EPTTime to try this stupid and rage-inducing game again. Maybe I can even be decently active this time.
Newbie Student Mafia XVIII
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mderg
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Time to try this stupid and rage-inducing game again. Maybe I can even be decently active this time. | ||
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mderg
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not blue doesn't equal vt  | ||
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boring lynching you would be much more fun | ||
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On December 29 2015 08:07 GlowingBear wrote: You're the quickest townread I have ever had! Hi! Welcome to the forums! Kush is nooniasoong. This account he is using is actually a smurf. Every time I talk about kush, I am talking about nooniasoong. Don't worry with meta. I think most of us in this thread doesn't use it. But we may talk about past games. It won't take much part of the game, so you can relax How did you get a townread on him for that post? | ||
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On December 29 2015 08:25 GlowingBear wrote: Pretty much sincere opening with him giving an opinion right away on what he likes. Sounds like someone who feels free to play the game without concern of how he looks. Looked more like a "Look, Im playing the game" type of opening to me | ||
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On December 29 2015 09:08 NocturneMage wrote: Greetings everybody! We're going to start the day by getting rid of obvious scum. And by obvious scum, I mean the dota players. Because as we all know Dota is a shitty game played by shitty people so it's never too soon to start taking out the trash! ##vote Fidei86 Fidei is the worst of them all, as he's openly admitted pre-game, he steals my wife on a regular basis playing dota with her in the evenings. After Fidei, we plow through Onegu who I understand plays with her on occassion and then we take out GlowingBear who has told me in a previous scum qt (newbie 13) that he wouldn't coach me because I'm a League player.  Welp. EZ game EZ lyfe get rekt scum. You're a league player? ##Vote: NocturneMage | ||
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People are quick to jump on GB, I like that because his opening was fishy but I also don't like it because it feels too easy. I'll have to see how that continues. Don't like GiygaS so far... Has made like 7 posts but I didn't see anything of substance. The fist reads also don't really seem that strong. I have a slight townread on NocturneMage, he's being out there and being open about his thoughts. He's also asking lots of questions which makes me think he's trying to solve the game. He is a dirty league player, though... | ||
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On December 29 2015 20:23 Fidei86 wrote: Eh what I meant to say is your lack of a read on ShapeLog (you don't actually have a read on him). For me, I think SL's "loneliest man in New York" rant was kinda towny, but it's more surprising that you didn't hit on that but went to Gigya. I haven't really gone through his filter because it's annoying to read and didn't notice anything special from him in the thread (aside from spam). I guess that also doesn't make him look too good considering the filter size. | ||
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On December 29 2015 20:56 Onegu wrote: VT Claim Not quite the first post I'd have imagined | ||
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On December 29 2015 21:33 Fidei86 wrote: I agree it's annoying, but what do you think about his alignment? Not sure, as you've already pointed out there's not much content and mostly useless posts. But from my experience useless spam comes more often from town than from scum. So I'm leaning in the direction of town on him. | ||
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On December 30 2015 00:27 Shapelog wrote: I Generally like having more then 2 pages (which half of which is either me or opening jokes) to base reads off of. I usually start subtracting the trolololo and add actual useful crap later into the day and into the later days. 100% tryhard mode this game. I promise. @Fidel I do not know about GB (only play with him in nutcracker for a bit tbh) or NM. About Onegu, His VT claim is dumb, but from what i heard from other players, this is the norm for him? Idk, I can tell more about him once he starts posting atcual content (if he does.) Last game i played (which was my first) he was more ativce days 1 and 2, but fell off during the later days. This might be because Koshi died thou. But i really shouldn't jump to conclusions yet based off another game. Especially as i was compared as a rsoul. Smurf (still trying to figure that out) Also I am not that experience IMO. I played 20 mafia games back in college during freshman year (so like 4-5 years ago) And nutcracker was my 1st forum mafia game ^.^ Personally, this morning I am giving a town read towards Irish and maybe NM. Irish for his general posting and podding questions. Mderg is another i could place as town. At first i felt his intro post felt a bit scummy and a bit after wards espially with this post: The Bold feels a bit like hes repeating a lot of what people are saying, which indicatives to me mafia trying to look present. However, hes recent posts on me gives me a bit of a more town feel. I do admit, to me, it is a bit early for filtering, but the fact he is thinking and perhaps doing it makes me want to say he is leaning more to town. I just want to bring up the above fact (repeating). Koshi died?  I'm pretty sure I've played with Onegu in the past but I don't remember him doing stupid stuff like that. That's why I have no idea what to make of his posts so far. I can see how the part about GiygaS can be seen as repeating what others have said but I definitely can't see it with my stance on GlowingBear. Can you elaborate more on that? | ||
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On December 30 2015 01:22 Shapelog wrote: Yeah Koshi and Kush both died on the same night because mafia unboxed a gun. Onegu called me, Koshi, and damdred scum all game and on day 3 and up keep saying we were scum and that was it. his only reads were posted on d1 and he tunneled. Also see above post for Gb. Sounds like an interesting game, not like a game I'd want to play, though. Right now Onegu is just a huge questionmark for me. I was hoping you'd pressure me a bit for kind of repeating what NocturneMage said here... would have made things a bit more interesting | ||
