|
ooh Marv is after me. this is exciting!
so Marv...you are correct that I asked a lot of questions but didn't provide any answers of my own. I wanted to get people talking about something/anything. There was fuck all else going on in the thread at the time. I was active the evening of the daypost, and then a little bit this morning at work. The topic of conversation when I dropped in at work was gonzaw. You were pursuing him, and I wanted to know how you felt about a few things that looked town to me.
In regards to those two things...in you're view I'm wrong to read them that way. That doesn't make me scum, it makes me wrong.
Basically, nothing really was spiking my scumdar in the material that I had available when I was active. There were a few things that piqued my interest, and I worked off those. My thoughts can be inferred from the questions. I'm a little confused as to how you couldn't see that.
-sciberbia is immediately not matching his town meta. I find this suspicious, so I point it out.
-keirathi's most lengthy post is on a safe zone topic. I want him to know I noticed that, and apply a little pressure. I also want an early connection between him and talis (I had trouble reading talis last game, and I don't want to repeat the mistake.
-vivax has thrown his vote around like a boomerang. I want him to focus, and to draw some early links between him and the people gonzaw accused.
So hopefully that makes it a little clearer for you. As to who I want to lynch today and why...
Miltonkram: I found to my sorrow that making a case on a town Talis is an easy thing to do. This also means that he is an attractive target for scum to harp on. I found Milton's reasoning strange. His filter is small, but there are several references to the use of meta. He uses meta to inform his reads on Keirathi, Sciberbia, and austin...but not his top scum read? I know for certain that the information he would find would be useful to him here. His case reads as phony, and I think there is a good chance he rolled scum again.
Risen: I've spent a ton of time in his past games. The two biggest things he did when he was scum that he didn't do when he was town were: stressing repeatedly that it's too early to have reads, and being forthcoming/defending his 'town reads.' So far this game he has hit both of those marks. He defended Mattchew, and concluded that Dropbear being town is likely. He has said twice that it's too early to post reads.
I feel better about lynching Miltonkram today, and as such:
##vote: Miltonkram
Now talis, you asked about austin. Right now he is looking a lot like he did in his town games. There are no scum games for me to look at, so the meta argument only goes so far. He makes long posts with a lot of stuff that amounts mainly to filler, but he also plants a few nuggets of really good reasoning.
This game his effort matches, and I feel he has made some good points on Risen. Him matching his town meta is only one piece of my view on him, and it's largely unnecessary. His actions thus far seem pretty pro-town to me.
|
what do you think of Miltonkram, Marv?
|
On July 13 2012 20:10 Miltonkram wrote:
s0Lstice- When you've got no other reads just sheep the vets, amirite?
Not really sure where this petulance is coming from, but it's unlike you. What's more, you're wrong. Gonzaw has come the closest to really accusing you, but he has since backed off. Other than that, there is Vivax, who is not a vet.
More, you want me dead now after Marv posted his case. Before that, nothing on me. So who is sheeping now?
Lastly, I was asked to say why I found austin to be town. Part of that is meta, so I said so. It's not the same as what you did. You are asking us to kill talismania, your top scum read, when you haven't done due diligence on your own case by looking at his past games. Having played with him and having done this myself, I know that his past games would give you some insight on the criteria with which you are finding him scummy right now. This would be fine if you aren't a big meta guy, but your use of it in regards to other people says otherwise. It makes me feel like your case is phony/an attempt to blend in, as I said.
-------------------------------------------
Marv, I still want to know what you think of Milton. After that you can get back to killing me otay?
|
quick ninja post while I should be working, regarding my thing with Risen
there are two conflicting ideas that I had some difficulty assignment weight to
-Risen is genuinely trying to improve his town play, and will deviate from his meta as a result
-Risen is matching a few key things in his scum meta
His desire to change his playstyle did seem genuine, especially in the post-game of SSB. I ended up assigning more weight to the second idea though because I believe it is very difficult to escape one's meta, as it is something that largely stems from the subconscious. However, the difficulty involved in ending up where I did was enough to make me want to pursue Milton primarily.
|
oh my bad. is your updated opinion on Talis something that will be shared before lynch time?
|
EBWOP: previous post directed to milton
|
gonzaw, it's Milton, not Milkton. it's bugging the shit out of me!
Marv, in regards to gonzaw, I've been reading through Liar game, and I wanted to share a few things I've noticed. You are first of all right about his activity level being alignment null. That was obvious. Others though I think are pretty telling
-he was very cautious about calling someone town
-he tunneled the shit out of Cephiro
-he cast suspicion on a handful of people for various reasons, often because of bad play, but it was never to the detriment of his focus on Cephiro.
In this game
-he very early on was making town-reads while he hunted scum, and was public about it
-he has not tunneled anyone, but rather cast a wide net to see what sticks. I'd even call it lack of focus, which is generally a town trait.
-he has been factoring in new information and adjusting his reads
It's a hell of a lot of reading, and I'm not quite done yet, but wanted to get this out there. What I found so far makes me think he isn't scum.
|
Yes, I will support a lynch on Risen. I think he has a decent chance at flipping scum.
|
Doing a little road trip this afternoon, so I'll be gone until later on this evening. I'll finally have some time then to do a complete read through and make some fresh reads.
I'm happy with this direction right now though. As I said I think Risen has a decent chance at flipping scum.
##unvote
##vote Risen
|
Vivax- what happened to Miltonkram? You've waffled around on him quite a bit, and now Risen is your top scumread?
|
@Milton Yea I'm here for a bit more. I think dropbear is town for mainly the same reasons that Matt does. He has been fearless, and doesn't particularly care about the consequences of his actions.
|
On July 13 2012 21:51 Vivax wrote:Ok Milton, your defense is quite good. I suspected you for going with towns' sentiment regarding talis and getting an easy lynch target, and to be honest I still feel that the arguments against him aren't very strong. He's in a bad corner cause of his proposition, in page 2 of his filter he stopped talking about the plan, then started calling out people before he got forced into a defensive position again. + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 05:49 talismania wrote:Time to poke the hornet's nest again dropbear what's your response to this (below)? The way I see it, you made a post asking vivax some questions with some implied suspicion maybe. Then marv votes vivax and you eagerly hop on the wagon. When called out, you say you called him out for being suspicious the page earlier, but the only post you made in reference to him was just the one where you asked him questions. You never actually called him out for being suspicious as you said. Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:04 talismania wrote:if you mean this On July 13 2012 01:39 DropBear wrote:Vivax I am very confused as the reasoning behind your voting so far. Why did you choose strongandbig initially? On July 12 2012 18:30 Vivax wrote:
@ NSH
It's cause of a habit. I just tend to expect links in underlined words <_<.
Back to the topic:
##unvote strongandbig
Very informative post about marv there.
Wanted to vote Milton next but he posted.
He tries to make himself pretty transparent by posting his games. It's a good sign, but nothing decisive.
Speaking of meta, sciberbia doesn't look good based on that.I was with him in two games and I feel like he's being different in this one.
s0lstice already pointed out the missing fast posts we're used to see from scib at the start of the game.
