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[W] Newbie LVIII - Disney Princess Mafia
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Barakos
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Barakos
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On August 12 2014 23:28 Amiko wrote: That's fine! If you have any questions on how the game works or anything like that, feel free to ask about them in thread before the game begins or by PMing a host. Your coach(es) can give you advice, too. I guess the most questions will come up while actually playing... and for the meantime, you gave quite a lot to read. And it's not, like there are no other games running on TL, which you could read to get a feel of how mafia is played here... I think I actually found a game with some names, that are also in this game. ^^ | ||
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And 'Happy Birthday' to our host, if i am not missinterpreting that little birthday-hat right next to your name! ^^ On August 26 2014 10:22 Superbia wrote: Scumreading JennyHell and abuse due to evil sounding names. Funny, that out of all people you call someone out for having an evil name, when it is you, who is using the latin word for 'pride', one of the seven cardinal sins, as your name... And in the last newbie-game a guy named DCLXVI was a mafia goon... latin numbers... and connected to the devil as well... this can't be a coincidence! | ||
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First of, to get this out of the world (at least I hope so): I didn't mean to attack superbia. I liked the irony and wanted to point it out, because I found it funny. I may be new to forummafia but i wouldn't go as far as calling people scum because of their names. I also could have added some smileys to make the intention behind the post a bit clearer. For what it's worth: 'Barakos' is a name I took out of a Warhammer Fantasy Battlereport, where the author named his Strigoi-Vampirecount 'Barakos' and i've been using the name ever since, so if you want a 'scummy' name... there you got it.  Hope, that will be all, there is left to say about the name-discussion... now for the important stuff: On Jenny: I think Jenny is playing very similar to the last Newbie-Mafia and trys to get the thread going / is very vocal, so seeing that she was town the last game, I read her as town for now, although i am not very sure, since she stated herself: On August 26 2014 16:59 JennyHell wrote: Whether I am mafia or town I would still play the exact same way, or at least try to, so that in the off chance I would get mafia in a game in the future it'll be easier for me to seem towny. Still most towny person at the moment. On Abuse: I didn't like you posting questions before answering them yourself... especially the ones, where you ask for the opinions on lurker- and liar-lynches.. It looks to me, as if you were trying to get yourselft the permission to lurk for a while... granted: you answered your questions when you were asked, still I found this a bit odd and will keep an eye on you. And to answer your questions: My alignment is town, but i kinda hoped i would roll mafia. I absolutely hate playing in the dark, so i would have loved to know, who is friend and who is foe. Now i will have to trust my instincts... god help us all! Lynching a liar is something that is very situation-dependend... like "Did the person lie to protect a powerrole at night?" vs. "Did sb. fakeclaim a powerrole at daytime to get the real powerrole lynched?". Lynching the lurkers is something I would only resort to, if I had no better scumread on anybody else, since I think it is a quite weak motiv to lynch somebody and chances are high, the lynchee will flip town. That being said: this is my first forumgame, so I haven't really met any really annoying lurkers. Let's just hope, everybody is active in this game, so we can get solid reads. On the other ones, that have posted so far: There is not much I can read out of your posts so far... mostly due to the fact, that there aren't that many posts to read from. | ||
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Nice you put that much work into the game... although the readability is suffering quite hard... i had to copy your stuff into a extra editor to try and filter it through... maybe next time split it up into several little ones? Pretty please? But there are three points, I would like to ask you about... first of all our Man of Plenty names... How do you read what meatpudding said about looking into Jennys heart to see her true alignment as a cop-softclaim? I mean... I can see how you could come to this conclusion, but to me this all sounds in line with the fluff the whole post was written in. So this seems a little far fetched. To be honest I find it pretty suspicious to talk people into (soft-)roleclaims before the first End of Day... feels like putting a crosshair on their back for the first night and the last thing I would want to do is make scums job of powerrole-hunting any easier. Maybe you might want to be a bit more careful with such conclusions? Unless of course I am missing sth... please guide me through the darkness, good fairy! Next thing is your vote on Breshke. While I get, that this vote might simply be a leverage to get him to talk... why exactly him? If I had to vote at this point to get somebody to participate, I would put it on Daydreamarine, gobbledydook or lilwade, since those didn't really post anything. Breshke at least promised some reads and seeing he is from Australia you got to take the timezones into consideration... maybe he is just asleep and before he went offline, there were not really that many posts you could use to read people. Same goes for meatpudding. Last thing would be Mihzaa vs. abuse Mihzaa scored -1 on your list, while abuse was at -0.5 yet still abuse is on your lynch-list, while Mihzaa isn't. Is there any read you have not given yet? And since I got some questions for you, here are the answers to your request: Towncircle: JennyHell (still in there, although she has been very quiet after her strong start, this judgement might also be a bit influenced by her strong towngame in the earlier mafia) almost towncircle, but didn't quite make the cut: Superbia I really liked the effort, you put into your post but after reading it the first time, I found it to be quite empty, since about 66.67% of it are agreements to statements others did, 16.67% are comments like "cool", "get a room", etc... and only the remaining part is your own opinion. But you seem comfortable in your opinion and I am looking forward to your answers. Mafia: none yet For me it is too early to have strong mafia-reads but I really need to hear stuff from lilwade, gobbledydook and daydreamarine | ||
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My last question has already been answered, so don't bother doing it again. | ||
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On August 27 2014 03:25 JennyHell wrote: I do come off rather strong at times, I agree. It's my new thing I discovered since I started playing forum mafia. How would you say you usually come off when playing forum mafia? Just curious. I think I already mentioned it in my first larger post but here again and in a bit more detail: This is my first game of forum mafia and I haven't played mafia in a good amount of years. We had a quite big group of live-mafia-players back in the day, when I still went to school but as it goes with everything, if you go to school in a smaller city... people spread out to go to university / do their required military service or get jobs in other cities, so we stopped playing. Few weeks ago i stumbled over the Mafia-section of this forum, got interested, lurked in some games and got more interested, and now - her i am. | ||
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But let's see, if we can lead this thread into a more productive direction... On August 27 2014 03:21 Superbia wrote: Eh, the soft claim may or may not be true. It just means I probably don't want to lynch him day 1 unless some dirty shit comes up. I also don't really think I'm helping mafia here, it really could mean anything, like you pointed out, but if it eases your mind I'll stop pointing shit like that out.  I don't want to elaborate too much on bresh at the moment until he starts talking. Fine with me, if you don't want to talk about Breshke right now. But I'll come back to this point some point into the game, if it is still important by the time, Breshke answers. Mind to talk a little about abuse? From your giant post I get, that you also didn't like the way he brought the discussion about policies into the thread. Are you with me, when i say that it looks kind of scummy and seems like he is trying to find out, if it is ok to lurk? Or do you think there is the possibility I am overreading things and he just made it sound a little weird? | ||
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the "Thanks, I guess " -part was directed at Jenny for welcoming me back to mafia. | ||
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On August 27 2014 05:00 lilwade wrote: 3) Barakos I think you started of pretty strong but have moved down a little bit with some filler posts. Who do you think we should persue? Did you actually read superbia's post? do you think it could have been scum motivated? What in it makes you think it is an abomination or were you merely calling it that because of how long it was? What are your thoughts on abuse? Welcome to the discussion, lilwade! About time, i might add. First about that abomination-part, since it is the easiest thing to answer: I didn't want to discredit superbia for putting as much effort in his post as he did. What I wanted to express was, that his post is absolutely huge and doesn't look pretty... just like the abominations in warcraft 3. I disliked several points in superbias post, which i already pointed out and he answered already to my concerns. Did you actually read, what I had to say about it? The thing I found most scummy was him trying to put a soft-copclaim to meatpudding for something that in my eyes was absolutely no claim at all. But his answers and - again - the huge effort behind his post make him look more towny than scummy in my eyes, which brings me directly to your next question... who should we persue? This is a hard one. My current feeling is, that i don't like the four guys who haven't posted anything meaningfull at all, which are Breshke, meatpudding, gobbledydook and daydreamarine but I think we should not persue them quite yet... three of them are australians (MP, Breshke and gobbledydook), which leaves only daydreamarine looking kind of suspicious, since he is in my timezone and should have had plenty of time to read at least something. But again... I don't want to pursue someone yet for not posting anything at all... there are still 29 hours of D1 left for them to make their entrance. So with Jenny being in my town and Superbia being close to being in my town this leaves you, abuse and mihzaaa as possible D1 lynches. Your post seems towny to me. You gave lots of reads and spoke out your opinion on several topics that were discussed earlier, which is good, but at the same time asked questions about a whole bunch of people. This can be attributed to you reading the whole thread and just gathering your thoughts but it could also be you trying to find something on some townie that will stick. So I haven't made up my mind on you yet. I think I also made clear in an earlier post, that i got some reservations towards abuse, of which I am not quite sure, whether they are just a wrong feeling about him on my side caused by our different understanding of what a lurker is or if they are substantiated. Mihzaaaa - i got a hard time reading him. I will have to look closer at his filter to make up my mind. Right now i get a feeling, that he could be town. Mainly based on the big post he made to comment on Superbias post, in which he pointed out where he agreed with superbia and where he disagreed and gave a general insight in his thoughtprocess. Also i like this sentence a lot: I like this a lot because I think things got a little heavy. I am guilty of being aggressive at times and i think it's a good policy to push but not harass and to inquire but not interrogate. Nothing is worse than a thread full of people shouting and flaming each other... | ||
