[M][N] Holy Guardians - Cpt 3

On July 08 2020 18:25 Jockmcplop wrote:
copcake do you have any suspicions yet??

On July 08 2020 18:32 Jockmcplop wrote:
Maybe i'm just being sadistic and want to pressure shockeyy while he's dealing with a hangover.
Or maybe he's just scum.

On July 08 2020 18:25 Jockmcplop wrote:
cos like, one fake vote without voting in the vote thread is a thing, but two just looks like feigning interest in the thread, and his answer to your question looked like he was just thinking up something random to write instead of trying to continue the conversation in an interesting way that might end up being useful.

On July 08 2020 18:28 Jockmcplop wrote:
I put VE's introduction in the 'let's see how that plays out over day 1' category

On July 08 2020 06:09 VisceraEyes wrote:
RNG vote is RNG, interest in game is townie to me.

That's about it, literally long version.

On July 08 2020 18:47 Jockmcplop wrote:


You don't think someone playing mafia two games in a row would try consciously to approach the game differently?
Or did you mean different specifically in a townie kinda way?

On July 08 2020 18:59 Jockmcplop wrote:


VE has already said he isn't going to post much on day 1 so i don't see how its more useful to go after him than shockeyy tbh.

On July 08 2020 18:54 Jockmcplop wrote:


So why aren't you voting VE?

On July 08 2020 19:09 Jockmcplop wrote:


Like everyone's saying VE is super suspicious but he's got no votes on him and no pressure on him, everyone just wants me to do it for them. Sorry I'm doing my own thing.

On July 08 2020 19:17 Tictock wrote:


Holy Shit you've read some of the Dirk Gently books? I think I only read The Long Dark Tea Time of the Soul
but loved it. Though I don't I've read anything from Douglass Adams I didn't enjoy on some level.

On July 08 2020 19:10 Jockmcplop wrote:


Playing a dangerous game there copcake lolololol

On July 08 2020 19:16 CopCake wrote:


Why?

On July 08 2020 18:56 raynpelikoneet wrote:

Yes, specifically in a townie kind of way.

The thing i find a bit weird in your approach is that in case you're actually interested in VE (who had the total 180 approach on shockeyy than you did -- so basically you should), i dont really know why you're "harassing" shockeyy right now instead of him? Like shockeyy did what he did and his posting so far definitely needs explaining. Which is something shockeyy will do anyways when he returns from the hangover land. Or if he doesn't, he is probably mafia. It's like... You progressed on something that will come out regardless of you asking for it, and left something else just be. Aka, from my pov you focused something useless instead of something useful.

On July 08 2020 23:14 Jockmcplop wrote:

He did?

On July 09 2020 03:25 CopCake wrote:
fos?

On July 09 2020 02:43 ShoCkeyy wrote:
I don't have a circle yet, I am my own circle, and I don't trust anybody to enter my circle just yet. However, I do have a few maybes. Rayn, TT, and yourself seem town this game although rayn and TT were mafia last game >:O ##vote rayn

Jock leans more scum to me and it's not because he voted for me straight up. . . maybe a little, but it's really more about how he "tried" to pressure me while I was gone from posting for the day.

On July 09 2020 03:54 Jockmcplop wrote:


By your own standards i should also be even more suspicious of you now considering you voted me when i was away playing video games for a couple of hours.

On July 08 2020 19:05 raynpelikoneet wrote:

I dont care who posts how much.
- shockeyy needs to explain his shit anyways
- VE doesn't need to explain his shit unless someone asks to
- Based on your posting you should want VE to explain his shit

On July 09 2020 07:32 ShoCkeyy wrote:
My current thoughts are:

Alakaslam (1): VisceraEyes
Shockeyy (1): Jockmcplop
VisceraEyes (1): Tictock
Tictock (1): Copcake
jockmcplop (1): Alakaslam

One of these fuckers are mafia 100%.

I meant the ones voting.

On July 09 2020 17:40 Jockmcplop wrote:

That doesn't make it any more townie in my eyes.
Why trfel over me? He obviously thinks he has a good case on me, because:


Its not just the lack of a reason to vote for trfel but the lack of a reason to stop voting for me which i'm interested in.
Just 'lynch inactives' isn't really good enough when he seemed sure i was mafia and i made zero posts in the meantime.