That alone is forgivable given the posted reasons. But the overall gut feeling is still bad cause of the overall style. What do you mean by an informative post? Cos he made a case he must be town or something? What are the differences in sciberbia you talk about? then I don't see you calling him suspicious, but just asking him questions. Implied suspicion I'll give you, but not calling him out as being suspicious by any means. Also good to know you're just as angry as in bastard 2 :-) If there is something I detest, is when someone gets accused for defending himself, like you did, Milton. Defending yourself is playing to win, from each alignments perspective. It's only logical that a guy who has to counter endless arguments can't be actively scumhunting, but Talis posted his reads already on page 1 before people started accusing him so heavily: + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 00:43 talismania wrote:Reactions to talismania's Shitty Plan
(for those who care) + Show Spoiler +marvellosityOn July 12 2012 08:54 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 08:50 talismania wrote:
pardon me for some half-assed musing:
since we've got majority lynch to deal with, what about some sort of nomination system? I don't like how majority allows townies and scum alike to save their opinions on people, especially day one and just hop on whatever bandwagon is happening near the end of the day. It would be nice if, say, 24 hours in everyone puts up a list of three players they want to see in consideration for the lynch and reasons why. Then all that gets tallied up or something and we decide between the popular choices. Actually you wouldn't even need to tally or enforce that. Just having everyone put up three names with reasons should be good enough to move discussion towards a consensus lynch candidate or two (hush s&b yes I am and always will try to get people to post their impressions of others). no next On July 12 2012 09:47 marvellosity wrote:
naw, I'm not killing anyone based on one post right at the beginning of the game (especially as pregame was quite active/friendly, it spilled over)
I'd rather lynch talis for his never-ending bullshit on listing names and reasons.
Seriously, 24 hours into day 1 and we're supposed to come up with reasons on 3 different people for why they might be scum? It's just nonsense.
Or... wait for it... I have an idea! If someone says something a person finds scummy, they can call them out and bring it to the thread! Wow, marv, you say - an amazing plan!
People shouldn't be 'forced' to make effort, the making of the effort willingly is what helps gives us our reads on people. Predictably shits on it, suggests policy lynching me out of his annoyance that I keep proposing these dumb plans. gonzawOn July 12 2012 09:36 gonzaw wrote:So, if the lynch was right now I'd want to kill one of these 3 guys: Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 07:56 Risen wrote:
Welcome to ICBINTMM in which Risen does not post in caps or call anyone an idiot THE ENTIRE GAME. Stay tuned to see if this actually happens...... Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 07:33 strongandbig wrote:
sup bros
i am currently watching Le Closer in french in my hotel room.
Scum y'all best get ready to get motherfucking interrogated Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 06:33 Mattchew wrote:
alight lets do this.
no zentor means no policy lynch based on names for me. You can see the recurring theme in all 3 (just 1 post, promising something/appearing they are eager to start but not doing anything else later). marv, talismania, anybody active, what do you think about these guys? If you had to kill one of them which one would you choose and why? (if you don't want to kill anyone then say so). Also this guy could die too: Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 08:05 austinmcc wrote:
Screw the number and size of posts. I'm not a scientist, but it looks like talismania's been town --> scum --> town --> scum --> town. Therefore, he's scum this game.
I know that millers are supposed to claim D1, but I don't see why we'd want claims on other roles right now. Except from marv, who needs to let us know whether he's a vigi or scum this game, since those are the only roles that he rolls. But at least he put a little bit more effort (although that's not town-telling) Dropbear and Milton haven't even posted, but well we can't do anything about it. Actually follows the plan - as I said seems rather townie. Especially the timing. MattchewOn July 12 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
Also, talis has the worst plan ever with his 3 people thing. That just allows people to half ass push some stupid reads and then connections theories run wild and everything turns to shit shits on it solsticeOn July 12 2012 11:04 s0Lstice wrote:
Keirathi, assuming you are still around...
why so verbose about lurkers? what do you think of talismania's plan? I actually don't see him reacting to it at all yet he asks keirathi about it. Interesting. He did react to gonzaw's post reacting to mine. austinmccOn July 12 2012 11:33 austinmcc wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 11:06 Mattchew wrote:
Anyway I want to hear more from austin his first post doesnt sit well with me That's because there's basically nothing to my first post except "Millers claim," which isn't helpful. What I can add is that I think talismania's 3-case plan is bad, but that seems to be the general sentiment. Forcing arbitrary requirements on everyone isn't really going to help us, and is going to clog up the thread later. People are going to make halfhearted cases to try to reach that number, someone will inevitably only find 1-2 people scummy and we'd end up in some "does x not making 3 cases = scummy?" discussion, and we also might end up lynching people that EVERYONE finds a little bit scummy rather than someone that a few people have a strong scumread on for good reasoning. Can also add that I haven't played with gonzaw, but I've obsed his recent games. Anyone here feel like they do a good job reading him, and if so, can you post some tips? I've found that I almost always end up reading him as scum, because he is active enough and posts enough that I keep finding scummy things to latch on to. Had him scum at the end of liar game just prior to the katina lynch, but also found him really scummy in the recent MTG because I felt like some of the plans he pushed hard were anti-town (check the obsqt early on, although I didn't post much there). So...any magical tricks for getting the right read on Gonzaw? Actually this reads scummy again on the second go-round too. He says he's about to "add" something but literally just copies/expands on what marv said and doesn't add anything at all. KeirathiOn July 12 2012 11:54 Keirathi wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 11:04 s0Lstice wrote:
Keirathi, assuming you are still around...
why so verbose about lurkers? what do you think of talismania's plan? Sorry was getting dinner. I was verbose because I have some shared experience with sciberbia, whom I was replying to. I know that most (all?) of his TL mafia experience was in newbie games, and the dynamic is just different when you can assume that people know how to play the game. As far as talismania's plan, I feel like it makes it too easy for mafia to blend in. The more townies you have making arguments against other townies, the easier you can push mislynches and not have to take any blame for them. There are other things wrong with it, but Mattchew and austin beat me to it. No need rehashing what they said. Mmm I think this is innocuous. He might not even have responded if he hadn't been asked to. DropBearOn July 12 2012 15:18 DropBear wrote:This is silly. Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 08:50 talismania wrote:
pardon me for some half-assed musing:
since we've got majority lynch to deal with, what about some sort of nomination system? I don't like how majority allows townies and scum alike to save their opinions on people, especially day one and just hop on whatever bandwagon is happening near the end of the day. It would be nice if, say, 24 hours in everyone puts up a list of three players they want to see in consideration for the lynch and reasons why. Then all that gets tallied up or something and we decide between the popular choices. Actually you wouldn't even need to tally or enforce that. Just having everyone put up three names with reasons should be good enough to move discussion towards a consensus lynch candidate or two (hush s&b yes I am and always will try to get people to post their impressions of others). This isn't going to happen and would just waste time.
