EPTAlso If damdred can post, he can catch up.
Newbie Student Mafia XI - Page 109
| Forum Index > TL Mafia |
|
Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
Also If damdred can post, he can catch up. | ||
|
WaveofShadow
Canada31494 Posts
On June 20 2015 09:51 batsnacks wrote: Sulfur's first post about you was a town read. Sulfur scum leans on damdred several times. So you're still just making huge, sweeping, wrong generalizations about my POE. It's not important to me whether or not people listen to me. Not one person has responded to a single thing I said in my POE reads. I'm happy to lead a horse to water it's not my problem if it won't drink. Trfel responded to your PoE reads and you only responded to one of his points. I think my biggest issue with your PoE is essentially to me you are now calling me scum for precisely NO reason because nowhere have you actually looked into anything I have done, rather made weak and arbitrary conclusions about other players to rule them out: sulfur's first post was scum reading and voting kickstart. Good knowing he's town. Also good knowing that we were lynching between town and mafia yesterday. There is absolutely nothing to say Sulf doesn't bus right off the bat. Especially when you consider how quickly the vote came right off of him. No other read in your PoE about Kickstart so apparently that one quick assumption is enough to call him town? Awful. Thinking about it more, ruxxar is probably town and probably wound up on so many wagons because he is over thinking his first game. He probably discredited my geript read because he saw n00b do it first and thought it would be okay for him to do it. I think all of his scummy actions can be explained in a way that makes sense for town. Why then if there are both scummy and towny reasons for his actions do you assume he is town based on this? sulfur hard defended Rels and rux from trfel d1. This is very likely a case of sulfur defending town from town, which he also did with oats and Rels/n00b. If Trfel is mafia sulfur is not going to hard defend two townies from him. You conclude from this that Trfel likely isn't mafia because of this, but that only makes sense IF ruxxar and Rels are BOTH town. Why can't Trfel be town and one of Rels/ruxxar be scum here? Once again, the problem I have with your PoE is you base a lot of it on things that Sulf did when you can't 100% understand his motivations, and then there are other points where you just arbitrarily choose single reasons to townread people which on their own truly don't appear to be particularly strong. And even then, were you to continue to go back with this list and reevaluate it would probably be ok, but this PoE was literally proved wrong, and yet you still continue to use the same faulty rationale to justify scumreads on me and Damdred without looking any further (never mind not having any actual reasons to scumread either of us), and that's just shit. I can't decide where I stand on this especially since I was still currently scumreading Damdred. I think I'm going to need to do a readthrough before going forward. | ||
|
Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
| ||
|
Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
Let's discuss trfel being mafia. | ||
|
Trfel
7015 Posts
On June 20 2015 09:17 WaveofShadow wrote: I guess I don't really know what to expect from town!batsnacks. This is the first game I've seen batsnacks being this active and focused on serious reads.Here's the thing about that. Bats has been pretty wrong despite taking very strong stances twice now which on its own is pretty meh, but now the fact that he's continuing on with his apparent PoE scumread of me, nevermind Damdred despite the method being obviously faulty in the first place? Something's up. As far as your townread of Damdred I am definitely not sold on that. Reasons to afk aside, the times where he has been here he has been extremely content to take a backseat, rather than what you say about him leading. Your bolded point is mostly meta-based, where you assume mafia Damdred will act a certain way even though meta is fairly easy to change in a case like this, and when you say starting a shit fight is at no risk to him when you're top town? Not really seeing how that's the case either. And I wasn't always townread when Damdred had the ability to fight me. The past few games, I've always ended up looking worse for arguing with Damdred. While it's a meta read, and it's a meta read that is easily changed, it's not worth it for mafia!Damdred to do this