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On August 27 2014 05:54 Superbia wrote: Sounds like a preface for getting easy miss-lynches and blaming it on lying/lurking. Lynch all lurkers is "ok". Lynch all liars is garbage. I already fucking lied (gave misinformation about my points), where's the HARD push, huh? Why reveal this? And why so early? This makes no sense as town. You should at least wait until everyone has answered the questions. And on that note, despite requests, abuse still hasn't answered all of them. Furthermore, to me, this makes it feel like there is much more substance behind the questions than there actually is. Don't get me wrong, I kind of liked the question behind lynching liars and lurkers, but it could also be used to distract town and eat time. The real question is: what have you gotten from the answers and how does it contribute to town? What? There's plenty to read (alright, not that much, but what?). I gave no reads in return? Did you even read my post? Or are you not interested in what town has to say? Red flag right here. Also, you didn't ask any reads from anyone yet, so it's okay not to provide any of your own? Not asking people shit is a bad sign, by the way. Another part that makes it blatantly obvious that you only skimmed over my post. Did you just crtl+f "scum" or something? How do I "rush too much"? You mean giving opinions and reads? Are you not happy that I'm giving a shitload of data (not all of it being good, granted), even though you complained about "no people being around". Good morning everyone. Just woke up, so here some thoughts on the abuse-case before i head to work: 1st quote and your reaction: I feel like you are overreacting at this point. You were called out instantly by 2 people on your math not adding up and gave the explanation to this without hesitation. abuse himself said, that lying without explanation would lead to him pushing people... you explained why you "lied" (i wouldn't even agreeing on it being a lie), so I would not have awaited a reaction from him, since pushing this point would have made him look more mafia than town. 2nd quote and your reaction: Here you slip hard. abuse has answered all of his questions http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia?page=7#129 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia?page=7#131 as well as the questions I had for him... in fact the post you quoted here was an answer to me questioning his motives behind asking his questions. 3rd and 4th quote and your reaction: You are absolutely right. Anybody calling you out for not giving any reads and not being consistant with your opinion is not reading your posts close enough. Your reasoning on why Jenny is in your towncirle wasn't obvious, since you started with a -0.5 on her but you developed your opinion on her throughout your entire post and in the end it made sense. I had to reread it all and add up your numbers twice, but it did make sense. 5th quote: While I see the valid points in your post, I feel very uncomfortable voting on him yet, since he is one of the top contributors to the thread and your vote feels rushed to me, too. Care to say something about my first two points? | ||
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I am still very unsure about you. Would you mind explaining the following: On August 27 2014 04:25 MihZaaa wrote: What bothers me is that the people I read as scummy have either not spoken lately or have barely spoken. I wouldn't like this to be a wasted lynch where we end up just lynching for inactivity but it seems that's the direction we're heading to. On August 27 2014 08:08 MihZaaa wrote: From least scummy to most. Barakos Superbia and JennyHell Abuse You complain about your scum-suspects not contributing enough yet you put abuse, one of the most vocal ones in this thread so far as most scummy? I feel like you are contradicting yourself here. Especially since your post was right after two posts of abuse. meatpudding: I disagree with your read on abuse, especially with calling this part: On August 27 2014 04:22 abuse wrote: I also completely disagree on your rating. Seems a little weird that you give minuses for some points (seriously? -0.5 because you think that warning you that I am vocal in my games and will push people who i find scummy - to be a preface for possibly scummy play), yet you comment on much of Jenny's stuff, along with "scummy reference, careful now!" but still give her no minuses. Sounds like blind agreement to someone who is the most vocal at the moment, while at the moment Jenny really has not done anything yet that would classify as real town. Only neutral. good analysis. This is a part I find especially scummy about abuse, since it shows, he hasn't read superbias post completely or is intentionally disregarding superbias change of mind on jenny just to make a point against one of the more towny people. Would you mind, rereading superbias post with a special filter on his tells on jenny and tell me, if you still think abuses post is good analysis? And speaking of Jenny: I like that you don't trust her completely... I went through my reads and find, that I cut her quite some slack. I will have to rethink my standpoint on her in the near future. I can see your vote on Superbia as a result of him trying to put a softclaim on you and him not reading all of abuses posts before making a case. But don't you think, superbia also got some really valid points on abuse and that therefore your vote is a bit too quick? gobbledydook: I didn't like you, coming in the thread and 15 lines of content later you claim to have discovered a scumduo. While I agree with you on abuse having some very suspicious posts, I dislike that you completely discard the fact, that it was his posts that got the thread going in the end. Would you care to bring forward some more points that back up your vote and make me believe that you actually read the whole thread and not just some posts that led you to believe, abuse is scum? At the moment, I believe you are overcompensating for being inactive the first 24h. | ||
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On August 27 2014 18:24 abuse wrote: Barakos What did you notice about me so far, while keeping an eye on me? I have explained this in one of my last posts, (the huge one) how does your opinion change, when you see that it was not what was implied by superbia? Why do you see why meatpudding does not trust jenny completely, but do not see why I don't? I noticed that you have gotten pretty defensive, which is a natural reaction, given the fact that you are being pushed right now. - So there is no read from this. You seemed overly defensive, when i asked Superbia about his thoughts on your motives and you jumped in before he could answer. Didn't like that you called it silly and a waste of time, when all I wanted to do is get him talking. I wrote in another post, that I thought his huge openingpost contained only little valid information, given how long it was, so I felt the need to get some more information out of him, which in the end I got, when he made the big case on you, even though this wasn't the result of my question. The explanation you gave on the read-discussion is as good, as it is simple. I can see that you meant something different than superbia and I understood. It was a fault by me for pushing you about this, while not thoroughly rereading what superbia quoted. On Jenny I already stated that I realize, I've got Jenny in my townpile without any good reason and that I am looking into it. And I allways could understand, why you wouldn't trust Jenny, I had a different problem with your push on Superbia. When Superbia put him in his townpile and you questioned his descision I read it as an attack on him for just having her in his townpile, which was absolutely fine with me at that moment (The fact, he put her in his townpile), since i was on his page and it also fitted with his logic and smaller reads he gave in his post. Now I realize, that you didn't mind the fact he had her flagged as town but much more the way he analyzed Jenny. For example you mentioned his comment "scummy reference, careful now!" which I read as one of his many trollish comments, he did in his post. Since I found the tone of most of his comments to be quite trollish, I didn't take that comment seriously and therefore found no inconsistency in his townread on Jenny. You did take the "scum reference" comment serious and therefor found some flaws in his logic, which you pointed out, which is good, since it makes me question the way I read his giant post, since I might have been blinded by his trollish undertone and therefore missed several slips and flaws. | ||
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On August 27 2014 21:36 gobbledydook wrote: What's wrong with proposing a scumduo? If you don't agree, that's fine, but scumreading someone for not having the same opinion is not fine. You overemphasize 'getting the thread going'. The thread is going to get going regardless of any person posting sooner or later on day 1. If I wanted I could also post a ton of open questions to 'get the thread going' but that's not the point. The point of discussion is to provide insight. Now that abuse has posted his list of reads I think he's town. I think he has put a massive effort into solving this game. The only thing I don't like is he omguses me, but that's fine I can live with that. ##Unvote A reread of meatpudding's analysis and follow-up to my post seems to indicate he is town. Also for those saying I just jumped into the thread randomly, that's how I roll, you can see my other games in the TL mafia database and I do this every game regardless of alignment. I am just not a high volume poster. I also happen to live in Australia where kangaroos live and where your night is my day. So you read a post of mp, called him abuses scumbuddy, get called out for it not being valid, read some more posts to see, that you couldn't hold up your point and retract instantly? Why didn't you bother with reading first and posting after? On August 27 2014 23:21 gobbledydook wrote: And if you want to lynch me that's fine. When I flip 'Princess Aurora, the Sleeping Beauty' as I claimed, then we know who's been misrepresenting my words and pushing for a mislynch. So you are trying to scare people away from voting to lynch you by saying "Don't vote for me, cause if you do, everybody will know I am a princess, which makes you scum?" Your overall appearance here in this thread looks pretty bad up until now. You hop in, you post some stuff, put a vote down, shortly afterwards take back everything you said, don't answer any question directed at you and on top of it all, you also explain that we shouldn't expect any more out of you, since this you are not a high volume poster and just randomly hop in and out of threads? Where is your effort to solve this game? I can't see it and the way you put it, you make it look like you are also not very interested in putting any effort into it. ##vote gobbledydook | ||
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On August 28 2014 04:30 JennyHell wrote: Barakos To start with I have a question. Do you usually answer your own questions before you let the person you ask answer? "Hey, I'm feeling awesome today, how are you?". I agree that if abuse had never answered the question himself, it would have been scummy. But to call him out on it so shortly after the question is a bit odd I think. Of course I don't usually answer my own questions beforehand. This would make for some quite strange conversations irl, i guess. But this isn't irl - it's a forumgame where everybody has to be as open as possible for us to win, to prevent misslynches. I found he wasn't open, I called him out and pushed a little... he answered the questions I still was a little suspicious about him but didn't keep going at it forever. Could have been too soon to call him out, yet I still felt the need to do it. That's all. | ||
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On August 28 2014 04:57 JennyHell wrote: Marry I'm not quite ready to marry someone yet, but I do have a keen eye for Barakos. How about we do a temporary engagement. Will you be my lovely bride? As tempting as it sounds to have you as my bastion of light, hope and all that is good in this world of wickedness... I am afraid I can't fully commit to being your bride right now. But let's talk some more and see, where it goes from here, shall we? You say lilwade is playing like last game and therefore have him in your banglist for now, even though he isn't very active. And at the same time your feeling about meatpudding is, that he plays a different game as last time, yet still you give him enough credit to put him on your banglist - at least for a one night stand. So my question is - why do you treat both the same, while only one of them is behaving as he used to do in the last game? | ||
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On August 28 2014 07:00 JennyHell wrote: It's really simple actually. Meat is scummy because I don't recognize this side of him, but his logic and his reads makes sense to me even if I don't agree fully on them. I like his approach to the game. lilwade is acting the same, and although he's not contributed much, I don't feel ready to lynch him this day due to something I noticed that I don't feel comfortable sharing right now. I can relate to your point on meatpudding, since i got the same feeling about his logic and even though he didn't post much, his answer to the question i had for him helped me see, where I missunderstood abuse. I got mixed feelings about lilwade. His entrancepost seemed sloppy to me, since he seemed to have missed some posts but he mentioned he was under some kind of stress because school. Looking forward to see what it is, that caught your eye - maybe it will help me read him a little better. | ||