On the majority lynch, day 1 this tends to be a right kerfuffle. I can't think of any system that has ever worked on day 1 in games I have been part of. So fuck a system, we deal with it when the time comes. There should be solid candidates by then anyway. Actually this doesn't sit that well with me at all. Conversation had started to move on and then he brings it back to my plan and says the same shit everyone else did. I also don't like his misrepresentation of my views on the roleblocker's use of their power. strongandbigOn July 12 2012 16:51 strongandbig wrote:Hey bros For people who weren't in ssb or mtg mafias, just wanted to let you guys know I am currently in Europe, where I don't have a cell phone data plan. This means I can only post when I have wifi, which is a change from my normal method. I've also been busy at work so please don't expect much from me before 8pm CET.
Now for serious stuff: I'm going to be watching marv like a motherfuking hawk. I think hosts tend to try to "balance" games sometimes by tweaking their scum team selection; however, that can and has led to extra info from town through balance speculation. Marvellosity makes an extremely tempting player for hosts to do this kind of balancing, because his scum play is empirically very good, but he isn't a "veteran" so he's not likely to be the subject of balance speculation. I also suspect bugs of doing this kind of balancing. + Show Spoiler [reasons, from wheel of fortune.] +The last of his c++ games I played in was wheel of fortune. That was a stacked game and I was one of the worst players in it, although I did eventually manage to figure out the scum team (and got shot for having correct reads before I could push some of them). With the benefit of hindsight, that scum team looks almost perfectly balanced for the player base. Radfield was town, ace was scum. VE and Forumite were both good players, but only on the edge of being full-on vets. I firmly believe that town would have won that game if Radfield hadn't decided to use a DT check on Ace, who was godfather. That kind of closeness is the sign of a well-balanced game; and the odds that both town and scum would have their best player as their best power role are very small from pure chance. So what does this mean? I am NOT proposing to policy lynch marvellosity; if he's town he can be a great asset, and besides that's totally against the spirit of the game. What I AM saying is that I think when someone points out something scummy he does, we should take it pretty seriously. Pure chance wouldn't explain why he has rolled scum in something like half his games since our first game together (noob 6) while I have rolled it once - him being good and me not does explain that.
NOW: having told you why you should pay attention, I'm going to point out something scummy marv has done. That thing is: propose/say he would be okay with lynching Talismania. Talismania's plan IS anti town. When Ace is host and he tells an obs QT how good a plan is for scum, you better believe he knows what he's talking about. Systematic case proposing plans give scum an excuse to make shitty reads and blend in, because everyone is making shitty cases and dumb reads. That kind of plan dilutes good information and adds bad information. HOWEVER: Talismania proposes this plan as town. All the time. Like, every game. Usually "pushing scummy plans" is a decent scum tell; but this specific player pushing this specific plan is not. And Marvellosity should know this. Marv has obs'd at least two games where Talismania proposed this plan or a variation of it (ssb, bangbang). Tali has proposed this in other games. Marv is the kind of player who pays attention; he should also know that I've pushed tali hard for these plans in the past, as have others. Marv putting tali forward as his first lynch candidates comes down to an easy push on an easy target for reasons he should know are bad. Marv, I'm watching you.+ Show Spoiler [on Talismania, briefly] + I'm not saying tali is an easy target in general, like kenpachi or grush would be. He's not that kind of shitty player slash bad case magnet. It's just that for marv to propose him for lynch based on that plan is scummy. He's right about me always pushing this idea althoguh I think he's overreacting to marv's reaction. So actually not that many people commented on it even though I thought like everyone did oops. My views: scummy responses: austinmcc, dropbear null responses: marv, mattchew, keirathi, strongandbig townie response: gonzaw did not respond directly although was in the thread: Risen, sciberbia, solstice I sure see the effort to post reads and clear stances here. The responses to his plan have quite some potential. Cause I think your arguments made against talis are inflated and not good, I can't believe you to be town yet. In fact, I may not be able to debunk your case against talis, but I still have an overall bad impression of you, Milton. Another thing in your disfavor: Your defense from s0lstices points is actually an attack. You don't seem to have pushed back his arguments regarding you, you rather tried to discredit him for inconsistence regarding meta, that's a pretty OMGUS/scummy type of defense imo. I'll post more about Keirathi and Dropbear soon, they offer quite interesting connections. Gonna try to interprete Dropbears mistake and draw conclusions.
Also Vivax, I'd like you to talk about this some. You start out by (I assume) clearing Milton of suspicion. Suspected is past tense. Then you go on about how bad Milton's case was against Talis, add another point against him in how he attacked me after being accused. You conclude in the middle that you can't say he's town yet, but you have a bad impression of him.
This meandering is strange. You cleared him at the start of the post, and then tip-toe back to near where you were before on him.
|
Marv I don't know why you are surprised I voted risen. He was one of my two focuses today, and nobody outside of vivax expressed real interest in voting milton.
|
man this has been an extremely frustrating day 1 for me. I'm normally pretty stellar at looking town, so it's a weird feeling to be up for lynch. It's my own fault though, I over-estimated how much time I would have to play before the weekend.
austin- in regards to vivax, despite some stuff I found strange (he never answered my questions), I still think he is town at the moment.
I should have left awhile ago. I wont be able to check the thread until this evening. If I'm alive, then I'll finally get some quality time with the filters. If I'm dead, then gg all and good luck town!
|
gg to marv, and hi to all.
I spent 4 hours last night in the wee hours of the morning reading filters. I ended up with a lot of town reads and not much else, it was really frustrating. Day 1 in general was pretty frustrating, I think for all of us. I'm here now and it's past time I gave the content I promised. I'll be reading and writing over the next 4-5 hours and will post following that.
|
Alright, so here is who I'm looking at: strongandbig
I don't like early stuff he posted on Marv, like at all. It was a lot of garbage to say one simple thing: Marv is dangerous as scum, so I will be watching. What is the purpose of all this...saying it in the first place and all the back and forth? If you are really worried about a player being scum with no evidence to go off of, why the heck would you announce to the thread that you are paying this person special attention? Just keep it to yourself and do it, and reap the potential rewards.
It's mainly because of this though:
On July 14 2012 04:50 strongandbig wrote:
i was leaning townie on risen because of his trolovote on vivek, it seemed town - but now that i reread his filter there are a few things that give me pause. specifically, his "i hunt for whole scum teams" thing is pretty turr'ble - he says "it's easier for me to make cases when I consider people as members of a team", which seems to be missing the point of scumhunting as a townie. i think a townie would be talking about "easy to find scum" not "easy to make cases". i also dont like how focused he is on defending himself by making a case on someone else instead of actually answering the cases against him. that said, I don't think that his inactivity makes him scummy, since he could just have lurked if he was lurky scum instead of promising future activity.
He was just in a game with risen where he flipped town, and exhibited the exact same behaviors he is finding scummy here. I know that he knows that Risen likes to throw out whole scumteams as town, and rely on connections between scum teammates.
Finding him suspicious for those reasons this game makes me think he is scum.
austinmcc:
I'm changing my mind. Honestly, this:
On July 14 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 14 2012 05:29 austinmcc wrote:
Torn on Keirathi. He's got some townie-looking posts, but they come only after he was pressured for being too neutral and guarded. Once he posts them, he's mostly checked out. Wishing there was more to work with here. (He posted as I was writing this, need to look back over)
Vivax looks scummy in his hopping around, all the meta nometa crap. But Vivax ALWAYS looks scummy to me. I mislynched him in newbie XVI, I found him scummy in LVI (alignment unknown as of yet), and so I don't really want to vote him D1. To me, he's an easy mislynch to push if I'm scum. He's so wrapped up in this person's meta or that person's meta that the scum team should be telling him to knock it off, right? There were plenty of other options for today's lynch, we had so many scattered votes at the start of the day. So why let him keep hanging himself? Don't like it.
marv and solstice, how are you seeing Vivax right now?
