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Some from LVI:
+ Show Spoiler +On June 30 2012 14:59 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 14:23 casualman wrote:
I love to bandwagon. Being a newb, I can read nothing from these posts and will blindly trust in authority figures. Woohoo!
##Vote BroodKingEXE What the hell is this
##vote casualman On July 01 2012 15:46 Mattchew wrote:Adam, what do you make of this post. Show nested quote +On June 30 2012 14:23 casualman wrote:
I love to bandwagon. Being a newb, I can read nothing from these posts and will blindly trust in authority figures. Woohoo!
##Vote BroodKingEXE And I like your thoughts on Mandalor
His tone is different. Just look at the posts this game. They discredit many opinions, but I can't recognize any active scumhunting coming from them.
From this game:
+ Show Spoiler +On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
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On July 13 2012 02:52 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 02:43 Mattchew wrote:Marv I want to disagree with you so bad, but I was wrong about something JUST LIKE this is MTG mafia... hmm I don't like the way sciberbia has been posting... it all seems forced as hell like the way he says On July 12 2012 13:31 sciberbia wrote:gonzaw asked for some thoughts on Risen, strongandbig, and Mattchew. Obviously there is not much to go on yet, but here are my thoughts so far  He clarifies that he's only saying this cause gonzaw asked, kinda reads to me like hes paranoid about not answering a question in the thread What do you want to disagree with?
your read on vivax
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On July 13 2012 03:18 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 02:52 marvellosity wrote:On July 13 2012 02:43 Mattchew wrote:Marv I want to disagree with you so bad, but I was wrong about something JUST LIKE this is MTG mafia... hmm I don't like the way sciberbia has been posting... it all seems forced as hell like the way he says On July 12 2012 13:31 sciberbia wrote:gonzaw asked for some thoughts on Risen, strongandbig, and Mattchew. Obviously there is not much to go on yet, but here are my thoughts so far He clarifies that he's only saying this cause gonzaw asked, kinda reads to me like hes paranoid about not answering a question in the thread What do you want to disagree with? your read on vivax
What's to disagree with? I mean, you might not think he's scum, but what I wrote was true... bangs on about meta, says he doesn't want to rely on meta.
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On July 13 2012 03:20 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:18 Mattchew wrote:On July 13 2012 02:52 marvellosity wrote:On July 13 2012 02:43 Mattchew wrote:Marv I want to disagree with you so bad, but I was wrong about something JUST LIKE this is MTG mafia... hmm I don't like the way sciberbia has been posting... it all seems forced as hell like the way he says On July 12 2012 13:31 sciberbia wrote:gonzaw asked for some thoughts on Risen, strongandbig, and Mattchew. Obviously there is not much to go on yet, but here are my thoughts so far He clarifies that he's only saying this cause gonzaw asked, kinda reads to me like hes paranoid about not answering a question in the thread What do you want to disagree with? your read on vivax What's to disagree with? I mean, you might not think he's scum, but what I wrote was true... bangs on about meta, says he doesn't want to rely on meta.
Yes I disagree that he's scum. But its similar to Zealos, and I was wrong there. I wasn't disagreeing with your content just your conclusion
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What do you see in Vivax that makes you think he might be town?
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On July 13 2012 03:23 marvellosity wrote:
What do you see in Vivax that makes you think he might be town?
his effort and his not giving a fuck style
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EBWOP not giving a fuck who he pisses off style
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Interesting, because compared to LVI/newbie games I've seen him in, he seems more restrained here.
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i.e. all the talk about meta is a way of contributing without actually contributing
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On July 12 2012 08:50 talismania wrote: pardon me for some half-assed musing:+ Show Spoiler +since we've got majority lynch to deal with, what about some sort of nomination system? I don't like how majority allows townies and scum alike to save their opinions on people, especially day one and just hop on whatever bandwagon is happening near the end of the day. It would be nice if, say, 24 hours in everyone puts up a list of three players they want to see in consideration for the lynch and reasons why. Then all that gets tallied up or something and we decide between the popular choices. Actually you wouldn't even need to tally or enforce that. Just having everyone put up three names with reasons should be good enough to move discussion towards a consensus lynch candidate or two (hush s&b yes I am and always will try to get people to post their impressions of others).
