[GG] Red Army Mafia
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On July 27 2009 03:44 QuickStriker wrote: Omg, what is this?!?!?! This looks fun!!! Sign me up please!!! ^_^ Sure, I'll just need your credit card and social security number, please. Oh, and a photo of your girlfriend and her home address. | ||
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On July 27 2009 04:50 HeavOnEarth wrote: wow how pathetic. + Show Spoiler + you forgot to ask for the pin! Hey, it's how we roll in the Motherland. If he doesn't provide the pin himself, he's evidently ukranian scum. | ||
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On July 28 2009 06:26 motbob wrote: I'm guessing this won't be necessary:Just send a PM to everyone who signed up to make sure they're still down. In a week make cuts and start the game. On July 26 2009 12:54 Caller wrote: SIGNUPS WILL CLOSE ON TUESDAY, JULY 28th, at 11:00 KST GAME STARTS ON WEDNESDAY, JULY 29th, at Whenever. | ||
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On July 30 2009 02:52 Ace wrote: No, because he could also be RC'd by a legit NKVD. If his defense fails, now the legit NKVD agent is going to be put up to be hanged - o damn we just lost 2 NKVD agents because one guy thought it was smart to pose as a Rebel. Now we also would have to deal with a situation where if every time someone gets Rolechecked and flips Ukrainian they just say "I'm an NKVD agent, I was just posing as a Rebel". Now what do we do? Wait a day and RC him AGAIN? Sweet, we waste another day and he kills again that night. We've just once again traded 1-1 or even 2-1 for a Rebel. That's not a good idea. In both scenarios the Red Army comes out fucked. You've been drinking too much Spetnaz Vodka. Hm. I'm not sure I agree with you Ace. Let's say on Day 1, an NKVD agent checks a player who comes up as Ukranian. If he says he's an agent (which he will), we give him 2 days to use up his remaining RCs and tell us what he finds, then we hang him. If he comes up as a rebel, we'll know to treat whatever he told us carefully, if he was in fact an agent we'll still have used up all of his RCs and know that info is true for sure. Besides, if there are say 9 rebels and 5 agents, it's much more likely that when a RC comes up as Ukranian, it'll actually be a rebel and not another agent. This does mean that if he turns out to be a rebel, we're giving him 2 more nights. That seems like the biggest cost. What's the upside of this plan? The ukranians can't coordinate from fear of contacting an agent. They can either: a. Operate independently, not sharing info. This screws them up big time because they'll waste a lot of time getting duplicate info. b. Try to contact each other to work efficiently. If they accept an agent into the fold, the agent will learn a bunch of rebel names and they get crushed. This is all assuming the rebels can't tell each other apart from an agent. If they can somehow tell each other apart, then this plan fails :p | ||
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On July 30 2009 04:20 Ace wrote: you do realize that by letting him live for 2 more nights you are just letting their KP sit and instead of "using" them they are indeed using you. Remember he doesn't have to do anything you tell him if he is indeed Ukrainian - so what do you gain from it? Basically you'll want to backlog everyone thats investigated for the sake of "ok, lets hope this guy is Ukrainian and dumb enough to work in the best interest of the town" when he'll just lie about everything and you are right back where you started - no reliable info and you let a Rebel live for 2 days. Come on, lets not assume the Ukrainians are all morons who will just do whatever we say and then get themselves killed. This is not what I suggested. Letting the suspect live for 2 days is clearly one of the downsides of the plan if he indeed turns out to be ukranian, since he will no doubt be working against us for these 2 days. The reason to let him live is to minimize the loss we take in case he turned out to be NKVD- we still get the benefit of all of his RCs and we _know_ they're reliable after his death. Let the vulture drop all its mines before it dies, is the idea. Ok, so all that stuff above is cost. Summary of costs: 1. Identified rebels get to live for 2 more days before their lynching. 2. Might end up lynching an NKVD agent, but at least we get 100% trusted RCs from him. Benefits of NKVD agents disguising as Ukranians: 1. Throws a wrench in rebel organization. They act solo, and waste a lot of turns with each one building up an intel network individually, so we can win by turn limit, OR 2. If they set up a mafia network anyway, we could get a mole in that network, who can give us the names of the rebels. Rebels get lynched, we win. | ||
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At any rate, the worst we can do is have everyone going off and trying their thing- I say, let the elected Field Marshall decide whether all the agents will disguise themselves as rebels, or whether none of them will. | ||
