[M][N] Vendée Globe 16' Mafia - Page 9

On February 06 2018 18:29 rsoultin wrote:


Meh. Not really liking this list post. It's defending me without defending me, which is more likely to come from scum, and I like where he's at on df and conv because that's where I'm at, but the default to lynching koshi is just shit-tastic.

Have no reason to anything koshi, so why him over poop soup, for instance?

On February 06 2018 18:48 rsoultin wrote:
I think I want to lynch into conv/rit/mderg today.

Not sure on mocsta...it's hard to tell with someone tunneled on you.

Rayn and truffle are town.

DF...I'm not sure. I see the issue truffle has with him, and it's part of why I'm reading truffle town, but I still think that tonally DF is kinda towny. Relaxed. Also, it doesn't really look like last game where he was scum.

What bugs me about ritoky most is he seems to have a decently strong reason to scumread conversion but isn't pursuing it. If conv ends up being scum, he probably is, too. Actually, he's probably scum anyway. I really don't get the focus on koshi over people who are actually scummy to him.

On February 06 2018 19:45 rsoultin wrote:


^ This is what I'm referring to, ritoky.

You say that you only have 1 and a half strong townreads, but this looks like a scumread to me. Also the only one in your filter at all.

Say you're joking about koshi, and yeah we all know what koshi can be like (though I don't know anything about whether he pushes you all the time or not), I'd still think this would be enough to push Conversion. Only caveat is you're not really doing anything, so not as scummy as say having this read and then pushing someone else. But the doing nothing with it certainly isn't giving me town feels, either.

Didn't someone already ask you why you thought HF was town?

On February 06 2018 20:00 rsoultin wrote:

The problem is if you're town you doing you looks like scum. Can you elaborate on this?

On February 06 2018 20:13 rsoultin wrote:


I get this to an extent because my brother used a similar method, but not with the hands-off approach you're taking. It still bugs me that for someone with limited reads you're not actively doing something about it, even if I can see the different play-style argument of must wait to pressure until x certainty. But you go ahead and be you.

On February 06 2018 20:21 rsoultin wrote:


Just as with holyflare's insistance that he was treating people differently last game based on whether he was at work or not, I have no way to verify this. You'd do better to, as I said, just be you.

I don't think you ever elaborated on your HF read?

On February 06 2018 20:26 rsoultin wrote:


Oh lol >< I do remember you posting that...I guess I just didn't see that as a strong reason to townread someone so it didn't register. To be clear, it's valid enough for D1 or if it happens consistently, but I wouldn't put that much weight on one comment/reaction that lines up.

On February 06 2018 20:35 rsoultin wrote:


I don't disagree with this on principle. I just disagree with one 'mind-meld' equating to it. I've also been burned by my '1 moment irrevocably makes x, x alignment' in the past, on both scum and townreads. We can agree to disagree on it, though.

On February 06 2018 20:36 rsoultin wrote:


Fair, I suppose.

On February 07 2018 18:00 rsoultin wrote:


I read him on emotion and tone...usually related to how he's being pushed. I'd say a bit of a scumlean, though. Even ignoring that he's wrong on me, which is unusual but not impossible, going back through ritoky's filter he's actually been super fluid in his reads and poking in a lot of places. Unless I'm wrong on ritoky, which I actually used to be quite frequently, it bugs me that Ian is scumreading him.

I'd like a more thorough description of why.

Although maybe the easiest way to read him is to just vote him and see how he reacts, lol

On February 07 2018 18:07 rsoultin wrote:


I've read ritoky's filter between the first and the second.

On February 07 2018 18:08 rsoultin wrote:


Read his filter and then tell me you don't see it.

On February 07 2018 18:23 rsoultin wrote:


Not the reads themselves, the overall picture of the game, Joni. I was dubious about him not actively pushing the one scummy read he seemed to have. His explanations were reasonable if unverifiable. I'm allowed to change my mind after rereading his filter (and a bit before, obv, given I unvoted him) -flicks-

On February 07 2018 18:23 rsoultin wrote:


Not talking about the koshi stuff at all. That's also NAI to me. It would be true as either alignment, from both of them. They're babbling about nothing relevant to the game.

On February 07 2018 18:38 rsoultin wrote:
Ritoky posts:

+ Show Spoiler +

These are slightly out of order to show where reads are changing, but that's what I mean by fluid, HF.

On February 07 2018 18:47 rsoultin wrote:


What reads did you think were bullshit from ritoky?

On February 07 2018 19:14 rsoultin wrote:


Because of townreading Rels? I mean, I understand why you think it might be...I forget the word...angling? Hold on, let me pop back into the DF filter.

On February 07 2018 19:24 rsoultin wrote:


:/ You're not supposed to leave, ritoky.

On February 07 2018 21:41 rsoultin wrote:


I'm tempted to sit on you because of ritoky. Your reads still seem to change based on others' reads on you, though. Or at least on people scumreading you. That resembles your scum play to me. If you have town games that show you kinda OMGUS your way through games, could you link one of them, please? I'll follow up eventually if I don't get lynched today, but my bruised ego would prefer a tidy collection of correct reads to leave town with, and I doubt I'll have the time before deadline to pursue that avenue.