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On December 30 2015 01:54 nooniansoong wrote: plynch = policy lynch I think it's the optimal lynch. I don't have a scumread on onegu. But the probability of lynching scum d1 is low. Onegu is probably going to be an unreadable entity all game long, so it's best to get him out of the way now. I don't think talking about the probability of lynching scum D1 is a good idea. I will strongly oppose a lynch like that, if you still want to plynch Onegu at the end of the day. | ||
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On December 30 2015 02:19 Kmatt wrote: I would think he'd be easier to kill if we kept him tied up. That's not nearly as fun, though. | ||
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If you want people to listen to you for D1 lynch, you should probably show a different attitude. | ||
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On December 30 2015 07:00 nooniansoong wrote: What does the legitmacy of my d1 lynch have to do with my attitude? Dude, you're not even trying to play the game D1 but want people to plynch Onegu. | ||
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On December 30 2015 07:48 Onegu wrote: Also I have a vote how cute. Wonder why? Onegu Rule might come into effect here. What's the Onegu rule? | ||
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On December 30 2015 10:07 nooniansoong wrote: S,T,T,~,~,S Wat I guess it should indicate slight leans on each of those people. | ||
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On December 30 2015 10:44 NocturneMage wrote: mderg, I looked at Kush/GB filters, Kush could be argued to soft push him and GB doesn't mention him at all, but if you are arguing they are both scum for that, seeing as you have independent (???) reasons to scumread them both, I'd rather see a flip or a stronger case against one of them before using the association argument. At the very least it's odd how up to this point they've had barely any interaction with each other. The soft push is basically nothing and doesn't have any follow up. They both see Kmatt as scummy but there is only this: On December 30 2015 09:04 nooniansoong wrote: gb get in here and you better have something more to add that I missed! That's a post that might as well come from a scum QT. So basically they only mention each other but don't actually have any kind of conversation. Considering that they've played quite a few games with each other that's definitely noteworthy and makes me believe that at least one of them is scum. | ||
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On December 30 2015 10:54 NocturneMage wrote: I'm looking at GB's reaction test on KMatt or his read on KMatt. My only issue with this reaction test is, looking at his filter, and his conversation with Shapelog is trying to see if his stance based on the reaction test would change his reads (or further solidify his reads) on Shapelog or KMatt. KMatt has responded since then and what bothers me further with GlowingBear is that I would expect him to also at least engage KMatt. Could KMatt be scum (there's a post I'll draw attention to, it was the one where he drops the GB scumread, it could be scum backing down or dropping a read or it could be a townie new to the game lacking confidence) - sure. But you would think the townie thing to do particularly of a veteran player would be to engage or further engage him. Wishy washy filter? okay. Vote placed? Okay. Reaction test and explanation? Okay. What are you doing with either the reaction test OR the scumread? Nothing. ??????????????????? I can get behind this, there should come more from GB regarding Kmatt. So far it's an "easy" scumread with little follow up. | ||
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On December 30 2015 12:07 TheCow wrote: This post is being written as of post 415. @Kmatt Before we proceed, I'd like to ask you three quick questions just to get a better understanding of you as a player. 1) How much experience do you have with the game Mafia? 2) How do you feel about this game in its current state? 3) In one sentence, describe yourself as a person. (not a question, but close enough ._.) @Irish 1) I did not and do not want to narrow my own and the threads field of vision by simply bandwagoning the leading wagon. Aside from that, Scott's activity level would waste the pressure of a vote -- much unlike Kmatt who is here now. 2) You, Irish, I had as topscum for a little while when I was catching up. Between that time and me catching up, you managed to redeem yourself in my eyes and became a void read. GB, I am conflicted because though they have been somewhat anti-town, they have not been overtly scummy -- or enough for a vote, at least. 3) Onegu looks like a player who is mislynch bait and without meta-experience, I do not feel comfortable making a definitive read without more evidence. For Fidelis, here is a quote from my notes: + Show Spoiler + [Fidea] seems to be the type of player I will scumread into oblivion regardless of their actual alignment. I have always had issues reading players like Fidea -- just their style and attitude doesn't mesh well with me. Not that much to go from but it makes me lean town on TheCow. | ||
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On December 30 2015 14:21 scott31337 wrote: So I have CPR and first aid training tomorrow morning so I have to get up early - I should be back on before EoD. The thing that gets me is - why would noon have a town read on me and go against thread sentiment if he was mafia? What's the motivation - so he moves up for me. Giygas's filter looks the worse - there's some SC stuff and nothing else - so I'm going to vote for him for now. Going against thread sentiment is common for mafia. I did that a lot when I was mafia in the past. If mafia simply goes along with the thread sentiment, some people are definitely going to notice and call them out for not bringing anything up on their own. Definitely a weak defense of noon. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + On December 29 2015 10:47 scott31337 wrote: GB throwing out townreads like it's drunken Monday - hmmm... Okay, I'm extremely doubtful a newb mafia makes the post above with the information available. Maybe GB was right  You get a townlean for this Irish. I could possibly jump on this - but it's a big bag of joke/null for now... This Kmatt guy kind of does what I do - quote into notepad, post thoughts - I like this so far as well. I'll work on page 11 after the American Football game (or maybe halftime) In the first one he mentions GB's strange townread on Irish which isn't bad in itself. But the fact that I had done just that before and that he doesn't provide any follow up at all makes him look bad in my eyes. Then he townreads Irish and Kmatt with only vague reasoning, nothing worth mentioning. Also the strange "I could possibly jump on this". I have no idea where to put this. + Show Spoiler + On December 30 2015 14:21 scott31337 wrote: So I have CPR and first aid training tomorrow morning so I have to get up early - I should be back on before EoD. The thing that gets me is - why would noon have a town read on me and go against thread sentiment if he was mafia? What's the motivation - so he moves up for me. Giygas's filter looks the worse - there's some SC stuff and nothing else - so I'm going to vote for him for now. In the second post he provides a weak defense of noon. I don't like it regardless of noon's alignment. Then he votes Giygas. I don't think this one is particularly scummy, it's just a vote based on the lack of actual content from Giygas. His own lack of content is not something that should be taken into account for this vote. I'd say he's pretty scummy and I'm gonna vote him for now because I'm not sure I can be back before the deadline and he looks like a good place to safely park my vote. ##vote scott | ||