and hoping that I comment on it, it's better for him to cause a huge argument and derail the thread. On June 20 2015 09:39 batsnacks wrote: I just don't understand this argument. Newbie scum KNOW that their scumbuddies' arguments are wrong, so I don't see why they wouldn't defend townies from their scumbuddies' arguments. The alignment of the person making the argument doesn't matter if it's against town, scum knows that it's wrong.I did not say that every time sulf defended someone it makes them town. I would take your responses more seriously if you were responding to things I actually said instead of making huge, sweeping, wrong generalizations about what I said. I said trfel is likely not mafia because sulfur defended rux and rels from him d1 and I said that oats is likely not mafia because sulfur scum read him for attacking n00b and Rels. That is not the same as townreading everyone that sulfur defended. The advice I have gotten from a very strong town player is to avoid POE reads most of the time, as they leave you susceptible for townreading people for weak reasons. Townreading Oatsmaster because Sulfurus pushed him is definitely a weak reason. Townreading me because Sulfurus townread the people I scumread is also weak. | ||
|
Trfel
7015 Posts
On June 20 2015 15:31 Oatsmaster wrote: If you have any questions for me, feel free to ask. If you have any reasons, feel free to share them.Guys come on, start talking. Let's discuss trfel being mafia. If you have anything else you want to talk about, let me know. | ||
|
Rels
France13467 Posts
| ||
|
Trfel
7015 Posts
Reasons ruXxar could be scum 1. Early on, ruXxar was slow to discuss people's alignments + Show Spoiler + I think that ruXxar's post answering my question to Kickstart while saying why you shouldn't answer questions directed at others is scummy. Others have disagreed. This isn't about that. On June 12 2015 07:22 ruXxar wrote: Well if the mafia are just going to lynch themselves then this should be an easy game! On June 12 2015 07:26 ruXxar wrote: I actually believe in the right of individual freedom, so as long as the mafia just stick to themselves and don't hurt anyone, I don't mind having them around  .*slaps himself* No, stop daydreaming ruxx! On June 12 2015 07:36 ruXxar wrote: Usually you want to hear the reasoning of the person you're asking. If someone answers the question before him, you potentially open up for someone else to make a logical conclusion beforehand, and then the guy the question was directed at get an easy bandwagon onto that guys conclusions. At least that is what I think. On June 12 2015 07:39 ruXxar wrote: Why don't you like liars? Lying is a powerful tool that when used in the right situation can greatly benefit one's interests. This goes for both sides. Deception is not a thing reserved only for mafia. What you meant to say is that you don't like liars that have conflicting interests from you. On June 12 2015 07:46 ruXxar wrote: He makes a few posts at the start that don't say anything. Fine, whatever.What I meant by the last sentence was that that was my number one assumption of why he made that statement. I won't pretend to be a mind reader, but I find it strange that he throws out unsubstantiated claims like that. So far kickstart is a scumlean for me. Then he answers the question I asked to Kickstart. Then he comments on Kickstart talking about people not lying. Even here, he seems to be putting words in Kickstart's mouth (whether or not you accept his explanation). And only in the very last post, after I made a scum lean on him, does he actually say something about Kickstart's alignment. He's commenting without thinking about people's alignments. That simply isn't a town mindset. 2. Early scumread of Kickstart feels forced + Show Spoiler + On June 12 2015 08:04 ruXxar wrote: Here is where he clearly explains his scumread of Kickstart.I didn't like his statement about not liking liars. This whole game is based on the concept of deception. If you don't like that aspect of the game, why are you here? You might claim that you like hunting lying mafia, But it's not a given beforehand what role you will be, so that doesn't make sense either. I have no prior info about any of the players here, so he might have some personal conviction for why he said that, but to me it didn't seem like a genuine well thought through statement. While this read is bad, I could still see it coming from town, except for this post: On June 12 2015 07:39 ruXxar wrote: Here, his first thought is that Kickstart made a wording