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So the mission failed after all.
Now before we even knew if the mission was going to fail we had our two prominent nayvoters EC and super appear back into the game and post as if it were day one.
For me that is way too big a coincidence to happen for both players. Sure I know I am the prime suspect of a spy for pretty much everyone in this game but neither of them posted that much after the first mission was approved and sent out (with me in the team). They only started talking so much when the 4man team was approved. Now of course they will cry vote analysis for this reason but my counter to that is they nayvoted the previous 3 man team too and yet they did not bother to cause such an uproar at that time.
So EC, super: tell us why the 4 man team bothered you so much but the 3 man team you let pass quite easily without much rejections?
Also I think SL and TW are still owing us explanations for yayvoting the 4man team although the team had people they accuse of being a spy.
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On February 08 2017 16:42 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +
First it was RT+sharkie, now it is Grack+sharkie? You keep pulling out these combos out of nowhere even though they make completely no sense? Next if silver were to defend me and accuse you, would you create a silver+sharkie combo?
Do you know the difference between OR and AND? I have my doubts.
Are you using '+' as OR? If so, apologies then...
I use '+' as AND...
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On February 08 2017 17:38 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On February 08 2017 16:44 sharkie wrote:
So the mission failed after all.
Now before we even knew if the mission was going to fail we had our two prominent nayvoters EC and super appear back into the game and post as if it were day one.
For me that is way too big a coincidence to happen for both players. Sure I know I am the prime suspect of a spy for pretty much everyone in this game but neither of them posted that much after the first mission was approved and sent out (with me in the team). They only started talking so much when the 4man team was approved. Now of course they will cry vote analysis for this reason but my counter to that is they nayvoted the previous 3 man team too and yet they did not bother to cause such an uproar at that time.
So EC, super: tell us why the 4 man team bothered you so much but the 3 man team you let pass quite easily without much rejections?
Also I think SL and TW are still owing us explanations for yayvoting the 4man team although the team had people they accuse of being a spy.
I had just voted the same team minus artanis and it passed...
On February 08 2017 17:40 sicklucker wrote:
most importantly why did you not have the same obvious conclusion as me sharkie since you voted the same team minus artanis. who would you have had over artanis? was artanis really that big of a difference that you voted no on a team you just voted yes?
Vivax was on the team, not artanis...
Also I explained my vote yesterday.
Sicklucker if you don't even know who was on the previous team no one will even consider voting yay for your team... You are so out of the game it's not even funny anymore..
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What is wrong with you all?
Suddenly Grack is everyone's favourite guy to hit upon? How can anyone turn from most trusted guy (wanted on the team by literally everyone) to the dumping ground of mistrust. And the most surprising thing out of all is how vivax and RT totally forgot their vendetta with each other and suddenly are best buddies (not saying that both of them are spies). I don't think I have ever seen anyone jump up so high in trust as vivax did while being in a failed mission.
Everyone can imagine Grack being the mastermind from the shadows, manipulating everyone from day one. Yesterday most didn't even bother listening to what I was saying how good spies don't play it the conventional way and you believed that I have to be obvious spy 100% (with the exception of RT). If you can consider Grack being a spy then surely silver can be a spy too (not saying that they are but has to be kept in mind). Way too many people are ganging up on Grack (math wise).
Also I even read how SL could be a possible resistance player, now that is one thing I cannot imagine at all. That guy doesn't care one bit about what is happening in the game. He doesn't even know who was sent out for the second mission..
Now I expect I get shit for defending Grack just like RT did yesterday for defending me...
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On February 09 2017 06:05 sicklucker wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2017 00:47 sharkie wrote:
What is wrong with you all?
Suddenly Grack is everyone's favourite guy to hit upon? How can anyone turn from most trusted guy (wanted on the team by literally everyone) to the dumping ground of mistrust. And the most surprising thing out of all is how vivax and RT totally forgot their vendetta with each other and suddenly are best buddies (not saying that both of them are spies). I don't think I have ever seen anyone jump up so high in trust as vivax did while being in a failed mission.