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On July 30 2009 04:42 Ace wrote: If he is an NKVD Agent what makes you think he will live 2 days to use up all his rolechecks? The NKVD agent who came up with the RC contacts the suspect personally, and the Field Marshall as well. Nothing has to be said publicly so the Ukranians won't suspect him. On July 30 2009 04:42 Ace wrote:ETA: Once again let's assume our enemies aren't stupid. How is an NKVD Agent going to get into the Rebel organization? How do you suppose the rebels will form an organization in the first place? They RC people, and if they turn up as rebels, they get added to the rebel network. If the NKVD agent is posing as a rebel, then the rebels either don't organize themselves at all, OR they accept anyone who comes up as a rebel in a RC into their organization- they have no other way of telling if any given person is a rebel or not. | ||
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On July 30 2009 04:47 Shikyo wrote: I'll just say that normally it is a terrible idea to have the elected officer decide for things like that, simply because if he's ukrainian, he'll just do everything to hurt the town. Wait what? The elected officer can be ukranian? O.o I thought his role would change to Field Marshall if a Ukranian was chosen to begin with... | ||
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On July 30 2009 04:51 Shikyo wrote: How will the detected ukrainian be lynched if nothing is said publicly? And are you really telling everything to the field marshall? And if it was established that every DT would appear as an ukrainian, do you really think they'd contact everyone they RC as ukrainians? Okay, first things first. All this time, I've assumed the field marshall is a trusted- the only trusted- member of the town, so correct me if I'm wrong on that assumption. Step by step: 1. NKVD agent RCs someone, comes up as Ukranian. 2. NKVD contacts Field Marshall he got a ukranian in a RC. 3. NKVD contacts suspect, tells him he will get lynched in 2 days' time. If he's a patriotic NKVD agent, he should use up his remaining RCs before he dies. 4. 2 days pass. 5. NKVD agent reveals his findings, Field Marshall confirms two days have passed since the findings. 6. With the info revealed, the town lynches the suspect. Perhaps it's too complicated, but it seems to work in theory. IF the field marshall is a trusted town member. | ||
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On July 30 2009 04:53 Falcynn wrote: He shows up as field marshall if he's checked, but he retains whatever role he started off with originally. Ok, I was wrong in one of my basic assumptions. Never mind anything I've said, Ace is right, NKVD agents should not disguise themselves as rebels -_- | ||
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On July 30 2009 05:07 Ace wrote: Even If the Field Marshal is a confirmed innocent you still haven't answered this REALLY basic question: how do you sort through the liars? I already answered this, in detail. You don't sort through the liars. You end up lynching whoever comes up as a rebel in a RC. This is one of the problems of the plan, I've stated it quite clearly. The plan also has benefits, which I've listed as well. At any rate, I for one already admitted that it's not a good plan :p | ||
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On July 30 2009 05:16 Shikyo wrote: How do you lynch them? Do you think the DT just publicly announces that he's the DT? And why should the town believe him? My assumption was that the NKVD agent contacts a trustworthy Field Marshal, so the Field Marshall can inform the Town. If this info was NOT given to the Field Marshal by an NKVD agent, then it was given by a rebel- no other Townie would want to impersonate an NKVD agent like that. So if a rebel was impersonating an NKVD agent so a conscript could get lynched, then that same rebel exposes himself and gets lynched the next day. Not a good trade for the rebel, so he wouldn't do it, so all this hypothetical debate is pointless. | ||
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On July 30 2009 05:53 Ace wrote: come on L, let's be serious here. In fact assume I'm a Ukrainian Rebel and you're an NKVD agent. do you REALLY think you'd ever successfully convince me you really are a Rebel and that you could get me to give up information about what I know and then get me lynched? The plan only works assuming our enemies are completely fucking stupid. I'm not playing the game based on that because it's an epic fail. Watch the NKVD agents all try it and all die. I guarantee it if the Rebels are even half competent. Pretty much. The only upside I'm seeing right now to having NKVD pose as Ukrainians, is that if a Ukrainian RCs an agent he will contact him and kill him after finding out he was a fake, giving the agent time to get out the word that a certain rebel contacted him and getting a rebel for an agent trade (rather than the ukrainian getting conscript as the answer to his RC, and killing the agent anyway). Not worth screwing over the efficacy of our agents, imo. Better to be certain when they get a rebel hit in their RCs. On a completely unrelated issue- can a 'dead' player still post after he got killed, such as saying "oh guys, before I died I got a PM from player X, it said such and such"? | ||