error. And he provides a possible slight wording change that would make Kickstart's sentence align with ruXxar's own thoughts.Why don't you like liars? Lying is a powerful tool that when used in the right situation can greatly benefit one's interests. This goes for both sides. Deception is not a thing reserved only for mafia. What you meant to say is that you don't like liars that have conflicting interests from you. RuXxar said this before he scumread Kickstart. On June 12 2015 08:14 Kickstart wrote: This is Kickstart's second post in the thread, after ruXxar had concluded that he was scumreading Kickstart.Liers means if you say you are going to do something but don't when it comes to forum mafia. Also good job breaking one of my rules, you answered a question directed at me! RuXxar gave a potential explanation for someone's behavior as town, then scumread that person before waiting for clarification or any more posts from them. To me, it feels like ruXxar forced the read to fit in. 3. Keeps saying he wants more thread activity, but does nothing about it + Show Spoiler + On June 12 2015 08:14 ruXxar wrote: I would also like your reason for Voting on me. Right now I want to make people talk so we have a wider range of information to base our lunches upon. On June 12 2015 08:56 ruXxar wrote: I'm going to bed now to get some good rest. I hope to see lots of activity when I read the thread tomorrow! In the time before he goes to bed, all he did was his previously mentioned scum lean on Kickstart. And he didn't really talk to Kickstart when Kickstart was in the thread (about 10 minutes after he said he was scumreading Kickstart). 4. Switches read on Kickstart for a weak reason + Show Spoiler + On June 13 2015 23:03 ruXxar wrote: This is pretty weak for a townread, especially given that ruXxar was scumreading Kickstart earlier.Then kickstart says this which aligns with my own thinking. This give me a townlean on kickstart. It's possible that ruXxar's initial scumread of Kickstart was to promote discussion. However, this doesn't make sense to me because ruXxar spent so many posts doing nothing and not providing reads. If he really wanted to promote discussoin, he would have been much more active and willing to provide reads instead of just commenting on things. Only the next day did ruXxar actually provide reads on people other than Kickstart. 5. Delay in responding to batsnacks' case on geript + Show Spoiler + At the time when batsnacks posted about geript's supposed scumslip, ruXxar had been posting fairly regularly and had been for a few hours. Still, it took him 30 minutes and several of his own posts before he actually commented on this, and he switched his vote from batsnacks to geript. By this time, geript had six votes and batsnacks had three; ruXxar's vote moved this to 7 to 2. On June 14 2015 06:10 ruXxar wrote: RuXxar's reasoning is really bad, too. He doesn't say that batsnacks' argument is persuasive or accurate, and really doesn't offer any commentary about it at all. He just says that he was scumreading both batsnacks and geript, but batsnacks can't be bussing geript here. So why does this make batsnacks town? Why isn't this mafia!batsnacks trying to get town!geript lynched instead of himself?Wow bats... I'm speechless. I had you and geript as my top two scum. I refuse to believe that you would bus your own scum teammate this hard. You really redeemed yourself here in my eyes. I'll have to change my alignment of you to town and change my vote to geript. ##Unvote batsnacks ##Vote geript Only later does ruXxar imply that batsnacks provided a convincing argument. On June 14 2015 21:52 ruXxar wrote: Why does he only now say that he was disappointed about the deadline being one hour earlier than he thought? Furthermore, in this post he's saying both that he wished he had more time to see through batsnacks' deception but he needs to ignore that post to scumread batsnacks. He's saying both that the post is good and that it's bad. This doesn't make sense.So first off. I'm very disappointed that the night actually started 1 hour earlier than expected. It didn't give me enough time to analyze batsnacks accusation even though it made sense when he posted it. I can't tell you his reasons for doing so, but it felt like such an improvised and irregular post that I don't know what to make of it. All game I had him as scum, and suddenly he makes this one move which totally breaks with his character so far. I can't help but feel like i've been fooled. I want to say that I should've stuck to my gut feeling and not be swayed so easily. If I disregard that one action of his, then batsnacks is still my top scumread. 