Everyone can imagine Grack being the mastermind from the shadows, manipulating everyone from day one. Yesterday most didn't even bother listening to what I was saying how good spies don't play it the conventional way and you believed that I have to be obvious spy 100% (with the exception of RT). If you can consider Grack being a spy then surely silver can be a spy too (not saying that they are but has to be kept in mind). Way too many people are ganging up on Grack (math wise).
Also I even read how SL could be a possible resistance player, now that is one thing I cannot imagine at all. That guy doesn't care one bit about what is happening in the game. He doesn't even know who was sent out for the second mission..
Now I expect I get shit for defending Grack just like RT did yesterday for defending me... vivax was not on a failed mission....
On February 07 2017 07:00 Rels wrote:
The team consisting of Grackaroni, sharkie, Silverika, Vivax has been approved.
Votes for: Grackaroni, RtaniSoul, sicklucker, Silverika, Tumblewood, Vivax.
Votes against: emperorchampion, sharkie, Superbia.
The team will now embark on the mission. If there are any spies on the mission team, they may sabotage the mission by PM to all hosts with ##sabotage.
Deadline/Mission results on Tuesday, Feb 07 10:00pm GMT (GMT+00:00) in .
Dude, pay attention to the game!!!
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I still disagree with the fact that one of us three are spies. I find it ridiculous how in the positions all three of us were that none tried to abuse the fact to sabotage the mission. I find it much more likely that vivax is in a team full of incompetent spies and tried to solo carry the team to victory. And if we consider how many incompetent players we actually do have in this game (ec, tw, sl, super half of the game) is this really so far fetched?
I disliked his stance of trying to create a rt/sharkie combo and then his sudden switch from grack being his best townbuddy to suddenly rt being his best townbuddy or is that normal play here on this forum when you get accused of being a spy that you turn 180 degrees on him? If that were the case, do people expect me to accuse silver, vivax, grack, sl, tw, super,ec spies since they at one point in the game tried to frame me for being spy?
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On February 09 2017 06:40 sicklucker wrote:
sharkie and ec* like the rest i kind of expect to vote how they did as either alignment
So in what world are ec's votes weird but Super's are expected (*hint* they completely voted the same way the last two missions).
I don't care whether someone thinks sicklucker is a resistance member by process of elimination or by his non-caring attitude of the game. For me both him and TW have shown us several times that they neither read our posts nor even pay attention to who was sent to which mission. Even if one or both of them are resistance players and we lose because I refused to put them on a mission I don't care. At this point I'd rather have vivax (who is a spy in my eyes) in my team than one of those two. Also, I am saying if resistance is going to lose the game I will blame SL and TW on the loss. I have never seen someone care so little about a resistance game that they actively refuse to participate in our discussions or even PAY ATTENTION to what is happening in the game. Stop pouting and do something ffs.
Also, I don't know how your gaming groups work but each time I play resistance with my friends they completely mix up their playstyle from game to game. I could never say "x is not a spy because that is not how he plays as spy/resistance". Citing old games is like giving your opposing players a fake alibi imo. "Here, look: that is how I usually play resistance -> I could never be a spy".
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On February 09 2017 16:10 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie-we gave those scum games cuz grackeroni asked.
That is true. I cannot give you negative points for something Grack had asked you to link.
I am just a player who goes into The resistance with a clean plate all the time. I look how players play THIS game and don't think of old games at all. So each time one of you mention that vivax is not the sort of player to do "X" my suspicion of him grows. Because what would be the best play as a spy? Exactly, play like you have never played before. That throws you off completely. I wish I had the assistance of players who have clean slates like me to help analyse vivax. From a neutral point of view everything Grack has said makes complete sense to me and is not the play of a spy.
