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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On April 08 2013 11:06 yamato77 wrote: Gonzaw, what do you think about killing sinani? Your assuming gonzaw outted himself as a day-vig / amercia / russia Im pretty sure he did it just to spruce convo. I think gonzaw is man enough to fire a target all on his own; instead of ask for permission. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 11:12 gonzaw wrote: I hate scummy guys replacing though  Something like that game can happen, where Ver was scum, got replaced, and his replacement acted in a way that made him survive until end-game or something. That sucks. I replaced into Normal Mini 4 the guy i replaced had a green check; and still many thought he could be godfather. If you want to come across as town; you can do it  As for Sn0; yes its possible that he is the one chasing a replacement; I also know from my 3 games with him, he tends to AFK during the weekends. I still think if you were worried about being NK'd, so needed to use a KP today, Sinani is the best choice. Only because, if hes town; hes always going to have suspicion cast over him; and if he is scum.. well of course thats just plain awesome. | ||
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Mocsta
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You guys are defying a very sound scum lynch in Artanis[Xp] To vote OO under the following pretense: (1) Didn't like an item of a meta-read, which was an extension to an already sound case. (2) You think he makes summary posts; when you yourself did the same thing regarding Sinani/Sn0Man prior? (3) You think he spams; which is contradictory because he calls out ppl for spamming. In regards to (3).. whilst that pisses me off.. the guy is a kid (I assume). And since when is spam indicative of alignment? OO was caught easily in hydra, because of his attempts to scum hunt. I dont see how (2) / (3) go anywhere close to finding applicable reasoning to call someone a scum read, in particular over Artanis[Xp] As for (1). thats a matter of personal opinion, and I cant hold that against Caller. Im curious as the inference from his post is that he thinks Artanis is town. And that his vote was a "trap" of sorts. I think this is the 2nd or 3rd time this game where Caller has backed out of actions by calling it a "trap". | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 11:25 Sharrant wrote: That timing is actually kind of amazing. Okay, so you're not convinced on Sinani, you just got two cases to read about Obvious, though I'll be honest I'd rather have him as a lynch. But I want to hear your thoughts on him now. Sharrant, im still waiting for a response to: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403766¤tpage=76#1502 Prob wasnt clear, because I wrote Mr.Rant | ||
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Mocsta
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Thing is: Keirathi and his role recommendation post: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403766¤tpage=34#663 NRA is desired by both partiesl and I can see why. It gives you awesome defense as town/scum against Day Kill and Night Kill. It also acts as a great trap pick for the early draftees. ============= Geript, whilst I have really liked your play this game. I think the move to jump to a conclusion to vote VE is too haste and requires a more fastidious attitude. VE play has been odd this game - that is undeniable. But odd does not 100% equate scum. I liked your case a lot; but I love the Artanis[Xp] case and what it unraveled. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 12:35 Mocsta wrote: Fuck.. i wish I knew whether gonzaw took a shot or not. I see two possibilities Gonzaw was killed by assassin.. and that requires them to know he was "jack" >> day-vig OR Gonzaw visited the NRA member.. but im sure he would have told us he was going for a kill. All other KP require something to be typed into the thread. (during the day cycle) | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 12:45 Sharrant wrote: I'm pretty much 100% sure that that was an assassin kill. Gonzaw pretty much gave away his role earlier when he was figuring that he could withhold his shot today and have any possibility of surviving until the next day and being able to shoot. This makes Sinani look worse for fishing for his role now that it is fairly likely that scum have an assassin. It is possible that he was day vigi'd, but that is much much less likely in my opinion. Day-Vig requires something typed into thread. The thing is.. so many roles have day vig america russia dayvig jack i dunno. i find it unlikely the assassin was willing to risk getting the role wrong.. (cos that will make the power void) i might look through gonzaw filter for crumb. because right now.. i suspect NRA is much higher the question then becomes.. who did he try to kill... artanis or VE | ||
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Mocsta
Australia9388 Posts
On April 08 2013 12:45 Sharrant wrote: I'm pretty much 100% sure that that was an assassin kill. Gonzaw pretty much gave away his role earlier when he was figuring that he could withhold his shot today and have any possibility of surviving until the next day and being able to shoot. This makes Sinani look worse for fishing for his role now that it is fairly likely that scum have an assassin. It is possible that he was day vigi'd, but that is much much less likely in my opinion. Yeah im not getting that. Closest I could find was: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=403766¤tpage=76#1518 Thing is, he describes the KP as one-shot. Which reduces role to Day-Vig/Jack. He was also commenting freely about town vigging at night; as if he knew town had night kp (instead of assume). I think you're right; scum if role hunting, could have surmised with enough confidence gonzaw was jack. So assassin in play; i suggest no more roleclaims. As we dont know if BC is in play too. I suspect only Geript is a potential kill then, as he has rolecliamed. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 12:49 Sharrant wrote: Are you 100% sure that Day vigs have to claim their shot in the thread? Do dayvigs have to claim in the thread? Please be around the thread for the next couple minutes, Mocsta, it's very important to me. Im here hunny, and changed my mind. Its assassin. Imm sure gonzaw woulda told us who he was hitting anyways (if NRA) | ||
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Mocsta