6. Changing stance on Sulfurus + Show Spoiler + First, ruXxar said that he didn't see anything alignment indicative from Sulfurus' filter (on Day 1). He even scumread geript partly for his scumread of Sulfurus. During Night 2, ruXxar pointed out two of Sulfurus' posts that he didn't think came from a town mindset, and switched his read on Sulfurus to mafia.However, a few minutes later, he posts this: On June 15 2015 07:18 ruXxar wrote: He's scumreading Sulfurus primarily because of an association with Rels. This allows ruXxar to lynch Rels and then not Sulfurus later, or to change his mind on Rels and then not switch to Sulfurus. There's no mention of the points that ruXxar brought up to scumread Sulfurus during Night 1.Although I have to say, there's something that irs me greatly about his play. What irks me is that sulfurs actions are so blatantly bad. Attacking trelf, which to a lot of people is a townie, had such a low probability of working that I'd think no mafia would be stupid enough to try to use that as their defense. In his last game he played he went against the grain and was actually town, so from a meta standpoint his play makes sense sort of? Still the associations between him and rels are too strong. Scum From there, ruXxar changes his mind on Sulfurus and says that he is town. On June 16 2015 00:46 ruXxar wrote: Why is ruXxar only thinking about bussing?Here's my reasoning on sulfur: 1. Sulfur under pressure of getting lynched tries to accuse townread trfel of being mafia, and hard defends Rels. This play is so bad that I don't even think a bad mafia would make this play, but still it's possible. 2. After n00bking's epitaph where he recommended to lynch sulfur as #1, moosy went of the offensive. Moosy and kick then both HARD agree that I have to bus rels and sulfur as the only chance to clear my name. 3. I then push really hard on sulfur to get his thoughts on Rels. He STILL didn't want to change his view on Rels and vote for him. If he was mafia scum, and the #1 suspect by n00bking. Would he not also vote for rels to try to clear his name? Any sane mafia person would. 4. If I were mafia together with with sulfur, and our only chance of winning was to bus Rels as the first lynch target, would I not instruct my mafia teammate to also vote on Rels? I can only conclude that Sulfurus is Town Furthermore, this argument just doesn't make sense. If Rels is town, it falls apart completely. When ruXxar changes his read on Rels, he doesn't revisit Sulfurus at all. 7. Inconsistency with regards to the implication of Sulfurus' flip on Rels' alignment + Show Spoiler + On June 17 2015 05:55 ruXxar wrote: Sulfur: If sulfur is mafia then I don't think these 3 people are mafia : Bats, Moosy, Rels On June 17 2015 07:13 ruXxar wrote: Well. Since he flipped mafia I'm sticking to the list I posted earlier. These people are not mafia : Bats Moosy On June 17 2015 08:20 ruXxar wrote: Yeah...Actually from the way Sulfur played I can conclude that Rels is mafia. 100% 8. Jumped around a lot and posted a variety of thoughts Day 1 through Night 2, then stopped + Show Spoiler + It's generally scummy to keep changing a read for no reason. But if someone does it all the time, it's possible that they just play like this. It's not bad, it just means that you have to look at the bigger picture for mafia motivation. I've been generally ignoring the fact that ruXxar's reads keep changing all the time. However, over the course of Day 3, his reads stayed relatively constant. He's not being crazy and jumping on everything, he was basically just suspicious of scott31337, Oatsmaster, and sometimes Damdred throughout the day. Not many read switches at all. It makes me feel like ruXxar is mafia and got too lazy to keep constantly changing his reads, he saw the lynch on town and let it sit there. This is shown because he initially said that Oatsmaster is scum and scott31337 is town, but when the scott31337 wagon didn't move, he switched to scott31337 and then sat there for the rest of the day. Reasons ruXxar could be town 1. Joined the push onto batsnacks as the second vote + Show Spoiler + While ruXxar didn't do anything to actually promote discussion or push anything for the first day, he did start the next day with a push on batsnacks. These actions are consistent with his words. 2. Generally willing to make his opinions clear + Show Spoiler + First with his scumread of batsnacks, then by following that up to scumread geript. 3. Very active The last two points are simple and general, but they shouldn't be underestimated. I don't feel completely sure, but it does feel like ruXxar is reasonably likely to be mafia here. It's not that hard for mafia to provide clear reasoning, the hard part is for the reasoning to be sensible, deal with scumbuddies nonchalantly, and to be consistent enough to be understood. And ruXxar is active and clear, but his play shows faults with regards to these things. Would like to see ruXxar's response. | ||