My biggest point in favour of Grack is: he defended me (that I don't care about personally) and accused a completely new combination of spies (rtani + vivax). Why should any spy do that? He could have just joined the cool guys (silver and vivax) into bullying sharkie and rt as spies and just enjoy his status as top resistance player. But he didn't do that! No way any spy would ever do such a play. That is self suicidal. You really expect a seasoned player like Grack to
1) Don't fail the first mission to gain credibility in order to prepare for a bigger con.
-> Yes, absolutely. That is very good spy play!!
2) After 1, throw everything into the wind and go defend sharkie and accuse vivax/RT
-> No way in hell, not even a n00b player would do that.
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First regarding vivax: Just regard his first few posts.
On January 27 2017 00:58 Vivax wrote:
I'm thinking that maybe the first nomination should immediately pass without a 24 hours discussion phase. That way we actually have something to discuss, the outcome, as there is no lynching and otherwise we will just be talking about who should go on a mission without any actual arguments to support a decision.
Like in voice I think no one was intent to oppose anyone on the first team anyway, when we played. It was mostly just seeing if it fails or not, there wasn't anything to discuss.
On January 28 2017 05:24 Vivax wrote:
I'm very comfy with nay saying until I get a better grip on the game..
On January 30 2017 08:47 Vivax wrote:
I'm blatantly advertising this team so we actually get something to pass at some point and if you have issues with any of its members speak up.
First he starts with "lets's just auto-accept the first nomination as that doesn't matter at all". Then he nays the first team and mentions that he has no problem with the nay voting game at all and he can keep doing that for a while. Then he is suddenly fed up with the nay-saying and wants that we all yay a team. Nothing too suspicious but for me it is just one of the things that pile up.
Next thing is how he regards people. He used to be always very suspicious of Grack and has for a long while even considered him a spy. But then he nominates a team which has not only me but also Grack in the team, also putting me into the team was done almost offhandedly. Also he never really explained at that time why he suddenly stopped suspecting Grack. Then the first mission passed and Grack is top resistance for him together with silver and the obvious spy has to be me. Not only that, rt and me have become a spy combo based on accusations that barely made sense. Each post I made to defend myself he just ignored and practically defended with "you have to be a spy, I ignore the rest of what you say."
But then he loses the support of Grack (support he actually never really had but vivax and you, silver, kept repeating that he has to frame me of spy) and rt and he become best buddies out of nowhere and Grack is the obvious spy (with a smaller suspicion of me). He keeps switching suspicions around as he thinks they suit HIM the best.
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On February 09 2017 18:01 Silverika wrote:
Actually sharkie, you told us earlier not to judge anyone based on what a spy should or shouldn't do but base our reads on their play. So I'd actually like you to explain why you are so hardcore defending and townreading grack when earlier in the game you were questioning why he was being put up for so many missions. Also, you have to understand that we don't all play like you and your friends and you should stop comparing the two.
~SW
I get that. I just don't believe that any of the 3man mission had a spy in it and vivas has to be the saboteur.
On February 09 2017 18:03 Silverika wrote:
*hardcore defending grack based on what a spy should or shouldn't do
Also, weren't you the one who said spies can resistance read a person and we shouldn't be townreading a person based on their read on us? Didn't you just do that with grack?
~SW
No I did not. I even mentioned it in parentheses that Grack defending me has nothing to do with my stance of him. o.O Don't accuse me of things I didn't do...
On February 09 2017 18:22 Silverika wrote:
Basically sharkie why aren't you holding yourself to the same standard as you put forth for the rest of us?
~SW
As explained above I do nothing of the things you just accused me...
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Also Grack's suicide defense of me and accusation of vivax completely makes no sense at all if he were a spy. What kind of meta would that be? Reverse- reverse psychology or what?
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On February 09 2017 19:17 Silverika wrote:
So grack being a townread based on his defense of you being suicidal goes against you saying we shouldn't townread people based on how a spy would or wouldn't behave.
Anyway, I'm gonna have to pull quotes since you are accusing me of saying you are doing things you aren't. I'm mobile posting and will have to do it later.
~SW
I'll do it for you.