On July 08 2020 19:31 Tictock wrote:


Nah, like a certain detective I like to have a bigger picture of the game before I throw down a vote.

Though I suppose Trfel is the only one to not post yet and Sho and Slam will probably continue to be Null reads for me for awhile.... Yea I could do the thing.

##Vote: VisceraEyes

On July 09 2020 20:35 Jockmcplop wrote:
Its even weirder because ticktock specifically mentioned chez being in before the game started too.

On June 06 2020 15:51 Trfel wrote:
I dunno Tictock, I'm having trouble getting much useful information from the posts you spoilered. Sorry

But seriously, I don't know why people really think I am mafia here. I can understand not thinking I am town, but I don't understand why everyone is so convinced I am mafia.

Yes, my activity was quite poor earlier. However, I've changed that now. I'm here, I'm present, I'm playing, I'm contributing quality thoughts. That's more than you can say for many of the players in this game.

So what if I find different things interesting than other people? Isn't that the beauty of the game, that different things stick out to different players? What a boring game it would be otherwise. How does that make me mafia?

Yes, my reads can change quickly. If you want meta, that's been a major mark of my town play the past few years (and unfortunately, is one of the main reasons why my lynch % has increased significantly), because I don't spend the time to review every little thing like I used to, so new information/new perspectives readily changes my reads. Fluid reads is generally considered a towny trait, as mafia have trouble changing their reads quickly. Especially when justified.

The one suspicious thing I've done is being wrong on CopCake. Granted, that was quite poor, and for that I (once again) apologize to all. But understand that I was in a rush to try and find something, as voting is mandatory in this game. Look at my play here, trying to analyze all of the possibilities and figure out the best lynch. This is how I play when I have more time and can analyze things more effectively. But in a five minute window or so, I'm not really sure what you expect from me.

I am really hesitant to say this, because saying this was a huge part of why I got lynched last game, but I'm probably not going to be around much tomorrow Which basically paints a huge target on my back saying "here mafia, come and lynch me." But it's unavoidable, I am busy with my family. Which is a lot of why I am spending so much time tonight trying to figure out the best lynch, because I can't tomorrow.

So there. Do whatever you want. But I think I've played a very reasonable game, I think I've put forth a decent scum pool and as time permits I'll keep working to find the mafia. I encourage everyone to re-evaluate and take a look at what I've posted. I encourage those scumreading Vivax to take another look. I am confident that mafia is riding all of the easy Trfel/Vivax scumreads and not justifying them well, just following thread sentiment (because they aren't well-justified reads). If you lynch me, that's on you.

On June 04 2020 04:45 Jockmcplop wrote:


I think this is town shockeyy guys.

On July 09 2020 05:09 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Also people who feel the need to inform they forgot about the game start after this confirmation thing started to happen tend to be mafia.

On July 09 2020 05:44 VisceraEyes wrote:

I'll give you this for free: I'm using little to no meta this game. I'm assuming most of it is trash because I've played so little.

On July 09 2020 02:43 ShoCkeyy wrote:
I don't have a circle yet, I am my own circle, and I don't trust anybody to enter my circle just yet. However, I do have a few maybes. Rayn, TT, and yourself seem town this game although rayn and TT were mafia last game >:O ##vote rayn

Jock leans more scum to me and it's not because he voted for me straight up. . . maybe a little, but it's really more about how he "tried" to pressure me while I was gone from posting for the day.

On July 09 2020 17:25 CopCake wrote:
I am going to wait for him to see his defense but I agree with you on that or at least I like your pov.

On July 11 2020 01:28 Jockmcplop wrote:

If its so unlikely to work why would mafia be doing it? Wouldn't they be better off pushing the wagon that would work?

Anyway i'm trying to push you as the wagon for D2 because I think you're mafia.

On July 11 2020 05:14 CopCake wrote:
Nah, if VE was mafia he would kill rayn on a heart beat I think

Killing TT is a very “Cake” move, or someone who believed rayn would get doctored/jailed/something

So whoever killed TT it is someone very wary of night actions.