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On December 31 2015 04:58 Onegu wrote: Why not. I found a scumslip. That makes you scum. Yes at first was a joke post but now I know you are scum. A wise man (might have been Palmar but I'm not sure) once said that scumslips don't actually exist in forum mafia. So I'm inclined to not believe there actually was a scumslip. With that being said, time to catch up. | ||
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On December 31 2015 02:49 GlowingBear wrote: Kush, if you see something as scummy, you say the guy is probably town because there is a 8/11 chance of the guy being town? If we think like that we won't lynch anyone. Then after some point he says that my post stood out but it doesn't mean I'm from any alignment? Kush, again, if something stands out, it stands out for either alignment. Standing out = alignment indicative posts. Doesn't stand out = NAI. You can add to that that he was just commenting on this and posting about starcraft in the thread. He is not committed into scumhunting. You do understand what I'm saying, right? So your main point on Kmatt is the lack of commitment to his read on you? I fail to see how that's enough to justify a lynch D1. | ||
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On December 31 2015 02:58 nooniansoong wrote: yo mderg i hope this interaction between gb and me satisfies you lol Now that I've already commented on your lack of interaction before it doesn't change much. | ||
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On December 31 2015 03:35 GlowingBear wrote: mafia mderg (no original thoughts. the guy is just following the thread and rarely putting any original thoughts on the thread. Throw suspicions without going after it, like he did talking about me and kush avoiding each otherm and simply isn't caring for actually uncovering people's alignment) This makes me sad Especially the no original thoughts part | ||
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On December 31 2015 03:54 Irishbound wrote: Fair warning but if we lynch Scott today and he flips mafia like I expect he will then I'll probably voting you for this, the sheer amount you've now defended him and made it less likely that he gets lynched is baffling given your read on him. It makes no sense as a stance whatsoever and really does ignore what the issues with him really are, sure he his lesser activity may fall under his meta, him town reading Noon for the reasoning he does doesn't though and him calling me town due to being a "newb" similarly doesn't make sense. I'd say scott flipping town would make GB look worse. Strongly defending a townie based on nothing just screams too much information. | ||
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On December 31 2015 04:51 GiygaS wrote: Still have a scumread on kmatt, just not as strong as scott. Was going to vote scott after reading, but I didn't really have a read on you in any direction so I want to go over your filter as there's interest on you. GB changed because he was already dropping and his posts seem like he's concerned about this out, mostly a feeling thing tbh. After reading your filter, you seem to be towny. So yeah, I'm going to vote scott. ##Vote scott WHat does make Fidei seem towny, please elaborate. | ||
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On December 31 2015 05:34 Onegu wrote: Then a even wiser man said they do exist. And as someone who has actually scumslipped before I know they are real. And I know what to look for. I think they happen very rarely but I don't see that being one. When I'm scum I'm usually even much more careful about wording things than as town. | ||
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On December 31 2015 05:47 nooniansoong wrote: ya know.. the way he writes big paragraphs and stuff I didn't ask you, though | ||
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actually that probably wasn't a serious response... | ||
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On December 31 2015 05:53 GiygaS wrote: The fact he reread the entire thread to make reads. That's not something I'd base a townread on | ||
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On December 31 2015 05:56 GlowingBear wrote: That's not my point anymore My point is that Giygas is his main scumread and was the second wagon to scott. He started saying that I was fishy but then said it didn't influence my alignment. He proceeded to drop his scumread on me. Then he suddenly decides I'm a "dangerous player" (? what does this even mean) and that scott's flip won't reveal much information. Instead of convincing people to vote his main scumread (who was the opposite wagon at that time), he decided to vote me. Which doesn't make sense because: 1) He said my "fishiness" couldn't reveal anything from my alignment, so his suspicions on me were weaker than the suspicions on Giygas 2) He DROPPED his scumread on me 3) If the problem is that scott's wagon won't reveal any information, he should rather lynch his main scumread because it at least is the most probable wagon to flip instead of mine. That definitely makes more sense. I can understand why he would call you a "more dangerous player", though. But his vote comes off as strange. | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:00 GiygaS wrote: Really? Why not? Why would a mafia reread thread to make reads? I always reread the thread at some points during the game. Doesn't matter what my alignment is. | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:25 Onegu wrote: I do it every game regardless of alignment. If you do something every game, it loses its meaning | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:47 scott31337 wrote: Im voting with Onegu instead That's meh | ||