On February 09 2017 18:03 Silverika wrote:
*hardcore defending grack based on what a spy should or shouldn't do
Also, weren't you the one who said spies can resistance read a person and we shouldn't be townreading a person based on their read on us? Didn't you just do that with grack?
~SW
On February 09 2017 16:38 sharkie wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2017 16:10 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie-we gave those scum games cuz grackeroni asked.
That is true. I cannot give you negative points for something Grack had asked you to link. I am just a player who goes into The resistance with a clean plate all the time. I look how players play THIS game and don't think of old games at all. So each time one of you mention that vivax is not the sort of player to do "X" my suspicion of him grows. Because what would be the best play as a spy? Exactly, play like you have never played before. That throws you off completely. I wish I had the assistance of players who have clean slates like me to help analyse vivax. From a neutral point of view everything Grack has said makes complete sense to me and is not the play of a spy. My biggest point in favour of Grack is: he defended me (that I don't care about personally) and accused a completely new combination of spies (rtani + vivax). Why should any spy do that? He could have just joined the cool guys (silver and vivax) into bullying sharkie and rt as spies and just enjoy his status as top resistance player. But he didn't do that! No way any spy would ever do such a play. That is self suicidal. You really expect a seasoned player like Grack to 1) Don't fail the first mission to gain credibility in order to prepare for a bigger con. -> Yes, absolutely. That is very good spy play!! 2) After 1, throw everything into the wind and go defend sharkie and accuse vivax/RT -> No way in hell, not even a n00b player would do that.
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Also my main point of all the things I posted is not defending Grack as resistance. It is that no one considers vivax a spy at all. I can understand that you don't want to believe in a good Grack anymore but how does that make vivax automatically a resistance player?!
And don't come to me with crap about how his past play proves that he is not that kind of player. Or how he has played makes no sense of spy play. WELL HELLO THERE neither does Grack's play.
But Grack is an obvious spy -> Vivax is not?!
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On February 09 2017 19:29 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie I have two comments to your big post.
First, did Vivax have suspicion of grack all game and can you quote that? I thought they were townreading each other until grack turned on Vivax.
But the number one most important thing I want you to address and is the biggest reason ika and I don't think he's a spy is:
-He put forward an all Town team as a spy and left himself off when he easily could of added himself.
-He risks ika and I adding another Town member to the team-he has no way of knowing we would pick him and make a gamethrowing mistake as a spy.
Just why would any spy do that?
~SW
1)
On January 30 2017 04:40 Vivax wrote:
I'm rejecting the team cuz superbia and silverika aren't on it. They are my strongest reads.
I'm requesting calix and SL to step up activity, I can't read them for crap like this.
I also very much like rtanisouls list except that superbia would be higher in mine, and grack is more of a null for the point he made about tumblewood which seemed perceptive to me, but can come from spies as well I guess.
Here's my suggestion that doesn't have me in it.
superbia/silverika/tumble
My next step would be to ask rtanisoul if they're fine with this.
Grack was null point for vivax, not resistance
On February 03 2017 19:59 Vivax wrote:
I'm more concerned about Grack tbh, mostly cause all his latest suggestions include him or TW, and cause I haven't seen him in a while which suggests he's happy with the status quo.
Ikawolf I think is indisputably town.
Sharkie is innocent child.
Need Grack to get in here and make me believe that approving this is great with him on the team. And cause I want to see his updated TW standing.
On February 03 2017 22:34 Vivax wrote:
K guess I'm fine with just treating SL as perma scum then.
I'm approving and just yoloing past my second thoughts on grack.
Vivax is suspicious of Grack but still includes him in the team because?
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On February 09 2017 19:29 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie I have two comments to your big post.
First, did Vivax have suspicion of grack all game and can you quote that? I thought they were townreading each other until grack turned on Vivax.
But the number one most important thing I want you to address and is the biggest reason ika and I don't think he's a spy is:
-He put forward an all Town team as a spy and left himself off when he easily could of added himself.
