• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 20:50
CEST 02:50
KST 09:50
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins HomeStory Cup 2910Serral wins Maestros of the Game 243ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12
Community News
Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format9[IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend!0Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back4BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion8
StarCraft 2
General
Reynor: GSL Loss Wasn't About Preparation Format Weekly Cups (July 6 - 12): Protoss strike back Co-op Commander Guide: Kerrigan Serral wins HomeStory Cup 29 Is the larve respawn broken?
Tourneys
GSL CK #5 Race War WardiTV Summer Cup 2026 RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event HomeStory Cup 29 Vespene Cup #1 — $300+ USD, July 10
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 534 Burning Evacuation Mutation # 533 Die Together Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family
Brood War
General
Pros Debate: Zerg Unfairly Nerfed? (ASL S22 map) screpdb: new Starcraft reporting tool BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [IPSL] Spring 2026 Grand Finals - This Weekend! [ASL22] Wildcard Qualifier IPSL Spring 2026 Top 4!
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread General RTS Discussion Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Path of Exile Summer Games Done Quick 2026!
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Power Rank Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently...
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport] Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Simple Questions Simple Answers FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
The Experiences We Want and …
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 4393 users

Newbie Mini Mafia XX - Page 2

Forum Index > TL Mafia
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next All
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:13 GMT
#107
I couldn't care less how many games you've played on mafiascum. As it turns out, in newbie games on TL, D1 bandwagons have a tendency to be lethal, particularly if there's no substance to the case to defend against. As such, it's better to target someone who's being either actively or passively useless, not somebody who's at least jumping into the deep end.

In particular, compared to his play in a different game, where he seemed painfully scummy, Hopeless1der seems like he's heading for direct contribution.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:14 GMT
#108
Or, of course, a read. Even a minor one, since it can at least be debunked by good play. Just avoid something that shows a vote that was never defended against.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:18 GMT
#110
Oh, and bear in mind, I won't do this if a case gets made. I let people make their own counter-claim. I only stepped in because I see random D1 votes as so dangerous in our newbie games.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:24 GMT
#113
I assume as long as you don't reference stuff from QTs, it's just the risk of multiple games. As you pointed out, there's a slight risk in using it for meta purposes, so it goes both ways.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:29 GMT
#116
And I made a very strong read against him and another player in XIX, the reads being linked, and was promptly shot N1, after which, when I wasn't pushing at them, they ignored the attacks completely, pointed to WIFOM, and started trying to direct the town. Mislynch #2 ensued.

Hopeless's play is different enough from D1 there, where I won't be convinced he's town unless he flips, that I'm convinced he's town here.

In particular he doesn't seem scared of prolific posting in the early game.

And I prefer substantial pressure. If there's nothing to refute, there's no argument to give off an odor. And the odds of hitting a townie with random votes are way higher than the odds of hitting scum.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:35 GMT
#118
Well then, consider yourself under pressure, and unconvincing, since you just basically admitted to being disinterested in making substantial cases, and said
maybe I got the scum by chance


Funny, when it's 3/13... 23% chance. That's not good odds in my book. You sound scummy.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 04 2012 23:41 GMT
#121
On July 05 2012 08:38 TMG26 wrote:
It's a 13 player game, and only 3 mobsters, so there is still a room for a litle mistake on day1

With a random vote on day 1 the probability of hitting scum is low, but missing wont be that dangerous, the question that i want to make is: With this low ratio of scum, does the nolynch becomes more or less viable?

I'm still a newbie in mafia games, thats one of the reasons of asking this questing


And sorry about my bad english, i'm not a native speaker

About what being happening here..
Lazer was not clear on what he said, Hopeless stated that, and yourHarry immidiatly voted Hopeless for that

So, in my opinion if we want to catch the scum we have to confront them, so i Hopeless did the right thing...But so did yourHarry, what i find funny was JingleHell jumping in to declare FoS on yourHarry

In my opinion Hopeless and yourHarry did almost same same thing

My main suspects right now fall to yourHarry and JingleHell, because your acusations seammed more like a counter acusation after a "scum teammate" being acused

But is all still too light, a lot of people still havent spoken


Wait, so my actual reasoning is supposed to be an OMGUS, and Harry's suggestion that 23% is gambling odds is only equally suspicious as my case?

When my case was based purely off of suspicious behavior, and my defense was based on the lack of substance, which was the grounds for my accusation? Not only does that not make any logical sense, it also feels like exactly what you just accused me of doing.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 01:19 GMT
#134
I can't decide what to laugh at first, but at least now people are explaining votes.