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On December 31 2015 06:54 nooniansoong wrote: my read is not based upon a phrase. WHy do people keep talking about onegu's scumslip case when I have an actual case! You actually call that a case? | ||
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On January 01 2016 13:33 Shapelog wrote: Page 28. This is either a big ass mafia slip (which btw, mderg copied his scum slip from me! look at the filter its their.) Or one huge town tell This may be the hangover but I don't quite get the part about me. | ||
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On January 01 2016 15:07 nooniansoong wrote: Kinda drunk. not gonna be a very good post but here goes. scum is in irish gigyas mderg onegu. I've given varying degrees of townreads to everyone else. Irish seems like a dude who would make a very townie looking scum. I find the reasoning behind his scumreads/townreads to be unbelievable. I know a statement like that is worthless without backing it up with specifics but that's not happening right now. If he dies, which he very well might if he's town, then that would be work wasted if I post reasons now. gigyas. all honesty i can't read this guy for shit. He seems scummy to be even when he's town. Dunno but his play seems like it has no creative thought behind it or anything to indicate towniness. No offense gigas I didn't mean that as an insult. mderg. Always taking the side of you'd think the townie would take: Hard against policy lynches for example. Seems like an upright citizen townie, but his towniness is very surface level. onegu- really wasn't satisfied with his respond to GB's recent questioning of him. Nothing townie in his filter. Looks like he found something he could call a scumslip then relied on that for a reasoning behind his vote. With no thought to "is it really a scumslip?" "did shape scumslip as well?" etc. These reads are all pretty shit. I'll verify them and stress them out during d2. Now that you're probably not drunk anymore can you get into more detail on these reads? | ||
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On January 02 2016 02:57 Fidei86 wrote: I think that when I made my post, things hadn't really moved on from his read on Kmatt. I do think up to around that point he was pretty scummy, for the reasons I gave. After that, though, I think his filter has been ... up and down. I liked alot that he thought over the case against Kmatt, and engaged GB on it quite extensively. It's difficult to see a particularly scummy reason for defending Kmatt -- scum would probably prefer to keep that avenue open (see #404). I did not like his case on me at all at #513, and a couple of other people posted that it was quite lacking. He actually says specifically at #571 that he didn't vote me for the scum slip, he did it because of his case. But as soon as the day was over, he admitted his case was bad (#633). Since then he has questioned Onegu on scum slips (#668), and thrown a bunch of shade on people at #696. He admitted in his post that the reads were ehhh, and I agree they were. Still, I think it's townie to start thinking about people others hadn't really been (especially mderg and Irish). I see that an experienced scum would probably start doing that now to set up the board for late game, but for a newer player I think it makes a ton more sense to just be typical townie paranoia. I also don't like that he aggressively pushed his case on me up until EOD, at which point he dropped it and hasn't really talked about me since. That could be because he realised he was tied to a weak case, and that the easiest thing was just to drop it. At the same time, we now know that scott was town, so it kinda makes more sense for this to be a townie Kush re-evaluating. That especially makes sense because Kush was town-reading scott and so would definitely have wanted me to get lynched, since I was the only other viable wagon. So, yeah. I think kush is probably town. It's pretty easy to see why scum might want to defend Kmatt. Just as it's easy to see why town would defend him. Based on reading your reasoning I wouldn't think that you're townreading kush. I also like him much more than at the start, though. Mostly because he actually started thinking about the game and bringing in new thoughts on people. His amount of interaction with GB skyrocketed after I mentioned it btw | ||
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On January 03 2016 00:38 GlowingBear wrote: There's a reason Irish is dead and I'm not. The reason is that he was probably right at least for one of his scum reads. His scum reads were kush/Giygas/Scott. Scott is dead, I think kush is more likely to be town. So I'm voting Giygas because I simply have no reason to town read him. That gigantic post from Kmatt probably makes him town. If I had a wrong scum read, it is him. I keep my scumread on mderg and Onegu, tho. To be fair, I'm pretty confident we hit a Mafia on mderg. But considering the night kill we should probably kill Giygas first. I don't like this post at all. You're simply using his reads to vote without giving it any real thought. You're also ignoring pretty much all of his other reads this game. That's not town play. ##vote GB | ||
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On January 03 2016 00:58 GlowingBear wrote: His other reads were town reads dude, why would I take that into consideration when deciding who to lynch now? Rofl What you're doing is basically taking a look at a list with his reads and taking the one that's most convenient for you. | ||
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On January 03 2016 01:05 Fidei86 wrote: Irish's reads were: He sets out his reads at #427, which are: Scott scum NM town GB town Kush scum mderg town Kmatt town Fidei null Shape town Gigya scum Onegu null/town Not really sure which reads you think GB missed out mderg? Gonna check your filter now for your progression on GB. I'm not saying he missed any reads. He simply picked one out and decides to vote that one. Without giving it any further thought (aside from "kush is probably town") | ||
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On January 03 2016 01:11 Fidei86 wrote: Can you explain your read progression on GB? Up until now you've not really interacted with him at all, You say at #709 that you want to lynch GB because of the scumslip discussion, but I assumed that wasn't a serious read. You say at #567 that Scott flipping town would make him look worse, but only because hedefended Scott. Then at #588 you agree with GB's reads. Is your entire scum read really off of GB correctly reciting Irish's reads ??? I haven't liked his play since the very beginning of this game. The instant townread on Irish for nothing. In general I got the feeling he's giving out reads with little to no reasoning behind them. The lack of interaction with kush D1 (admittedly that's not a very strong reason to scumread him). His crazy defense of scott and now his use of Irish's death. Well, that's pretty much just a list of things I didn't like about his play but I commented on most if not all of these, so I think one should be able to see how I came to this read. | ||