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gobbledydook breshke daydreamarine daydreamarine basically for being the least active person in this thread so far, so this isn't a scumread, I just got nothing from him, while other candidates for position 3 (lilwade, meatpudding), contributed with the few posts they made. | ||
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On August 28 2014 07:45 gobbledydook wrote: I think we should vote breshke for being completely useless. If I get enough support I am voting him instead. I'll be keeping my vote on you for now... for the same reasons, I had earlier. You don't actually contribute and just follow trends at the moment without any own well-thought reasoning behind it. I accept the risk of you flipping town at the end but the way you are playing right now, will not help us in the future. | ||
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On August 28 2014 08:19 Breshke wrote: I have null on 3 people right? its 9 player game is my maths wrong? I think is ridiculous that anyone claims a read on daydreammarine they have had like one post. And my read on you and superbia arnt exactly neutral, you are leaning town for me jenny but i didnt want to put you in my town circle whereas superbia is leaning mafia but in no way do i want to lynch him today We are 10... so since you wont have a read on yourself there are 4 people missing on your list: me, superbia, daydreamarine and jenny | ||
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But do you care how your change of heart considering meatpudding comes? Last thing you wrote about him before asking your question about the vanilla town claims was, that you feel you should have a townread on him but you don't. What changed your mind? | ||
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On August 28 2014 08:30 gobbledydook wrote: my top lynches are superbia, breshke and lilwade. Reasons can be found in my filter. what's your reason for lynching breshke besides him being the only realistic wagon besides you atm? Your filter mentions breshke not a single time before you suggest to lynch him instead of you. | ||
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That certainly didn't turn out as I would have expected. Huge compliment to Jenny for being the only one to defend gobbledydook, when even he himself failed to do so. I have to take a step back now to see, where i picked up that vibe in gobble, that made me so sure about him being scum, that I couldn't be persuaded off of him anymore. Mistakes were made on my side and I can't have that happen again D2. | ||
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First of all: You ask me about my opinion on MihZaaas answer to my question, yet you call him out for dodging questions and quote my question. I think you might have misquoted something, since I feel he didn't dodge my question? I understand MihZaaas explanation to my question... I checked the timestamps on the post and what he says is true, there are only few minutes between abuses posts and his, so this makes perfectly sense. Up until end of day I liked him for calling out gobbledydook on his weak claim, since it was in line with my line of thought. In hindsight I feel I should have pursued him more, since he said his scumreads were abuse and lilwade, yet he didn't react to them posting at all, which is suspicious especially in the case of abuse, since it was quite clear that both of them were in the thread at the same time. This could have been a costly mistake. Also lilwade was present at the end of day, yet no interaction at all. No questions directed at lilwade and he only asks abuse once about his opinion on lilwade. lilwade also made it from his list of people who didn't contribute enough to his scumreads without him giving any reasons behind this change. You only see him writing, that he wants to see more from lilwade. Next thing that feels a bit off is that his vote on gobbledydook came 15 minutes after him mentioning gobble. This may be personal preference but I don't like that his post only contains the vote and you have to scroll through his filter to find, what he doesn't like about gobble because between his vote and his reason behind are two more posts. As for why I didn't follow up on my questions on you: I missunderstood something in abuses push on superbias post and therefore interpreted things wrong. I mentioned it in a post to Jenny that your post helped me see, where my logic was faulty and I also explained my missunderstanding a few posts earlier when answering abuses question. I didn't feel the need to follow up on your post, since it was based on flawed logic on my side. Sorry I didn't give you any notice of me, not planing to follow up on that push. | ||
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On August 28 2014 19:47 Superbia wrote: I'm currently living in a world where at least 1 of the 2 mafia was not active last night. It was way too fucking easy for mafia to hide because only half of the entire player group was around. I'm afraid that we may have had no real pressure on any mafia at the end of the day. Lilwade and Breshke both switch their votes from dook to MihZaaa as the end of day draws near. This means that it was very easy for the vote to swing Breshke's way (only needing 1 from dook +1). I don't think you take that risk as mafia. I actually feel Breshkes swing has got some bad taste in it. First of all there is this quote: On August 28 2014 08:36 Breshke wrote: I agree i was looking on him with a towny light but he seemed to just flip out. I'm not going to lynch someone just because they get Bm so "oh he must be town" that sets a bad standard. If people don't understand your reads its your job to try and explain them. Yet he still votes on gobble, not for being mafia but for being anti-town, after gobble started insulting people. Then he only went for MihZaaa after wades swing and when he could be quite sure, that he would not get lynched, since it would have taken 2 extra-votes on him and there were not enough people active in the thread to accomplish this, since many of us - myself included - were not present at the end of the day. Gobbles vote already was on him by the time he switched, so it would have taken 2 out of Meatpudding, abuse, superbia, lilwade an me. Lilwade switched back to his prime suspect just a few posts before, so he could be quite sure, he wouldn't get lilwades vote and meatpudding, abuse and I were not present anymore by the time he switched. I don't think this switch was a risk at all. On lilwades swing I feel unsure, since he had MihZaaa as his first vote, then switched to gobbledydook after his outburst and then switched back to MihZaaa, once his outburst was over and the tempers have cooled down. I don't like the back and forth, but it is in line with his previous posts and I can't blame him for swinging to gobble for a short period of time. He also gave an explanation for swinging: On August 28 2014 09:19 lilwade wrote: I will make this clear I See MihZaaa as my scum, but I do not like people who are detrimental to town. I think gobbledydook needs to put on his big boy pants and play the game. Still: I don't like the switching back and forth but I can understand both switches. I still would have felt better, if he had stuck with MihZaaa. | ||
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Could you give us a little more insight in your switching back and forth? breshke: I pointed out some contradiction in your vote, since I get out of your post, that what has triggered your vote on gobble was his bm. Am I wrong here? If so, what was the reason you put your vote on him? | ||
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On August 29 2014 00:37 Superbia wrote: Barakos - voted on dook / semi-active during EoD Lots of substantial posts. Active and useful. Read and interacted with my posts in a very townie way. Says he "might have been blinded by his trollish undertone and therefore missed several slips and flaws." (with regards to my megaposts) but never revisits this. May have had better targets on day 1 (votes on dook in his next post, 5 hours later), but I would like to see a follow up. Absent for the last 1 1/2 hours of the EoD without notice. Never lynching you today, unless you scumslip hard. I dread the world in which you're mafia. I reread your whole filter and it really was a pain. :p I come to the conclusion, that no matter how I read your entrance-post, be it in a trollish tone or be it serious, it doesn't matter to me in the grand scheme of things right now, since it doesn't influence my general read on you. On the one hand you gain a lot of credit for stimulating the discussion in the thread but on the other hand... i took about 15 minutes to reread your first post and I am afraid I will have to do this over and over again during the course of this game. You got the biggest filter in the game by far, but lots of your posts are your interactions with abuse, that all are a result from your push, that - as I stated earlier - was legit in it's core but over the top in the details. This being said, I don't want to go through all this posts, since there are more pressing issues on my mind. Main thing being the misslynch, which the two of us have to take a major blame, so I'll be going through the way of your votes. You stuck with abuse for a really long time and unvoted him only quite late yesterday evening, when you saw no chance of him dieing. Right now you still got him in your scumpile, which is ok with me, as long as you don't tunnel as hard on him, as you did D1. What do you mean when you say he likes Breshkes reads? The only time abuse agreed on any of Breshkes reads, was when he said, that he agreed with Breshkes read on leaning town and the next time Breshke appears in abuses filter is, when abuse says, breshke has worked his way down on abuses ladder towards a "null/scum"-area. Unless I have missed one of abuses posts, this again looks like you are inflating a point abuse made and twist it to his disadvantage. Continuing with the vote: Well... it looks grim. The vote was placed and you didn't revoke it, although you stuck around till the end of night. But looking at your reasoning, I don't see obvious flaws. The post you quoted in your vote is the same post, that confirmed my vote on gobbledydook. I agree with your reasoning behind your vote and I also like the fact, that you stuck to it, although you had opportunities to change your vote to anybody else. For scum this would have been a golden opportunity to earn easy towncredit. You didn't take a chane I think many mafia would have taken and this makes you lean town to me. Now you are doing work again by giving out a new set of reads on everybody. I like it. This is town-work again. If you wouldn't seem so "tunnely" on abuse I would like it a lot more. To me it seems like you are holding some kind of grudge against abuse, that makes you see things he does in a more scummy way than they acutally are. I held - and still hold - my reservations towards him, too, but be more open towards differnt opportunities. At least now you recognize him as being active - I see this as a good start. | ||
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On August 29 2014 04:04 Barakos wrote: What do you mean when you say he likes Breshkes reads? The only time abuse agreed on any of Breshkes reads, was when he said, that he agreed with Breshkes read on leaning town and the next time Breshke appears in abuses filter is, when abuse says, breshke has worked his way down on abuses ladder towards a "null/scum"-area. Unless I have missed one of abuses posts, this again looks like you are inflating a point abuse made and twist it to his disadvantage. EBWOP: ... that he agreed with Breshkes read on me leaning town... | ||
