genuine game quality overall along with solo caster.
</div> Should be "quality, along with only a solo caster"
Though I'll admit the shiny production makes up for a lot of it, it is extremely hard to make predictions on the bracket for discussions sake because it's hard to pinpoint when these players actually played the game,
The IPL's focus on post production and the fact that it was branched from a mainstream video games organization sets a lot of amazing precedence for western ESPORTS,
Sets a lot of amazing precedents for Western ESPORTS...
That was most of them. The interviews looked really good. There were a few others like post-production having a hyphen, and making sure West and Western are capitalized. A few comma errors but those are little things.
Just trying to keep Team Liquid professional. This was an amazing write-up and really well done interviews. I am really excited for IPL Season 2!
It was expected that IdrA would start off IPL2, having the champ defend his throne. The undisputed best NA Zerg has had
I wouldnt say idra is the UNDISPUTED best NA zerg. sure when he plays like himself, he can beat literally any player in the world, but he messes his own chances up often so you cant rely on him to beat lesser players
On July 14 2011 18:10 CNSnow wrote: Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
Why do you watch Starcraft II? Your mannerisms suggest that you're not a high level player (although this is purely an assumption, after all, Day[9] sure loves his exclamation marks and xDs), so I'm assuming you watch for entertainment value.
Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice. Do you really prefer not to watch a game because of the race of the players? I dunno if that could be considered 'racist', but it can certainly be considered stupid. If you want to watch the best in Europe, well, there's events like DreamHack. Same with the US if there was a North American LAN event (NASL had international players and such). In online tournaments, where a player is nothing more than their name and their skill, there is no room for weaker players to get the main stage just because of their nationality (except if there's lag and stuff).
It's obvious why IPL is excluding Koreans; their audience is different than the other events. Who's watching NASL aside from SC2 fans? No-one. IPL has a mainstream gaming audience and it's easier to associate with players that aren't Korean, because we don't know their language, and 'they all look the same'. It also breaks the reputation that BW had, as foreigners didn't even come close to Korean level. I do understand where IPL is coming from, and I agree that SC2 as an esport looks more attractive to someone who's never seen it before if it's not 2 Koreans playing, but beyond that first impression it's stupid not to let the best play.
That's my opinion, not trying to be spiteful or anything, if anyone has a counterargument I'd be happy to read it, I'm genuinely interested in the subject.
Though IPL Season 1 was praised for slick presentation and production, perhaps its only fault was just its genuine game quality overall along with solo caster.
</div> Should be "quality, along with only a solo caster"
Though I'll admit the shiny production makes up for a lot of it, it is extremely hard to make predictions on the bracket for discussions sake because it's hard to pinpoint when these players actually played the game,
The IPL's focus on post production and the fact that it was branched from a mainstream video games organization sets a lot of amazing precedence for western ESPORTS,
Sets a lot of amazing precedents for Western ESPORTS...
That was most of them. The interviews looked really good. There were a few others like post-production having a hyphen, and making sure West and Western are capitalized. A few comma errors but those are little things.
Just trying to keep Team Liquid professional. This was an amazing write-up and really well done interviews. I am really excited for IPL Season 2![/QUOTE]
Personally, I find overly critical posts even more annoying than grammar and spelling errors. If you want to help someone out try PM'ing the OP instead of cluttering up the thread with red ink style posts.
On July 14 2011 17:51 Chenz wrote: MLG > IPL > NASL. Meaning, I'm quite excited for this one. Watching IPL seems to always be a quality experience.
Good production is really nice, but cant get excited about the matchups we gonna see today atleast. Could have been round of 64 in any random open tournament.
On July 14 2011 18:10 CNSnow wrote: Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
Why do you watch Starcraft II? Your mannerisms suggest that you're not a high level player (although this is purely an assumption, after all, Day[9] sure loves his exclamation marks and xDs), so I'm assuming you watch for entertainment value.
Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice. Do you really prefer not to watch a game because of the race of the players? I dunno if that could be considered 'racist', but it can certainly be considered stupid. If you want to watch the best in Europe, well, there's events like DreamHack. Same with the US if there was a North American LAN event (NASL had international players and such). In online tournaments, where a player is nothing more than their name and their skill, there is no room for weaker players to get the main stage just because of their nationality (except if there's lag and stuff).
It's obvious why IPL is excluding Koreans; their audience is different than the other events. Who's watching NASL aside from SC2 fans? No-one. IPL has a mainstream gaming audience and it's easier to associate with players that aren't Korean, because we don't know their language, and 'they all look the same'. It also breaks the reputation that BW had, as foreigners didn't even come close to Korean level. I do understand where IPL is coming from, and I agree that SC2 as an esport looks more attractive to someone who's never seen it before if it's not 2 Koreans playing, but beyond that first impression it's stupid not to let the best play.