|
Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
| ||
|
Rels
France13467 Posts
On June 20 2015 17:50 Oatsmaster wrote: Who scum reads me? I just wanna know who I should kill ^^. I do. I expect to see you tonight then. I'll leave some cookies on the kitchen. | ||
|
Trfel
7015 Posts
I've only played with WaveofShadow once before, in Noir Mini Mafia Chapter 3. I was town, and he was scum. We caught him Day 2, and I helped with that. I caught him mostly for commenting and sharing suspicions but not actually pushing his reads, and for having his pushes not line up with his words. So I'll be looking primarily at how his words and actions line up. His first major scumread was geript. + Show Spoiler + On June 12 2015 11:14 WaveofShadow wrote: So he's scum making obvious looking town lynchbait post because nobody at all commented on it? This is shitlogic right here ladies and gents. ##vote: geript I will be so proud of myself here. On June 12 2015 14:39 WaveofShadow wrote: Back from streaming Town tier: Oats, Kickstart, Moosy Blergh tier: Almost everybody Scum tier: Geript, noobking 2 ez On June 13 2015 02:27 WaveofShadow wrote: WaveofShadow made several other posts on geript. He seemed truly interested in pushing geript, and his filter has a clear direction.Too scummy to be scum is a poor metric. Geript absolutely can be (and likely is) mafia here. While geript wasn't providing large amounts of new content, WaveofShadow was reading and responding to geript. On June 13 2015 03:12 WaveofShadow wrote: This is a clear difference from WaveofShadow's play in Noir Chapter 3 (as scum).You wish you could get me lynched bbygrl. I like your 'everyone is town' list. Especially the part where you exclude me from it. His suspicion of n00bKing wasn't pushed, but he provided an insightful reason for removing his scumread of n00bKing (that newbie mafia would stop doing the thing that was getting them scumread, while only newbie town would keep doing it). However, this is something I noticed WaveofShadow do as scum. He scumreads someone, and then says why someone else's reasons for scumreading that person are wrong. This doesn't make much sense from a town perspective. In addition to geript, (and excluding n00bKing), WaveofShadow showed suspicion towards Sulfurus and batsnacks. When he changed his read on geript (for a weird reason, see here), he was fairly early to suggest that batsnacks was town, and voted for Sulfurus. Even though his explanation for unvoting geript isn't very convincing, I don't see scum voting for Sulfurus here while saying that batsnacks (the other wagon at the time) is town. With only these two wagons, and batsnacks being in the lead, this play doesn't make sense. The last thing scum wants to do on Day 1 is to bus. And when WaveofShadow returns the next day, he does push the Sulfurus lynch. + Show Spoiler + On June 14 2015 03:46 WaveofShadow wrote: You know it's funny I remember unvoting you for feels and now that I'm back and seeing that you haven't done anything, nor am I seeing hardcore scumhunter geript I'm starting to worry again. Would not lynch above Sulf though. Nothing redeeming about that guy whatsoever. Might sheep Trfel too. Really liking him this game. I also remember Damdred and Scott pinging my radar for some reason---something along the lines of not knowing where they stand but I think scott sort of addressed it. Damdred who do YOU want to lynch today aside form 'not batsnacks?' On June 14 2015 04:50 WaveofShadow wrote: I'm tempted to sheep myself but I personally think Sulf is worse here. He keeps showing up, posting something once of no consequence and fucking off again. Why exactly do you think Rels is a better lynch? On June 14 2015 05:08 WaveofShadow wrote: 'Cause he's about to be lynched. Come on, bats. I'm fine with Sulf and Rels being the wagons for now. I'll keep my vote where it is for the moment. We should try and consolidate closer to deadline though so no room for last minute solo switches I do find it odd