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On August 29 2014 01:30 lilwade wrote: My switch was to pressure gobble to try to bring a case for himself, but he crumbled and gave up. Which is something is hate to see in mafia. Artanis told me in the first game to just keep it cool and dont take it personal. Pressuring gobbledydook is a fair point. But what made you switch back? You say, you didn't like about MihZaaa, that he one-line-voted and then got all silent. As i see it, you did the same thing before end of day... On August 28 2014 09:24 lilwade wrote: If we get momentum going for MihZaaa I will go for it On August 28 2014 09:24 lilwade wrote: ##unvote ##vote: MihZaaa and then silence until now. | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia?page=23#456 How did you miss this? In case you are asking for a definite judgement, on how scummy MihZaaa is: he is one of the two most likely mafia at the moment. The other being Breshke. So this answers one of your next questions already. When it comes to mafiapartners: It would be somebody MihZaaaa is not definite about, since I think allying with your scumpartner this early in the game is something no sane mafia would do, since if one of them flips by getting lynched the main suspect would be on the partner, which is something nobody wants. On the other hand you wouldn't want to push your scumbuddy too hard, since there is the high chance, that it sticks with the thread (especially in an inactive game as we are in now). So it would have to be one of MihZaas Null/Bang-reads. This is the point, where it get's hard to interpret, since he is really inconsistent, when it comes to placing his reads. There is this post: On August 27 2014 08:08 MihZaaa wrote: Ill go to sleep now but before I go I'll leave some thoughts. From least scummy to most. Barakos Superbia and JennyHell Abuse People who haven't contributed enough: Lilwade Meatpudding Breshke Gobbledydook and Daydreamarine With lilwade contributing the most out of those 5. Out of the people I have gotten reads on I would lynch abuse the most but he's been much more useful to the town than the lurkers so I can't be happy with lynching him. He explains that abuse is his top lynch, and later on in his posts he deviates you from Jenny, saying that he is neutral on Jenny and has you in his towny corner. So in case of MihZaaa flipping red my suspects, who could be his scumpartner are Jenny and the people he had no read on at the moment he posted this. I can't give reads on the posibility of daydreamarine being mafia, since i he just isn't in any of my calculations at the moment. You can't read an empty book. That's the problem with him. Everything I post about him would be speculation and I don't want to throw out wild speculations based on the complete absence of one person. | ||
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On August 29 2014 05:08 JennyHell wrote: Barakos, you mention that if MihZaa flips red you think I could possibly be his scum partner. Try to see it from the other end. What if I were to flip scum, who'd be my partner then? Do you still reach the same conclusion that it would be MihZaaaa? That said, how likely do you feel it is that I flip scum after I've been vomiting town all over this entire game? The bolded part is exactly, what i would do with each of my suspects, in case MihZaa flips: I would look at it with switched roles. I haven't put much thought into scenarios in which you flip scum, cause those scenarios are the most unlikely for me at the moment, so I am not 100% sure, what would be the outcome if I checked your interactions with MihZaa. But let's see... There was the early interaction between you two, when he called you out because he felt that the rate between the length of your posts and your reads was off and you mentioning that superbias list was inconsequent considering the score on mihzaa and abuse. The next noteable thing is that you made a really long post, where you never really made up your mind considering him. After that you only had interactions, where you encouraged people to either put their votes on or off MihZaaa. (At the beginning of EoD you asked wade to put his vote off of MihZaaa and when you were trying to safe gobbledydook you asked wade and breshke to form a wagon on him. So while everything up until the end of day one was "flip-floppy" as you called it yourself there were no definite leans in your interactions with him, which then changed. One time tried to get a vote off of him and the other time you tried to get votes onto him. While this isn't consistent behavior, it is both too extreme. So this plus taking the fact, that you had him on your top three scumlist, leads me to believe, that in case of you flipping red, i wouldn't see MihZaa as your scumbuddy. Which in return would also make you one of the weaker suspects, in case of MihZaa flipping red. Please don't ask me for other spontaneous analysis on the other possible suspects right now, or at least don't expect me to post them right away. 1) this is all theory on what would happen, if he flips scum, which absolutely isn't a given and if at all will happen not earlier than saturday night, the main question right now should be: "is mihzaaa a good D2 lynch" and not "what happens, if we lynch him and he flips red" 2) this takes quite some time... i reread both of your filters (not indepth but it still took lots of time)... and right now it is getting late for me, since i haven't gotten much sleep this night 3) as a result of 2) i already got a minor headache | ||
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On August 29 2014 05:12 Superbia wrote: Which of the two would you rather kill? This is not the final answer to this question, because there is still a question at Breshke, which he hasn't answered yet. Atm for me it is Breshke, since i disliked the way he reasoned before voting. I will have to wait until my question is answered. But given the way things are atm, we might also have to consider daydreamarine as one of our possible targets. His inactivity kills any possibility to read him... If you hear this: Shape up mr.marine! Get out of your shell and post something. I can't believe, you read the whole thread twice and still got not the smallest hint of a tell on anybody. | ||
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Town: JennyHell, Superbia Leaning Town: meatpudding, abuse Leaning Scum: lilwade, daydreamarine Scum: Breshke, MihZaaa With abuse it is a close call between leaning town and leaning scum. The two of us started off on the false foot, and had some missunderstandings but since they have been cleared I see him leaning more town. This will be my last post for today. I wish you all (sadly, i could also write two) a good night and may we all wake up again tomorrow. | ||
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This kill... it doesn't make any sense to me. Going through mps stuff. There has to be something he said, that triggered this kill. Because I can't believe that superbias promise to dive through any of us was enough to make scum not shoot any of the three of us... we have been reevaluating each other several times now... There has to be a stronger motive - I'll go digging! Daydreamarine: Welcome again to the thread. I am really looking forward to you insight and hope by getting your view on things you bring up new points that we have missed up until now. In case you didn't know - in the upper right corner of every post there is a quote-link... I would appreciate it, if you use it, since my first thought, reading your post was "why is he talking to himself" until I realised, this was something Jenny said to you. | ||
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Thanks for sharing the pm with ous - not sure, what to make of it right now, will give it some thought. I am not sure, if we really should be speculating about powerroles right now, as it is daytime and powerroles don't matter that much. On the other hand this pm leaves us with 3 possible role-setups. 2 of them include a mafia roleblocker. This would make the kill on meatpudding way more understandable to me, because if mafia has a roleblocker, they know, that there is either a medic or a jailer in town, which means they have to plan their kills around the possible safes, to ensure a kill. This would mean, that there is a high likelyhood that they didn't really want to shoot meatpudding, but went for him, as it was a pretty safe bet, that he would not be protected and they would not waste their shot. Will give this some more thinking. Also abuse: Why are you so defensive? Big parts of your post are basically a defense against things that haven't happened yet. Please don't do this, as it makes you look weak, when I think, that you could be a strong contributor to town, if you wouldn't spend to much time overdefending. For example you informing us about the pm was helpfull, your guess on the roledistribution was so in some way, too. Anyways: have fun at your wedding. From what I have heard, weddings in your part of the world tend do be lots of fun! Hope you have a good time, but don't forget to read the thread so your vote is as well-informed as possible. | ||
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In your 2nd quote, you quoted yourself saying you had a read about lilwade but were not sure about him yet and you quoted Jenny posting something similar... Do you think mafia might have been seeing this as a claim of one of you hinting at having a powerrole based on that statements? | ||
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Still not making sense out of the kill on meatpudding. | ||
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I am off to my lunchbreak now, so no further analysis on who would profit in an non-obvious way. This will be one of the many things we need to figure out till EoD. Thank god it's friday. | ||
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On August 10 2014 07:34 Amiko wrote: In sum, the setups will be RNG'd among the following: (A) Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, 1-Shot Bulletproof Town, 6x Vanilla Town (B) 2x Mafia Goon, Town Cop, 7x Vanilla Town (C) 2x Mafia Goon, Town Doctor, Town Tracker, 6x Vanilla Town (1) 2x Mafia Goon, Town Jailkeeper, 7x Vanilla Town (2) Mafia Roleblocker, Mafia Goon, Town Cop, Town Doctor, 6x Vanilla Town (3) 2x Mafia Goon, 1-Shot Bullteproof Town, Town Tracker, 6x Vanilla Town Mafia KP is always 1. Mafia may not no-kill, but may self-target their KP. Mafia roleblocker may roleblock and night-kill in the same night. Mafia roleblocker's action resolves before a Jailer's action. In setup A there are two blocking-roles in roleblock and jailkeeper. Given, that abuse was blocked, this is one possible scenario of role-distribution. Ohter possible scenarios are 1 and 2 with either a jailkeeper and nobody else being able to block someone or a mafia roleblocker with again nobody else to block someone. We can't be sure, which scenario we are in yet, since we don't know about other powerroles except for somebody being able to roleblock/jail somebody. As for, what is shown "on screen" as far as I understand it, the blocked / jailed person recieves a message. In abuses case, he choose to reveal his message to all of us. There is no further moderator-notification in this thread about blocks and jails, as far as i know. | ||
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What about your read, you promised us, daydreamarine? | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia?page=27#523 | ||
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Now that you read my idea the right way... do you agree? | ||
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You both said you had some hint on lilwade, which you didn't want to give out but wanted to wait. Somebody who reads this might interpret this as you waiting for a nightphase to check wade before giving out your tell. Did I mix something up here? Do you really not see this logic? At this point I am trying to understand the block on you and this would be my best guess... | ||
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So in case it was a roleblocker, that blocked you, this would explain this... There is still the chance of the jailer, thinking you were mafia as well... but that doesn't make sense... there would have been better targets to block. As a jailer you either block your most obvious scum in order to prevent the nightkills or you block your top town in order to protect him from a nightkill, even if this means you may prevent an allys special ability from working. But let's not get sidetracked by this, as this is to much theoretical consideration. Back to the hard fact, that meatpudding died. | ||
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On August 29 2014 22:27 Daydreamarine wrote: Which indicates to me that he is fake claiming jailkeeper to get the real jailkeeper lynched at the end of the day. I don’t think that he is the real Jailkeeper because giving away your role immediately like this is bad for you and the town. I have to defend superbia at this point, since I feel you totally missunderstood him. The way he meant his sentence was, that he threatend to reevaluate Jenny and me, if none of the two of us was killed that night. And his opinion was, that both, Jenny and I are alive because of this thread to reevaluate, like "i tricked mafia into lynching a lower priority target by saying i would misstrust Jenny and Barakos, if the don't die." In his opionon he out-mindgamed mafia. This by no means is a claim of a powerrole, since at the time superbia said this, there was nothing, that even hinted at a role. This first came into consideration by abuse giving out the pm, which hardconfirmed the existence of a blocker in the game. Superbia might still be mafia, I will go to the rest of your case to see, what else you got and analyse it further but superbia is definitly not mafia for this sentence. You completely missunderstood the context in which he said this and your conclusion out of this is just false in my eyes. | ||