That's my opinion, not trying to be spiteful or anything, if anyone has a counterargument I'd be happy to read it, I'm genuinely interested in the subject.
People have multiple reasons for not wanting to watch the best of the best play, in any sport, all over the world. You watch a game between ppl who aren't the best because you feel emotionally linked to them and to the "sports scene" the game belongs to. I, for example, prefer watching any Brazillian soccer tournament than Europe's Champion's League even though the Champion's League has overall better games. If you want to call me racist or stupid, that's your problem!
"Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players. What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game."
On July 14 2011 17:18 Lovedrop wrote: We actually could go higher than $50,000, and I would not be surprised if IGN pays out more than $1,000,000 in prize money within the next 12 months.
holy ****..... thats a number i LIKE to hear :D yeeehaaww go IPL go eSports!!! :D
and i dont care if its live or not....for ME it is live, because i never saw it :D...and the casting IS live, its not like the casters know who won and commentate stupid. its totally fine... but mb some offline finals would be nice. just for the chering crowds. moar goossseeebuuumbbss!!!
On July 14 2011 18:10 CNSnow wrote: Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
Why do you watch Starcraft II? Your mannerisms suggest that you're not a high level player (although this is purely an assumption, after all, Day[9] sure loves his exclamation marks and xDs), so I'm assuming you watch for entertainment value.
Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice. Do you really prefer not to watch a game because of the race of the players? I dunno if that could be considered 'racist', but it can certainly be considered stupid. If you want to watch the best in Europe, well, there's events like DreamHack. Same with the US if there was a North American LAN event (NASL had international players and such). In online tournaments, where a player is nothing more than their name and their skill, there is no room for weaker players to get the main stage just because of their nationality (except if there's lag and stuff).
It's obvious why IPL is excluding Koreans; their audience is different than the other events. Who's watching NASL aside from SC2 fans? No-one. IPL has a mainstream gaming audience and it's easier to associate with players that aren't Korean, because we don't know their language, and 'they all look the same'. It also breaks the reputation that BW had, as foreigners didn't even come close to Korean level. I do understand where IPL is coming from, and I agree that SC2 as an esport looks more attractive to someone who's never seen it before if it's not 2 Koreans playing, but beyond that first impression it's stupid not to let the best play.
That's my opinion, not trying to be spiteful or anything, if anyone has a counterargument I'd be happy to read it, I'm genuinely interested in the subject.
People have multiple reasons for not wanting to watch the best of the best play, in any sport, all over the world. You watch a game between ppl who aren't the best because you feel emotionally linked to them and to the "sports scene" the game belongs to. I, for example, prefer watching any Brazillian soccer tournament than Europe's Champion's League even though the Champion's League has overall better games. If you want to call me racist or stupid, that's your problem!
Thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard. If you find yourself having an emotional link to a player(s) surely your ultimate hope comes down to that player aspiring to becoming the best in the world? Why win a second rate tournament with little prestige than an event that makes people notice you as being one of the best players in the world? People talk about the money, and how its not "fair" that koreans could end up taking it all, but so what? If people want to take the game seriously then they need to step it up a gear, and events like this isn't allowing it.
IPL season 1 was the first American tournament that used the same quality settings ingame as Dreamhack. I really hope they keep up the awesome production and dont feel like they need to mimic other tournaments.
I find the quotes about Korean (mostly) and European skill lvls worrying. It's basically like saying, "we cant compete with the best so lets shut them out"
On July 14 2011 21:28 Pipeline wrote: IPL season 1 was the first American tournament that used the same quality settings ingame as Dreamhack. I really hope they keep up the awesome production and dont feel like they need to mimic other tournaments.
I find the quotes about Korean (mostly) and European skill lvls worrying. It's basically like saying, "we cant compete with the best so lets shut them out"
That's not what he is saying at all. He's saying he still wants to grow the NA scene but at the same time wants to slowly bring in the Koreans and Euros. It's still strictly about growing the NA scene though from the sounds of it. Nothing wrong with that.
On July 14 2011 18:10 CNSnow wrote: Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
Why do you watch Starcraft II? Your mannerisms suggest that you're not a high level player (although this is purely an assumption, after all, Day[9] sure loves his exclamation marks and xDs), so I'm assuming you watch for entertainment value.
Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice. Do you really prefer not to watch a game because of the race of the players? I dunno if that could be considered 'racist', but it can certainly be considered stupid. If you want to watch the best in Europe, well, there's events like DreamHack. Same with the US if there was a North American LAN event (NASL had international players and such). In online tournaments, where a player is nothing more than their name and their skill, there is no room for weaker players to get the main stage just because of their nationality (except if there's lag and stuff).