Risen still doesn't look great either. He comes back with a full scum team, an alternate scum in Gonzaw, and finds my finding him townie scummy. No activity --> 5 scum reads, with only a little reasoning backing that up. And now he tunnels Vivax, who again I always seem to find scummy and could see myself trying to mislynch if I were scum.
At the moment, I'm willing to consolidate onto Vivax or Risen if needed, but probably not Keirathi in light of his most recent response(s).
For now, my vote's going on solstice. Something really bugs me about him finding my early game to match my townie play. Yes, the length is always there, but my early posts were a mess. Gonzaw's right about that, marv is right that they look off. I wasn't pressured at all really in my newbie games, barring XIII which was just an odd game to play in. I think my response to a little pressure here was way off, because while I normally post lengthy, it's not so disorganized and jumbled. Concerned that he didn't pick up on that. That little thing keeps nagging at me enough that I'm willing to vote him.
##Vote: Solstice Seriously? Strongest read: vivax (but apparently he's allllways scummy to austin), but imma vote s0Lstice. They don't write sitcoms this good, folks.
So yea, like Risen, I don't like how I garner the vote instead of Vivax or Risen.
I don't like how he said he would consolidate on Risen, when his reasoning for going back from town read to scum read is his transition from inactivity to 5 scum reads and an alternate. I don't like this because I know he has looked at town games where Risen has shown exactly this same behavior as town. Have a look:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 06:04 austinmcc wrote:Milton's post is fluffy but as people keep noting every time he comes up, he said he'd be gone for 12-24 hours before the game started: Show nested quote +On July 10 2012 17:31 Miltonkram wrote:
Eh, screw it. I'll /in this game if people don't mind me being a little inactive for the first 12-24 hours. The players in this game look too good to pass up. No read on him yet.
Here were my earlier thoughts on Risen: + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 01:31 austinmcc wrote:I'm more interested in Risen though. Need to read him and see if he actually doesn't have scumreads early, but does that sit alright with people? My D1 reads are AWFUL, but I still have them. How do you read the game as town and not have scumreads? Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:18 Risen wrote:
I think it's too early for anything. I don't really like to make reads without any connections (this might be a bad thing to do). I just think it's easier for me to make cases when I consider people as members of a team, not as individual scum members. Anyway, Risen's filter is a lot of talking about how he's going to play this game. Which is helpful, lets us know his plan and can explain away some differences in behavior. But it's basically filler about oneself. Early interaction with Gonzaw, which ends with this: Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 10:38 Risen wrote:
I was just pointing out I found it odd you would try and push people onto "lurkers" so early on. I don't think anything about you. There's nothing to go on right now. I don't think that post was in your favor, though. When he speaks about DropBear later, we get: Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:22 Risen wrote:
For example: this could be DropBear bussing/giving his teammate a way to backtrack on his plan or it could be scum calling out a townie. I'm not saying I even have a scumread on drop as he seems to want a pro-town environment, which is something I'm all for, but this is something that could be used to confirm a connection in my mind at a later point in time. Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:22 Risen wrote:
EBWOP: He could also just be a townie doing pro-town things. This is the most likely option. Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 15:25 Risen wrote:
I don't like how drop is trying to take the lead here and I think previously with all this "hey mate decent line but try this instead" or "hey mate lets be bros but I don't think you should be doing this"
I generally don't like anything that could be considered guidance coming from anywhere other than a plan with spelled out logic. He could be scum bussing a scumbuddy. He could be scum calling out town. He's probably a townie. He's a townie but I don't like what he's doing. A lot of filter, but nothing really said. Dunno. Being wrong as a townie is plenty forgiveable. It's going to happen, especially on the early days. But not scumhunting, or not having reads until later in the game, isn't helpful to town at all. Even if you don't trust your reads early as much as your reads late, you've got to contribute. Apart from just not having contributed much except the discussions concerning Gonzaw and DropBear, neither of whom he has any strong feelings on, it just doesn't feel like Risen has done anything this game despite having a lot of posts. Hasn't really been activity since then, so my read is roughly the same. I don't like that a lot of his filter is about how he's going to play this game, with the rest being non-reads and his statement that he doesn't like to make reads early. I still don't know what to make of the statement about not liking to make reads early. It doesn't fully correspond with past games. I said I'd go back and look, and I did. SSB:+ Show Spoiler +On July 03 2012 04:26 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2012 04:15 kingdedede wrote:On July 03 2012 04:09 iGrok wrote:
It's all about how difficult it is to lynch them. There are a lot of things that are -1kp in this game. Cutting everyone down from 3 to 2.5 is very nice for us because then it only takes 2 actions to kill them instead of 3 (or two lynches) Ah, that makes a lot more sense. It's all about the vig shots. While scum kp is also 1, the chance of scum shooting someone who just got lynched is pretty small: why would they bother shooting someone who got lynched (aka: looks scummy)? However, it allows us to vig shoot someone who was lynched and not waste 2 lynches on it. Bringing down everybody's stock sounds like a good idea. How can you be agreeing with this? iGrok you've hosted this before I feel like your giant cred post at the very beginning was an attempt to make everyone confirm you as town right off the bat, but as someone coming in late to the party I think your behavior is very scummy and I don't think someone who knew how this game worked would suggest your plan. We should be minimizing town stock loss. What do you mean "if the scum don't follow us it's clear who they are". Yeah no shit, this plan works out perfect for them why wouldn't "they" follow it. The more I think about it the more I KNOW you wouldn't post some stupid idea like this as town. Add to this your removal of two people from the item position list? What the heck man. All you've done by removing two people from the item list is make it so mafia has a better chance of getting an item. Want to minimize mafia chance of item while maximizing town chance so we're not double stacking? Then have us go down the list in numerical order and say that's left, bottom left, center, etc. Same for left, center, right on the position discussion. I'm going to be voting iGrok for lynch at this point. On July 03 2012 06:13 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2012 06:13 Cephiro wrote:On July 03 2012 05:59 Risen wrote:
Exactly WHAT does standing on the same platform tell us? It tells us NOTHING. 1) It gives us insight on iGrok's thoughts. (He made a very neutral/safe choice, punishing everyone or no-one, not grouping people yet, which he however IS doing in his item picks/sit-outs. He also gave a valid reasoning, it may not necessarily be the optimal choice, but I haven't seen anyone else give a better idea yet.) 2) The reactions of the players on iGrok's choices. (For example, you insist on not going left with everyone, which you haven't given a valid reason for. Or talismania willing to sit-out, even though there is no risk of a fight [Stock loss] if people follow the plan.) So tell me, have a better idea? For now all I am seeing is that you are saying you are not going to follow the plan. (Which you say is because this gives us no information, which is false.) And in your latest posts you were thinking of dividing by the list. (Which doesn't give us any information at all.) I can say it's not much, but it's better than nothing, and we need something to get the scumhunting started. If you're still going to go against the plan without either a) Giving a better idea or b) Giving proper reasoning, then you're certainly not looking good in my eyes. Found the other scum. Two total? Easy game. On July 03 2012 07:02 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2012 07:00 iGrok wrote:On July 03 2012 06:54 Risen wrote:On July 03 2012 06:50 Cephiro wrote:
Because you're clearly smarter than me, would you care to explain more in-detail why do you consider that both factions losing percentually the same amount of stock out of their total, thus the ratio staying the same, is worse off for town?