-He risks ika and I adding another Town member to the team-he has no way of knowing we would pick him and make a gamethrowing mistake as a spy.
Just why would any spy do that?
~SW
Regarding 2)
- he added before the game started not to put himself on the team, he CAN'T go back on his word. If he does, he is AUTOMATICALLY a spy to everyone I hope?
- What risk? He even asked you what team you would suggest to put up. He practically said "I trust you what you do. Tell me what to do" Don't tell me that didn't give him bonus points in your view. As you can see not including himself gained him massive resistance points from everyone with the exception of me.
- Why? Because his spy teammates suck.
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On February 09 2017 19:30 Silverika wrote:
You mention it's the biggest point though, it's irrelevant that you don't care for it. You mentioned it twice.
If you think it should not be a reason you should not mention it.
I mention it only because not mentioning it would be withholding information about what has happened.
If I didn't mention his defense of me I bet you that there would be at least one person who would say "oh sharkie, you defend grack only because he defended you. Why don't you mention that he defended you?"
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What is PoE and bussing?
On February 09 2017 19:57 RtaniSoul wrote:
sharkie, level with me, is your biggest issue with people suspecting grack that you think too many people are?
No, it's that vivax is getting a free pass.
On February 09 2017 20:03 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie let me try this approach as well: you think both can be scum yes?
How about you show a logical conclusion on why it must be the case and explain why scum!vivax would cast shade on his teammate scum!grack
Cus the point that's gonna be argued is that they are playing in a suboptimal format by doing so are they not?
I don't think both of them spies. That's way too deep of a level. That is like considering that you are a spy.
On February 09 2017 20:34 Vivax wrote:
Well RtaniSoul gets an easy townread now.
I don't even know what all the fuss is about me sharkie is making, I asked him a clear question: Which team do you think would succeed, and since he's so convinced Grack is not mafia, would he still think that if the team failed without me on it and for example rtanisoul instead?
Right now he's just flailing at me getting TR and grack scumread. What point is there, where does he want to lead? Just don't add me on the team then or don't approve teams with me on it, I'm perfectly fine not being on a team as long as I think it will succeed. But with what you're doing you aren't providing solutions.
No, I don't think the team had failed if we had rtanisoul on it. But then we would probably also have gotten more nayvotes (including yours). But I can't prove anything.
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On February 09 2017 22:42 RtaniSoul wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2017 22:34 sharkie wrote:What is PoE and bussing? On February 09 2017 19:57 RtaniSoul wrote:
sharkie, level with me, is your biggest issue with people suspecting grack that you think too many people are? No, it's that vivax is getting a free pass. On February 09 2017 20:03 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie let me try this approach as well: you think both can be scum yes?
How about you show a logical conclusion on why it must be the case and explain why scum!vivax would cast shade on his teammate scum!grack
Cus the point that's gonna be argued is that they are playing in a suboptimal format by doing so are they not? I don't think both of them spies. That's way too deep of a level. That is like considering that you are a spy. On February 09 2017 20:34 Vivax wrote:
Well RtaniSoul gets an easy townread now.
I don't even know what all the fuss is about me sharkie is making, I asked him a clear question: Which team do you think would succeed, and since he's so convinced Grack is not mafia, would he still think that if the team failed without me on it and for example rtanisoul instead?
Right now he's just flailing at me getting TR and grack scumread. What point is there, where does he want to lead? Just don't add me on the team then or don't approve teams with me on it, I'm perfectly fine not being on a team as long as I think it will succeed. But with what you're doing you aren't providing solutions. No, I don't think the team had failed if we had rtanisoul on it. But then we would probably also have gotten more nayvotes (including yours). But I can't prove anything. PoE is Process of Elimination. And trust me, we haven't given Vivax a free pass. You mentioned people can change their play and I agree that there's a few things that people can change, but a lot of things are things people do subconsciously or just really don't fit into their personality and would never come up with. I believe I'm familiar enough with Vivax that this is the case for him. We also really don't see a situation in which Vivax is a spy without one of you/silver/grack being a spy simply because the risk of losing outright after that if silver decides to put me on the mission next, which given his reads was a very likely option.