It's obvious why IPL is excluding Koreans; their audience is different than the other events. Who's watching NASL aside from SC2 fans? No-one. IPL has a mainstream gaming audience and it's easier to associate with players that aren't Korean, because we don't know their language, and 'they all look the same'. It also breaks the reputation that BW had, as foreigners didn't even come close to Korean level. I do understand where IPL is coming from, and I agree that SC2 as an esport looks more attractive to someone who's never seen it before if it's not 2 Koreans playing, but beyond that first impression it's stupid not to let the best play.
That's my opinion, not trying to be spiteful or anything, if anyone has a counterargument I'd be happy to read it, I'm genuinely interested in the subject.
People have multiple reasons for not wanting to watch the best of the best play, in any sport, all over the world. You watch a game between ppl who aren't the best because you feel emotionally linked to them and to the "sports scene" the game belongs to. I, for example, prefer watching any Brazillian soccer tournament than Europe's Champion's League even though the Champion's League has overall better games. If you want to call me racist or stupid, that's your problem!
Thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard. If you find yourself having an emotional link to a player(s) surely your ultimate hope comes down to that player aspiring to becoming the best in the world? Why win a second rate tournament with little prestige than an event that makes people notice you as being one of the best players in the world? People talk about the money, and how its not "fair" that koreans could end up taking it all, but so what? If people want to take the game seriously then they need to step it up a gear, and events like this isn't allowing it.
He said: "Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice" and concluded it was because of racism/stupidity.
I said: "People have multiple reasons for not wanting to watch the best of the best play, in any sport, all over the world" and gave an example.
Love the model, as a games media outlet it just makes so much sense not only to drive traffic and develop the IGN brand but it leverages skills a lot of gaming outlets have these days: video production. Not only that but the qualifiers have given them a bit more content to put out there and the broadcast and production experience, can't wait for the main event and here's hoping it's here for years to come.
On July 14 2011 20:31 Morphs wrote: So 8 PM ET is 8 PM european time? Or eastern time? What's the broadcast time for europeans? Kinda omission that it's not clear.
On July 14 2011 20:37 layerz wrote: Sweet so it starts 20:00 europe time?
Will we be getting a tale of the tapes before each figh.....i mean match The front page really does look like the fight cards for an MMA event,,, which is awesome
I've been so spoiled by all the recent Koreans in the other major tournaments that I don't feel hyped for the IPL. I might check in for the finals, but I'll definitely check out Season 3 once Koreans are invited. Keep up the good work!
The funny part is prior to like a month or so ago I thought IPL had started little to my knowledge they had a ton of qualifiers, anyway I'm pumped for season 2
I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
As much as I root for Americans/Europeans, I think you're only kidding yourself if you think Koreans are not the best players in the world right now...
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
you clearly dont know what you're talking about : D
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
As much as I root for Americans/Europeans, I think you're only kidding yourself if you think Koreans are not the best players in the world right now...
I'm not trying to kid myself. They are the best players overall. But they are not so far ahead that IPL2 is a joke. In 100 straight between some Korean pro and some NA pro, the Korean will win the majority. But these guys in IPL2 are still amongst the best of the best, and can beat the Koreans on any given day. The absolutely are the best in the world, but the margin of separation is not as large as most people think.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
you clearly dont know what you're talking about : D
In any given tournament, someone like Drewbie/iNcontrol/Kiwikaki can knock out a korean. If they were to play 100 straight games, yea, the korean will win most. The koreans aren't THAT much better, but they are definitely better.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
I'm not sure if you've been following the international Starcraft scene lately, but it's not the beta anymore...
Looking forward to this. IPL production has been quality. I actually like that we have one major tournament that doesn't have Koreans. As a spectator I really like that GSL/NASL/Dreamhack/MLG all have a mix of the best players but its nice that foreigners have a tournament just for them. It is good to have variety.
Very nice, they do have great production quality. The dream situation would be to have the high level of finsh/polish couple with the rush of a live event.
It's so hard to believe people aren't grasping what IPL is trying to do here. They see no Koreans so it's an instant turn off because blah blah blah.
It's stated right in the article. They are trying to throw some serious cash out there so players from NA and EU can get some financial backing so they don't have to do their 9-5 jobs and can sit down and practice like mad. Get their skills to the level where they can be competitive with all the Korean players.
This is nothing but a good thing. A few seasons go by with little to no Korean players doesn't just write this off. Players that don't have to worry about punching the clock at work, or do ridiculous amounts of coaching to keep their lights on, is a great idea.
We're still in the infancy of this game. If this league can help get a good sized group of players focusing full time on the game, then bring on all the Koreans that you want. We can be ready and maybe we can start posting some real results against them.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
I'm not sure if you've been following the international Starcraft scene lately, but it's not the beta anymore...