So I was going back through the thread looking for more information, when this leaped out at me. When I read it the first time through, I didn't think anything of it because I don't have previous experience with you, but if you propose the same plan in every game you play in, then how is it "half-assed musing" this time?
It feels like you're pre-emptively making an excuse for a bad plan. And why, as a townie, are you half-assing things anyways?
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it's half-assed because of the form it took. what I've pushed before is "everyone make case" or "everyone list impressions" and the like. I was trying to think of a way to beat the day one doldrums somewhat and thought of that on the spot and posted it. I figured no one would agree to it but at the very least it would stir the pot.
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On July 13 2012 03:37 talismania wrote:
it's half-assed because of the form it took. what I've pushed before is "everyone make case" or "everyone list impressions" and the like. I was trying to think of a way to beat the day one doldrums somewhat and thought of that on the spot and posted it. I figured no one would agree to it but at the very least it would stir the pot.
are you actively lurking or is it a coincidence that you respond quickly when you are mentioned and then are quiet in other times
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On July 13 2012 03:32 marvellosity wrote:
i.e. all the talk about meta is a way of contributing without actually contributing
You got your answers about matt. You asked for meta information, not me. My arguments against matt weren't based primarily on meta like you are trying to put it.
Also, good job on asking for information you think is not a contribution. If that's the information you want town to get, it's not hard to guess which team you are on.
On July 13 2012 01:49 Vivax wrote:
Anyway, I don't like Matt's filter, it looks like he posts rather meaningless content, no active scumhunting in it, rather commenting on what other players already said.
He also acts a little differently than in LVI.
Bold: The actual meta content regarding matt.
It's interesting how you inflated such a sentence and go on calling it an inconsistency with my opinion regarding meta. I said I wouldn't base my reads heavily on meta.
+ Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 01:49 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 01:39 DropBear wrote:
What do you mean by an informative post? Cos he made a case he must be town or something?
No, he doesn't have to be townie. But I initially voted for him cause he didn't post anything, then he posted the metagame info and I found it good enough to unvote him. I remember sciberbia for more concise, compact posts, and I remember him posting really early. He already explained why he didn't post early in this game, so what remains are the posts that subjectively look different to me. But I prefer to not rely heavily on meta, my play changes often aswell and I don't have as much experience.
Anyway, I don't like Matt's filter, it looks like he posts rather meaningless content, no active scumhunting in it, rather commenting on what other players already said. He also acts a little differently than in LVI.
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On July 12 2012 22:52 Mattchew wrote:
lets just call him confirmed town over and over again and maybe scum will do our read for us.. and if not we lynch him day 3
oh shit they can read this too cant they
I like this idea :3
talismania:
Actually follows the plan - as I said seems rather townie. Especially the timing.
...wait...
..I wasn't following your plan >_>
I didn't know you wanted people to post 3 reads and shit later, I thought it was your usual "Post a case by the 24 hour mark" plan so I ignored it 
On July 12 2012 23:35 strongandbig wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
Sorry bro, but that's kind of the nature of the game I guess - any post could be made either by scum or by town? Do you have any suggestions as to how to be more townie? Meanwhile, I feel like there's something to be read in Gonzaw's post about Derpbear - I'm just not sure what. Dropbera accuses Gonzaw of tryharding overmuch, when he's just Gonzawing - then Gonzaw attacks him in a way that I'm pretty sure either exaggerates or straight up mischaracterizes dropper's tiny filter. hmmmmmmmmmmm...... I'll think some more about this later tonight. Gonzaw, have you and DropBurp ever played together before?
The thing is his behaviour struck me as odd, and I wanted to "get the ball rolling" to see what happened..
Apparently nobody even commented on it, which was what I was expecting to.
I was not confident in Dropbear being scum, but I got a feeling he could.
Him later just discrediting my FoS, and general aggressiveness doesn't make me very comfortable FoSing him, since it's always more likely townies that do such thing; although I'm still wary of him buddying up to marv there and jumping on the Vivax bandwagon.
*sigh* However that's not decisive evidence, yet he's still one of my candidates for scum.