If I understood right, you'd rather do a 3-2-3 split. Assuming there are 2 scum, best case scenario is if both scum end up in the middle and a tornado hits them both. Chances of this happening is (1/3)*(1/4)*(1/7) ~ 1,18%
Worst case scenario is that it hits three townies: (1/3)*(3/4)*(5/7)*(2/3) ~ 11,19%
The chance of worst case scenario happening for town is almost 10 times higher than scum, if my math is not wrong.
Can you explain me why your plan is better?
Especially as iGrok's plan only has a 33% chance of anyone taking damage, and if it happens, we all take damage in an equal ratio.
End ratio isn't equal. Someone else posted on this. Stand where you want to stand people, don't be directed. No information comes from all of us standing on a single square. Damage outweighs benefits imo. Think that sums well. NO, HE POSTED THAT THE END RATIOS ARE EQUAL. QUIT BEING OBTUSE. Don't post in big caps. I was wrong on that, cool. Fact remains we have a smaller buffer. No need to shout. I'm almost 100% iGrok is scum. He doesn't get heated like this usually. Within the first day of SSB, he's decided two players are scum. However, his Cephiro read DOES match up with what he said this game, that he likes connection cases, because he finds Cephiro scummy based on his finding iGrok scummy On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. On April 22 2012 03:39 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 03:31 slOosh wrote:
Hey layabout I think Risen is acting really off. Agree / disagree? Oh hey look, easy wagon member #1 On April 23 2012 05:33 Risen wrote:
Honestly johnnywup is my biggest scumread atm Pac. I have no idea why he thinks forwarding another lynch candidate at the last second is a good idea, and it just shits up the thread. Do we take the case against him seriously? Do we try and organize everyone to swap their votes over to zeph even though no one else has mentioned zeph as a serious candidate thus far? We can't do that, we don't have the time.
I know I was against it before, but I don't see how marvel could be pushing a lynch on VE right now. We can't lynch our claimed JK. It's been stated in the thread but I'll state it again. You don't lynch a claimed doctor, and we shouldn't lynch the closest thing we have to a doctor. Is it possible VE is lying? Yup. He might be lying and be a vigi, or a tracker, or scum, or vanilla. Doesn't matter. The only shitty thing is that the person who is jailed doesn't know they were jailed, so I don't know how to confirm his claim.
Regardless, a vote on VE is stupid. It's just like everyone who voted for me when I claimed a guaranteed sane detective with a red check. Only an idiot would vote for said blue unless it was LYLO. It's applicable here. We can't lynch someone who claims such a powerful blue role right now. Is it a shitty claim? Yeah. I don't think it was smart, but we have to roll with it now that it's in the open. Any trackers watch him, I guess.
I'm voting marvel. Pre-EBWOP I just looked at the voting thread prior to hitting post. What the hell is going on? How can you lynch a claimed blue? This is so stupid. If need be I'll vote BM b/c I'm all for lynching someone who's being useless, but for now my vote is resting on marvel.
##vote marvellosity On April 23 2012 06:45 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 01:16 gonzaw wrote:Risen:I'd like to lynch Risen and I'll tell you why On April 22 2012 02:22 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 01:42 layabout wrote:How are you feeling VE? Any thoughts on marvellosity paqman or mattchew? we need Risen to rise and get posting we need ghost 403 to de-cloak we need St.Daniel to grace us with his presence we need Janaan to get out of bed we need slOosh to stop fapping to Beethoven *we need BroodkingEXE to execute som scum for us we need Bill Murray to get his head in the game we need Zephirrd to tell you guys to stop posting shit we need layabout to stop with the puns lead us to victory Yeah I'm sorry. Just woke up. I'll get posting. Posting lots is pro-town and from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy. I'd rather we put pressure on someone who isn't posting. I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting. From the last page I do have a problem with mementoss' idea. It seems solid but as you said on this page, all vigs would have to get on board. I don't like directing blues in the first place (i realize this game has special stuff going on, though, so I don't think forwarding the idea is scummy. I just don't think we should do it). Another problem with your plan mt is your directing of jailkeepers. By directing jk away from targets and the vigis you give scum a potential three kill night. They can kill the vig, another person, and then if the vigi target is town they get to laugh at us. To sum, don't direct blues. I think there's been enough discussion about it and with no clearly best plan there's no way to get everyone behind one plan. This post is wishy washy as hell. First he starts by being unnecessary apologetic when laya called him out. He posts a very wishy washy statement like "from what I've read I don't find anyone really all that scummy". Really? That's not the town Risen I know of. The town Risen I know of would instantly find people scummy and try to create discussion. Town Risen wouldn't stay neutral and spout wishy washy shit like "I'm not sure who's scummy". Then he keeps trying to appear more "innocent" and neutral by saying things like "I messed up last game with my pressure on ET so I'm not sure how to get everyone posting". Then the rest of the post is fluff about Mementos' plan. He doesn't seem to have a solid stance on the matter (says things like "I don't like directing blues, though I realize this game has special stuff going on") yet he just keeps talking about it. Also, please note the tone of his post. It seems neutral, but most of all it's not aggressive at all. It seems submisive. Layabout called him out and he seems afraid and posts only because he was called out. Also take notice of the bolded "Posting lots is pro-town" bit, I'll use it later. On April 22 2012 02:28 Risen wrote:
I don't get your reasoning mt or anyone else's voting for marvel. He's posting and it's very early day 1. There isn't that much to go off of so I don't think he's scummy. I hate lurkers, they always fuck us and it isn't pro-town at all. I'd rather not lynch someone who's here day 1. Posting is pro-town and I don't think we should be scaring people away from posting day 1 bc it just gives people an excuse to be worthless He just barely comments on the marvel issue, but doesn't really take any stances. He keeps up with his "I still don't think anybody is scummy" excuse to avoid taking stances on people. He also doesn't comment on other things happening in the thread, like VE's "case" on me, or my case against VE, or the Paqman/Mattchew issue, nothing. Again, note the bolded bit too. On April 22 2012 03:04 Risen wrote:On April 22 2012 02:54 layabout wrote:
Anybody feel like Risen is hustlin' us? I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me. ##vote layabout I'm done for now. I'll change my vote if someone does something scummy but I don't see anything and I think someone trying to push a wagon at this point is our best bet. I'll vote for the hydra too. Now here's the kicker. Here he goes against layabout and votes him, and his reason is "I think you're making up bullshit to try and push an easy wagon on me"... ...really? I already said how this seems like Toad's play from LI. He ignores current discussion, he avoids taking a stance on the current events, and instead decides to FoS someone completely irrelevant for shitty reasons, and keeps his vote there. This vote only disrupts town because he fails to justify it and derails current discussions. Not only that, but it makes it so he can "justify" his vote and just leave it there, so he can fake trying to contribute. But there's another important thing to take into account: Notice how aggressive he's become against layabout.Why did the tone of his post and his behaviour change so much? In that first post he sounded afraid. Laya called him out and he sounded submissive against him, he was the opposite of aggressive. He posted trying to please laya, had a very neutral tone, was wishy-washy and didn't take any stances. Yet now that layabout points out Risen being suspicious, he flips and goes all crazy against him? Really? I don't buy that change of behaviour, it's inconsisent, it's way too sudden and doesn't make sense with the way he was posting before. Hey, remember that bolded bits I was mentioning before? Here: Posting lots is pro-town He says that posting a lot is pro-town, yet he's not following his own advice and is barely posting!So really people, Risen is scum because: - He barely posts at all even though he said posting a lot is pro-town and people should be encouraged to do it