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On January 03 2016 01:41 GlowingBear wrote: Mderg, what's your read on Koshi? Koshi is always town. He's not in this game, though. | ||
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He's meh. Not much actual content coming from him and he isn't trying that much to bring the discussion forwards. For the most part he was just going after the supposed scumslip. His extreme insistence on lynching Fidei for the scumslip makes me think he's town but I wouldn't be surprised, if he was scum. So, probably town but I don't want to be the one to make the decision on him. | ||
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On January 03 2016 03:10 GlowingBear wrote: Why is he in one of your lynch lists then? He is? | ||
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Yeah, I wasn't serious about that | ||
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I still don't think that is a scumslip | ||
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On January 03 2016 06:13 nooniansoong wrote: 1 Why would scum post in the thread similar to how they post in the scum qt? 2 Why do you conclude that at least one of us is scum? I would think that both of us would be scum considering it's a read based on both of us avoiding each other. pretty strange time to respond to that 1 You definitely change the way you interact with each other,if you're talking to a scumbuddy. I don't think scum wants to post similar to the scum qt here but posts with unusual tone do happen. 2 It doesn't necessarily take both to change the interaction between 2 people in a strange way like that. | ||
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I simply wouldn't expect scum to tunnel so heavily for IMO stupid reasons. So yeah, I'm not very confident in this read. | ||
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On January 03 2016 11:40 Kmatt wrote: I'd like you to explain this bit in detail. I'm assuming "all those things he said town doesn't do" to be the following Note that I never said it's things that town "doesn't do" but that they are things a townie has no reason to do. Could you present the town motivation for calling TheCow's theories "cute" instead of an actual response? Could you present the town motivation for deflecting a chance to explain his own platform in order to ask for reads? (and what about "now that I have you attention"? We're on a forum, everyone can "hear" him loud and clear) Could you present the town motivation for placing a vote onto Scott not because he believed Scott to be scum but that Scott voted on one of his townreads. What is the town motivation to intentionally lynch another (supposed) townie? Some thoughts about your case on Glowing. I've only skimmed that huge post, though. I don't think looking for town motivation behind posts is the right way to get your reads. Townies do lots of stupid shit. For me the question is: Is he scum? If those things are not something town "doesn't do", you admit that town might do those things. In that case you'd have to take a look at a possible scum motivation behind it. Does scum have more reason to call theCow's post cute than town? --> I don't see a good reason for that as either alignment. Could you see the scum motivation for deflecting a chance to explain his own platform in order to ask for reads? --> I can Could you present the town motivation for placing a vote onto Scott not because he believed Scott to be scum but that Scott voted on one of his townreads. What is the town motivation to intentionally lynch another (supposed) townie? --> I don't think Glowing ever gave a strong townread on scott. That's why I found his defense so scummy. So, I think your case is not well thought out at some points (and should have been half as long at most). But it brings up a few good points and I'm pretty confident in Glowing being scum. | ||
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I would rather say his play is too dumb to scum. That goes in a similar direction, though. | ||
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On January 03 2016 23:36 Onegu wrote: To scummy to be scum or too dumb to be scum is a terrible reason in every game for every player. That's why I'm absolutely not confident in this read | ||
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On January 04 2016 01:10 NocturneMage wrote: I know why you are reading mderg as scum fundamentally Funnily enough I don't | ||
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On January 04 2016 03:09 nooniansoong wrote: Why would I tell you? You aren't today's lynch. Telling you why you're scum at this point would be like giving you tips. This makes me think you don't actually have a good reason to scumread me. | ||
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mderg
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On January 04 2016 03:43 nooniansoong wrote: Let's just say my reason for scumreading you isn't going to be some big thing that makes people say "ah ha" and convinces them. So it's a bad reason? Or nonexistent? | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:15 GlowingBear wrote: Am I really getting lynched? ROFL I'm fairly confident you're scum | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:26 GlowingBear wrote: For no good reason. It doesn't matter since you're 100% mafia. Why do you think that, though? | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:26 GlowingBear wrote: For no good reason. It doesn't matter since you're 100% mafia. btw I'm pretty sure I gave more reasons to scumread you than you gave to scumread me | ||