Learn to read what is written and not what you think I might possibly be implying. The koreans are the best, no doubt. They aren't so far ahead that it wouldn't even be competitive to play the guys here in IPL. I never once said that they were equal to or better than the koreans. They are "amazing world class players". Enjoy the tournament and stop bitching. Apparently that comment was to be directed at you. Your ignorance and those of you alike is the only thing hindering the growth of IPL which is likely the highest production value online tournament out there.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
I'm not sure if you've been following the international Starcraft scene lately, but it's not the beta anymore...
Learn to read what is written and not what you think I might possibly be implying. The koreans are the best, no doubt. They aren't so far ahead that it wouldn't even be competitive to play the guys here in IPL. I never once said that they were equal to or better than the koreans. They are "amazing world class players". Enjoy the tournament and stop bitching. Apparently that comment was to be directed at you. Your ignorance and those of you alike is the only thing hindering the growth of IPL which is likely the highest production value online tournament out there.
I would tone down your language unless you want to get a temp ban. Anyway, I would say the TSL3 has the highest production value of an online tournament.
On July 14 2011 23:34 TelesisGQ wrote: I don't see drewbie as being in the same class as Idra, not by a long shot.
They're surprisingly close in skill actually.
Depends if Idra plays his best or not. On his best days he should have no problem with Drewbie, but then he could just get 2raxed twice. As an Idra fan I hope he'll bring his best into IPL2, the first one had really good production values so I'm expecting a lot of IPL2.
On July 15 2011 00:13 qbs wrote: dont know why so much hype with this match drewbie vs idra it can go only one way : /
Why exactly? Drewbie has beat him fair and square on multiple occassions.
Not entirely sure why people are taking a dump on the guy who made the premier league remark, he's absolutely right. Sports fans watch the match because it's the match, not due to who is playing. They do not ignore all of the matches that aren't being played by the top couple of teams, they enjoy the sport, regardless of who is playing it. The idea that you can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played at the absolute razer edge of perfection is something I'll never understand, not to mention is a fairly harmful attitude to have. I actually feel sorry for people that can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played by Koreans, how terrible to be denied so much entertainment simply due to some self-imposed restriction.
Wow no koreans or EU players ? Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players. What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game
Translation : Americans sucks therefore we don't want to compete with the rest of the world atm
I don't understand the mentality involved here , you can only get better by practicing / competing with the best.
I don't think i would be watching this league (Nasl has horrifying production but the rosters is amazing and the games were awesome) i rather watch NASL season 2.
Do they at least allow Huk to participate ?( or does he counts as koreans now that he practice alot and in GSL code S?) i would love him to win this league.
On July 15 2011 01:17 VL-Orion wrote: Wow no koreans or EU players ? Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players. What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game
Translation : Americans sucks therefore we don't want to compete with the rest of the world atm
I don't understand the mentality involved here , you can only get better by practicing / competing with the best.
I don't think i would be watching this league (Nasl has horrifying production but the rosters is amazing and the games were awesome) i rather watch NASL season 2.
Do they at least allow Huk to participate ?( or does he counts as koreans now that he practice alot and in GSL code S?) i would love him to win this league.
First off, your location says Australia... Secondly, DieStar and Tarson are European.
On July 15 2011 01:17 VL-Orion wrote: Wow no koreans or EU players ?
We have a ton of EU players!
As David mentioned in his interview, we're growing gradually to make sure every step is awesome. S1 was all NA, S2 was NA and EU, and who knows what we'll add moving forward! :D
On July 14 2011 18:10 CNSnow wrote: Sooooooooooooooooooooo exited about his cause no Korean is in the tournament!!!!! I love koreans game play but i dont like ti see them everywere!!! I wanna see other players too and the foreigner seen is very good!!! A little bit behind koreans but he are giving their best!!! GL to all players and especially to Idra/White-Ra!!!
Why do you watch Starcraft II? Your mannerisms suggest that you're not a high level player (although this is purely an assumption, after all, Day[9] sure loves his exclamation marks and xDs), so I'm assuming you watch for entertainment value.
Why the hell would you watch anything less than the best of the best if you have a choice. Do you really prefer not to watch a game because of the race of the players? I dunno if that could be considered 'racist', but it can certainly be considered stupid. If you want to watch the best in Europe, well, there's events like DreamHack. Same with the US if there was a North American LAN event (NASL had international players and such). In online tournaments, where a player is nothing more than their name and their skill, there is no room for weaker players to get the main stage just because of their nationality (except if there's lag and stuff).