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well its called tunnel vision. i was concentrating on how gonzaw could have died, and it came to what options are day-vig. I wasnt thinking how gonzaw could have visited NRA, i was thinking how gonzaw could have died. The conclusion you jump to is over the top if you had a town read on me prior. But, its a fair point. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 12:57 Sharrant wrote: ??That's twice you've forgotten he actually would have had to write it into the thread, even though you mentioned it just a few minutes ago on the opposite side of the argument. I was looking through gonzaw filter when you and keirathi had an exchange. I made the post above; before reading what you wrote about "gonzaw having to type: ##kill" see, im a townie without all the information.. so i have to piece things together hence why it was fallacious initially; yet i came to the right conclusion in the end - just a different logic train. What i find odd is that you knew with 100% confidence that the death was by assassin. Yet you werent even sure how a day-vig works... NOW that is odd. Want to explain? | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 12:57 Keirathi wrote: So yea, Mocsta is (kinda) right. America, Russia, and Day-Vig are ruled out. I don't see Assassin gambling his power on gonzaw unless he found a lock tight crumb. And, if there is a solid crumb, that (maybe?) opens up the possibility of a BloodC0bbler too. NRA would make some sense, but gonzaw was claiming that he wasn't shooting even as the shot post came up. And who knows how long ago the shot was actually sent in and it took BC to get here and post the death. Meh. Looking back through filters a bit. I think BC is ruled out from the (quick) filter dive i did. =============== Now anways, lets get this show back on track. Gonzaw was a good scum hit; the timing is what is interesting. Are they trying to force us onto VE, because it happened when we were talking about him? hmmm.. for now, i want to maintain the legacy Gonzaw started. We keep the lynch on Artanis[Xp] | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 13:03 Keirathi wrote: Oh hmm. I guess you are right Sharrant. It specifically says that Jack skills are bound by the same rules as its regular counterparts. I honestly hadn't thought about it, and assumed that Jack sent in day kills silently, since his night vig kills would be silent. Keirathi, pls comment on my reversal of sharrant, where he knew that the assassin was the logical choice. Yet didnt even know how day-vig worked etc. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 13:03 Sharrant wrote: This is the post where I knew with 100% certainty that he was the Jack. Scum should've known right then too. He's confident he can save his shot for tomorrow even having already said he could day vig. If I were in his position I'd be 100% sure that I don't live to see tomorrow. He's 100% confident that the town has at least 1 night vig shot. Jack is the only KP role that would let him live the night, and let him day vig. It was the only thing that fit how he was playing. Yeah, well the confidence about surviving night is an inference rather than direct read. Its more the certainty of town night KP that clarifies him as jack > day-vig. Either way; i know not all town read and look for the same things.. But, that you could recall this post so quickly post-hoc gonzaw death; makes me curious. At the same time, i dont think scum would be trying to get involved in identifying the kill as assassin in play so quickly. Both of us made fallacious comments regarding the matter though; you on the day-vig requirements ; me with the jack jay-vig requirements. All in all: I think this exchange firms up my read on you. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 13:10 Sharrant wrote: I feel like you're trying to put suspicion on me, there's a reason I asked in the thread if day vig had to claim his shot. I was unaware of that restriction so thought dayvig could have been in play, but you said it couldn't have been because of the claim. So when Keirathi showed you were indeed correct, it showed that there was only one possible way he could have died, and you had enough information to know that too but you came to the wrong conclusion. Perhaps it was an earnest oversight on your part, but you should have known immediately. The fact you had referenced it so recently but failed to take it into consideration is suspicious. That you're trying to turn this around on me like that makes it doubly so to me. You're an idiot. I was the one trying to openly solve what happened, by laying suggestions and looking for feedback. Why do I have to be right about something I dont have full context for. We have logically deduced it had to be assassin. That is not from me, or you; but teamwork in sharing ideas. You comment on me; when im looking for something specific.. just because your fixation was on a different piece of logic does not make me scum. If you think i was trying to manipulate ppl into thinking it was only NRA, go ahead then and call me scum. But i think i was pretty fucking transparent about the whole exchange. | ||
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Mocsta
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On April 08 2013 13:13 yamato77 wrote: Sentiment is fine.. but i need to extend the thoughts as per:It doesn't matter what killed him, it matters why. Gonzaw was killed because he was obviously town and people were forming around him. What did he advocate? Killing artanis. Let's murder him. On April 08 2013 13:03 Mocsta wrote: The posts identifying Gonzaw as "jack" were from ~8hrs ago.Now anways, lets get this show back on track. Gonzaw was a good scum hit; the timing is what is interesting. Are they trying to force us onto VE, because it happened when we were talking about him? hmmm.. for now, i want to maintain the legacy Gonzaw started. We keep the lynch on Artanis[Xp] i.e. He could have been killed anytime between 8hrs ago, and just before the cycle finished. If they wanted to kill him due to the artanis case.. well... its odd they waited so long. and I choose not to use timezone as a reason for delay. The thread topic at the time was: Geript/VE NRA item. Which was potentially juicy enough to get a wagon off Artanis Im saying this all this, because if Artanis (who we are lynching) flips red.. im inclined to think VE is town. | ||
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On April 08 2013 13:14 Bill Murray wrote: Mocsta, I haven't fully caught up. What is the case on Artanis? You look really town right now, so I don't mind sheeping you. Check artanis filter. He replies to the case directly in snippets.. so you can get a feel for the back/forth. U can also check austinmcc.. 50% of his filter is devoted to standing up for Artanis. | ||
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On April 08 2013 13:13 Keirathi wrote: But that's mostly irrelevant. The bigger question is why were you thinking so hard about what gonzaw's role was in the post you quoted? I agree, and want an answer from Sharrant as well. | ||
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Mocsta
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Dude, whether you are behind the thread or not. I have heard many tales of the legend of "Bill Murray" I thought you were meant to have a pair of balls? So far, your play has left me pretty limp - and being young, dumb and full of cum... I dont like that. | ||
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