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On July 30 2009 06:19 So no fek wrote: There's certainly risks in the NKVD disguising themselves as rebels, however, I think that's the entire point of their role and the rebels not knowing each other. To throw a wrench into things. The ability to disguise yourself as a townie/another blue is nearly worthless. And Ace just explained why the ability to disguise yourself as a rebel is also worthless, because a rebel will find out what you really are through the kill list. Ok, to be fair, it's not completely worthless. You can get a rebel who RC'ed you to tell on himself and MAYBE he gets killed- if you can prove he's not another NKVD, which you can't. On the other hand, you throw a wrench on the work of your fellow NKVD agents who are trying to find rebels, because anyone who comes up as rebel will claim to be NKVD. Is this tradeoff worthwhile? I'm thinking no. | ||
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Beware, Town, everyone's pulling in different directions -_- | ||
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On July 30 2009 07:10 coltrane wrote: easy, you ask for any information of both, then you lynch one and mafia kills the other, or you lynch both. is a 1:1 trade anyway, and it is good. So your argument is: 1. All NKVD disguise as blue rebels 2. NKVD never PM someone they RC as rebel 3. When a rebel PMs an NKVD asking if he is rebel too, the NKVD can be sure whoever PMed him is rebel 4. NKVD comes clean. He and Rebel get lynched both (accused first, accuser later- spare accuser if accused turns out to be rebel). 5. We kill one rebel and probably lose an agent, plus if agent dies we get confirmed townies that the agent points out before his death. On the downside, a RC from an NKVD that comes up as blue is useless and NKVD is only good for confirming townies and being a landmine for rebels who are RCing. It... actually makes some sense. Hm. | ||
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The prevailing argument on the other side is, you don't prove it. When an argument breaks out with two people claiming they're NKVD and the other guy is a rebel, you lynch 'em both (or if the first guy you lynch ends up being a rebel, you let the other live). You're trading an agent for a rebel, while if the rebel had RC'ed the agent and gotten anything other than a mafia, then the agent would get killed, no questions asked. | ||
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On July 30 2009 09:53 coltrane wrote: Is way more convenient to lower directly the KP than make them believe we have more HP than we actually have. No one's arguing against that, the discussion is whether having NKVDs posing as rebels would have a net effect of lowering their KP or if that would simply create one huge political mess in the Town, making us turn on ourselves due to false accusations. On a tangentially related note: What's KP stand for? Killing Power of the mafia? | ||
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On July 30 2009 10:22 person935 wrote: Won't it get chaotic anyways when other roles find mafia? Zato/coltrane's argument is starting to make some sense to me.. what am I missing? First, let me clarify my stance on the issue. I find Ace's proposition to be the safest because there's a lot of people in the town, and when something goes wrong trying to explain a system with a lot of moving parts to a lot of people will end up in a train wreck. Ace's system is simple. When a NKVD RCs someone and it comes up as rebel, he's a rebel, period. I'm still not certain as to whether the best way to convince the town of this is through persuasion and tying clues to that person, or by role calling as NKVD and pointing to the rebel. Either way, it should be a relatively clear-cut deal. I find coltrane's argument to be riskier, but in theory it could work out better. If each NKVD is acting as a landmine, waiting to be contacted by a rebel who RCs him, then in theory each NKVD agent will take one rebel down with him. If there are, say, 9 rebels and 5 agents, taking down that many rebels early on while they're still getting their network together could be crippling- this is the best case scenario. The worst case scenario is that through argumentation, sentiments and confusion, the plan goes wrong, no one knows for sure who's what, innocent people get lynched and the Town ends up divided, all the while the Mafia are getting organized and killing us off one by one. By speaking in favor of coltrane I'm playing a bit of devil's advocate- I'm still more convinced by Ace's proposition. | ||