In the end silver and you don't believe vivax is the spy because he is not the type of player to make such risky play isn't that true? Obviously, it is not the only reason but it is a big reason.
As a neutral player I do not have this prejudice, do you understand how for me this can be a very likely possibility?
(And silver did not put you in the team though. In fact it was never in discussion because I had suggested it but both vivax and silver declined my suggestion and then started to bombard us with spy accusations.)
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On February 09 2017 23:00 RtaniSoul wrote:Show nested quote +On February 09 2017 22:57 sharkie wrote:On February 09 2017 22:42 RtaniSoul wrote:On February 09 2017 22:34 sharkie wrote:What is PoE and bussing? On February 09 2017 19:57 RtaniSoul wrote:
sharkie, level with me, is your biggest issue with people suspecting grack that you think too many people are? No, it's that vivax is getting a free pass. On February 09 2017 20:03 Silverika wrote:
Sharkie let me try this approach as well: you think both can be scum yes?
How about you show a logical conclusion on why it must be the case and explain why scum!vivax would cast shade on his teammate scum!grack
Cus the point that's gonna be argued is that they are playing in a suboptimal format by doing so are they not? I don't think both of them spies. That's way too deep of a level. That is like considering that you are a spy. On February 09 2017 20:34 Vivax wrote:
Well RtaniSoul gets an easy townread now.
I don't even know what all the fuss is about me sharkie is making, I asked him a clear question: Which team do you think would succeed, and since he's so convinced Grack is not mafia, would he still think that if the team failed without me on it and for example rtanisoul instead?
Right now he's just flailing at me getting TR and grack scumread. What point is there, where does he want to lead? Just don't add me on the team then or don't approve teams with me on it, I'm perfectly fine not being on a team as long as I think it will succeed. But with what you're doing you aren't providing solutions. No, I don't think the team had failed if we had rtanisoul on it. But then we would probably also have gotten more nayvotes (including yours). But I can't prove anything. PoE is Process of Elimination. And trust me, we haven't given Vivax a free pass. You mentioned people can change their play and I agree that there's a few things that people can change, but a lot of things are things people do subconsciously or just really don't fit into their personality and would never come up with. I believe I'm familiar enough with Vivax that this is the case for him. We also really don't see a situation in which Vivax is a spy without one of you/silver/grack being a spy simply because the risk of losing outright after that if silver decides to put me on the mission next, which given his reads was a very likely option. In the end silver and you don't believe vivax is the spy because he is not the type of player to make such risky play isn't that true? Obviously, it is not the only reason but it is a big reason. As a neutral player I do not have this prejudice, do you understand how for me this can be a very likely possibility? (And silver did not put you in the team though. In fact it was never in discussion because I had suggested it but both vivax and silver declined my suggestion and then started to bombard us with spy accusations.) On one hand, I do understand. On the other, I feel like Vivax has made a bunch of plays much less likely to come from a spy than Grack has. Mainly the not putting himself on a mission (you mention he said he wouldn't from the start, my argument would be why would he bring it up to begin with? Plus you can backtrack on your words anyway like Grack has regarding not mentioning what he'd vote for) and the whole play with switching me in for you when he was widely townread that didn't make much sense. As for silver not putting me on the mission: At the time when Vivax made the nomination, it was impossible for him to know that. It would be a very big gamble if he were mafia. I don't think these suspicions were loud enough at the time Vivax nominated his mission that he could be reasonably certain he'd be picked for the next mission instead of us but I could be misremembering.
So your answer is practically yes but you don't want to admit it. XD
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Since I am running out of people to add in the team, currently if I had to nominate a team I'd propose: RtaniSoul/Sharkie/Silverika/Super
I cannot add vivax as he is my prime suspect and if I add Grack the team won't happen anyway. And out of all lazy players super seems the most likely candidate for resistance I guess?
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EPT