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On August 29 2014 22:27 Daydreamarine wrote: Superbia He seems to be the most likely Mafia at the moment to me because in my opinion he was the one who speculated wildly the most without giving real arguments (e.g. the soft claim, scum because of evil sounding usernames, framing me as Mafia twice despite my low post content... etc) He was the person that I was waiting for to frame me as Mafia, since he tried to scapegoat most of the other players and I would be the easiest target to do this with, since I had the lowest posted content. He did not disappoint me. To this I can reply that I would probably not be in the game anymore if I accidently posted as Mafia what I did in day 1 (even if it is my first game). Furthermore as Mafia it would have been way easier for me to just jump on the bandwagon saying "BM is unacceptable if he is not killed by a mod we have to do it (I nearly did but while I was angry Jenny posted and confused me, since in the end I could not tell if he is town or not anymore)." bold: I actually didn't read that part right, when I first read the post... you were present at the end of day and did not vote on purpose? Because this is how this sounds. underlined: this is the only part in your first post, that makes you look town to me. I got the impression, that you at first had a totally wrong understanding about the concept of forum-mafia and thought this is a roleplay, where everybody would be given a role and then the thread would be some kind of roleplay with open roles. So this leads me to believe, that if you actually rolled mafia, your openingpost would have looked totally different and might actually have given your role away. At the moment, you are town for me, but not for the content you provide, but only for the simple fact, that I am quite sure, that you didn't understand the rules and had you been mafia, you would have given yourself away at this point. | ||
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If your claim turns out true to be true - who do you think could be the second scum? Do you think there is a chance, that abuse and superbia made the whole fighting up and this all was some kind of play by the two? Or do you think that it is only superbia trying to frame abuse? Also in case of superbia turning out to be town at some point in the game - would you start to agree with his reads on abuse? What do you make out of Breshke, MihZaaa and lilwade? I get that those aren't people you have a good read on, since you said this in your post, but if you had to answer, what would you say is your general impression on them? | ||
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And one of them is the neverending story of abuse vs superbia... really? At least you are back to life, lilwade... you still owe me an answer. And thanks for your further analysis, daydreamarine. With your case and abuses case on superbia him there are two (for me) confirmed townies having a case on superbia. After I pointed out your flaws in your line of thought and what i think was a missunderstanding on your side. Are you really sure about your feeling on supberbia? Because I am not. So ask yourself, are you really sure enough about superbia to have him potentially lynched at the end of this day? | ||
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On August 29 2014 23:13 Breshke wrote: Also if anyone else got role blocked you should out. Jenny, you quoted this as well and later in your post said, that telling that you have been blocked would give away the rolesetup, since there is only one possibility of 2 blockers and you hesitated, cause it would give scum information they might not have. What are your thoughts on Breshke asking for potential others blocks? To me this makes him look worse than before. Breshke: The explanation you give in your post on the votechanging is logical in itself but again you don't really do things on your own, you only follow lilwades example. This looks bad to me, since you again sheep someone and use others to explain your decisions. You don't take responsibility for your own actions and I dislike this. What were your motives behind asking for other blocked people? I feel they were not genuine. | ||
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On August 30 2014 07:10 Superbia wrote: You feel Marine is a confirmed townie? Yes. Reason is given here. Read it and feel free to ask questions about it. | ||
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On August 30 2014 07:18 lilwade wrote: @Barakos what question were you referring to? I re read everything and you directed nothing except why I switched in the night phase. This part here remains still unanswered. | ||
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On August 30 2014 07:27 Superbia wrote: Really dude? I asked him a question and he responds very strongly and defensively, and then makes a vote on me while I was outside of him scumlist. All while ignoring my question. Am I the only person who sees abuse as possible scum? I don't blame you... I feel his vote on you is hasted and uncalled for. But seeing that Jenny and he are the 2 blocked people, chances are high, that abuse was blocked by mafia. So unless mafia used a powerrole at themselfes this confirms abuse as town for now. So I have to filterdive you again to see, if I agree with both of my at the moment confirmed townies or if I find enough to defend you. In case i find enough to defend you I will go over the thesis of mafia blocking themselfes to spread confusion and confirm one of them as town. Since you seem to still have him on your potential scumlist, have you taken into consideration, that abuse was blocked by his scumbuddy? If so, what are your opinions on this? | ||
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Your D1: First there was your megapost. Bad formatted, with small content and many null-statements from you... "yeah", "allright", "cool"... You also kept it in a very trollish tone (for my ears), so whenever someone would go through this post, you could say "Well... I was only half serious at this point.", which you did several times. Your answers to criticism are offhand, like when you were called out on having missread some posts you said "well, i missread you, fuck me, right?", or something like "private reads". The former plays down the misstakes you made, while the "fuck me" part simultaneously implies, that it would be over the top to go at you for this minor mistake, the latter is a weak excuse for inconsistent logic while buying time to find an excuse, should anybody follow you up on those inconsistencies. In your case vs abuse, you overinterpreted things, you were missing posts from him and you stick with your case, until there is a better opportunity to lynch someone. You going for gobbledydook actually makes quite some sense, since he thought you were one of the more scummier people in this thread. Then, when Jenny voted on you, you gave a comprehensible defense, for which I liked you at the time - you didn't overdefend like others did and you made sense. Now, rereading this defense I saw something, that I missed earlier: On August 28 2014 05:21 Superbia wrote: I'd like MeatProbability's and Barakos' opinion on me and the whole "taking shit out of context" conundrum. They are my top town at the moment. I missed the " 'd " the whole time... I gave you my opinion on your overreads and rushed vote on abuse already. You even interacted with me about this point. Yet still you ask me about my opinion again? This is again a sign, that you didn't read through the thread... you even forgot about some of your interaction with me and yet you still claim this: On August 28 2014 05:32 Superbia wrote: I'm pretty invested in the game. I've put a lot of time and energy into it. This doesn't add up for me. I know, i gave you several townreads up until now, but looking at it now, with the thought in mind, that my 3 of my most likely town-people (gobbledydook, abuse, daydreamarine; gobbledydook being the hard-confirmed, abuse being 95% confirmed, daydreamarine being 99% confirmed) had/have you on their suspectlist made me reevaluate things. Granted, daydreamarines case is not plausible but still i don't question his intention behind his suspicion. Your way of posting things D1 - the confusing format, the over the top accusation, the partialy offhand retorts to people pointing out flaws in your line of argumentation, you missing things, that should have been important to you and not slipped your eye at the time you posted them, you switching your vote to someone, who had you as a suspect as well - makes you look like you tried to confuse the whole thread more, than you wanted to get a discussion started. Your N1: You posted a complete read-list, in which you didn't give away too many new things. Basically you just summed things up and gave some general reads in the tone of "town atm, would like some more activity", "iffy about meatpudding, but there are better lynches" "there is a chance, he is mafia, but gets a townpass for now"... in basically every read you give some pros and some cons on the person, you are looking into without actually forming a firm opinion. The only things to which you commit on in your list are Jenny and me as no-lynches and MihZaaa and Breshke as top-wagons. Things that were very well in line with the general tone of the thread at the moment. So overall this now seems like you just made sure nothing in this list would actually stick out, so nobody would be able to call you hard on flaws in this list. You then follow up your list of reads with a list of times, how long people were active... Totally letting aside, that you ignore the fact, that meatpudding is in a totally different timezone than MihZaaa and me... what was your point? You didn't follow this up at all and just let it stand there for itself without any further comment or reads out of this. Might be trying to keep a list but also might be you trying to make others look suspicious without doing anything yourself and just hoping that somebody would make something out of this. After that you again asked me something, I had already answered a few posts before - this time my opinion on MihZaaa. You also start with a new theme in your posts: nagging on people that were absent... first by asking me about the possibilities of daydreamarine being mafia. A person on which nobody at this time could have an actual sensible read. And after I don't answer to your satisfaction, you let the topic slide for now but not without giving it a final subtle push by saying mafia might have been alone D1. Then we come into D2. You start it off with this: On August 29 2014 10:01 Superbia wrote: Easiest fucking deflect of my life. Donkey mafia, how does it feel to be remote controlled? I don't like this post at all... for several reasons. The first reason why I didn't like it is also the reason, why I didn't call you out on this, because the reason has no ingame-relevance. I will just give it now, for everyone to understand, why I pick it up only now and not earlier. I absolutely hate all those stupid sentences like "easiest ... of my life" / "ez ... ez life" / "2ez4..." "kappa" ... twitch-chat basically... I hate it from the bottom of my heart. So this is only a problem I have with the words you phrased it in and I didn't want to let this cloud my judgement and that is why I ignored the post for the most time. I even defended it vs daydreamarine and explained it to him. What I don't like is that you taunt mafia in it. Why would anybody do this in forum-mafia? It is highly unlikely that this will have any effect, because even if mafia is a little pissed at this comment... there are two days of D2 to calm down after it. So why do it? Out of overconfidence? Or out of confidence, that there won't be any ramifications, because you didn't have to fear mafia? I just don't understand, why someone would put this out. What you also do, is try to take credit for deflecting any nightkills off of Jenny, you and me with your last comment before EoN... have you ever thought about the line of thought, that your claim on meatpudding being cop was the reason he died? No. Why not? Maybe because the reason is, that you know, that he died because of mafia rolehunting. Yet still you try to appear heroic and clever by pushing mafia away from killing one out of Jenny, you and me. Then your next D2-actions sum up as complaining about only MihZaaa and Breshke being the only wagon without providing something new except you stating, that you don't like abuses opinions on MihZaaa - and ask him about it - fully aware, that he can't really interact with you, cause he told us in advance, that he wouldn't be here for some time. Or did you miss this post as well? Cause I know for sure, that you missed one of my posts again, since you asked me, since when I had daydreamarine as confirmed town. So all in all I don't have you in my town anymore and at the moment am more willing to join abuse and daydreamarine than to defend you. | ||
