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On July 24 2012 09:11 Mattchew wrote:
Prob I find/found it weird that you were unwilling to discuss Katina with me. Usually you and Gonzaw are both extremely longwinded and willing to type out your thoughts on literally anything at anytime. With so many votes on Palmar he was/is set to be lynched and you STILL refused to answer questions about her. There is something different about you this game
See Day 1.
I worked like an all mighty bitch to get a lynch of either Gonzaw (my preferred) or BH (backup). By my reads that would be a choice between two scum which explains why it was so hard. My point though is that the no lynch was facilitated because people were allowed to bring in other targets. I was one of them. Take it as lesson learnt.
Palmar is my strongest read and so I have pushed him. If you want to lynch someone else, then explain why my case is wrong and I will consider yours. Until you do that I am not risking a no lynch simply because someone else might be scum. You forget we have less voting power than usual.
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Yes that is what I mean. Relative to scum we have to be more organised to actually get a lynch. Ironically having two clear scum targets is worse for us than having one because scum can split us between the two.
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On July 24 2012 09:18 Mattchew wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2012 09:14 Probulous wrote:On July 24 2012 09:11 Mattchew wrote:
Prob I find/found it weird that you were unwilling to discuss Katina with me. Usually you and Gonzaw are both extremely longwinded and willing to type out your thoughts on literally anything at anytime. With so many votes on Palmar he was/is set to be lynched and you STILL refused to answer questions about her. There is something different about you this game See Day 1. I worked like an all mighty bitch to get a lynch of either Gonzaw (my preferred) or BH (backup). By my reads that would be a choice between two scum which explains why it was so hard. My point though is that the no lynch was facilitated because people were allowed to bring in other targets. I was one of them. Take it as lesson learnt. Palmar is my strongest read and so I have pushed him. If you want to lynch someone else, then explain why my case is wrong and I will consider yours. Until you do that I am not risking a no lynch simply because someone else might be scum. You forget we have less voting power than usual. Lol you forget that other cases may be as good if not stronger than yours. Didn't you chastise (or atleast allow people to chastise) me for doing the exact same thing to my strongest read Katina? I don't see you revoking my claims in order to push my vote onto Palmar. Why should I do something that you are not willing to do yourself?
That's a fair point.
To counter I posit that Palmar is more likely to be an Exec than Katina and so a more useful lynch. Besides, the choice was really between Zealos and Palmar. Katina never went anywhere, we can look at her tomorrow. As for Zealos, well when he flips, he will flip Zealos. The guy looks like scum when he is town and given Kurumi's flip I am sceptical of Sandroba PM plans acually outing scum and not dumb town.
Again I go back to my original point, if you wanted my vote, I made it clear how to get it.
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On July 24 2012 09:06 VisceraEyes wrote:Probulous, I'm going to hold you PERSONALLY responsible for this flip. That cool bro? 
and you doubted me 
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On July 24 2012 10:27 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2012 10:26 VisceraEyes wrote:
I can't think of any reason for a townie to feel 'demotivated' by anything after a half-cycle in which three scum die in quick succession.
But you know...that's just me. Maybe it's because I like the game so much. That's not demotivating. You being unnecessarily sarcastic is. Last time I checked, "what are your reasons for calling someone scum, when the only one presented is setup gaming based on extremely incomplete information" was not an unreasonable question.
Marv, don't get drawn in. VE is being tricksy. We are in a good position (3 scum baby!) so we need to consolidate it. Given Palmar's flip can you take a look at MZ's filter fo me?
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On July 24 2012 10:49 VisceraEyes wrote:
Probulous, explain your comment to marv immediately. What do you mean by "VE is being tricksy"?
Do you want me to tell town your secret? Really? Because I was totally going to wait until we flipped Chez...
Ok, since you asked. I assumed you are pushing Chez because you want mafia to spare him. Of course that is no longer an option because you outed it. If you seriously think Chez is getting lynched tomorrow then you will need to be more persuasive than you have been.
I have found Chez quite useful actually. His trolling is just his style of play and using that as an excuse to lynch makes 0 sense. I also note that the people most annoyed with his trolling have been scum. In addition his questions around Sandroba were good ones, we didn't have enough information to resolve the PM stuff so there is no harm is positing an alternate explanation. As you say, all it took was a single PM.
Build a case and I'll reconsider but right now he is one of my stronger town reads.
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On July 24 2012 11:02 VisceraEyes wrote:
I have no desire to save Chez from mafia. On the contrary, I want them to shoot the piss out of him so A) the thread is sane and B) my theory can be further proven/disproven.
What do you make of the fact that Chezinu hasn't outted who he's messaged and no one has claimed receiving a message from him Probulous?
It means he didn't send a message  Or that he was bussing his scum mates earlier like you suspected sandroba of doing. Or he sent a message to a dead guy. Or the person who received it doesn't want to post it.
I need to recheck what messages come from where because it still confuses me. Shooting/lynching Chez because of his posting style is dumb. If that is part of your case, why have you not mentioned QBertz? Chez is making an effort at least.