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On January 04 2016 06:52 The Shining wrote: See I have two big issues with the lynch right now. If GB is in fact scum, no one is trying to save him or pulling any sort of defense. If scum is actually voting to save him, 3 scum are in the 3 Onegu votes? Or 2 + Shapelog because he's not here? Unless you're in NM world where Onegu and GB are both scum and double bussing. Whereas if Onegu is scum, he has no cares about this lynch, even though its pretty closely contested. Its speculation but it would make sense if he was that relaxed because he can guarantee 2-3 votes on GB aka scumteam. And his only post in the last few hours is to scum Fidei once more. Everyone voting him except for Kush is scum to him. Over a scumslip and some weird reason I couldn't really pick up on RE: GB. So you think Onegu would be the better lynch? | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:25 Fecalfeast wrote: I'm the laziest dude can you talk about this for me mderg? I'm sure you've talked about it already but it'd be a big help On January 03 2016 01:24 mderg wrote: I haven't liked his play since the very beginning of this game. The instant townread on Irish for nothing. In general I got the feeling he's giving out reads with little to no reasoning behind them. The lack of interaction with kush D1 (admittedly that's not a very strong reason to scumread him). His crazy defense of scott and now his use of Irish's death. Well, that's pretty much just a list of things I didn't like about his play but I commented on most if not all of these, so I think one should be able to see how I came to this read. | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:53 Fecalfeast wrote: mderg I instantly had irish as town, too, though that can't be proven since a real person would have read the OP or something. May I ask how he's using irish's death? Is he pushing a scum agenda with it? Kush is so town this game I also had Irish down as town fairly early. But did you have irish as town right after the first post? I didn't and I simply don't see it at that point. Basically he took irish's scumreads on kush and giygas, said kush is probably town --> giygas has to be scum. Based on the fact that irish was nked which supposedly happened because irish was right on a scumread. Why exactly do you think kush is town. Please explain it for me who has almost no recollection of how he plays. | ||
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On January 04 2016 08:55 Fecalfeast wrote: GB doesn't apply to the 'too scummy to be scum' metric and I feel like you should know that. GB uses a lot of associative reads, was there anyone GB scumread on the scott wagon when he switched over? I was on the scott wagon and he had/has a strong scumread on me | ||
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On January 05 2016 00:28 GlowingBear wrote: I want every single people to tell me: 1) why is mderg town 2) why is fidei scum 3) is anyone townreading Giygas? 1) shouldn't you also explain why I'm supposedly scum? 2) I don't have a scumread on Fidei. He has kind of disappeared the last few days, though. 3) He's meh. Did look rather bad at the start but managed to look more towny after D1. But then he made that last minute vote switch. So not a would lynch now kind of guy but also not a never lynch guy | ||
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On January 05 2016 01:07 nooniansoong wrote: clarification: I thought GB's reasoning was bad. Mderg's reasoning for scumreading that post wasn't bad but it's too easy to get townpoints for. That's not wrong BUT is there anything I get scumpoints for? Seriously, both you and GB have been scumreading me for like 5 rl days without giving any proper explanation for it but for some reason want the others to prove that I'm town. That's so fucking stupid I can't even believe it. | ||
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On January 05 2016 01:27 nooniansoong wrote: um that's gb who is doing that not me. I just can't townread you so I'm assuming you're scum. What you can do about it is tell me who is scum and why. HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU NOT DOING IT? If you're town I sincerely hope you get a coach next game! | ||
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On January 05 2016 03:20 NocturneMage wrote: I had to read this exchange a few times to understand but now I finally understand why mderg has I think a valid concern here. Noon, you agreed that mderg's reasoning to scum GB at least made sense - from context "wow what a bad reason to scumread/vote someone". But mderg is saying that your reasoning to say that it's obvious that mafia can think of this (Now I finally understand why Noon, you are not giving him townpoints for this. I disagree, but I digress.) - he doesn't dispute this (third quote). But what may be a problem here is that from his eyes, you are characterising his play as exclusively scummy, or taking what can be seen as town play and seeing it from a mafia standpoint. To frame it as such and exclusively, that, can be mafia indicative. mderg - (1) is my understanding of the problem correct? (2) when I went to Noon's original concern on you he said you were playing passively, a little too passively for town. I am not familiar with you. How would you describe your towngame? (3) how often have you played with Noon? Is it enough where he should be familiar enough with your towngame? (1) You've pretty much got it. He at some point decided that I'm scummy (with like 1 throwaway line to say how he came to that conclusion). And now he just takes things I post where there chance of scum making that post is not 0 to further confirm my scumminess. So far he hasn't tried to convince anybody that I'm scum, he simply found something for him to be able to keep that read alive. If he truly had a good reason to assume I'm scum, he would try convincing people of that but he isn't actually doing that. (2) It's difficult to describe my towngame since my last game was about a year ago. Generally I've tried to point out things I've noticed without committing too much early on. Once I've found a scumread I'm confident on I'm usually pushing that pretty strongly. There may be other people who can give you a better explanation. Keep in mind, though, that I'm not a player in the same league as the absolute tl players. (3) I've played with him like 5 times, maybe a bit more. He could be familiar with my towngame but he might also have forgotten a few things about my playstyle. | ||
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On January 05 2016 04:32 nooniansoong wrote: FF my reads are in flux right now. I dont really find Fidei scummy. Not sure who my scumteam is right now. nm, i understand mderg's problem with my suspicion against him. he can't defend himself. I took a look at one of his scumgames and after he defended himself from a case everyone thought he was townie. I'm not giving him a chance to defend himself. The only way he can prove he is town to me is if he acts townie. If you had actually looked at my scumgames carefully, you'd have seen lots of differences to my play now. Granted, that's quite a bit in the past (probably around 1.5 years). I've also looked to defend myself from accusations many times as town. So that's another one of those "he could theoretically do that as scum" reasons. On January 05 2016 04:34 nooniansoong wrote: and mderg dont go into depth about how my metaing of you or whatever the above is is wrong. I dont care. just attempt to find scum. I don't mind that too much but since this a game where the majority decides, maybe other people actually do care about how this compares to my scumgame or my towngame. | ||