It's obvious why IPL is excluding Koreans; their audience is different than the other events. Who's watching NASL aside from SC2 fans? No-one. IPL has a mainstream gaming audience and it's easier to associate with players that aren't Korean, because we don't know their language, and 'they all look the same'. It also breaks the reputation that BW had, as foreigners didn't even come close to Korean level. I do understand where IPL is coming from, and I agree that SC2 as an esport looks more attractive to someone who's never seen it before if it's not 2 Koreans playing, but beyond that first impression it's stupid not to let the best play.
That's my opinion, not trying to be spiteful or anything, if anyone has a counterargument I'd be happy to read it, I'm genuinely interested in the subject.
People have multiple reasons for not wanting to watch the best of the best play, in any sport, all over the world. You watch a game between ppl who aren't the best because you feel emotionally linked to them and to the "sports scene" the game belongs to. I, for example, prefer watching any Brazillian soccer tournament than Europe's Champion's League even though the Champion's League has overall better games. If you want to call me racist or stupid, that's your problem!
Thats the stupidest thing i've ever heard. If you find yourself having an emotional link to a player(s) surely your ultimate hope comes down to that player aspiring to becoming the best in the world? Why win a second rate tournament with little prestige than an event that makes people notice you as being one of the best players in the world? People talk about the money, and how its not "fair" that koreans could end up taking it all, but so what? If people want to take the game seriously then they need to step it up a gear, and events like this isn't allowing it.
So then I guess that the fans of the teams that never make it to the Premier League should just give up because they will never get to see their players be the best in the world?
some of you guys really need to get off the "Koreans only have good game" crap. Americans and EU players are very well capable of putting on a great show for us all.
I think of the IPL as College Football compared to the NFL. Is it "stupid" for hundreds of thousands of people to prefer the former? Because it's quite true in this analogy.
This is going to be great. And stop using the stupid > this > this. Support the tournaments accordingly, each will improve and they all bring a different atmosphere.
On July 14 2011 22:38 Mr Showtime wrote: I've heard enough of the "these aren't the best players" bullshit. That's what it is. Complete BULLSHIT. Stop complaining. All of these guys are amazing Starcraft players. The people of the UK get wicked hyped for the Premier League championships even though at least the worlds top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. These guys are all amazing world class players. Go out an enjoy the awesome championship, and stop bitching. Please.
I'm not sure if you've been following the international Starcraft scene lately, but it's not the beta anymore...
Learn to read what is written and not what you think I might possibly be implying. The koreans are the best, no doubt. They aren't so far ahead that it wouldn't even be competitive to play the guys here in IPL. I never once said that they were equal to or better than the koreans. They are "amazing world class players". Enjoy the tournament and stop bitching. Apparently that comment was to be directed at you. Your ignorance and those of you alike is the only thing hindering the growth of IPL which is likely the highest production value online tournament out there.
I would tone down your language unless you want to get a temp ban. Anyway, I would say the TSL3 has the highest production value of an online tournament.
Thanks for the concern, but I'm not too worried about that. If my point is made, it would be worth it. I'm tired of listening to that crap. Besides, I uttered nothing derogatory and never will. That's the stuff that should stay off the forums.
And I agree that TSL3 had better production value than IPL1. So far I've heard really good things about IPL2, so we'll see!
On July 15 2011 01:17 VL-Orion wrote: Wow no koreans or EU players ? Even though I am American patriot, I do realize the possible skill gap between Americans/Europeans/Koreans players. What I want to do is to tilt the balance a little bit, and have American players earn more time not having to worry about their living and spend that time practicing and up their game
Translation : Americans sucks therefore we don't want to compete with the rest of the world atm
I don't understand the mentality involved here , you can only get better by practicing / competing with the best.
I don't think i would be watching this league (Nasl has horrifying production but the rosters is amazing and the games were awesome) i rather watch NASL season 2.
Do they at least allow Huk to participate ?( or does he counts as koreans now that he practice alot and in GSL code S?) i would love him to win this league.
The NA players aren't protesting the presence of koreans in the tournament because they are too good. Not sure where you got that idea. That's completely false. Koerans aren't participating because they don't care to because it's an online tournament in NA, or they didn't make it through the qualifiers.
On July 15 2011 01:50 DarkenedLite wrote: I think of the IPL as College Football compared to the NFL. Is it "stupid" for hundreds of thousands of people to prefer the former? Because it's quite true in this analogy.
Hey, someone who gets it! I used a similar analogy that I personally like a wee bit better, even though we are both kinda saying the same thing. In my opinion, the skill gap between college football and the NFL is much larger than that between the Koreans and NA players. I said that people in the UK still get hyped for the Premier League championship which features some of the worlds best players (i.e. Rooney, Torres, Tevez), even though at least the world's top 3 players (Messi, Ronaldo, Kaka) all play in La Liga out of Spain. They aren't THE best, but it's way too close to make a fuss about. Though the analogy is a little shaky because I focus solely on the individual rather than the team, but I think you can see my point.
the thing i REALLY liked in this writeup was the match history for the main card for IdrA and Drewbie, showing both their TvZ/ZvT histories and then the personal histories between the two players. it really sheds light on how well they feel in the matchup and against each other. i hope TL starts doing that for every preview in future writeups.