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On August 30 2014 08:59 Breshke wrote: For me it was a bonus that Jenny was the other person that was role blocked as at the time i was starting to live in a world where as i explained previously jennys defense of dook was just an easy way to get town points and she was going to coast her way to an easy victory. Now that she has claimed role blocked i think that world would be less likely as she could have just kept that information to herself and on the off chance she is lieing i think that situation will resolve itself. I have given the idea of a fake-claim by Jenny some thought as well. For me, there is no way of her fakeclaiming... There are severel scenarios: - Jenny is Mafia and therefore knows that abuse was blocked by her team - in this scenario Jenny has either one or two townpeople, who could prove her wrong. Either the Jailer or the cop/medic-duo. There is no way in hell, that mafia would sacrifice themself this early in the game, just to find out powerroles. Jenny would have instantly been called and lynched and her mafiabuddy would be alone. Scum-Jenny is to smart to take such a huge risk this early in the game. - Jenny is vanilla town - again 3 possible people, who would counterclaim her. Again Jailer + Cop/Doc. Her fakeclaim would give away at least one town-powerrole, cause a misslynch and would confuse town totally. Town-Jenny will never do this, as it causes only damage to town and does town no good. - Jenny is Jailer in this case, the person she had blocked would have claimed so. Again her fake-claiming of being blocked will cause confusion, a misslynch, a dead powerrole... no chance, this is possible - Jenny is Doc/Cop and claims being blocked to not give away the real rolesetup. In this scenario the other powerrole could claim that he is cop/doc, again, mafia knows the setup, one powerrole would be out in the open, Jenny would get misslynched because of the claim... There is the chance, that the other townrole would see through this maneuver and stay silent, but I don't think anybody would do this, because it would be too suspicious by Jenny... so this scenario could probably work for her but again - this is not a risk Jenny would take. For me, her claim is confirmed. | ||
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On August 30 2014 23:15 Breshke wrote: Barakos since you might be around, if you had been there at EoD would you have changed your vote if so on to who? Honestly I don't know. I had a non-townie vibe from what he wrote and I don't want to make a call on how I would have behaved, had I been there the last 1.5 hours. Jenny had a really strong feeling about him not being scum and it is possible, that she could have convinced me to switch but this is all theoretic. This is all an instinct-thing and I can't give any authentic insight on what the last part of the day felt like, cause I reread the pages I missed after i knew, gobbledydook flipped town and therefore knew, what was behind his posts, why he got mad, why he did try to convince people to vote on you. I might have switched, because of Jennys feeling and this might have convinced me. And I can't tell you, where my vote would have ended either, because again... I reread the EoD with the knowledge of gobble being town, and this also might change the way I interpret stuff you all said, because I knew, who was wrong and who wasn't. | ||
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Lilwade is a good suspect but then again... his activity is so low, that it doesn't come surprising, that he doesn't have a full read on everybody. Speaking of him - he hasn't answered me yet, which is also annoying. How are you supposed to read someone like him? Same goes for MihZaaa, of whom we haven't heard a single word since his answer to my question and his vote on gobbledydook. You to some extend as well, but at least you are here at the moment, trying to make sense out of the game. I also like the fact that you acknowledge, that you might be a wagon today and not flip out like gobble yesterday but stay calm and try to fight the upcoming wagon.It is good, that you think about Jennys motives and also had the idea in mind, that her claim may be false. Even if this is highly unlikely. What's your opinion on this btw? You just brought up the idea but never followed it up? | ||
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My reasoning can be found here. ##Vote: Superbia | ||
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On August 31 2014 00:46 Daydreamarine wrote: ##Vote: Superbia Don't know, how accurate Amiko is with the format, but you might want to bold this for readability. | ||
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Jenny - have you gone through my case? If so, did you find flaws in it? You say your feeling is, that superbia is donkey-town, so this concerns me, since your feeling was spoton at the end of D1. At the same time, can you bring up something more against MihZaaa than "he has done nothing, I don't want questionmarks in the final 3." I said something similar about gobbledydook and this seems to be not the best reasoning for lynching someone. At the moment I feel like MihZaa hasn't been talked about at all today (i know, there are some posts, where he was mentioned), due to his absence and this makes him impossible to read for me. | ||
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When I said you missread posts, I don't blame you for drawing wrong conclusions on people by calling them scum/town for the wrong reasons. This are things, that are bound to happen in this game, since everybody has a different way of interpreting stuff, what i meant is, that you just didn't read a post thoroughly enough so that your mistakes don't result in you missinterpreting, but in you not actually reading the post right. Kind of, what happened to me with the "I like" vs. "I 'd like"; only in a much bigger scale. You miss one of my main points. I am not pushing you on your private reads or on your offhand answers and things one by one... What I am saying is, that they all add up and up and up. Your day 1 posts as a whole paint a are trollish and distracting picture. (I don't know how to express this any better.) And I don't deny, that you gathered informations at day 1. I question your motives. On the MihZaaa-Topic and your request. You gave exactly the explanation, that I offered you, after calling you out. On August 29 2014 05:02 Barakos wrote: I already elaborated quite a bit on MihZaaa in my answer to meatpudding: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia?page=23#456 How did you miss this? In case you are asking for a definite judgement, on how scummy MihZaaa is: he is one of the two most likely mafia at the moment. The other being Breshke. So this answers one of your next questions already. This is something that is missing in my original case. I didn't find your answer to it, at the moment I was writing it and forgot about it, when proofreading it. Sloppy work by me. -.-' I don't want to go over your whole defense any further, since we don't have the most time left and we would go back and forth over details. Just know, that my general impression of you is, that you don't pay the needed amount of attention, because I got the impression you missed several posts. For now I think, this is, because you are not too concerned if your cases are as accurate, as they can be. But whatever. You are here, this is good. Let's get work done. I don't want to miss this lynch again. | ||
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I wanted to make my point clear about the first part, since I don't want you to get mad. It's up to you, to dicide, if you want to discuss this with me up unto the last detail. I gave you my opinion on you and this is where i stand after reading all of your defense. If we find someone more suitable to be mafia, I will switch this vote. | ||
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On August 31 2014 04:31 Superbia wrote: Barakos, why do you feel there's not need to respond to the rest of my defense but still keep your vote on me? If you're going to vote on me, isn't it important for you to get as much information as you can on the defendant, to ensure it's not a miss lynch? Yes it is. But you said you are looking for other buses and while we still got time, it is limited. So - up to you, to decide. Chances are, you find a more promising lynch, which would do you more good, than argueing with me about some details, since my opinion still stands. | ||
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On August 31 2014 03:10 Superbia wrote: I'll just say it at this point, because it didn't work, it was a play. Two of your reads are correct on this post, it's meant to taunt mafia and be annoying (specifically towards mafia). I was hoping one of the higher-rated towns (e.g. Jenny or yourself) would pick up on it and mirror it to be more annoying towards mafia. It's meant to bait out mafia to become agitated and justify the(/their) lynch (indirectly, most likely). Notice the missdirection during EoN1 also acts as a prelude. Provided, it doesn't have a high chance of success, but it doesn't take up any time. I don't like to accept the "I can't interact with you" line. Besides, I can still ask questions and he can answer them later as far as I care. I'm not going to push someone for ignoring things I ask, else I would probably have to start pushing on everyone. Here's my fear for tonight: MihZaaa doesn't show up -> we don't lynch him because lynching lurkers is a big risk -> he takes the free warning and shows up on day 3. Can we get a wagon other than me? I would like to have higher chances of killing scum. First: Thanks for explaining the first post after the nightpost. I didn't see it this way. Never crossed my mind, to join in in something like this, since I don't see anybody falling for this. We will just have to life with the fact, that we got different approaches on this post. Second: I bolded this part: I already did. This is exactly, what I am talking about, when I say, you invoke the impression of not reading the thread close enough. I don't expect you, to know the thread insideout, but this was a post, in which I was defending you from daydreamarines attack. You must have seen this post... But this is, what I mean, when I say, that I don't really want to discuss this. A discussion like this has a high chance of ending in an arguement, that goes like "you see, you did this again" - "yeah, right... i missed one single post. fuck me, right?" - "i called you on this also." - ... Which would lead to nothing, but waste both of our time. Third: I am uncomfortable with lynching inactives and therefore am really concerned about heading into a lynchvote with one inactive and you. This inactivity by almost all just sucks. | ||
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On August 31 2014 04:48 Superbia wrote: So you'd rather join a bus than start one yourself? Why? I think I gave a pretty good reason to join your bus, or do you think I made this decission lightly and without thinking about it? Yes, I am following my main-townreads. No, I am not mindlessly joining a bus, to make my life easy. You said it yourself. I was the first, to make a complete case on you. | ||
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I like, that you don't jump on Breshke and I agree with you, that the little things he contributed today all seem towny. I was on him today aswell, but all he wrote, especially the part about the roles was credible for me. You not jumping on Breshke right now, even though you are in need of another lynch-target, seems to me, like you actually try to solve this game. On lilwade I can fully agree as well. His posts up until now are very null to me or I had mixed feelings about them. Him not answering my followup-questions is annoying as f***. The only thing that prevents me from going at him today is his promise to follow up and his absence. He is the second case of somebody being absent and thereby dodging further investigation by me. Also i can see now, why you didn't mention my answer and point at your previous post. Makes sense, to repeat this and to give a general explanation, since you are not only talking to me, but everybody else. | ||
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As I said, fire away. I'll answer and try not to be too picky. | ||
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2) daydreamarine is as good as confirmed town 3) Jenny was blocked - since this claim would have been too risky, if it was a fake-claim 4) Abuses claim Note: This is also a ranking of credibility from 100% down to ~90% | ||
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daydreamarine said, he was there and just didn't post. Others might have done the same. This is all speculation, all we know is, who was there. There might have been players present, who haven't posted and there also could have been players absent, who would have wanted to be there - abuse comes to mind here. | ||
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Breshke did some work today, that put him into my leaning town. you are also not as scummy for me, as you were, when i made my post. | ||