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On July 30 2009 11:30 Ace wrote: telling what group? ^_^ How can the NKVD tell anyone they found a mafia when they can't trust anyone else? By role calling themselves as NKVD and publicly accusing someone of being mafia. It's called a landmine strategy for a reason- the landmines blow up :p | ||
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DT doesn't stand for Dark Templar! When detectives are introduced as NKVD agents, newbies get confused :p | ||
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On July 30 2009 13:00 t_co wrote: This means day 1 we need to throw up tons of chaff, have each mafia have 20-30 potential mafia. I may not have played this game before, but 20-30 total NKVD+mafia sounds too high. Let's say there's 9 mafia and 5 detectives for instance. The chance a mafia will get a 'rebel' result on a RC is 13 in about 50, or about 1 in 4. That means about 2 mafia will get a rebel result in day one. On July 30 2009 13:00 t_co wrote: Then day 2, the mafia have to let people know whether they are mafia or not by marking a target--but that has been made impossible, because mafia can't send out a target to 20-30 people and then have it go through. Yeah... your numbers sound way off. I'd rather just stick to NKVDs posing as vets and keep an eye out on this forum. Mafia seems to be lurking. | ||
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No one is mafia Until you meet them in a dark alley at night, that is... | ||
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On July 31 2009 03:18 Ace wrote: Well since I'm better at this game than 99% of the people playing and I have never ever been wrong I think most people should follow my advice. You better get that first lynching right when/if you get elected Field Marshal then :p | ||
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coltrane, a couple of points: Ace uses good spelling and grammar. You have no idea how much that helps your persuasion online. Ace is also a respected member of the community with a long history of being right in these games (according to him at any rate, and I don't see any of the older members contradicting him). Given the above, most people will find what he says compelling, especially when his arguments sound reasonable. You have a legitimate disagreement with him, but you don't sound so humble yourself at times, plus you don't express your ideas as eloquently. I suggest you don't wage a war against his personality, because that's a losing battle for you. Stick to your strengths- analysis and ideas. The Town is always in want for additional help, and everyone here- Ace included- will appreciate any contributions you can make along the way. | ||
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On July 31 2009 04:01 Falcynn wrote: for everyone who thinks they should disguise as Russians, do we at least agree that they should disguise as Veterans rather than Conscripts? Yeah. It's the role that makes most sense- a role with weak offense (in terms of what they can do- they have no abilities to help their allies or hurt their foes) and powerful defense (need two hits to kill) should be the least attractive target for the rebels. | ||
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On July 31 2009 06:10 L wrote: Well, its pretty much tied between those two, but Lucas hasn't started his ridiculous troll spam this game thusfar Oh... so THAT's what it was. I got a total of 5 PMs from Lucas yesterday, drilling me about my vote for Field Marshal and what I thought that candidate's game plan was and how I didn't understand it ;_; On July 31 2009 06:10 L wrote:B) Every day will have special pre-determined conditions that will be announced on the day. These conditions are not game breaking but may be neutral or provide a slight advantage to either side. Discuss what we think is going to come up. As for me, I'm going home soon. Well, conditions have to be ad hoc to the setting. Maybe there'll be a curfew one night (skip 1 night phase), or heavy snow one day that will make any action taken (including RC, a medic protecting someone, following a clue, etc) leave clues behind. | ||
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On July 31 2009 06:26 coltrane wrote: Ok, look... my maths arent wrong Maths are a very powerful tool, but it does seem a bit like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole in this case. From what I gather, Mafia is a deeply social game. You can't predict people's actions with a probability distribution if you have no idea what drives them to take those actions (and those actions certainly aren't chosen randomly). While mathematical analysis of some sort might be helpful (with a LOT of assumptions) to determine how many people of each role there should be, the actual outcome of the game will be determined by things like which players were chosen as mafia, what clues are given and what we make of them. | ||