On July 15 2011 00:13 qbs wrote: dont know why so much hype with this match drewbie vs idra it can go only one way : /
Why exactly? Drewbie has beat him fair and square on multiple occassions.
Not entirely sure why people are taking a dump on the guy who made the premier league remark, he's absolutely right. Sports fans watch the match because it's the match, not due to who is playing. They do not ignore all of the matches that aren't being played by the top couple of teams, they enjoy the sport, regardless of who is playing it. The idea that you can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played at the absolute razer edge of perfection is something I'll never understand, not to mention is a fairly harmful attitude to have. I actually feel sorry for people that can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played by Koreans, how terrible to be denied so much entertainment simply due to some self-imposed restriction.
Agree. One tournament without Koreans is fine by me! They're playing in everything else for goodness sake. I get as much enjoyment out of the Euro and NA scenes as I do the KR.
On July 15 2011 00:13 qbs wrote: dont know why so much hype with this match drewbie vs idra it can go only one way : /
Why exactly? Drewbie has beat him fair and square on multiple occassions.
Not entirely sure why people are taking a dump on the guy who made the premier league remark, he's absolutely right. Sports fans watch the match because it's the match, not due to who is playing. They do not ignore all of the matches that aren't being played by the top couple of teams, they enjoy the sport, regardless of who is playing it. The idea that you can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played at the absolute razer edge of perfection is something I'll never understand, not to mention is a fairly harmful attitude to have. I actually feel sorry for people that can't enjoy SC2 unless it's being played by Koreans, how terrible to be denied so much entertainment simply due to some self-imposed restriction.
yeah you are right and dont get me wrong i will watch it and cheer but i fell like this match is more like can drewbie make a upset( btw i hope he does ! : D ) ? Im waiting for moonan vs furry and and die star vs minigun should be fun ! gogo !
I really think the best model for SC2 and something the IGN guy was alluding to could be NCAA basketball... tons of regular season games very few people watch except for fans of each school, but then almost everyone in the country is aware of the bracket tournament and the final four. Something like that could be viable at the outset.
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
i think his list of accomplishments alone prove that
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
i think his list of accomplishments alone prove that
There is a difference between being a very strong player and being the undisputed best.
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
I would have said he was on his way to becoming the best Zerg, but bailing out of Korea I don't think he will. Korea would have made him so good, but he threw away that awesome opportunity.
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
i think his list of accomplishments alone prove that
There is a difference between being a very strong player and being the undisputed best.
but once again. his accomplishments along already have proven he is the undisputed best zerg player in NA.
On July 15 2011 04:48 SC2Joker wrote: Sheth > IdrA playing and competing in GSTL proves that.
Idra would still be a top level Code S Zerg if he hadn't opted to leave Korea. Was your memory erased in February, or were you just not following GSL before then?
On July 15 2011 04:48 SC2Joker wrote: Sheth > IdrA playing and competing in GSTL proves that.
Idra would still be a top level Code S Zerg if he hadn't opted to leave Korea. Was your memory erased in February, or were you just not following GSL before then?
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
On July 15 2011 04:15 barkles wrote: So IdrA is the "undisputed best NA zerg" now is he? I think that Sheth might have something to say about that at MLG Anaheim
Sheth is a very skilled player, and on a given day could beat IdrA. He's just not as good. IdrA was a top code S level player. Sheth was knocked out of code A very early. When Sheth starts winning a multitude of tournaments you will have an argument, but until then..... no. I'm a big fan of Sheth and IdrA, but there's no doubt who the better player is.
After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
On July 15 2011 06:06 Golgotha wrote: ipl is great but the players....
Yeah I'm going to tune in to a match here and there, but I'm so glad that they're opening the Korean doors soon. The production value is top notch, and the player skill needs to match it. I especially love the TLPD ratings, there are so many people who are on there just because they played a half decent guy in some $50 weekly cup, the stats are absolute garbage...
The undisputed best NA Zerg has had a short run in multiple tournaments as summer began, but coming in as the winner can have a positive effect on his mentality.
I'm not the only one that reads that and gets a bad taste in his mouth, even if it is true. I'm a fan of IdrA and he pretty much is the best American Zerg. But.. It's always been a issue of foreign vs korean to me. And I don't want foreigners to win yet, despite strongly being one of them*(I think being American qualifies). And this is why.