- Starts off wishy washy as hell, sounds very submissive and afraid of being called out, ignores current discussions and doesn't take stances on them, posts uninteresting fluff about directing blues while not even taking a solid stance on the matter
- Makes a very flimsy vote on layabout and doesn't justify it at all
- Has a very sudden change of behaviour. He becomes aggressive very quickly while his previous behaviour was the opposite of that
- He doesn't play like when he does as town at all. As town he posts without fear or hesitation, he actively calls people out and tries whatever he can to get some discussion going. As town he posts more and pushes people more, as town he doesn't park a vote on someone irrelevant for irrelevant reasons and remains hidden for the rest of the day
So people, let's lynch Risen
##Unvote: VisceraEyes
##Vote: Risen What kind of stupid shit is this? By request of jubjub Pac I'll respond. Wishy washy? What the hell do you want from me not even a day into the game? How the hell could ANYONE have true feelings of someone being scum that early on. You can have policies that guide you, such as kill every idiot you see, like anyone on VE or lynch lurkers like BM, but you can't possibly have feelings of people being scummy that early on. Only people who are atrocious at this game would take that point seriously. Oh look, we have pac taking it seriously. I'm so shocked. You say this posting looks like Toad from LI? Awesome. I'm not Toad. Also, where do you get me being SUBMISSIVE to layabout. The guy was playing like an idiot and I called him out on it. If you count me apologizing for cursing as being "submissive" then you need to get your head checked. How can you go from me voting layabout to trying to get approval from him. Stupidity at it's finest. BUT Pac wants me to address this piece of shit case so lets keep going. On to your little bullets. 1) I've been busy as all hell, but I've been trying to come in and read and post instead of lurk. Screw it, I should have just lurked. You're right, posting in the thread is anti-town. My bad, I was wrong. I'll stop posting. 2) Not taking a solid stance? I SAID DONT DIRECT BLUES. IT IS BAD. How much more solid does it get? What do I have to do to make it more solid? 3) A flimsy vote on layabout? You right... because votes before a day has passed in the game are going to be super solid. Oh wait. They're not. Only an idiot or scum would try and say something like this. I'm leaning idiot because at least your vote isn't with the derps on VE. 4) I like how you call me passive and then point number 4 is saying I'm being too aggressive. This case is air tight guys, let's all get on the Risen choo choo. Right Janaan? 5) People don't have lives my b I always forget about that. I wasn't supposed to head back to Vegas until next weekend and when I signed up for this game it didn't matter anyways. It took two years to start, though, and I've only been able to read the thread from my phone. Now I'm able to type on a keyboard and tear this horrid case to shreds. I'll sum this case for all you dolts voting on me. Risen isn't playing like his town play usually is (but lets not link any of Risen's filters and quote anything from previous games, lets just SAY that's how it is and pray people don't actually check his filters.) Wow. Slam dunk case Paq, glad I took the time to respond to it. Why are you on me again? I don't have much time, I'm driving back to Flagstaff very shortly. I'm going to cut all this nonsense short and post cases against every person on VE. They're all idiots and/or scum who should be killed. Risen was scum this game, threw around a good number of votes in thread but not as many actual reads as above. Again, focused heavily on connections like who was voting for VE or who found him scummy after the "Risen is scum" idea was proposed On March 23 2012 06:01 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 21 2012 22:54 Acrofales wrote:
Okay seriously WTF. I know I'm new to this game, but voting me for that reason alone makes no sense. In fact, it seems quite a scum move to cast suspicion on people right at the start of the game.
Or am I going overboard and it's just a way of getting people to post at the start of the game? Either way, I'm watching you and risk.nuke. Voting off the bat seems fishy. Everything about this post screams emotional overreaction to being voted with something that is clearly not a serious vote. Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 02:23 Acrofales wrote:On March 22 2012 01:50 DoYouHas wrote:Acrofales reads exactly like newb scum to me from his first posts. His first post reads as already being defensive to me: On March 21 2012 18:51 Acrofales wrote:Hi everybody! Well, Curu hasn't said I cannot speculate about Petyr's win condition. Remember that this is idle speculation, but I have read the books a number of times and if Petyr is anything, he is untrustworthy. He only serves his own means, so I am inclined to ignore everything he says, including that he is a vanilla townie  My hunch is that he must kill Ned Stark and keep Catelyn and/or Sansa alive until the end of the game to win. And then he pulls an OMGUS on 2 different people in a very short period of time. ##Vote: AcrofalesGumshoe, wake up and read day1 carefully. We already know who Littlefinger is 100%. It is given information. Your posts are yet to actually be relevant to the game. What you bolded was basically a follow-up to my question before the game started: On March 20 2012 18:13 Acrofales wrote:Are we allowed to speculate about what Littlefinger's win condition is? I have a hunch Unfortunately it has nothing to do with Dementors eating Daenerys baby in order to generate infinite facebook spam messages. As for the rest, I've calmed down a bit, with later people talking about the random votes. It is my first game (ever) and I was hoping to live past the first day. People instavoting for me got me a bit upset. I am happy to unvote Matthew when a better candidate comes up, the ghost of High Heart is kinda cryptic when it comes to her prophecies It was more of a "if you vote for me, then I'll vote for you"-thing anyway. That said, Matthew, why did you vote for me? Chaoser already had the random vote on me. The 2nd one was just mean. That vote has been the entire contribution to this game, with no explanation or text (except for a lololololol, which is even less useful). For reasons I can't put my finger on, I get the feeling from this post that Acro is either horrible, horrible town, or trying to just talk with mattchew so they can generate discussion that looks pro-town. Makes me feel like Acro and mattchew are both scum. Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 05:34 Acrofales wrote:On March 22 2012 05:16 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 03:15 Acrofales wrote:
Any further discussion will have to wait til I'm home. Be back in about an hour.
PS. I read through a couple of games before signing up for this one. It's quite different to play than to watch! :D where you at homeslice and why should i think you are not scum Because I'm town. How about you? More proof of my earlier feeling. Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 06:21 Acrofales wrote:On March 22 2012 06:13 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 05:34 Acrofales wrote:On March 22 2012 05:16 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 03:15 Acrofales wrote:
Any further discussion will have to wait til I'm home. Be back in about an hour.