On July 11 2020 13:32 Jockmcplop wrote:

I really can't see a world where shockeyy kills Tictock.
I'm gonna have to be convinced to get over that before EoD if you want me on a shockeyy wagon.

On July 11 2020 04:34 ShoCkeyy wrote:


1)You're not really doing much to help imo especially after D1 and N1.



2)My thought would be that VE killed TT for fun, just cause A it would throw people off, and B, probably wanted to see if he can get away with it.

3)The other part that makes VE seem scummy is him voting for Trfel then unvoting for him. He does not state any real reason why he voted for him then switches to Slam for who knows what reason.



In all honesty, VE seems even more scummier than slam at this point.

On July 09 2020 07:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
I mean he did soft-shit on your townread of TT, so there's that, but you didn't even mention that.

On July 09 2020 08:45 VisceraEyes wrote:
##Unvote
##Vote: Trfel

Did you forget again sir?

On July 10 2020 04:22 VisceraEyes wrote:

Combined with my pure town read of Jock based on


this post

I just went with it. I didn't NOT think Trfel was mafia, but I was also fine with Slam being counterwagon etc etc, plz forgive.

On July 10 2020 03:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I don't usually do something like this but now i will. I think in case there is a cop / tracker they should be checking into TT and Jock aka the off-wagon voters. We can figure out the Slam wagon. If you're a tracker you're basically a cop now because the last mafia has to send in the night kill.

On July 10 2020 03:15 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I don't usually do something like this but now i will. I think in case there is a cop / tracker they should be checking into TT and Jock aka the off-wagon voters. We can figure out the Slam wagon. If you're a tracker you're basically a cop now because the last mafia has to send in the night kill.

On July 12 2020 21:24 CopCake wrote:


Like rayn suggest the “tracker” to visit ticktock, why would he kill (as mafia) ticktock and not lets say slam/ve/me/anyone else?

That is stupid. Like he is going to kill the person he told a blue role to check lol.

On July 12 2020 21:54 Jockmcplop wrote:

OK. There's no way i would vote for rayn anyway, but i'm keeping an open mind.

I'm torn between VE and shockeyy right now.
Its probably just shockeyy tbh.

I really didn't like the way VE switched his vote away from shockeyy yesterday, but at the same time shockeyy has been much scummier over the course of the game.

##unvote
##vote: shockeyy

On July 13 2020 01:22 Jockmcplop wrote:


I was gonna say I didn't pay any attention to what trfel was saying when he was basically dead already.

On July 13 2020 01:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:

i dont know, why should i consider you as town and who should i consider as mafia instead?

On July 13 2020 01:29 Jockmcplop wrote:


Wait rayn knows you're town and is acting, and yet he's voting for you and you still don't think he's mafia?

WHAT THE HELL DO YOU THINK RAYN IS DOING?

On July 13 2020 01:33 Jockmcplop wrote:


But it doesn't make sense.
If rayn knows shockeyy is town, and rayn is voting for shockeyy, that makes rayn mafia, no?

On July 13 2020 01:12 raynpelikoneet wrote:

i dont know, why should i consider you as town and who should i consider as mafia instead?

On July 13 2020 01:55 Jockmcplop wrote:
I was the wagon when he voted, I claimed afterwards, but he just came to post his vid and vote and then left immediately.

On July 13 2020 01:57 Jockmcplop wrote:


Before
I only claimed when i hit 3 votes and was in mucho danger.

On July 13 2020 21:41 VisceraEyes wrote:
Idk my brain is flubber over it. Jock playing real quiet since his claim, that's an observation.

On July 13 2020 22:48 Jockmcplop wrote:
And a question for everyone except rayn...
Are we just assuming rayn is town? I struggle with reading him always but it seems like quite a deep assumption among everyone here and I admit to not really getting why. Educate me.

On July 14 2020 02:52 Jockmcplop wrote:
Also the only way rayn could have 'played a perfect game' is if he's mafia because he voted town on day 2.