that WaveofShadow wasn't around for the two hours before the deadline, but he did hint at the possibility that he wouldn't be online. I missed that earlier. WaveofShadow scumread Sulfurus and Rels on Night 1, and followed up with a vote on Sulfurus early in Day 2. He continued to actually push Sulfurus. Assuming that Rels is town (which could very well be false...), I don't see why mafia!WaveofShadow would bus Sulfurus instead of voting for Rels when Rels had five votes. The Rels wagon looked solid (this was before Rels started his extreme activity thing), and WaveofShadow had scumread both of them. I'm getting sleepy now, I can't finish this tonight. But WaveofShadow pushed Sulfurus very aggressively, at times when mafia wouldn't need or want to bus. Furthermore, the way he pushed his scumreads through the first half (or so) of Day 2 is vastly different from his play as scum (Noir Chapter 3). I find it very hard to see WaveofShadow being scum here. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
On June 20 2015 17:16 Trfel wrote: ruXxar Reasons ruXxar could be scum Would like to see ruXxar's response. 1. Early on, ruXxar was slow to discuss people's alignments: I don't see how your quotes back up that statement. All of those quotes are from the first few pages of the game, and then there's even a scumlean in there. My reads so far this game has been : Mafia: # Kickstart scum, # Bats scum, # Moosy medic # Geript scum (I read his filter before the battrap and I already found it lacking. It was easy for me to sheep bats at that point) # n00bking town, # Trfel town, # Rels scum, # Moosy scum baiting as medic, # kickstart scum, # oatsmaster and scott scum. # scott town # wave town # batsnacks town # kickstarter town Probably not correct order,but accurate enough. To say I haven't been out there putting my neck on the line and making alignment statements is wrong. I used exactly that argument against Moosy first time around when I accused him of being wishy washy and non committal. 2. Early scumread of Kickstart feels forced Again an argument from the first 5 pages of the game, you read too much into it. 3. Keeps saying he wants more thread activity, but does nothing about it First off, my filter is twice as long as yours. Second off, if you read my filter you can see that I've actually been pushing the thread all game, not afraid to throw out new thoughts, trying to spotlight players I feel have been getting an easy pass. Whenever I've had an opinion I've thrown it out there, even to the point of making me look wishy washy sometimes because I make new realizations minutes after I post them, and most of the time they even contradict my previous thoughts. I'm not afraid to make pushes on people that other considered towny based on my own interpretation of the situation. I don't need other peoples arguments to make a push, I make them myself. When I say that I'm going to bed, it usually means I'm going from my computer to my bed, and start reading on my phone. And yes, I don't push equally as strong every day. I have a day job that requires my attention and sometimes the thread is simply at a standstill and you've run out of ideas. I find this argument to be very weak also. 4. Switches read on Kickstart for a weak reason: I actually went through geripts filter and came to the same conclusion that he did. Admit it, geripts filter was weak, and going through the filter I came to the same realizations that kickstart did. Besides the first statement about liars from kickstart, he did nothing else that made me feel he was more scummy. Again, you read too much into the first few pages of the game. 5. Delay in responding to batsnacks' case on geript I think this makes perfect sense. My top two scumreads were bats and geript. I did not think bats would bus his own teammate. This makes bats seem town. I don't see how this logic is hard to follow. 