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On July 31 2009 08:58 Shikyo wrote: So, who are we planning on lynching at this moment? I didn't get if Ace was serious about Vivi57 or not. Who might other possible lynches be? Also, what shall the town's attitude be towards inactivity? Will the inactives be lynched, or is the town planning on rather concentrating on clue analysis and behavioral analysis to catch the Ukrainians? I'm guessing that we'll be wandering around pretty aimlessly until the next morning... not much to work with until then. I don't think anyone can tell any ukranians atm, so the chosen Field Marshal will just lynch someone randomly or someone he dislikes I guess. Which means Ace probably was serious about Vivi57 ^^; I don't see the point to lynching inactives. I guess if there's no one else we might as well, but strong mafia suspects are a much better use of our lynch. We win either by time limit or by killing all the rebels, so killing the bad guys advances both of those goals and should always be our priority. That means we'll need lots of people checking a ton of profiles for clue analysis @_@ Not really sure how to go about doing behavioral analysis, but it's definitely worth trying. | ||
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On July 31 2009 09:56 Vivi57 wrote: Great. I was going to roleclaim as soon as I got home. I'm nkvd. Could have done a shitton more good for the town if you and ace weren't so intent on killing me no matter what. Hm. Losing an NKVD on the first lynch would... suck. Then again, with this roleclaim, maybe the mafia will kill him on the first night anyway. If he doesn't die on the first lynch, is there any way we can tell whether he's telling it true? | ||
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Do we have any idea of how many agents we have left? Or how many rebels, commisars, medics, etc. there are in total? | ||
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Nothing to work with imo. Looks like a pretty innocent mistake to me- and I say mistake because he wouldn't want us to think he's a rebel regardless of what he really is. Doubting anyone on minor stuff like this is a bad idea. Wait until there are clearer signs of suspicious behavior or until you can link a clue to him. | ||
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Get on it, townies. You read RebirthOfLeGenD's spam. There are a few ways to tell it's fake. One of them is to read this thread. Another is, as a ukranian, to RC the spammer to make sure his role comes up as rebel. But RC takes a night. Your homework: Write a PM you would send, as a rebel, to someone you just RC'ed as a rebel. Send a copy of that PM to 10 players at random, addressing them with their name. Townies will know all they get is spam. If half the townies do their homework, each rebel will have 5 spam messages indistinguishable from a legitimate PM from another rebel. If they reply to a townie spammer, they get exposed and lynched. If they don't reply at all, they can never organize and town wins. | ||
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On August 01 2009 17:49 Scaramanga wrote: LYNCH KUJA AND REBIRTH TOMORROW NIGHT AFTER CLAZZ In Soviet Russia, Mission Accomplished actually means Mission Accomplished The spam campaign was originally intended to prevent rebel organization more than to catch rebels. Scaramanga's findings are merely a bonus. Don't slack off townies, you have a duty to the motherland to clog the tubes of the internet with our righteous message! | ||
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Please correct me if I'm wrong on any of this: Attractive targets = frequent posters. If the people who are generating ideas for the town die, we could suffer a significant setback. The rebels who RC'ed a townie on night 1 will probably hit that person, while the rebels who RC'ed another rebel will have to RC again on night 2 and wait until night 3 to start killing stuff. Likely targets: Elemenope Falcynn L Malongo Scaramanga Zato-1 | ||
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On August 02 2009 07:28 L wrote: No, we know that Clazz is desperate because he's going to die tonight. Assuming he's a rebel. | ||
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On August 02 2009 10:46 Siefu wrote: Shouldn't we be thinking about the special condition for Night 2? What is there to think about? I doubt this condition will change anyone's choice of action for night 2. There will no doubt be some analysis to do after we know how many players acted on night 2. | ||
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On August 02 2009 11:06 clazziquai wrote: I don't get it. Three birds with one stone?? I want to know why lynching me does this. Seriously I am so confused =/ Can anyone who knows explain this to me when I'm dead or when the game is over? Hard to tell what he's referring to, specifically. Killing a rebel is clearly one of the 'birds'. The other two are either other rebels he's somehow discovered, or maybe he's talking about all the voting support he got and how he's diminishing his detractors. Or maybe he's bluffing and throwing red herrings around. I wouldn't give this too much thought if I were you. | ||