I'll reread some stuff and respond to other stuff later (just want to have the unvote right now so I don't have a vote and another one later, and so this post isn't huge)
##Unvote: DropBear
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On July 13 2012 04:18 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 03:32 marvellosity wrote:
i.e. all the talk about meta is a way of contributing without actually contributing You got your answers about matt. You asked for meta information, not me. My arguments against matt weren't based primarily on meta like you are trying to put it. Also, good job on asking for information you think is not a contribution. If that's the information you want town to get, it's not hard to guess which team you are on. Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 01:49 Vivax wrote:
Anyway, I don't like Matt's filter, it looks like he posts rather meaningless content, no active scumhunting in it, rather commenting on what other players already said.
He also acts a little differently than in LVI. Bold: The actual meta content regarding matt. It's interesting how you inflated such a sentence and go on calling it an inconsistency with my opinion regarding meta. I said I wouldn't base my reads heavily on meta. + Show Spoiler +On July 13 2012 01:49 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On July 13 2012 01:39 DropBear wrote:
What do you mean by an informative post? Cos he made a case he must be town or something?
No, he doesn't have to be townie. But I initially voted for him cause he didn't post anything, then he posted the metagame info and I found it good enough to unvote him. I remember sciberbia for more concise, compact posts, and I remember him posting really early. He already explained why he didn't post early in this game, so what remains are the posts that subjectively look different to me. But I prefer to not rely heavily on meta, my play changes often aswell and I don't have as much experience.
Anyway, I don't like Matt's filter, it looks like he posts rather meaningless content, no active scumhunting in it, rather commenting on what other players already said. He also acts a little differently than in LVI.
y u always misunderstand me D:
I know I asked you how Matt was different this game, obviously it would be completely hypocritical of me to say you kept on talking about meta for that, I was talking about earlier when you made a couple of posts on sciberbia's meta and unvoted s&b for posting good 'meta' stuff on me.
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About Vivax: (Fuck I need to use these tags again >_>)
Marv, I don't agree with your read on Vivax either
On July 12 2012 07:07 Vivax wrote:
We should lynch Mattchew cause his avatar is a zerg.
Keirathi is the serial killer.I know it.
On July 12 2012 07:21 Vivax wrote:
We don't have much movement yet, so I have used my psychic powers to determine the first scum player:
sciberbia
Let's hear his defense.
I don't see a "relatively noob" scum posting like this as soon as the game starts.
He "jokingly" accused 3 people by that point, and seemed cheerful about it. That's not how noob scum play (why would they try to "joke" accuse people if it puts them more in the spotlight as SOON as the game starts?), hell they even rarely post at the very beginning of the game at all, and they never appear cheerful or anything. Why? Because they are scum that's why, they have to check their scum QT, check their buddies, talk to them, think how they are going to proceed, etc.
Someone more experienced could pull this off, but I even doubt that.
That's what made me think Radfield wasn't scum on iGrok's game and I was right, basically no scum jumps right into the action at the very start of the game and start joking around and posting without hesitating at all.
On July 12 2012 17:21 Vivax wrote:
##unvote strongandbig
##Vote Miltonkram
Well you said you were watching something on tv yesterday and would start calling out scum soon, so I thought you were monitoring the game.
Anyway, that was a pretty informative post about marv, you have my seal of approval for unlurking.
Now I wanna see something from Milton :p.
I also don't see him posting like this as scum. His vote+unvote on S&B wouldn't make much sense to do it as scum.
Why would he do that as scum? Why would he vote someone when almost nobody else had voted at all, and then unvote him immediately after when that guy posts and never speak of him again? It doesn't seem to cause any confusion or push any scum agenda, since if he wanted to cast doubt on S&B he could have continued to do so after his post.
That's not entirely definitive to think he's town, but for me it's VERY definitive for not lynching him on D1.
About marv:
At first I found your behaviour odd as well. Because you seemed very aggressive, and very eager to stir shit, like this:
On July 12 2012 09:47 marvellosity wrote:
naw, I'm not killing anyone based on one post right at the beginning of the game (especially as pregame was quite active/friendly, it spilled over)
I'd rather lynch talis for his never-ending bullshit on listing names and reasons.
Seriously, 24 hours into day 1 and we're supposed to come up with reasons on 3 different people for why they might be scum? It's just nonsense.
Or... wait for it... I have an idea! If someone says something a person finds scummy, they can call them out and bring it to the thread! Wow, marv, you say - an amazing plan!