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On July 24 2012 10:59 marvellosity wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2012 08:07 marvellosity wrote:
Alright, as people are around and hopefully can answer me instead of shouting at me to read... I see plenty of people don't like slOosh's claim. If the claim is fake, what was its agenda in making it? was there anything on this?
My running theory is to distance himself as much as possible from his original Foolishness defense. Night 1 had no vigs so mafia assume there are no vigs, or they are delayed. Then when Foolishness flips they know someone will claim that shot, so they claim first. Remember this is a closed setup so we don't know if there are multiple vigs, his claims adds nothing to the discussion because we cannot verify it. All it does it give him a shot at town cred. Unfortunately for him, it was supersoft not someone like Zealos, who counter claimed.
The claim itself is my sticking point as well and anyway I look at it, I come up with a null. It doesn't say anything really. What does the rest of his filter say?
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You're not typically this....obtuse, Probulous. Considering the scum flip, I'd think you'd be pretty excited and happy. But your super-serious tone is sticking out like a sore thumb. You weren't pleased with that flip. Why?
Because I expected it 
I trust my reads. I was almost 100% certain palmar was scum, no need to jump around.
Remember, this is a big game, my small game play is very different because it is typically much easier to prove your aligment (for me at aleast). You say Chez is trolling, how is that alignment indicative? It isn't and so I am ignoring it.
Now yes Chez did put the idea of a scum Sandroba into your head. As you found out it was easy to resolve. The purpose of this as far as I can see from a scum Chez point of view is just to fuck with you. I mean he must have known Sandroba could clear himself and besides if he was bussing his team mates he would run out of messages and team mates. He knew that a Sandroba flip would implicate him based on his own theory so why push for his lynch?
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On July 24 2012 11:39 VisceraEyes wrote:
He didn't push for his lynch...that's my point. He voted with me, but he never "pushed" the lynch at all. He left that to me, the townie.
He wanted the lynch to fail. Because it would implicate him as scum.
Ok so what is the upside then?
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For Chez?
Why plant the idea in your head. It was clear to everyone that he was the genesis of the idea and if you did manage to lynch Sandroba you could rightly point back to Chez as the source. Again, it implicates him.
Further more if he was the genesis of the idea of matching roles, why not keep Sandroba around? I mean as you say Sandroba's flip implicates Chez with his own logic so why even suggest it? I fail to see the motive here.
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On July 24 2012 11:52 VisceraEyes wrote:
Interesting...you are trying to argue that because there's no upside that it means he didn't do the thing. Am I reading that wrong? Because he doesn't have a readily available motive, that he didn't do it? Because I can assure you he did.
I don't know why he does what he does, that's a byproduct of his playstyle which you're defending. My point is that he did put that idea in my head, he did back off it when Sandroba flipped, he did support the Sand lynch but he did not push the wagon. These are all facts, in the thread.
I never said he didn't do anything. I said I fail to see the mafia motive behind them. Like I said earlier, he knew my role name which could have caused my misslynch (speculation but it is a bad name). Instead he chose to work out what my role does and then keep a secret, in a way that benefited me and ultimately town.
Why would Chez do this as mafia and not as town? The same goes for his crazy shit with you, if you don't know why Chez does stuff then you don't know why he would do it as scum or as town. Maybe you need to explain it from the beginning with a clear through line explaining how his actions benefit mafia.
I am defending Chez because of his actions towards me and his reads.
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On July 24 2012 12:06 VisceraEyes wrote:
Maybe you can help me out here then Prob:
Tell me EXACTLY what happened when he "figured out your role name". Tell me how you know he "knew" your role name, and tell me why you think that it could have caused your mislynch.
I am the Promotions Manager
Note, I have a management role name. I clearly have a role and that role involves giving other people roles. Sound scummy to you? One aspect of my role is to give the lynch to one person overnight, that was you. Here is the exchange between Chez and I.
He randomly started suggesting I was a senior level mafia.
+ Show Spoiler +On July 20 2012 11:34 Chezinu wrote:
I have a Problem with Prob Probably cause he is an executive mafia... On July 20 2012 11:45 Chezinu wrote:
Shh, be quite... Prob is going through a tough time right now.. He tried laughing it off.. but deep down, he is r scared! On July 20 2012 11:47 Chezinu wrote:
I was trying to imply that you are the chairman of the board? Was that what I was doing? On July 20 2012 11:56 Chezinu wrote:Are you scared prob? you know.. that I know your secret? Are you going to answer me?  
On July 20 2012 11:58 Chezinu wrote:
Who do you work for? you Probably don't know...if you get what i mean.. muahahha
Which is an obvious crumb regarding my title. Note the bolded.
On July 20 2012 12:01 Chezinu wrote:ya know, mini mafia 2 was a pretty fun game.. but this is taking it to a whole new level!
In this game he was a detective. I assumed that he had worked out I had a management title starting with Pro through some detective ability.