On July 14 2020 03:11 Jockmcplop wrote:
You engineer a situation where you can paint me as 100% scum because you didn't kill me last night and then you don't vote for me so you can kill me on day 4, when your 'why aren't you dead yet?' argument has an extra day to settle in.

Its so obvious though.

Why would I kill TT night one? I wouldn't, you or chezinu are dangerous to me when i'm scum, i would have killed one of you.

Why would I go for you instead of slam now? That's insane if i'm mafia.

From a town perspective it makes much more sense because slam wouldn't start the day like he did if he's scum.

On July 14 2020 11:32 Jockmcplop wrote:
How does me asking why rayn said VE was mafia make me mafia?
It was stupid, yeah, but you can see why i made that mistake.

Rayn was basically saying i'm lying about everything and then saying he trusts my claim, except i didn't think any deeper than that and realise that VE is clear either way.

Anyway, fuck it idc if i die, just VE please don't assume i'm mafia because rayn will kill you tonight so if you can get some *other* mafia playing than talking about why i'm mafia done in the next few hours it will probably help.

Rayn's got chez in his pocket for lylo anyway so i think the game's lost.

If anyone reads this when i'm dead rayn is mafia.

Can i just say that again, rayn is mafia.

Its rayn.

On July 14 2020 11:57 Jockmcplop wrote:


Probably chezinu because all of that in the last post could apply to chezinu too, but to a lesser degree (ie he was 'less' comfortable at the time of TT's death).

On July 09 2020 08:07 Tictock wrote:
Rayn I don't expect much, but can you throw a bit to help me understand why you feel Chez is town?

I get he is sorta claiming his "character name" but I don't see how that helps identify him as town. As far as I am aware we all received a character for flavor purposes but doesn't determine alignment.

Trfel's only post is hot garbage. Excuse into throwing shade based on what happend in another game.

On July 14 2020 12:08 Jockmcplop wrote:


Just saw this.
Its not exactly a smoking gun.
I know chez has payed close attention to rayn this game. Rayn suggesting we check me/tictock and then chez killing tictock does make alot of sense.

On July 14 2020 12:44 Jockmcplop wrote:
For my part, I hated the way rayn came into today like slam is the lynch but without even the slightest open mind toward me not being mafia. I cant square that circle. It looks pure scum. If there's some ironclad argument from earlier in the game that i'm not getting it coudl do with explaining now.

On July 14 2020 11:54 VisceraEyes wrote:
Like if rayn is mafia, his game wasn't perfect. He idiotically bussed his partner D1, Trfel could've ridden for D1 and came back blazing D2 it happens ALL the time. There's no long-con justification for bussing your partner D1 in mafia it's a numbers game dog.

On July 10 2020 00:13 raynpelikoneet wrote:
Firstly, i have to say that i think there is no reason why Trfel's scumbuddy isn't possibly voting for him right now assuming Trfel is mafia. Votes on him (aside from me and maybe Chezinu?) are basically because he is inactive. That's easy to fix, Trfel just starts posting and you can take off the vote on your scumbuddy. No harm done.

However i actually do think Trfel's post in itself looks like a mafia post. Basically i see Trfel as paerson who investigates things and asks questions because there is some sort of contradiction to his own thought process of how things should go and he tries to figure out what the person thinks and if it makes sense or not. See for example him questioning Cake last game at the start of the game.

This post though:

...doesn't reall show any of this. First of all the whole question i nthe first place about TT is really stupid and shows no thinking behind it at all. Because TT was fucking mafia in the last game!!!! Trfel thinking TT was town last game doesn't mean shit because Trfel was WRONG and if TT is town this game, there FOR SURE is a difference in his play (regardless of if anyone can notice it or not at that point). Like the whole question feels like a throwaway thing based on no thinking at all. It just.... doesn't make any sense to me that THIS is what Trfel has to say when he comes and posts. Coming in late makes it more likely you make mistakes as mafia, and i think Trfel made on here.

Also a smaller point is that yeah, as i said earlier, people who feel the need to tell that they forgot about the game starting (regardless of if it is true or not) are more likely to be mafia. That's a fact. No matter when you start posting there should be no reason for a townie to feel the need to explain why they haven't been posting so far.