On February 07 2018 21:44 rsoultin wrote:


What did you disagree with on my darth foley read? You asked for my filter dive on him (demanded it actually), I quoted where I'd already given it just as I quoted the ritoky posts that had me reading his game as fluid that I'd already given to holyflare when you asked, and you insta-voted me.

So either you have a problem with my read that I'd like explained, or you didn't realize I was quoting where I'd already answered what you were asking for.

On February 07 2018 21:58 rsoultin wrote:


I'm not a big fan of Joni's townread on mderg or the fact that he was (is?) scumreading ritoky for the same reason that I was, but honestly this post probably makes him town. That and I'm generally not getting the 'scream until my target is lynched' vibe that I normally get from a scum Joni - he's still pushing, but taking the time to prod. Caveat here is he knows how I read him and has catered to that before. Caveat to the caveat is if he were scum here he could push me until the cows come home with no one listening to my trying to say he's scum for not involving people, and no one else seems to have that read nailed down on him. So. Still pretty sure he's town. Just being Joni.

On February 07 2018 22:04 rsoultin wrote:


Mostly just inconsistencies and nodding my head to Truffle's posts which gave me warm fuzzies at the time. I was a shameful sheeple.

It wasn't my strongest read at the time. Thus pursuing ritoky. However, ritoky addressed some of my concerns and then Conversion comes to the thread echoing a sentiment you'd just posted...something about me not doing anything about my scumreads. Then posted that well I'd poked at ritoky but that didn't mean anything because he didn't see what I'd gotten from it. Maybe it was an emotional reaction at the time, but it looked to me like he hadn't actually read what I'd posted since he'd left, then realized his mistake and posted to acknolwedge it before he could be called out on it, but still stick to his read.

In effect, though, even if that's true it still could have come from town. I'm just bad.

On February 07 2018 22:49 rsoultin wrote:
There are glimmers of something in mderg's filter until the list post, which is mostly nulullllullululull.

I was gonna bother but you know what?

Truffle felt town to me most of the game until the reversal on Conversion's case. It's not even that Conversion's case was bad, because it wasn't; it's that it touched on the sort of intangibles that the Truffle of years ago didn't tend to find compelling. I think he's still town but don't give him a free pass.

Holyflare is whatever the fuck. I can never tell even when I care.

And I'm sure you all will blame me when you inevitably lynch me tonight after I bugger off for the rest of the day, but personally I only hold myself responsible for the beginning of the day when I was being a bit of a snit. At some point this game just isn't worth it anymore.

Voting mderg.

Don't want to vote DF without talking to ritoky about his read first.

On February 08 2018 02:31 rsoultin wrote:
As for the truffle read, it's just that he used to have a tendency to focus on tangibles more than intangibles. By that I mean inconsistencies between actions and words, or words and words, kind of like he's still doing throughout the game. So it's actually unusual (but only weakly so given this is a years' old meta read as both he and I have said) that someone posting about intangibles about how I feel within the game vs how I feel within other games would be that convincing to him. Townreading you for it is completely within expectations and he should anyway because he's awesome like me except when I'm not.

@Truffle, that's because Conversion wasn't my main scumread when I was voting ritoky. You have the timing off, perhaps because I poorly communicated it.

I was talking about the point in the game when I posted the below post:

On February 08 2018 03:28 rsoultin wrote:


Although that does remind me that I did actually have a question for you.

I think ritoky looks good this game. He and Joni are probably my biggest townreads. So what is it that you don't like about ritoky?

On February 08 2018 04:19 rsoultin wrote:


Fair. It was partially curiosity and partially because I think that you being wrong on both me and ritoky as town would be pretty unlikely. Probably a little more curiosity because you posted something that I think you'd probably never post as scum. But I'm really not sure who it is that you actually want to lynch right now?

On February 08 2018 04:25 rsoultin wrote:
@df

And you can adjust the 'tempted' part to I'm resistant to lynching you today because of ritoky.

On February 08 2018 04:44 rsoultin wrote:
I don't have a better vote than prplhz, and I'm not convinced on that either.

But I don't want to lynch mderg and I want to discuss darth foley with ritoky so yolo \o/

On February 08 2018 04:45 rsoultin wrote:


Oh, yeah that. That was pretty shit actually lol. Half of it was based on this idea that my ritoky scumread was an association read.

On February 08 2018 04:47 rsoultin wrote:


Like you honestly could have said the same thing just by saying I didn't have a clear scumread on Conversion. Quoting the posts where I was talking about poking him for a joke and talking about ritoky not pursuing the one read that appeared to actually be a scumread of his is pretty disingenous.

On February 08 2018 07:27 rsoultin wrote:


I wanted ritoky's take on darth foley. Beyond that it was mostly nullish reads, so yeah -shrugs-

On February 08 2018 17:49 rsoultin wrote:

You might be right actually.

I really don't see a scum Damdred though. The way he whined for my attention is just not something I see him doing when he knows how well I read him. Also, his vote on me makes just as little sense.