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On January 05 2016 05:39 nooniansoong wrote: Like what? I'm a sucker for self-meta. I thought you didn't care about that? I've been scum in 3 games so far on tl. One of those doesn't count because it was pick your power and town had a good plan from the start. So I just tried to bus immediately and hoped for a miracle. The 2 relevant games: In my first scumgame (Detention Mafia) I've put myself in the spotlight by spending most of D1 defending a townie who was getting mislynched. Only at the end of D1 did I make a small case on someone. That's the part I assume you're referring to because I've had to defend myself quite a bit at that point. Somehow I made people believe me to be town. After that I pursued my case until I had to bus my scummate and the 3rd scum got modkilled. I don't remember very much after that but I was mainly trying to skate by without going against thread sentiment too much. The other scumgame (Normal Mini Mafia LVI) I was afk quite a bit and made mostly long posts. Generally my play was awful that game because I didn't have much time to play. My biggest "case" there was about someone who found a supposed scumslip. I obviously knew the scumslip wasn't real, though. There's a small similarity to my play here in me saying there are almost no scumslips in forum mafia. You can go over that game yourself, though. The filter isn't even 2 pages long. I don't think my play here is particularly close to any of those 2 games. | ||
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On January 05 2016 06:22 Fecalfeast wrote: You generated an entire page of what I would consider useless posts before this post. You never come back to kmatt and even go on to chastise GB for not talking about kmatt. This post also feels really out of place from mderg's obvious conversational style almost like someone in scum QT said he was shitting the thread. Setting up what if scott flips town even though before this you made your first real post about someone about scott being mafia. To me it seems weird to be talking about what if scott flips town after this. Most of your posts this game have been replies to people talking about their reads. I'm not going to paste a bunch of random one liners here but I'm getting more about what you think of other people's reads than what you think of people. GB is scum but who else? Can you give me a list of people you think are scum please That's much more pleasant to work with. 1) Not much to say about that. It's correct that I've never come back to kmatt. I'm still not 100% sure about him but I'd put him more towards town. 2) You may think it was weird I think it was reasonable. I was simply giving my opinion on an association that I disagreed with. 3) Yes, lots of my posts are about other people's reads. I think you should be able to see from my wording that I think kush is scum. So I think both kush and GB are scum. The other candidates are you, shining and giygas. There's not a particular favorite in that list. | ||
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On January 05 2016 06:37 Fecalfeast wrote: wait do you have cases this game? If you're talking about a huge ass post to say why I scumread someone, then no. If you're talking about giving several reasons for scumreading someone, then yes. | ||
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On January 06 2016 06:59 Fecalfeast wrote: so the only person who hasn't made any posts this day phase is mderg who totally bailed after I started asking him stuff. ##vote mderg You do realize that I'm from a different part of the world than you and most humans need something called sleep? I do know that you have your reasons to vote me but this makes me a bit sad. People should already know my opinion about gb ##vote glowingbear | ||
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On January 06 2016 07:18 Fidei86 wrote: This wagon on GB gives me the super heebie-jeebies. There are too many people jumping onto it too easily and with too little explanation. I think we should be lynching mderg instead, for the following reasons: His first read on GB makes no sense At #237 he notes that people are quick to jump on GB, for reasons that he agrees with "his opening was fishy", but he doesn't like it because it "feels too easy". So the opening is scummy, but people pointing that out is fishy? Huh? His second read on GB is based on a falsity Day 2 he votes GB initially (#741) for absolutely shit reasons - GB quoted Irish's reads accurately, and tried to do some NK WIFOM. Mderg then said that GB had NOT given Irish's reads correctly (which GB had) and voted for him. When called out on it, he tried to say that GB had cherry picked votes, which he HADN'T. This is just a read based on a factual innaccuracy, but instead of admitting the mistake, he doubles down. He parrots other people's reasons for voting His Scott vote at #455 was for reasons that had already been set out by others (set out helpfully by Irish at #441). On top of that, he also says that he's going to "park his vote" there, which is pretty scummy as it indicates a lack of conviction and looks to be leaving himself room to change later. He doesn't actually change his vote, despite not really saying anything about scott through the rest of the day. When he finally explained his GB read after the #741 issue, he basically just summarised what people had said previously about GB. Then at #815 he calls out Kmatt's case, but says that he agrees with some of it and that GB is scum anyway. His posts are responsive and reactive. Most of his posts throughout his filter are responses to other posts. It's a classic scum technique of appearing active, while actually not contributing anything. See, for example, #599, #587, although really most of his filter fits the pattern. His only long posts have come recently, and they seem to have mostly been an explanation of his own play in past games ... big help. LYNCH mderg. Please. ##vote: mderg Haven't actually read this, yet. But what I bolded is just factually wrong. | ||
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On January 06 2016 01:51 NocturneMage wrote: EBWOP - poorly worded phrasing And I think particularly with Noon's claim on mderg's scum meta being reflected in this game. Just saying, if you're checking my scum meta, you should also check my town meta. | ||