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If we don't get consecutive mafia-lynches and it comes to a do-or-die, i want to be in it with people I have as many sources for reads as possible. Also on daydreamarine... confirmed town or not. He has shown at some points, that he has the time to participate but just doesn't... While marine still has to understand, that activity is key to bringing up thoughts about the game, the other two already should know better. | ||
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If we go to mylo and no-lynch as jenny suggested, mafia would be given an extra night, by shooting the bulletproof for a nokill and another day in the mylo-scenario. | ||
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If so, could you give your impression on what you make of my case on superbia? I am looking further into it, cause he pointed out, that I was too harsh at one point... Do you see other things that I might interpret too harsh? | ||
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Both paths were viable at this moment, so his choice isn't alignment indicative. If anything I am willing to give him credit for sticking with his instincts, after he made the choice to vote on gobbledydook. Switching would have looked like trying to avoid blame for the misslynch. and superbia: no, I don't think so... weddings in eastern europe / russia are really big happenings with lots of vodka. I've seen this first hand. He also might point out, that things are likely to get crazy. :D | ||
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There is a bit new interaction between us, which I felt was positive. I would like to get Jennys opinion on this too. This could be really bad... With things being as they are, we might kill 3 people tonight? 2 modkilled for not voting + you... If wade doesn't show up, I am revoking my vote on you, since I don't want to see 3 people dead. | ||
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If anybody deserves to get lynched for inactivity this day, it is MihZaaa, who failed to post and vote. Amiko - what happens in the case of this double-infraction? | ||
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I will digg into lilwade tomorrow to get him talking, Jenny is absolutely right, when she says, that blank-reads shouldn't be in mylo, MihZaaa is a blank read, so get rid of him... On top of that, you made a lot more sense today, than you did all D1 and your posts got more serious. Maybe this pressure was, what was needed, to get you on valid town-game. ##unvote ##vote MihZaaa | ||
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See you in a few hours. | ||
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As I said last night, I did some digging into lilwade. I still think, we need to discuss, what happend yesterday, I still want to get this out as soon as possible. lilwade: You came in with some questions to random people that I felt were to search for possible points where you could attack townfolk and get a misslynch going. In this first post, you missed several posts. For example my criticism on superbias post or my reservations about abuse. I already stated, that I disliked him D1, yet you still asked about my thoughts. So you didn't read all the posts before writing your post... asked general questions and even asked things, that already have been answered only two hours before you made your entrance. If you acutally had payed attention, you would have known this. So why did you actually ask me about superbias case again? Did you want to draw attention to it, cause you liked the fact, that it was pretty confusing? Then came the night. You went into the night with having MihZaaa as your hardest scumread, because MihZaaas gave a one line reason to vote for gobble, when mihzaaa actually had two posts regarding gobble out of which his vote makes some sense. gobbles retreat was, what triggered his vote, after he pointed out, that gobble came into the thread and just jumped on the actual trend. MihZaaas vote does make sense, again, you just failed to read the thread. Then the next day, you fail to give a complete answer to my question, why you jumped back and forth... I followed up and you only answered after I reminded you of my post... Again you missed a post... again you leave the impression, that you don't actually read the thread but just hop in and out of it as you please. Then on D2 you come into the thread and post "Marry - Daydreamarine after his day 2 activity I think it is undeniable this guy is top town." Daydreamarine jumps from being absolutely unreadable to top town for his activitys? For which of them? For his case on superbia, which is flawed as hell or for his general reads on me and jenny, which brought no real new insight? Or maybe you just read, that I had him as confirmed town but didn't bother with my reasoning, because as I said... Daydreamarine is one of the top towns. But not for his activity, but mostly for missunderstanding rules. Or maybe - and this is, what I didn't notice up until now - maybe it is, what daydreamarine reads into meatpuddings activity, which is that meatpudding reads superbia as scum and wanted to copcheck him and therefore dies. Totally aside, that daydreamarines logic here is flawed again... but you know, what meatpuddings last words were, before he died? "lilwade is my top scum." You basically liked what daydreamarine said, because he failed to see, that meatpudding read you as top scum and had you on his scumlist almost the entire game. I got sidetracked as hell by Daydreamarine saying, superbia was one of the people, that meatpudding hat on his scumlist, but you were on meatpuddings scumlist the entire time. He even had you as his top scum. This is a possible answer to the question, why meatpudding died, I have missed the entire time, although it was right out there. So lilwade. You still owe me an answer to my question about you switch back to MihZaaa. And you need to defend yourself. Get active! | ||
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I feel like most of the blame has to be put on me. To give you my reasoning: Me feelings during the night changed from superbia being almost definitly scum at the beginning and when I made my case more to the way Jenny felt about him. His defense was reasonable, his cases on lilwade and breshke made sense but were too weak, to form another wagon, which he realised. In my eyes mafia would have taken any chance to form another wagon, to raise the chances of them not being hit, so him not trying to push through his weak cases gave me town-vibes from him. After that we talked through some stuff and I again got the feeling, that he didn't want to sidetrack me but more or less try to get some final thoughts out of his head, so we would have more to work on, in case of him dieing. At the end of the night, my scumread on him was pretty weak and I had to make the call, with whom I would rather continue playing... the player I had a scumread on or the player, that was pretty much nonexistant. (In hindsight: Shouldn't he have been given a warning, for not posting at night, and then be modkilled for not posting on the following day?) I still feel, in this moment it was the right. I just hate the results. And what I forgot in my frustration about the latest events: Rest in piece, MihZaaa | ||
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On August 31 2014 22:19 Daydreamarine wrote: What I noticed is that if two people should have died in Night 1 (assuming a Mafia roleblocker can also kill someone) that means Jenny should have died in Night 1, but she did not thus she is confirmed town (I highly doubt she is lying about being jailed, her outing seemed too genuine and sophisticated) and we have one more townie whose information should be trusted This isn't possible, since mafia can only kill one per night. "The mafia-killpower is allways 1" doesn't mean, that all mafia can shoot 1 person per night, but mafia kills 1 person. So Jenny is by no means confirmed. All we know is, that our Jailer thought, Jenny was the best bet to block and protect. Since meatpudding was shot night 1, this means Jenny was not targeted by mafia night 1. So Jenny is by no means confirmed town. | ||
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This would be a claim, that everybody can make. It doesn't have to be true or false, but it's a tactic. What you are not allowed to do is give out the exact wording of your role-pm. Also the option, to ask amiko for a fake-roleclaim is for mafia-players only, i guess, since they are not given the name of disney-princesses but the names of disney-villains. So they need a valid princess-name, in case they want to fakeclaim. | ||
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And also note: Claiming you are Role XYZ is perfectly legal. You don't get disqualified for doing this. See the claim-rules on page 1, points 5,10 and 11. | ||
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Are you all right, Jenny? Agree with you on no-voting tomorrow. Also roles-outing shouldn't be done, sooner than lylo. Tomorrow will be either talking and no-voting or thanking god for a deathless night and trying to get our first scum. So completely on board with what you said. | ||
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What a messy night. rest in peace, abuse and Breshke hope you are, where you belong now, lilwade. There is still no use in roleclaiming now, what good would it do? Gives mafia easier targets. ##Vote: No Lynch Superbia: My reluctance to push on lilwade came from the fact, that he wasn't present. I actually say in my quote, that his credit is used up after this night. And look, what I did the first thing in the morning... I followed on my word. | ||
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bit high on painkillers and wont post anymore today. see you tomorrow | ||
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Can't be really mad at him. | ||
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Totally agree with you on this. | ||
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I had you as top scum out of the last 4 remaining. If your last post wouldn't look that damn honest, this would be an easy call. -.- | ||
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But since we all got into that silent agreement, that it would only benefit, if they get more information before their final shot, that didn't happen... But well. Let's see, what Jenny claims, once she joins us... The way it is set up at the moment, it could also be you being the one, who has to make the final call. | ||
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I am Quasimodo, the Tragic Hero and you, JennyHell, are a fraud. ## vote JennyHell And your defense is also nothing but some breadcrumbs you threw out the whole game, to lure us into your gingerbread house! On September 04 2014 11:20 JennyHell wrote: Night 1 I tried superhard to be hit by that bullet, but that didn't happen. And I was thinking to myself, who'd not want me in final 3, probably Barakos. Daydream and Barakos had been buddying up to eachother so if I was out of the picture it would have been easy for him to misslynch Superbia. But I bet you didn't count on me being the BP, did ya?! Hah! It's not like you were the only one, being town. Superbia and me were with you the whole night, trying to push the game further. We all were not sure, who would hit the that night and if we would live till the next morning... well... you of course knew, who would be the target and I knew, I would live, the only one gessing was superbia but still you did nothing extraordinary during the night. What really made you look town at the end of N1 was your attempt to get everybody from gobbledydook to breshke in D1. A very good way, to get townpoints, you even fooled me there, but in the end, you tried to make people switch from townie A to townie B, since you just didn't care, which of them died, but you sure looked good at that moment. And where was I buddying up with marine? The only thing I did all game was call him out for his out-of-this-world reads and flawed logic and correct him, when he missunderstood rules. On September 04 2014 11:20 JennyHell wrote: I've even hinted earlier in the thread that I'm not a princess. In hindsight, such a shit tier read, but if we look past the fact that I read Barakos completely wrong, I asked him to be my bride. Why would I as a girl ask a guy to be my BRIDE?! Because I am a GUY in the game. I am Prince Phillip, the Dashing Hero. Because we are all princesses maybe? Why would you ask a princess to be your groom? Doesn't make sense and is just you trying to find things, that affirm your counterclaim and now you come up with a roleplay-line. If you haven't read it yet... I agreed on your second proposal by saying "be my princess and I'll be yours". Just note, that I didn't say anything about being "your prince", because I was under the impression, that we agreed on being a same-sex couple... Of course I could now make something up and say that I didn't write "I'll be your prince.", because I was just the ugly hunchback to confirm