6. Changing stance on Sulfurus So this is probably the most damning evidence against me, my alignment with sulfurus. Yes, I was wrong on sulfurus. My mentality was that his plays were too obviously bad to be scum. As you say this argument falls apart if Rels is town, which I actually realized in a later post Despite that, I still clung onto the fact that sulfurus was town. Even if the evidence was right in front of me, i had somehow locked away the thought of re-evaluating sulfurus, due to my earlier conviction. That's a terrible mindset to have from my side, but that's how I thought at that point. Combine that with the fact that he'd been talking good about me all game, he actually did an excellent job in converting me to his side. I don't know if that was his plan, but I have to commend him for it, and slap myself hard for falling for it. 7. Inconsistency with regards to the implication of Sulfurus' flip on Rels' alignment Let me explain. After the flip on sulfurus, my head was in a disarray. Everything I had believed in so hard had just fallen apart. At this point im scrambling to try to make sense of things. So I put Rels on that list because the only reason I could think of that made sense with sulfurus flipped, was that rels was town. Which comes from the realization I had in point 6 above. Then I later reevaluate and think that I must've been overthinking and that sulfur was actually just defending his scum teammate all along which I outlined in this post: On June 17 2015 09:30 ruXxar wrote: Here's my thoughts. People were voting on sulf day one. Trfel makes a case on rel. Sulf calls rels his best town read and sticks too it all game. End of story. I used to believe in the too obvious too be scum theory. I don't anymore. 8. Jumped around a lot and posted a variety of thoughts Day 1 through Night 2, then stopped + Show Spoiler + I've been generally ignoring the fact that ruXxar's reads keep changing all the time. However, over the course of Day 3, his reads stayed relatively constant. He's not being crazy and jumping on everything, he was basically just suspicious of scott31337, Oatsmaster, and sometimes Damdred throughout the day. Not many read switches at all. By day 2, tell me who else you would find suspicious besides scott, oats and possibly damdred? You can't deny that oats and scott were looking the worst, you even said it yourself and almost everyone agreed on the point that either of them were scum. So this point applies to pretty much everyone on day 2. You call me lazy, but I made cases against oats and scott and I mentioned damdred multiple times. I actually thought that Scott was mafia. But then I looked at his day 1. And I had to agree with moosy, it actually looked very towny. + Show Spoiler + On June 17 2015 07:50 ruXxar wrote: Btw Scott is mafia 100%. On June 17 2015 08:33 ruXxar wrote: You're right. When i look at Scotts voting patterns it doesn't make sense, since he even voted for Rels. Yup Scott is town and Rels is mafia. I later changed my mind on scott since I didn't like his defense when pressured. ------------------------------- If something is unclear or you feel I didn't adequately respond to a point, please ask and I will clarify any questions you have. I'm very happy to have an open discussion of where we go from here. This is my current read list: #Trfel: town. #wave: town. He did make some weird posts lately though, not sure what to read into that. #damdred: uncertain, I pegged mostly his inactivity, but he said he had internet outage so I don't know. #batsnacks: town. #kickstart: town. #Rels: uncertain. He puts in a lot of effort though, which I like. #Oats: scum although I don't know why sulfurus would try to make a case against him, not sure here. I'll be re-evaluating some posts from the last day and try to create some talking points. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
I'll make an evaluation on him to see if I can put together a solid case based on his actions. After I'm done with that I'll be giving you my clear stance on Rels. I'm doing this as much for my own sake, to get all my thoughts in order. I need to clear out my head on the Rels/sulfur association. | ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
I know it's a lot to catch up to, but please try to summarize your thoughts on the situation. I would appreciate it very much. | ||
|
Rels
France13467 Posts
On June 20 2015 21:51 ruXxar wrote: From actually thinking through what I wrote up above, it could make sense that Rels is mafia. I'll make an evaluation on him to see if I can put together a solid case based on his actions. After I'm done with that I'll be giving you my clear stance on Rels. I'm doing this as much for my own sake, to get all my thoughts in order. I need to clear out my head on the Rels/sulfur association. Sure. I'm happy you're doing this 'cause here is my POE right now: Town: WOS Trfel batsnacks Kickstart ruxxar Scum: Damdred Oatsmaster You're my weakest town read, so bring on your case. I want to see if it's forced or not. | ||
|
Rels
France13467 Posts