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On January 06 2016 07:18 Fidei86 wrote: This wagon on GB gives me the super heebie-jeebies. There are too many people jumping onto it too easily and with too little explanation. I think we should be lynching mderg instead, for the following reasons: His first read on GB makes no sense At #237 he notes that people are quick to jump on GB, for reasons that he agrees with "his opening was fishy", but he doesn't like it because it "feels too easy". So the opening is scummy, but people pointing that out is fishy? Huh? His second read on GB is based on a falsity Day 2 he votes GB initially (#741) for absolutely shit reasons - GB quoted Irish's reads accurately, and tried to do some NK WIFOM. Mderg then said that GB had NOT given Irish's reads correctly (which GB had) and voted for him. When called out on it, he tried to say that GB had cherry picked votes, which he HADN'T. This is just a read based on a factual innaccuracy, but instead of admitting the mistake, he doubles down. He parrots other people's reasons for voting His Scott vote at #455 was for reasons that had already been set out by others (set out helpfully by Irish at #441). On top of that, he also says that he's going to "park his vote" there, which is pretty scummy as it indicates a lack of conviction and looks to be leaving himself room to change later. He doesn't actually change his vote, despite not really saying anything about scott through the rest of the day. When he finally explained his GB read after the #741 issue, he basically just summarised what people had said previously about GB. Then at #815 he calls out Kmatt's case, but says that he agrees with some of it and that GB is scum anyway. His posts are responsive and reactive. Most of his posts throughout his filter are responses to other posts. It's a classic scum technique of appearing active, while actually not contributing anything. See, for example, #599, #587, although really most of his filter fits the pattern. His only long posts have come recently, and they seem to have mostly been an explanation of his own play in past games ... big help. LYNCH mderg. Please. ##vote: mderg Ok, done reading this. 1) what I meant was if everyone just piled on gb for that without any counterwagon, it would be unlikely that he's scum. 2) factually wrong 3) the vote parking should be pretty obvious in context. I said that I wasn't sure to be back before deadline. If you think my reasons for scumreading GB are simply repeating what others have said, you're free to think that but it doesn't change the reality. Of course I took into consideration what others have said but I also gave my own reasons and I've been talking about not liking GB before. 4) I've actually heard something similar quite a few times. I don't hide that a lot of my posts are reactive but that's just how it is. | ||
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On January 06 2016 07:40 Fidei86 wrote: This is your post. So it's not so much that you said that the reads were wrong, but that they were misleading. I just don't see how you could think that. GB posted all of Irish's scum reads, which was the basis of GB's post. I feel like you're arguing about semantics. Of course he wrote down Irish's reads but he simply listed them down and picked the one that was more suitable for him. | ||
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On January 06 2016 07:50 Fidei86 wrote: That was the point of his post - discussing Irish's scum reads.. I don't think so. If he had wanted to discuss those reads, he should and would have done so in a completely different manner. | ||
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On January 06 2016 08:05 Fidei86 wrote: He literally said the reason he was not dead was because Irish was right in one of his scum reads. Then he gave Irish's scum reads. Exactly that plus he simply decided it had to be giygas and voted him. | ||
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Looks like I was wrong on kush and he is actually town. His defence of me makes absolutely no sense as scum in this situation. His activity and questioning look very towny this day. | ||
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I didn't like the quick townread on Irish for a very typical first post. His reasoning would work on like 90% of opening posts. He continued with prodding here and there and asking some questions which I liked. There was absolutely no follow up, though. I really don't like #300. Having the same read doesn't mean you can't find it strange how someone else came to the read. That thought process is something I even consider towny. When he voted kmatt to me it felt like he delayed his explanation to actually find reasons to scumread him. It's definitely possible that he was speaking the truth here, though. Then he made a small "case" on kmatt. It's mainly about lack of confidence in the reads. Lack of confidence in ones reads is not something I'd build a case on this early in the game. After that he scumreads Onegu and me. Onegu based on meta. I can't say too much about it but obviously Onegu flipped town. He scumreads me mainly for having very few original thoughts. I disagree on that but whatever. When the scott wagon got rolling he defended him by trying to lynch kmatt. I'm not really sure, did he want to lynch kmatt or did he want to defend scott? Looking through it it was actually much more attacking kmatt than I remembered. Could come from town could come from scum. He then townreads kmatt for the huge case but doesn't engage it at all because he doesn't care about cases made on him and skipped it by default. A bit later, though, he almost immediately responds to NM's (admittedly much smaller) case on him. That just doesn't add up, scummy. He then proceeds to scumread Giygas based on Irish's reads. That's scummy and we have gone through that enough times now. After he got under pressure he obviously defended himself a lot and gives explanations on his posts and reads which is simply NAI. IMO the only notable thing after that is him complaining about Shape being modconfirmed town. It doesn't really make sense and I have a wild and possibly stupid theory about that. This is not the time for that, though. So yeah, I can understand GB's play at some points and not everything put up against him is exclusively scummy. But there are some things I simply don't see a townie come up with and there's little to nothing that says "I'm town". This means he should be the lynch today (which kind of seems to be decided on based on the activity in the last few hours). | ||
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On January 07 2016 06:49 NocturneMage wrote: Hmmm, does it make sense for scum to wifom something like this? IDK. I don't know when he first said it. At this point in time it's not unthinkable. | ||
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He was clearly the leading wagon at that point, so it's possible | ||
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Also don't get why people were so mad... I like scum winning | ||
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