On July 03 2019 23:02 raynpelikoneet wrote:
I am not sure if people understand my read on ES, definitely don't understand why some people call it a bad read. My read is based on the fact ES seems (first) to be having an opinion on how Grack plays, then follows the logic further and comes to a conclusion that makes no sense. I can somehow understand this from town perspective still because ES seems to be a player who dumps everything she currently thinks into the thread and possibly can make logical mistakes (reference; the gunsmith game for those who know). That's why i unvoted. I was not sure. But then she did it again with HF. Like she literally said HF is super strong mafia player and then she went on saying if HF is mafia he is just gonna afk and we kill him. That's strike two and noone ever says that as town if the starting point is that HF is ridiculously strong mafia player. If someone has an opinion on someone else's play based on meta they NEVER contradict that opinion straight up as town, i am just not going to believe it.

I am letting Eywa off the hook at least until ES flip because i think ES is mafia, lately Eywa has made sense regardless of if i agree with her or not, and i think bussing would be stupid here, double bussing ridiculously stupid. I don't believe there is any chance they are mafia together and i think ES is scum so there is that.

I had a townread on grack early on because i decided (after his last scumgame) to read him like i read yamato. Grackaroni is quite a low quantity poster. His post early on where he asks kind of a throwaway question on Trfel made me think there is some sort of thought process in his head. I gave him a slight townread for that. When he came back and followed up his stuff he actually DID follow it up and it even made sense. When Grack was mafia he didn't really post anything "bad", in fact he posted all the right things but all that together was some random right things. The bus on Vivax especially threw me off there. There was not really any train of thought seen from his posting, if you get what i mean. rn i think it's different, however i am not fan of Grack's read on ES, especially the reasoning behind his read, because -- just like trfel's -- the reasoning doesn't really make anyone anything, it's a surface level read and easy to make without saying anything wrong, but there is really nothing that should make the opposing player anything. I guess they could be mafia together but i do not want to lynch Grack over ES.

I am not a fan of Trfel at all. I have pretty much no idea what he is doing and what he is trying to achieve. It feels like mafia!disformation-style-of-posting where you say stuff and look like youre thinking about stuff but you don't really say anything or do anything and everyone just ignores you.

Idk if i missed something. I have a friend over at my place so i am trying to read along and i will kick him out at latest 1 hour before deadline to be around.

On July 14 2020 14:54 Jockmcplop wrote:


Slam is town here.
Slam wouldn't 1v1 me as mafia.

its you or rayn.

On July 14 2020 14:54 Jockmcplop wrote:


Slam is town here.
Slam wouldn't 1v1 me as mafia.

its you or rayn.

On July 16 2020 00:00 Jockmcplop wrote:
VE is cleared though.

On July 10 2020 03:12 Tictock wrote:
Yea it's one of Cake/Jock for the final mafia.

Slam is never mafia this game, and Chez is super unlikely as well given that Trfel actually fought a little at the end.

My money is still on Cake though.

On July 10 2020 10:31 Tictock wrote:


No idea why anyone would think you might freak out...

I think Jock is the smart lynch tomorrow. I have a feeling I already know how things will play out though.

On July 18 2020 22:55 Jockmcplop wrote:


This is a different setup, i was roleblocked last night.

On July 18 2020 23:46 Jockmcplop wrote:


Please go look at the voting thread for day 3.
Chez's only concern was survival, right?
I can't see any evidence that he actually cared who was being lynched except that he survives.

You know chez better than me, is that a thing that town chez would do?

On July 18 2020 23:54 Jockmcplop wrote:


Yeah I'm here!

Trying to untangle this mess.

I have to go with my thoughts. Part of me wants to lynch you but i think that has something to do with feeling bad for lynching rayn yesterday.

I think I have to go for chezinu tbh.

His day 3 voting was pretty blatant mafia behaviour imo.

On July 20 2020 06:04 Hapahauli wrote:


Also a good post, and honorable mention for best post in the game.

It is worth looking at the D3 and LYLO lynches in more detail. Observe which players were trying to lynch their reads, often at the expense of their own safety (townies), and which players were trying to blindly stay alive.

Jock's post here is an accurate depiction of how Chez played.