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On August 02 2009 23:19 Scaramanga wrote: make day/night 36 hours, 48 is just too long and thread goes inactive Agreed. | ||
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On August 03 2009 03:20 Sinensis wrote: This is a good idea.Anyway, I would like to request Ace to compile a list of people he believes would be optimal focuses for rolechecks. On August 03 2009 02:23 L wrote: This is a good observation.People who regularly post blocks of text that don't actually say anything or provide real content are generally trying to fake activity for various reasons. Aside from those two phrases, Sinensis and L's only recent contributions are helping to make this thread a more unreadable. While we do have the Gazetta to provide summaries, I don't feel we should rely on it entirely, which many of us will have to start doing if the (useful posts / total posts) ratio keeps dropping. My suggested NKVD role check list: Sinensis L RebirthOfLeGenD Kuja900 Scamp Last 3 are based on posts from this thread and voting history. I was a bit torn on Elemenope, since he has very few posts with any substance to them. At least they don't pretend to have any substance and they're short and easy to read, so he gets off the hook for now. Scaramanga is an obvious suspect if Kuja and Rebirth turn out to be townies. L is also on my medic cover list so he should be a priority, don't want to waste medic actions on someone who turns out to be a rebel. | ||
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Saving them all for later would be a waste, and since they can't follow clues yet they should use a RC for this night. Just be smart about it! Hm. Kuja might be a sure enough candidate to lynch without a RC. edited for clarity | ||
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On August 03 2009 06:00 ~OpZ~ wrote: Well...Lets see one problem with Zato's post...Voting History? Are you serious? We are going with voting history right now...? Can we even use voting history this game? Mafia don't know who each other are....so what good is voting history? Sorry...That's just mildly or extremely retarded right now to even claim that that can be a factor... Maybe you can use the thread, but vote count is kind of out of the question. Really now? Let's review a list of people who we strongly suspect are rebels at this point: clazziquai Kuja900 RebirthOfLeGenD Two of those voted for L, and one of them for LucasWoJ. L promised to say "Wow I'm good at mafia, pick me!", but he didn't even do that iirc. And this is Lucas' campaign speech: "I'll run for Field Marshall." I'd say that warrants looking at the voting history. | ||
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1. To elect one of their own. 2. To elect someone who wouldn't make for a good Field Marshal. In this game, reason 1 is out of the question as you pointed out, so it would have to be reason 2. The mafia would choose someone they think would make for a lousy Field Marshal and vote for him. "But the mafia can't bandwagon!" you say. If the mafia members can individually come to the same conclusion of who would make for a bad Field Marshal, then you can get something pretty similar to a bandwagon. At the time the campaigning was going on, L was barely active iirc- he only started to post a lot later on. clazziquai, Kuja and Rebirth seemed to think L and Lucas would make for a worse Field Marshal than Ace. Why wouldn't other rebels arrive at the same conclusion? | ||
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Voting lists are hardly good evidence. Very little is, at this point in the game. They're just something to be kept in mind. And if you're wondering, voting lists were a comparatively minor influence on my list- the goings on of this thread had much more weight. | ||
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On August 03 2009 08:16 ~OpZ~ wrote: And don't use indefinite's such as "probably." They really ruin the message you were trying to convey. I normally avoid using them, but in the unlikely scenario that we all magically agree on what NKVD should be posing as, I believe they can still PM Caller and ask to change their disguise. As such, it is not a certainty that further discussion will be fruitless- it is only very probable. | ||
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On August 03 2009 09:34 Caller wrote: Kuja900 Are on the execution watchlist. Guess we don't even have to worry about lynching him now. | ||
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18 hours? :D | ||