People shouldn't be 'forced' to make effort, the making of the effort willingly is what helps gives us our reads on people.
On July 12 2012 19:22 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 16:51 strongandbig wrote:Hey bros For people who weren't in ssb or mtg mafias, just wanted to let you guys know I am currently in Europe, where I don't have a cell phone data plan. This means I can only post when I have wifi, which is a change from my normal method. I've also been busy at work so please don't expect much from me before 8pm CET.
Now for serious stuff: I'm going to be watching marv like a motherfuking hawk. I think hosts tend to try to "balance" games sometimes by tweaking their scum team selection; however, that can and has led to extra info from town through balance speculation. Marvellosity makes an extremely tempting player for hosts to do this kind of balancing, because his scum play is empirically very good, but he isn't a "veteran" so he's not likely to be the subject of balance speculation. I also suspect bugs of doing this kind of balancing. + Show Spoiler [reasons, from wheel of fortune.] +The last of his c++ games I played in was wheel of fortune. That was a stacked game and I was one of the worst players in it, although I did eventually manage to figure out the scum team (and got shot for having correct reads before I could push some of them). With the benefit of hindsight, that scum team looks almost perfectly balanced for the player base. Radfield was town, ace was scum. VE and Forumite were both good players, but only on the edge of being full-on vets. I firmly believe that town would have won that game if Radfield hadn't decided to use a DT check on Ace, who was godfather. That kind of closeness is the sign of a well-balanced game; and the odds that both town and scum would have their best player as their best power role are very small from pure chance. So what does this mean? I am NOT proposing to policy lynch marvellosity; if he's town he can be a great asset, and besides that's totally against the spirit of the game. What I AM saying is that I think when someone points out something scummy he does, we should take it pretty seriously. Pure chance wouldn't explain why he has rolled scum in something like half his games since our first game together (noob 6) while I have rolled it once - him being good and me not does explain that.
NOW: having told you why you should pay attention, I'm going to point out something scummy marv has done. That thing is: propose/say he would be okay with lynching Talismania. Talismania's plan IS anti town. When Ace is host and he tells an obs QT how good a plan is for scum, you better believe he knows what he's talking about. Systematic case proposing plans give scum an excuse to make shitty reads and blend in, because everyone is making shitty cases and dumb reads. That kind of plan dilutes good information and adds bad information. HOWEVER: Talismania proposes this plan as town. All the time. Like, every game. Usually "pushing scummy plans" is a decent scum tell; but this specific player pushing this specific plan is not. And Marvellosity should know this. Marv has obs'd at least two games where Talismania proposed this plan or a variation of it (ssb, bangbang). Tali has proposed this in other games. Marv is the kind of player who pays attention; he should also know that I've pushed tali hard for these plans in the past, as have others. Marv putting tali forward as his first lynch candidates comes down to an easy push on an easy target for reasons he should know are bad. Marv, I'm watching you.+ Show Spoiler [on Talismania, briefly] + I'm not saying tali is an easy target in general, like kenpachi or grush would be. He's not that kind of shitty player slash bad case magnet. It's just that for marv to propose him for lynch based on that plan is scummy. ##Vote: strongandbigDamn this game is easy. First section is fluff. Second section is a completely insidious attempt to create additional suspicion on to me under the guise of "balance". He spends time saying people should scrutinise me especially for mythical 'balance' reasons... that for some reason are working exactly like he says and no other way. As to "I should know this" about talismania. I didn't really obs SSB so much (I think there is even a comment in the post-game where someone said Risen had no credibility but i did not know because I hadn't followed that closely). But in bang bang talis was SCUM and proposed similar. And I still find the plan scummy whether he proposes it as town or scum. One last point on his shitty balance bullshit - " Pure chance wouldn't explain why he has rolled scum in something like half his games since our first game together (noob 6) while I have rolled it once - him being good and me not does explain that." I have rolled scum TWICE. I have said in at least one other thread recently (maybe MTG?), directly in response to him I think, that I have only rolled scum TWICE. This is not half the time. This whole post is the worst thing I've ever seen. ##Vote: strongandbigI'm doing it twice because I feel so strongly about it.
You were just accusing people as soon as possible, and it seemed to me you were just trying to create chaos and having people fling shit towards you.