PS. I read through a couple of games before signing up for this one. It's quite different to play than to watch! :D where you at homeslice and why should i think you are not scum Because I'm town. How about you? so you ignore the case against you and then come back with a one liner holding no information? i say we lynch acrofales and everyone that has defended him I'm still trying to figure out what case that is. I have already said twice now why I overreacted at first. Although I am starting to think my reaction was the right one. You're clearly not adding anything: you choose to ignore the two posts I made in defense of my overreaction, and now mention some case against me. Post your case clearly and properly and I will respond to you, but at the moment you just seem to be trolling me. Even more... Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 23:39 Acrofales wrote:Why we should lynch Mattchew: First off, he starts building an alibi with a case made of air. I understand the pressure vote, but his follow-up was lackluster: On March 22 2012 02:21 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 02:15 Lyter wrote:
I'd say ignore wbg at least for now, we have absolutely no idea what his motives/intentions could be, when more of a picture is formed then we should come back to it by all means.
I'm not sure on Acrofales, yea he could be flipping a shit cos he got called out so early, but his actions are hardly unlikely for a new guy anyway. oh so your his scum teammate? I understand that this is his character, but it is a very useless accusation. You assume I'm scum, therefore everybody who defends me must also be scum. His main reason for calling me scum is: On March 22 2012 03:28 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 03:26 GreYMisT wrote:
Explain to us why he is. over defensive "im a noob" that doesn't want to be be put in the spotlight. look at his reaction compared to the other "noob" guy with a vote on him. its way more aggressive and emotionally angry. The meta-comparison is a completely moot point, as had been pointed out by a number of people. So you were basically tunneling on me, and the reasons given are flimsy at best. Secondly, his defense when other people start questioning his motives: + Show Spoiler [Reply to Zentor] +On March 22 2012 06:10 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On March 22 2012 05:32 MrZentor wrote:Hello people of Mafia! It is I, MrZentor! Anyways, I thought this started a day after it did, so I am a little late to the party.  Let me tell everybody my opinion, so you can get a good read on me! First we have Acrofales overreacting to a vote that didn't have a basis. On March 21 2012 22:54 Acrofales wrote:
Okay seriously WTF. I know I'm new to this game, but voting me for that reason alone makes no sense. In fact, it seems quite a scum move to cast suspicion on people right at the start of the game.
Or am I going overboard and it's just a way of getting people to post at the start of the game? Either way, I'm watching you and risk.nuke. Voting off the bat seems fishy. He then votes for Mattchew. On March 22 2012 00:04 Acrofales wrote:
Hodor's terribly talkative all of a sudden.
Luckily I have better sources than that. The Ghost of High Heart told me that you are scum.
##vote: Mattchew Lyter defends Acrofales. On March 22 2012 02:15 Lyter wrote:
I'd say ignore wbg at least for now, we have absolutely no idea what his motives/intentions could be, when more of a picture is formed then we should come back to it by all means.
I'm not sure on Acrofales, yea he could be flipping a shit cos he got called out so early, but his actions are hardly unlikely for a new guy anyway. Then Mattchew, bad spelling in hand, attacks Lyter for defending Acrofales On March 22 2012 02:21 Mattchew wrote:On March 22 2012 02:15 Lyter wrote:
I'd say ignore wbg at least for now, we have absolutely no idea what his motives/intentions could be, when more of a picture is formed then we should come back to it by all means.
I'm not sure on Acrofales, yea he could be flipping a shit cos he got called out so early, but his actions are hardly unlikely for a new guy anyway. oh so your his scum teammate? I really don't like that Mattchew attacks Lyter for defending Acrofales, who I think at this point is innocent. It also seems silly that Mattchew is 100% positive that Acrofales is innocent over one nooby overreaction. If you look at Mattchew's filter, you will see he only said something slightly helpful when he was asked to; everything else is just him attacking other people without any real reason. For now, I think he is most likely to be scum. then MrZentor, bad reading comprehension in hand, makes a terrible post with his lead point of his slippery slope theory being untrue because Mattchew (who is awesome, sexy and lover of all townies) never even voted for Acrofales! He does not answer MrZentor's questions or doubts, but instead deflects them and builds a straw man argument about whether or not he voted. This deflection is successful, because the rest of the entire page of discussion is about whether or not he actually voted: he STILL has not answered MrZentor's questions. + Show Spoiler [Reply to Chaoser] +On March 22 2012 07:35 Mattchew wrote:lol Show nested quote + yet he has not commented on anything else aside from tunneling acro, even when the other stuff happening in thread is tied to acro or has been a reaction to acro's posting. Mattchew has literally added nothing to the discussion while looking like he's applying pressure. It's basically false pressure. so you want me to comment on what I am involved with already? wut? and all i did was pressure a newbie who had a bad reaction, i just wanted to push him, and make him post some more. The thread has talked about WBG (which is stupid), Gumshoe's "scumslip" (A common scum tactic to "catch" a townie on) and me/acro More deflection without actually giving his opinion (except that the Acro-Mattchew controversy is the only useful thing in the thread to that point, which I disagree with). Third, and final point: he is really trying to use meta-arguments to make himself look good in the discussion between him and DoYouHas. This is basically just useless fluff which serves only as a meta-defense as "look, I'm not a screwup noob". Okay, lets say I buy that. That leaves you being scum as the only explanation for you building a case out of air and avoiding any other meaningful discussion. Newest info: his last post is actually something of substance, but I'm suspicious of him anyway. It might just be him realizing his gambit is failing and posting something townie. Specifically his sudden change to me being town Entire post is about how he wants to lynch Mattchew... but the last line is telling. He's clearly giving himself an out for when he decides miraculously not to vote mattchew because "someone more scummy" has come along. Show nested quote +On March 23 2012 03:47 Acrofales wrote:On March 23 2012 00:50 Risen wrote:
Class for another hour and a half, time for some reading when I get back. (Just an update for those who may think I'm lurking since I haven't posted as much as I should have) Most useless "I'm saying I'm not, but secretly am still lurking"-post I have seen in this thread. I think you might be beating out Evantrees for king of the lurks. Remember that in the Game of Thrones kings tend to lose their heads. A legitimate post calling out a lurker. My feeling: [r]scum[/r] He's the most scummy read I have thus far. On March 23 2012 06:04 Risen wrote:
Most of my problems with Mattchew have been summed up in my post on acro. He's either town who is seriously focusing on one guy who other people find suspicious (why should he spend so much time refuting what this guy is saying), or he's scum and coasting by arguing with another mafia guy. Neutral read for now. Scumread on Acro, although a good ways into D1. Finds Mattchew possibly scummy based on his interactions with Acro. I stopped at that point, although there's a little more GoT D1 and LI. But he DOES look like he makes a lot of his reads, even D1, off of connections. The game in which he was most active with voting, he was scum. For now I still find his filter this game odd, because it's quite a few posts to not have reads, but past games make me less uneasy about his statement that he doesn't like to scumhunt early, it's not just making an excuse to coast for a day or two this time around. Right now I'm leaning town on him, because of his response at the end of SSB64. In the scum QT there, Acro and Cephiro talk about how to deal with him, and note that "if he learned to control his rage and angst i think he'd be a really good player." So for now, I think that while his filter seems off, it's off because he's trying to actually do that. I think that also addresses some of your worries here Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 05:15 gonzaw wrote:
However, his "kind" attitude and way he's posting make me wary. Like, the way he posts is very weird and would certainly call people's attention....but isn't it too obvious perhaps? Like, it seems he doesn't really care how people see him, which doesn't make me that confident in thinking he's scum.