On June 20 2015 10:56 Oatsmaster wrote: Rels looks like mafia for not seeing the "scum slip" You're serious about not reading. Ruxxar pointed about this "slip" first, and we pressured scott about it, and here was his response: On June 20 2015 00:54 scott31337 wrote: I did but I had real life issues and was unable to use it. Coaching QT: LoneMeow http://www.quicktopic.com/51/H/vWGAAqtcjfQp | ||
|
Oatsmaster
United States16628 Posts
| ||
|
ruXxar
Norway5669 Posts
Imagine for a second, that Rels fell for the same thing that I did. This follows along the logic that batsnacks outlines which led to both me and Rels actually reading sulfurus as town. In that case I can understand both me and Rels defending sulfurus on day 2. What I can't understand is how oats master kept his vote on kickstart over sulfurus. Look at this votecount at the end of day 2: Oh fish ul Votecount ruXxar (0): Rels (0): Sulfurus (7): MoosyDoosy (0): kickstart (2): Oatsmaster (1): sulfurus ----------------------------- Do you not see something suspicious here? Sulfurus is voting for oats, yet oats is voting for kickstart. So I wanted to see the reason for why oats is voting on kickstart. First, i wanted to look at sulfurus / oatsmaster association. This is what I found: Oatsmaster expresses his desire to lynch sulfurus: + Show Spoiler + On June 13 2015 11:11 Oatsmaster wrote: btw we still have like a day lol. if bats flips town, ill be going after sulfurus. On June 13 2015 11:37 Oatsmaster wrote: I'm scum reading sulfurus because you are sleeping people onto bats, means you don't really tthink bats is mafia, but your town reads do so you value their opinion over yours. Bats isn't gonna shit up the thread lol, that's an empty threat. I was totally right about geript switching off moose btw. I think geript is easily mafia. Here oats claims that sulfu was really obvious mafia: + Show Spoiler + On June 18 2015 09:30 Oatsmaster wrote: It's not for town cred. It's for not looking like mafia when sulph eventually flips. Which clearly worked to you anyway. Sulph was just so obvious man. If you ignore voting analysis, what else makes him town? Here oats says he's really against the kickstarter lynch: + Show Spoiler + On June 16 2015 08:41 Oatsmaster wrote: I really dont like this kickstart lynch, its coming up super fast and everyone is supporting it. What happened to lynching ruxxar? I thought that was pretty good. or damdred. On June 16 2015 10:17 Oatsmaster wrote: Kickstart is pretty damn obviously town and him not doing anything doesn't really diminish his start. Like this is a super easy lynch for scum to push because Kickstart 's attitude sucks and a pretty predictable response will come. Let's lynch ruxxar instead. On June 16 2015 10:18 Oatsmaster wrote: Seriously why the hell is kickstart a better lynch. Can someone like trfel give me one reason that doesn't include the words activity and promises. Yet somehow, he stayed the course and voted on kickstarter? Something doesn't add up here. Later claims that I could've been a bus + Show Spoiler + On June 17 2015 08:39 Oatsmaster wrote: I really dont think anyone should be given a townread for that lynch without kickstart flipping. Sulph looked really bad the whole game, it might just have been a bus. Also, both sulph and kickstart expressed an interest in lynching me. Which is really weird. Scott switched really late, like 10 minutes before the deadline and you guys are calling him town?!?? On June 17 2015 09:43 Oatsmaster wrote: Yeah you don't know the concept of bussing. Why does he mention bussing? Well because he wants people to think that all the mafia are amongst the guys voting on sulfurus, so as to remove suspicion from himself who stayed on kickstart. Which either means that Rels is mafia, or that there actually is 1 mafia voting on sulfurus. Add that together with these two comments On June 17 2015 20:19 Oatsmaster wrote: hey at least im not getting killed tonight. On June 17 2015 23:49 Oatsmaster wrote: Hey at least im not dying tonight. And him trying to deflect away from sulfurus: On June 15 2015 12:58 Oatsmaster wrote: moosy, you rather lynch rels than sulf today right? And if you add together ALL of this "Hey lets kill" or "Hey this guy is mafia" posts: + Show Spoiler + On June 20 2015 15:31 Oatsmaster wrote: Guys come on, start talking. Let's discuss trfel being mafia. On June 18 2015 01:01 Oatsmaster wrote: Wave you want to lunch danded tmr? On June 14 2015 09:14 Oatsmaster wrote: Let's get moosy tmr On June 14 2015 00:14 Oatsmaster wrote: Lets lynch geript kk. I really want to vote for oatsmaster. ##Vote oatsmaster | ||
|
Rels
France13467 Posts
| ||
|
Kickstart
United States1941 Posts
| ||
| ||