That kind of behaviour is not really what I remember when you play town (at least in these past few games I've Obs'ed), were you are more calm and composed.
..hmm, however your later unvote of S&B, and your later seemingly genuine interaction with people and lack of fear in your posts made me change my mind.
I like you being more active in discussion later, and I don't think I'd see you do that as scum
However you are all over the place man, like with these posts:
On July 13 2012 00:57 marvellosity wrote:
Having a quick flick through a few filters, Keirathi comes across as sounding incredibly neutral.
I agree with this....but it just seems like you post whatever you want and then ignore it.
Keep it cool man, don't do weird shit like that because it scares me
About Matt:
No Vivax, I don't agree with your FoS either. Matt seems very apparent town to me right now.
On July 12 2012 10:44 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 10:38 Risen wrote:On July 12 2012 10:34 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 10:00 gonzaw wrote:On July 12 2012 09:49 Risen wrote:
Any particular reason you're trying to push something on people with a low post count in thread so early? Didn't even know lurking was possible at this point. So you're either an extremely eager townie or scum looking for easy targets to push early. Thank you captain obvious. Instead of posting tautologies, do you have an opinion on said subject? (i.e do you think I'm extremely eager townie or do you think I'm scum looking for easy targets to push?) In hindsight this came out more aggressive than I meant it :/ It's cool. It's nothing compared to what I handled from igrok my last game. Anywho, I was just pointing out I found it odd you would try and push people onto "lurkers" so early on. I don't think anything about you. There's nothing to go on right now. I don't think that post was in your favor, though. He wasn't pushing lurkers he was pushing people that posted that sounded excited to participate and post and then didn't.
Here he acts very non-chalant to me calling him out, and he agrees with my criteria for accusing him. Yet he doesn't seem to care or be bothered by it.
If he was scum I think he'd either:
-ignore it
-say that my accusations are shit
-say that my accusations are right but trying to defend himself so I don't accuse him and accuse S&B+Risen instead
Him acting like this give me town vibes.
He also made very concise and helpful posts like these:
On July 12 2012 10:46 Mattchew wrote:
Also, talis has the worst plan ever with his 3 people thing. That just allows people to half ass push some stupid reads and then connections theories run wild and everything turns to shit
On July 12 2012 22:39 Mattchew wrote:
Strong I feel like the entirety of your posts could easily be made by either town or scum, if this is you trying to establish your alignment you have done a poor job with me. Your post is longwinded and looks to explain your thought process, but we both know that 95% of your posts content has nothing to do with this game at all. Not only that but your early attempt at a read on marv does not even account for his other posts in the thread. And your reasoning for voting him from this game is too, extremely weak.
On July 12 2012 22:43 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 12 2012 22:41 marvellosity wrote:
Matt, while you're here - what do you make of gonzaw? He seems to be making stuff out of nothing, but it could just be provoking conversation.
I guess normally at the start of day 1 he has setup shit to ramble on about, which he does not here. he is trying really really hard, and once again he is explaining his entire thought process. I dont think i have ever seen him as scum, but this is the exactly how he plays as town
And I agree with his approach to the Vivax wagon (check my Vivax read above).
If he was scum I don't see why he wouldn't either:
-Fuel the Vivax wagon
-Ignore it
...hoping that its wagon increases to create a D1 misslynch
All his actions make me think he's town, and so do his style of posting (absolutely NOTHING AT ALL like either MTG or LIII).
So yeah, no Vivax or Mattchew misslynch today please
I'll get to my "scum" reads (or dudes I find suspicious) in the next post (most of them are based on process of elimination basically, but their posting and shit make me more comfortable as well)
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thank gosh we have gonzaw to solve the game for us Day 1 
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The moment you think marv is scum, is the moment you should realize hes town.
Also, marv and gonz, what do you think of scib
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hmmm. scib looks ok to me at the moment.
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On July 13 2012 05:00 marvellosity wrote:
hmmm. scib looks ok to me at the moment.
This.
I have 2 other walls of text coming, so prepare
(hmm, I don't know if that will be one of those "gonzaw walls of text that harm town more than they help him", so I don't know if posting all my thoughts about the "scummy" people would be good...but hey at least I'm not having 10 pages of filter by now)
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EPT