On July 20 2012 12:16 Probulous wrote:OK I just skimmed that game and you were a detective. If you are implying that you are the same this game (you have of course claimed as such) with a check on me, then something is seriously whack. Chez, I know this isn't your style but can you be a little less obtuse? If you have a check on me than that is information we need to sort out.
I think he has a list of rolename and can check one person during the day to see what name they have. Once I understood this I tried to explain it to him.
On July 20 2012 12:25 Probulous wrote:
Okay I get it. Your interpretation is wrong, but I think I understand your role now. You're going through the motions aren't you?
On July 20 2012 13:40 Chezinu wrote:
I'm glad you understand. Your a sturdy player. Sorry for the delayed response, the power went out and just came back on.
he then digs further with this
On July 20 2012 14:47 Probulous wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2012 14:32 Chezinu wrote:On July 20 2012 14:27 Probulous wrote:On July 20 2012 14:22 Chezinu wrote:
can anyone here guess my abilities? You can check the Role Name of people. So, are you saying that you are the chairman of the board? PS: see my comment to rastbanwhatever about how to understand the question. Not quite. Promotion seems a long way off and I haven't received the call. I wish I had minions, I'd make them crown me king and carry me through the office on their shoulders. But right now I am just a regular worker bee, carrying others around.
His response to rastaban was that when he suggests people are mafia through questions he doesn't actually think they are mafia. My response is a clear explanation of part of my role that involves Kingmaking. I even mention the word king. What does Chez do?
On July 20 2012 14:48 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2012 14:47 Probulous wrote:On July 20 2012 14:32 Chezinu wrote:On July 20 2012 14:27 Probulous wrote:On July 20 2012 14:22 Chezinu wrote:
can anyone here guess my abilities? You can check the Role Name of people. So, are you saying that you are the chairman of the board? PS: see my comment to rastbanwhatever about how to understand the question. Not quite. Promotion seems a long way off and I haven't received the call. I wish I had minions, I'd make them crown me king and carry me through the office on their shoulders. But right now I am just a regular worker bee, carrying others around. Carry my workings now and I be your leader!
Now can you see why I trust him almost completely. He knew my role before I could use it. If he was scum he could out me and push for my lynch, or he could out my role and get me shot. He doesn't bring it up at all.
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VE was handed the power to instantly lynch someone (he chose BH). I gave him that power because I could not use it myself and he was my biggest town read.
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On July 24 2012 14:08 Chezinu wrote:Show nested quote +On July 24 2012 14:05 Probulous wrote:
VE was handed the power to instantly lynch someone (he chose BH). I gave him that power because I could not use it myself and he was my biggest town read. oh... so BH didn't kill The Fool after failing to kill him and then ending up stabbing him with that coffee mug..
You serious
The giant picture of a crown didn't give it away. I mean I said quite clearly that VE was going to get some silverware and then he types ##lynch BH and suddenly BH dies but you don't connect the two? For someone who expects us to work out your clues you don't spend much time working out ours.
Hmm this suggests you didn't actually know that I could do that. What did you think this meant
On July 20 2012 14:47 Probulous wrote:Show nested quote +On July 20 2012 14:32 Chezinu wrote:On July 20 2012 14:27 Probulous wrote:On July 20 2012 14:22 Chezinu wrote:
can anyone here guess my abilities? You can check the Role Name of people. So, are you saying that you are the chairman of the board? PS: see my comment to rastbanwhatever about how to understand the question. Not quite. Promotion seems a long way off and I haven't received the call. I wish I had minions, I'd make them crown me king and carry me through the office on their shoulders. But right now I am just a regular worker bee, carrying others around.
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On July 25 2012 07:25 supersoft wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2012 07:10 Mattchew wrote:On July 25 2012 06:59 syllogism wrote:
Of course it means something. Just because mafia do not know who the other mafia are does not mean they want to actually lynch mafia if they can get away with it. Pushing to lynch mafia every day isn't a very sound strategy for a mafia victory. This is using your knowledge that like Palmar is 100% scum. Not everyone is as confident as you I was.
Me too 
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On July 25 2012 08:09 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2012 08:05 marvellosity wrote:
lol @ clenched. only your buttocks dear. I don't follow, I pretty clearly was reading Palmar as town until midway through yesterday...to be honest, I'm astounded no one has called me out on it yet.
Why? You're clearly town, why cast doubt on you? It's a dumb play.
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On July 25 2012 08:13 VisceraEyes wrote:Show nested quote +On July 25 2012 08:12 Probulous wrote:On July 25 2012 08:09 VisceraEyes wrote:On July 25 2012 08:05 marvellosity wrote:
lol @ clenched. only your buttocks dear. I don't follow, I pretty clearly was reading Palmar as town until midway through yesterday...to be honest, I'm astounded no one has called me out on it yet. Why? You're clearly town, why cast doubt on you? It's a dumb play. I'm not - you are with this post. Interesting.....
ROFL, VE I love your skepticism.
My point is why would people call you out on your Palmar stance if we think you are town? It makes no sense as it casts doubt on you for no reason.
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I have a very simple explanantion for not noticing your crumb.
Who would expect two kingmakers???
Did you VE?
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EPT