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
I see the immense amount of effort, practice- love for the game Code S level players show and want them to win.
I hope IdrA goes all the way to the top and represents my race with pride. But my heart knows that the player who deserves to win, will, and traditionally his nemesis has earned his wins.
Sorry for being slightly off topic. Just my thoughts. I look forward to the IPL none the less.
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
You're beyond kidding yourself if you think a code A player could win this with ease. Stop comparing the IPL to code S. They aren't currently a competitor with code S!!!! They aren't trying to!!!
This is a highly competitive tournament with some of the world's best players. Enjoy the competition and quit complaining. The amount of bitching going on is absurd.
On July 15 2011 04:57 Kira__ wrote: IdrAs korean ELO is still above huks and far above jinros and especially sheths. Idra is #26 in korea still, none of the others are close.
Half the people he beat aren't even in the GSL anymore, comparing the quality of play in the GSL back then to now and saying, "Look at his Elo from over 6 months ago" doesn't mean shit. You're comparing his Elo from then, to their Elo from now.
On July 15 2011 06:06 Golgotha wrote: ipl is great but the players....
Yeah I'm going to tune in to a match here and there, but I'm so glad that they're opening the Korean doors soon. The production value is top notch, and the player skill needs to match it. I especially love the TLPD ratings, there are so many people who are on there just because they played a half decent guy in some $50 weekly cup, the stats are absolute garbage...
most def. once the koreans are invited then it will be glorious. plus I predict that the koreans will be very impressed with how professional the IPL is.
I'm pretty pumped to watch this and i'm excited to see some players that I've never watched before.
Since there are no koreans, it gives us an opportunity to get a feel for who the best non-koreans are, as otherwise the koreans would dominate the bracket and we wouldn't get as many foreigner vs foreigner games.
Super excited for this. I don't understand the elitest i only watch tournaments with koreans in them hate but hey... to each their own. A 50k prizepool for a tournament outside of korea that is based on qualifiers instead of the majority being invites is something we desperately need to keep the scene available to up and coming talent. Those who are really passionate about their sport usually enjoy watching the college teams play because it is there that you will see new talent. That's how I see this tournament anyway. =]
On July 15 2011 01:17 VL-Orion wrote: Wow no koreans or EU players ?
We have a ton of EU players!
As David mentioned in his interview, we're growing gradually to make sure every step is awesome. S1 was all NA, S2 was NA and EU, and who knows what we'll add moving forward! :D
Yes, I really can't understand why people seem not able to read. This was explained since IPL 2 was announced a few months ago.
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
You're beyond kidding yourself if you think a code A player could win this with ease. Stop comparing the IPL to code S. They aren't currently a competitor with code S!!!! They aren't trying to!!!
This is a highly competitive tournament with some of the world's best players. Enjoy the competition and quit complaining. The amount of bitching going on is absurd.
Puzzle, Leenock, Ryung, Gumiho, MMA, Dongraegu are all code A or lower and could win IPL.
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
You're beyond kidding yourself if you think a code A player could win this with ease. Stop comparing the IPL to code S. They aren't currently a competitor with code S!!!! They aren't trying to!!!
This is a highly competitive tournament with some of the world's best players. Enjoy the competition and quit complaining. The amount of bitching going on is absurd.
Puzzle, Leenock, Ryung, Gumiho, MMA, Dongraegu are all code A or lower and could win IPL.
What the fuck? Most of those guys have beaten Code S players so that doesn't really mean a whole lot...
On July 15 2011 07:04 BaRR wrote: idra looks like a weak nerd when he holds up his fists
Ironically he's in the gym more than 99% of TL.
lol, I agree. IdrA has gotten more toned since he started working out with Machine. Joke or not, it reminds me how people say iNcontroL is fat, when he's not. Anyone that exercises/lift weights frequently know that Geoff is a powerlifter.
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
You're beyond kidding yourself if you think a code A player could win this with ease. Stop comparing the IPL to code S. They aren't currently a competitor with code S!!!! They aren't trying to!!!
This is a highly competitive tournament with some of the world's best players. Enjoy the competition and quit complaining. The amount of bitching going on is absurd.
Think about it. We don't care that Code S is in Korea. Foreigners can get into Code S. That's why we said Code S instead of Korea. Think about Code S and what I highlighted.
Code S.
Okay done with that
We don't want some of the worlds "best" players. We want the best players. It's worth tuning in even if the regular competitors for the GSL aren't in attendance, I am not ungrateful. But watch as Code A dominates all but the very best. I am happy to be surprised but this is how I see it going. 14 minutes awaaaaay.
On July 15 2011 08:48 dishington wrote: sry if i have missed something obvious but were can i watch the games? are they streamed live etc? thanks in andvance.