But meh, I'd appreciate people's thoughts on him
because the kind attitude and posting style are perhaps an adjustment from the norm. Oh, I've been ninjaed by your other post. I'll respond to that shortly.
I don't like how his posts feel. They are always long, but I generally find a few nuggets of really useful and solid logic in them. I'm not seeing that from him this game.
I don't like his early attack on Talismania. We are here to lynch scum, and his huge discourse basically came to the conclusion that the plan was anti-town/unhelpful. I don't see the explanation for the jump from that conclusion to scum....and it's needed. There is town motivation for Talis doing what he did, so not liking the plan should not be enough to garner a vote.
|
s&b,
In response to your defense....it was MTG and SSB. You've seen it twice. I find it hard to believe that you don't remember seeing that from him. In regards to your original third point on Risen, the exact same is true. He OMGUS' all the time as town, and you've seen it before. That leaves only your second point, which is basically semantics. It's really weak. This case is what manufactured cases look like.
More, you are guilty of the same thing you are accusing Risen of. You OMGUS me in your defense for manufacturing a case against you.
I mean I guess it's possible you really don't remember, but I find myself doubting it. I hope I also answered your two questions in your defense post.
In regards to your stuff on Marv...I understand your reasons for wanting to watch him closely. I agree that he is hard to catch as scum. Why did you announce it to the thread? Why not just do it instead of making this huge bombastic post with set-up speculation and hyperbole? You filled a looooot of space to say 1 thing: Marv is good at scum, hosts like good scum, watch him.
Also:
On July 15 2012 19:55 strongandbig wrote:
Since I didn't think that any scumteam of non-marv people here would be able to successfully push a mislynch onto him, making him look as bad as possible was a win/win for town.
Why, oh why, would taking the risk at demoralizing a town Marv be a win/win? Do the potential benefits of weakening him early as scum outweigh the risk of dragging an extremely solid town player through the mud? I say emphatically, no.
Also I have another question for you: what was the deal with the day 1 Vivax vote? You posted one line on him leading up to deadline:
On July 14 2012 04:50 strongandbig wrote:
im also leaning scum on vivek because of how he kept backing off of someone as soon as they defended themselves a little bit.
Vivax wasn't in your 'people i'd consolidate on' list prior to this post, and all of sudden he is garnering your vote because he is backing off people after they defend themselves? More, there was a counter-movement on Dropbear, Marv was calling for austin to get lynched, and I was in danger myself if someone had taken to pushing me a little harder. These people were all potential candidates that, from your filter, you had more going on than that 1 line from Vivax. You going with Vivax really puzzles me. It just seems like you didn't care since you know all the target's alignments already.
I dunno man, I get a pretty bad feeling from your filter. I see a lot of logic stretches, inaccuracies, and indecisiveness.
Miltonkram,
In response to your suspicions on me: 100% correct. I haven't been anywhere near my town meta. There are a number of pretty valid reasons for this that I'm sure you don't care about. Short version is that I've been traveling all weekend with a sick baby, and when I made time late at night to get in the thread it was everything I could do to stay awake. All I can do is do better, so keep watching. Also I want you to know that I'm not reading you as scum at the moment.
Dropbear
There is nothing I can really say for when I posted. I posted when I had time, and there was usually something to defend against when I did.
On being absent for the lynch, I said I had to hit the road. I was gone maybe 2 hours before the deadline? Something close to that. I knew that I'd miss out on any late switches. By the time I left, there was steam on a Risen lynch, who was one of my two day 1 targets. That's why my vote was there.
I can't help that you think I purposely went afk for the lynch, and in your shoes I might be thinking the same thing. I'll tell you the same thing I told Milton, keep watching me. If I can't fix my shit before I'm mis-lynched then I'll deserve it.
|
i'm back to null on Risen right now gonzaw. He is reminding me a lot of his townie play but I really, really didn't like his behavior around lynch time. I believe s&b brought this up already. I wasn't there directly, but reading through it later, I think he was the only happy person in the thread. Like, happy-go-lucky even. Granted, his top scum read was being killed, but it almost went to dropbear. I would think he would want to push harder in the Vivax direction...like right up until the deadline.
|
Here's some examples, gonzaw. They are from SSB64 where Risen was town.
OMGUS
On July 03 2012 06:13 Risen wrote:Show nested quote +On July 03 2012 06:13 Cephiro wrote:On July 03 2012 05:59 Risen wrote:
Exactly WHAT does standing on the same platform tell us? It tells us NOTHING. 1) It gives us insight on iGrok's thoughts. (He made a very neutral/safe choice, punishing everyone or no-one, not grouping people yet, which he however IS doing in his item picks/sit-outs. He also gave a valid reasoning, it may not necessarily be the optimal choice, but I haven't seen anyone else give a better idea yet.) 2) The reactions of the players on iGrok's choices. (For example, you insist on not going left with everyone, which you haven't given a valid reason for. Or talismania willing to sit-out, even though there is no risk of a fight [Stock loss] if people follow the plan.) So tell me, have a better idea? For now all I am seeing is that you are saying you are not going to follow the plan. (Which you say is because this gives us no information, which is false.) And in your latest posts you were thinking of dividing by the list. (Which doesn't give us any information at all.) I can say it's not much, but it's better than nothing, and we need something to get the scumhunting started. If you're still going to go against the plan without either a) Giving a better idea or b) Giving proper reasoning, then you're certainly not looking good in my eyes. Found the other scum. Two total? Easy game.
On July 04 2012 05:47 Risen wrote:
EBWOP: What am I thinking? I'll lynch tali. Just realized he has me down as being slightly scummy for no reason.
##unvote
##vote: talismania
OMGUS of the best kind.
scum teams/connections
On July 04 2012 07:29 Risen wrote:
I think it's safe to assume that scum was on both sides. Tali/grush scum team imo
On July 05 2012 20:37 Risen wrote:
Food for thought in the thread: bus cephiro and risen. Shoot cephiro. Dedede says: Hey guys look at my breadcrumb!
Meanwhile in mafia chat: omg we got lucky and grush shot cephiro too!
Scum team: dedede and cephiro.
Any flaws in that logic? I like it, because it gives cephiro benefit of the doubt on not being horrible. Only problem is I really liked dedede. His name is so good :/
|
gonzaw, your filter + tali's are the two that I'm not totally fresh on. I'll have a look.
I see the case on Talis too, from sciberbia and matt. I've read both, and I think they are pretty good. I misread Talis badly in SSB so I want to look a little more into this. Once I'm through his filter I'll post my thoughts.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