my own claim, but that wouldn't be honest and I won't resort to roleplay-lines to do that. On September 04 2014 11:20 JennyHell wrote: Other than that I've been super towny all game, even multiple times told everyone to not feel like anyone is confirmed even though it's made you guys feel iffy about me. Also, why I wanted no claims yesterday was because if a save happens or if I get hit then it's so much easier to find out who the last mafia is. Of course you were super-towny all game... that's what you had to try, because lilwade didn't do anything to help you, so you had to pull the weight of the two of you. The way you tried to achieve this is by becoming top town and pretending like you had some positive reads on him but were not quite sure yet, to make everybody look away from wade, since you did the same... I am quite a bit embarrassed to say, that it worked with me for such a long time. But your way of being super-towny was nothing more than telling people to stay alert and of course now it makes you look good, because now you can point everywhere in the thread and tell everybody "look, i told you not to trust me, ain't i super town?" I must admit, I didn't do such a thing, because I was fully aware of the possibility of everybody being potentially mafia except the dead and didn't need to remind myself of this all the time. The only thing I did, was try to prevent unjustified accusations, that were over the top and call people out for posts they missed and defend people from marines flawed logic. I guess, it's up to superbia now, to tell, what was really genuine and what was part of a bigger scheme, made up by mafia to look as well-intentioned as possible. On September 04 2014 11:22 JennyHell wrote: Because he knew he had shot me and I didn't die. Nice to out yourself with your extra information there, Barakos! There is no extra information in there? Nobody dieing and the jailer being modkilled for inactivity is a clear sign of mafia hitting me (or the modkilled jailer, but who would go for that?). Everybody can do this math... The only thing I do, is remind superbia of the possibility of you counterclaiming my role instead of Vanilla Town, which you did in the end. On September 04 2014 11:38 JennyHell wrote: If I was mafia, would I really CC someone who's been townread the entire game? Or would I go for an easy win by trying to act towny and get you out instead, seeing as he's had you as scummy almost the entire game? Why would I intentionally make it extra difficult for myself? I edited out the crap you had in that post; stop trying to make me angry, please. You realize, the same questions apply for me too? Superbia at this point claimed he was VT by saying, he wasn't the bulletproof. Now why would I make superbia make the choice between you and me and not you make the choice between him and me? I mean... up until this point we were married, right? So it doesn't make any sense for me, to try and go against you in head-to-head. My guess, why you decided to go up vs me: You read superbias last post and you read my statement, where I say, that his post looks damn honest and that I have serious concerns about his position as top scum, so you didn't want me to make the final call but him, because you could use the fact, that he had you as top scum, to mindgame him into lynching me. Of course, superbias list of people, he thinks are mafia, is also something, that you could bring up as reason, why I decided to go vs you and not vs him... In the end superbia will have to decide, who is actually genuine. oh... and we are so getting divorced! | ||
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You are basically saying "I am not sure, who of you two is trustworthy, so could you please both tell me, how you feel about your play." You are basically asking scum to lie about their whole game, which is bound to confuse you... You know, how the game went and you know, how the answers are gonna be (more or less)... I will tell you, that I did, what I did to keep the thread constructive, to eliminate unfounded suspicions and basically to win the game for town. Jenny is gonna tell you, that she did, what she did, because she wanted everybody to stay alert, to focus everybody on the mafia-hunt and to never give anybody a free pass. It is your job now, to determine, whose motives you question and whose you don't. The two of us talking about the game again will give you a 2nd and 3rd opinion on everything, which will only derail you from finding your answer, since it takes away from the time you got, to reevaluate everything and come to a correct solution. So the questions to us should not be "why are you town". Your question at us should be something like "jenny, why did you cut lilwade so much slack, when at day one you already found out, that he wasn't softclaiming tracker, cause he didn't follow up on your question?" and "barakos, why did you push lilwade only after the misslynch and not before?"... it should be about things, that are unclear to you. This kind of question I will gladly answer and this will help you determine, who did things because he was town and who did things because he was pretending to be town. The question you asked above is too general, so I will give you a short answer to not derail you further: What I did was all in order to keep the thread as clean as possible, to not give mafia a place to hide. I was never afraid to speak my mind and to defend somebody of false or illogical accusations, I tried to prevent people from jumping at conclusions and only took a definite stance on somebody, when I was sure enough of myself. | ||
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When EoD2 came, there was some kind of relaxed athmosphere in the thread. Everybody was in a bit more joke-y mood and that kind of got to me. It had not much to do with ingame content, since Jenny wasn't present for most part of D2, due to her being sick. Really more a "spur of the moment"-thing. Plus: at that time she sill was my top-town | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464494-newbie-lviii-disney-princess-mafia#4 Don't try to confuse superbia... all names are possible and nothing can be read into them. | ||
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has been a pleasure to play with the two of you. | ||
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On September 05 2014 05:15 Amiko wrote: [b][blue]Currently, JellyHell will be lynched with 2 votes.[b][blue] Might want to check your spelling there, amiko. And also I'm glad, you came to the right conclusion, superbia. It was the right choice. | ||
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Main thing, was that I was thinking at the moment, that you would turn this thing into something like "you two now behave your best to make me not angry" and I kicked myself for putting you in charge of the misslynch. Turned out it was the right call after all... but still, I could have put a lot more effort into it after your questions and I basically put the whole game at risk for me. I basically took a gamble, that you would stick with your guesses you posted. | ||
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Thanks for hosting this to amiko, alakaslam and glowingbear and putting this much effort in you Day/Night-Posts. And also thanks for coaching to Holyflare and Shinobi. The one thing I didn't like was the inactivity... especially lilwade and abuse. The game would have been a lot more fun, had they taken part in it... lilwade for being my partner and abuse for his critical reads, even though they were wrong, when it got to superbia... lilwade actually managed to get himself modkilled after posting in the mafia-QT, which I still can't process fully... That's also why breshke died in N2. Wade wanted to go head to head in the lynchvotes vs superbia, since at that time abuse + marine were totally on the superbia-scumtrain and we could have gotten the misslynch there... but then he manages to not post, while playing an other game her on this site... To answer your question, superbia: I wasn't sure about Jennys view on the two of us and the post you made shortly before EoN seemed like you believed in what you said. And since I read you as someone, who doesn't change his mind easily, once he is convinced, I thought you were a safer bet than Jenny. Also I felt like I had some credit with you for not lynching you D2. | ||
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I mentioned in the mafia-QT, I thought me going full emotional and defensive wouldn't fit to the way I played this game at all and I also never really attacked someone hard this game... I had two solid cases vs wade and superbia but never really attacked anybody with full force. So going all ham on Jenny would also not fit... It felt for me like superbia wanted more or less confirmation on his reads, he posted the night before and I tried to give him this by staying "in character". Everybody telling me, I should be more emotional / aggressive in this last post got me thinking though... will definitely take this into consideration, should I ever get in a lylo-situation again. | ||
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On September 05 2014 08:44 Tehpoofter wrote: I'd love to hear why Breshke was the kill n1 he seemed to be a prime target for a lynch so curious what mafia's thoughts were on that. I gave that reason already... you don't pay attention to the thread, scum! :p Driving force behind this was lilwade. My kill for this night would have been abuse or superbia, iirc. Wades line of thought was, that he wanted to form a wagon against superbia the next day, because the thread (abuse and daydreamarine) were pretty sure, superbia was scum, so that would have been two sure votes on superbia together with lilwades and mine this would have been a sure misslynch. Basically it was lilwade, arguing he had a better chance vs superbia than vs breshke and I think it would have worked... but then came the modkills. :D | ||
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On September 05 2014 15:12 gobbledydook wrote: superbia you are the one of the worst town i have ever seen you were unimaginably wrong the whole game and I am extremely frustrated by your bad play. That's absolutely uncalled for... especially coming from you, since you gave us a super easy day1 misslynch with your attitiude/manners and (in-)activity during D1/EoD1. You made your sign-in-post, saying 'somebody teach you, how not to be a shitty town'... maybe work on not getting yourself killed D1 for shitty attitude. But then again... looking at the obs-QT, I guess your answer is "lol, don't lecture me"? Superbia may not have been right about most tells, but to be fair... Who had me as scum in any of their posts before lylo? Jenny said, she had suspicions about me but they can't be seen anywhere in the thread till D3 and Meatpudding mentioned, he wasn't too sure about me, but I guess that's it? At least superbia tried and playing with/against him was fun, which - judging from this game and the way you've played in it - can't be said about you. @abuse: I read your coach-QT and I must say, I'm impressed... the two of us think pretty much alike. Looking forward to play some more games with you - hopefully with a more europe-friendly deadline and no weddings interferring with the game. @superbia: I find your name pretty fitting and think you are pretty self-(over-)confident. Maybe, you should work on this a little bit... Had you been humble enough, to question your opinion on Jenny and me again, when we went into lylo, I think there is a high chance for you to win this game and become town-hero but you stuck to your opinion - in my opinion, because you were to proud to admit to yourself, that you might be wrong and because you didn't want to second-guess yourself. I could be totally wrong here, but that was my impression of you. Nonetheless, I enjoyed playing vs. you. Chances are, I wouldn't like playing with you, but that's an other story. On all this stuff considering playing dirty and lieing as mafia... I think the only two lies I told in this game were my two claims of being town and being bulletproof... the rest of the game was pretty "clean", I feel... I'm not really confident with lieing into peoples face, I guess, that comes with practice as scum. ^^ | ||
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The only reason I always refrained from shooting you was me thinking "how can anybody be this obnoxious and full of himself without having a safety-net?"... Your cocky behaviour and all this stuff was kind of a soft-bulletproof-claim to me. Glad to see, that this was all a facade, because tbh... I found you pretty annoying. :D | ||
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He took all the blame for a wrong decision, that wasn't even easy to begin with... and it's not like 2 town-modkills didn't help mafia immensely. Imagine, what this game would have looked like with 5 town alive instead of 3. You and marine played a huge role in this mafia victory as well. | ||
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