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If you're a townie, you can get names of red townies and coordinate us. That's good. If you're a rebel, you get names of red townies and post them publicly for all the other rebels to read freely before we lynch you. That would be disastrous. Your story is nice, but words are wind. Claiming credit for figuring out Clazz and Kuja is just that, claiming credit. It's an interesting plan, but if we go through with it and you turn out to be mafia, we're giving the blues exactly what they need to win. For now, I would suggest townies to keep their roles to themselves. | ||
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On August 04 2009 00:32 Malongo wrote: I claim publicly that im townie. And I didnt get the pm from Ver. i guess im not "that" good. Neither did I. I wonder if he's trolling us with his claim that he PM'ed 40-45 people. | ||
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On August 04 2009 04:32 Malongo wrote: Nah. Ver probably pmd those of who hes sure about his behavior. Makes sense since he doesnt know you and knows im always doing weird crazy stuff. I'm still interested in other people saying whether they got his PM or not. Additional info is helpful when you're trying to make an informed decision. | ||
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On August 07 2009 01:59 chaoser wrote: he means, one mafia comes out by saying he's mafia, tell everyone to send the message they got from caller saying they are mafia. only people who send in a message that has the exact same wording would be mafia Brilliant. But, what happens if this person who comes out happens to have been a townie? Congrats, you've just given a list with all the mafia names to the Town! Ah, but mafia can make sure this person who came out is, in fact, mafia- through a role check at night! (edit: even then it could be an NKVD posing as mafia) Unless, of course, it's not one person claiming to be mafia and asking all mafia to roleclaim to them. It could be five people. In which case mafia can't RC them all and it all degenerates into one, huge mess. No, mafia could not have coordinated before the election. More importantly, mafia doesn't have the benefit of having a channel where they can discuss the wisdom of roleclaiming to someone- unlike the Town. (yes, I know I'm dead >< just posting my thoughts here. I wrote a big post about it in the sticky thread of the mafia forum). | ||
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On August 07 2009 08:10 Caller wrote: You know, for people that haven't even gotten the win conditions yet, you sure are confident Psh, now you're acting like this is your game or something. O wait. Happy Birthday ^^ | ||
Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On August 08 2009 05:40 L wrote: They should have simply skipped rolechecks and went all out rapeshit insane, might lose a few in friendly fire, but the volume of hits they can produce is absolutely prodigious. That might've worked. You know what the mafia needed, badly? Some channel of communication. By this, I mean an equivalent to this thread, where people could anonymously discuss strategy for mafia. The only info source the mafia had was this thread, so we pretty much did what people said they were expecting of us- whatever seemed to make sense. If some mafia came up with an intelligent method for dealing with PM role phishing and contacting each other through PMs safely (and I did, eventually), posting a good tactic for mafia in this thread instantly made you suspicious. I'm not sure what would've been the best way to set this communication channel up. But you can be sure Mafia won't act intelligently if there can be no discussion as to how mafia can act intelligently. | ||
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Chile4253 Posts
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Chile4253 Posts
On August 17 2009 08:14 coltrane wrote: who killed me? I told yoou since day 1, dont trust ace. What? Ace was one of the biggest contributors to the Town. As the field marshal, the most likely way he could die was by getting lynched, so he did his best to stay on the Town's good side, by contributing against the mafia. No one suspects him, and the fewer mafia there are the smaller the chances all his bodyguards get killed. He never did the town any harm. | ||
Zato-1
Chile4253 Posts
On August 17 2009 10:49 Shikyo wrote: If rebels had no victory condition the whole game was just a farce so that you could reveal your amazing nazi idea? Stupid. Aw, that's harsh. My guess is: Caller had some notion of victory conditions but didn't have them set in stone. He felt that the Town outplayed the rebels overall, so towards the end when there were very few players still left and activity was nonexistent, he just decided to end it and hand victory to the side that did better overall. His saying "soviet power wins any way because the Ukrainians are weak" is just him talking as Comrade General Caller, I'm pretty sure. Was a good game Caller, shame about the inactivity towards the end though. | ||
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