On July 15 2011 09:22 common_cider wrote: may u take down the overlay header? It is very big, and i feel it lessens the viewer experience.
does anyone else feel this way?
I disagree. You'll get used to it.
However, not being able to see the supply of both players is troublesome, even though there's nothing that can be done since it was played on cloaked maps.
IPL has had some of the consistently best production quality of any tournament to date. IPL TV so super underrated too. Makes me so sad when I tune in and there are <1k viewers...give them a chance!
On July 14 2011 17:18 Lovedrop wrote: Going a little deeper into the prize pool aspect of things, the first season had a prize pool of $5,000, and quickly multiplied tenfold. Is this an indicator of your success, or was it already on your checklist when you started?
I had planned this all along. The experimental IPL1 gave us data points that gave the green light to proceed. We actually could go higher than $50,000, and I would not be surprised if IGN pays out more than $1,000,000 in prize money within the next 12 months.
Wow, $1,000,000? Incredible! Wish all the best to IPL. Make it all happen!
Idra's strongest rival will always be his mindset. I think he goes on tilt faster than any other pro player. When he's playing his best, I do think he's the best NA zerg. I don't think Sheth can compete. At least not in ZvZ (we've seen Idra sweep him 3-0). Did sheth improve MASSIVELY after 2 weeks in Korea? I doubt it.
Is Idra the best foreigner zerg? Definitely not.
As far as IPL2 goes... I'm kinda saddened tht all the matches are pre-recorded. The game sounds are way too low, and the brightness is hella low. It's so dark it's hard to tell whats going on sometimes
On July 14 2011 17:18 Lovedrop wrote: We actually could go higher than $50,000, and I would not be surprised if IGN pays out more than $1,000,000 in prize money within the next 12 months.
holy ****..... thats a number i LIKE to hear :D yeeehaaww go IPL go eSports!!! :D
and i dont care if its live or not....for ME it is live, because i never saw it :D...and the casting IS live, its not like the casters know who won and commentate stupid. its totally fine... but mb some offline finals would be nice. just for the chering crowds. moar goossseeebuuumbbss!!!
Why do people think the games are casted live? This very article states otherwise. I mean do you think painuser, catspajamas, tastosis, djwheat, and HD were all available TONIGHT to cast 1 or 2 games for IPL RO64 day 1? Use yo noggin...
thats actually pretty cool, and a huge number for esports prize money.
As of right now, IPL is strictly an online tournament. Are plans underway to make future IPLs a live event?
Yes.
Grats to IGN for at least getting it right so far, taking some time to get production right is always a good idea; don't put too much stress on it too soon and the whole thing will turn out better. Also a good idea is shooting to surpass whats currently out there. Looking forward to the future of this tourney
On July 15 2011 06:15 hmunkey wrote: After watching all these other tournaments with Korean levels of skill, IPL just seems really lackluster. I mean, they have great production and all, but now I know with absolute certainty that pretty much any Code S/A Korean could easily win this.
You're beyond kidding yourself if you think a code A player could win this with ease. Stop comparing the IPL to code S. They aren't currently a competitor with code S!!!! They aren't trying to!!!
This is a highly competitive tournament with some of the world's best players. Enjoy the competition and quit complaining. The amount of bitching going on is absurd.
Puzzle, Leenock, Ryung, Gumiho, MMA, Dongraegu are all code A or lower and could win IPL.
Oh they absolutely could win IPL. They are amazing players. But you'd be kidding yourself if you think them winning is a sure thing. They are awesome players..... but so are those in the IPL now. They would be good matches, but no guarantees.
So far as i expected the IPL has good commentators, easily accessed vods , impressive streams with no lags/stutter , an amazing production overall.
The game however has been lackluster so far and their player rosters is really not all that impressive with only few players that stands out (Idra, white-ra,thorzain ,select and ret).
That being said its a good league and when they get real competition not just few very good players crushing faces I would definitely watch the IPL
i don't really understand all of the criticism about the overlays, the occasional bits of lag, etc. The games are great and enjoyable to me thats what counts the most as long as the production value doesnt directly have a negative effect on the viewer experience
yea game 3 doesn't load AT ALL for idra vs drewbie. gg IPL, and FFS have a low bandwidth stream option instead of this buffering non-sense. way to destroy your tournament after the sucess of the first.
Someone should tell idra to hold his hand by his cheek when he is boxing. Otherwise he'll get punched in the face. As far sc2 goes, drewbie doesn't stand a chance. I'm thinking idra or vibe will take this.
On July 17 2011 21:21 sporei wrote: yea game 3 doesn't load AT ALL for idra vs drewbie. gg IPL, and FFS have a low bandwidth stream option instead of this buffering non-sense. way to destroy your tournament after the sucess of the first.
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