I could see one scum between df/rayn assuming I was wrong on rayn, but not both. If Joni is scum the df lynch would be trying to push someone when the lynch on me started losing traction. I don't think they can ever be scum together.

Your point on disinfo was good. I was liking him alright because it seemed like the lynch energized him, and hadn't thought about him following the game before.

That just puts him at null though. Also kinda liking prp.

Hf is always town here. Still like ritoky.

If koshi is scum he's pocketed me so hard lol.

You're posting smart truffle thoughts.

As for mocsta...he's probably just town but I don't think I'll ever be sure of him.

So in short unless I'm forgetting someone I must be wrong on my reads somewhere.

On February 08 2018 20:09 rsoultin wrote:

I actually think scumming with mocsta would be super fun. All kinds of crazy shit going down.

On February 06 2018 11:59 ritoky wrote:
hf town
not lynching mocsta today
rsoul prob town

df hot and cold

conv kinda poop soup

lynch koshi

On February 06 2018 12:15 ritoky wrote:


i looked at her first 10 posts and they had less than 10 emoticons or typed emoticons in them. thus she is likely town.

On February 06 2018 20:11 ritoky wrote:


i mean i was confident until you told me she got nailed for it last game, then i looked and it was kinda true; so i lost some confidence in it. i was banking on using the read i invented years ago to get a sneakster read, but it appears people still plagiarize my reads shamelessly.

trfel took a quote out of context pretty bad, so he doesn't get to sit at the table anymore.

On February 07 2018 08:05 ritoky wrote:
I understand and agree with your point about rsoul HF. I also don't know who she thinks is actually scum after all that posting. However when I was talking with her last night, she seemed genuinely confused about my alignment and posting. It didn't feel like it was coming from a place of certainty or agenda. So I am inclined to think she isn't red even though the vast majority of her filter is defensive.

On February 07 2018 18:48 ritoky wrote:
i am pretty sold on:
holyflare
rayn
darthfoley

then like next tier is probably:
rsoul
trfel

then there's a lot of confusion

then probably bottom tier is:
damdred
mderg

On February 08 2018 06:46 ritoky wrote:
casually lynching mafia on my birthday.

framer implies cop. cop should be on rsoul, green gives us 6 or 7 confirmed. red gives us 2 mafia in 2 days; both are pretty unlosable scenarios.

gonna try to finish my nap before birthday dinner, cya tomorrow.

On February 08 2018 11:59 ritoky wrote:
also if you're a normal cop. don't listen to koshi, listen to me and check rsoul. split vote day 1, check da other person. like i said, if it is red mvm and 2 mafia in 2 days. if it is green you're looking at like 6 confirmed. if you're a parity cop, do w/e the fuk u want.

On February 08 2018 12:06 ritoky wrote:
@rsoul idk what is important about my df read?

the guy looked at his alignment, saw a post of a guy claiming the same nationality, and generated a read from it. either you believe it is so asininely stupid that it comes from town; or you believe it is an angle shot trying to garner info from role pms to inform game reads.

i think it was the latter, and from my experience i have only seen 4 other angle shot reads on this forum (1 by me, 1 by robik, 1 by geript, and 1 i don't remember who) and all have been town.

if you want to talk tonality, i make the "fuck you" read all the time. people who tell others to go fuck themselves rather than pander or beg in a decent amount of circumstances read town to me. because mafia tend to be image conscious whereas townies want to get in there and rumble.

On February 08 2018 12:27 ritoky wrote:


well i am not lynching any1 who lynched mafia tomorrow or considering their alignment unless we wake up to a cop saying "rsoul is red". i don't really think it was mvm, i think it was mvt.

i think koshi is probably lock town regardless of rsouls alignment.
i think i am pretty much lock town.
i think df is pretty much lock town, but i doubt others will find my reason compelling.

the people who didn't lynch mafia i don't have strong inclinations toward yet.

i am of 2 minds on rayn. the read he made on me he once made on me in an obs qt where he convinced the entire obs i was mafia in the f3 only to see me lynch the mafia and win, so i know it is a read he has made before from a neutral perspective (and maybe once in a game) so i read it as pretty normal and town. but then he kinda avoids mderg weirdly from what i remember considering i feel like rayn would normally just dump on him cuz he was basically an afk. but then rayn isn't the type of mafia to save his drowning teammates. but then rayn had a good excuse to stay away from drowning mderg as leader of opposing wagon. so idk that's my mind for him.

damdred kinda negative on him. the read wasn't really cuz he was wrong about me....it was more cuz it felt obligatory rather than a read he wanted/cared about making.

all i remember about prp is calling me town when other people weren't....so i might be misted.

you and rels slot i feel the least about at this point. i know i kinda didn't like you earlier but i mostly forgot why.

On February 09 2018 22:03 ritoky wrote:
also i am pissed at the cop for not claiming with a check on rsoul from what i saw.

if you're a parody cop i forgive you slightly

On February 11 2018 11:34 ritoky wrote:
well, that 0% correct rsoul read streak stays alive. some things never change.