If you want to see what showed me that early voting with no rationalization at all is bad, go see D1 XIX. Ridiculous mislynch, because of votes with zero substance.

I won't bother demonstrating what's the difference between my vote on Harry and his vote on Hopeless, because if enough people can't figure it out for themselves to avoid a mislynch on me, I think it'd be the preferable alternative for my sanity, and for the resulting information.

By the way, from within the same post:

BTW, I am not OMGUSing Jingle.


##Vote Jingle


It's like Harry is a stand-up comedian.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 01:41 GMT
#137
On July 05 2012 10:34 Lazermonkey wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2012 10:19 JingleHell wrote:
I can't decide what to laugh at first, but at least now people are explaining votes.

If you want to see what showed me that early voting with no rationalization at all is bad, go see D1 XIX. Ridiculous mislynch, because of votes with zero substance.

You clearly are not getting the point here. Noone has even been close to getting lynched yet.


Plurality Lynch must be completely confusing.

7. Whomever has the most votes at the end of the day will be lynched!


Unless that means something entirely different than what it says, we aren't running majority lynch.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:00 GMT
#139
On July 05 2012 10:49 TMG26 wrote:
Even if it is Plurality Lynch, there's still 40 hours left

And its again funny to see that Hopeless jumped on your defence... After you had already voted harry after harry voted hopeless

In my mind, you and harry are the prime suspects..but only a few hours have passed, and i dont want to jump into bad conclusions


Hopeless is pointing to the meta, feel free to check it, unless you prefer to bandwagon on a case made out of paper mache.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:11 GMT
#142
Yeah, you pretty much nailed my point, Release. I actually already explained it, but they're ignoring it and burying it with more of this nonsense, so I'm not feeling particularly inclined to get into a shouting match with them. If the town has the slightest chance in hell this game, then people will see the sense in the responses I've already made.

My light commitments and obvious easy comments are mostly because there's little to discuss without stooping to their level. If I don't play their game, and I don't want to get the bandwagon rolling violently over a towny, then the best thing to do is observe and respond, rather than letting myself get dragged into some OMGUS shouting match that only benefits scum.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:13 GMT
#143
EBWOP: Did you watch the rest of XVIII after you got killed, Release? If you did, you know how much it benefits scum to get into large, drawn out, chaotic, tunnel-vision shout-fests.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:29 GMT
#146
On July 05 2012 09:18 YourHarry wrote:

Here, someone may question whether my initial vote against Hopeless also makes me scummy for above reason. But as I explained, I don't particularly find him scummy and my initial attempt to incite responses from him and others did partially succeed - mostly in the forms of accusations toward me.


You didn't even begin to answer them sufficiently, all you did was repeat yourself. You want to gamble, based on all your anecdotal experience playing with completely different people. That's great and all, but I consider it scummy. Now, considering that you seem to think votes are "just pressure" or some such, if you're really town, and think you can defend yourself adequately, why are you so concerned by my vote?

Unless there's something to what I said, which you didn't seem to acknowledge, as you and lazer have made it into the basis of a "case" against me, then you shouldn't be bothered in the slightest. And if you do admit that there's something to what I said, you probably should have unvoted Hopeless instead of trying to start attacking me because of "just pressure". That would make sense, right?
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:30 GMT
#147
On July 05 2012 11:29 YourHarry wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2012 11:13 JingleHell wrote:
EBWOP: Did you watch the rest of XVIII after you got killed, Release? If you did, you know how much it benefits scum to get into large, drawn out, chaotic, tunnel-vision shout-fests.


What we want is a substantial discussion. But in order to get there, we have to start somewhere. Some random votes or some FOS on evidence that may seem trivial at first allows us to start up such discussions. Personally, I like to apply pressure - it usually works well for me in the past.

And this is why I am questioning you now. You can answer my questions, in a logical manner. At this time, the only reason I am voting you is because I cannot understand the basis for your thinking that I am scum. While townies also do make mistakes during lynches and can sometimes be stubborn at times, in average townies tend to be more logical.



Damn it, should have refreshed. I've already outlined my logic. See my previous post, then decide if you really want to discuss logic, when it's very much against you.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 02:41 GMT
#150
So a me too post that contributes nothing while taking me out of context is supposed to make me nervous? Yawn.

The day1 voting reference was talking about people bandwagoning onto any case built on nothing, as I actually discussed. Which you completely ignored. It's like you dug through 20% of my filter and ignored all the inconvenient parts. You sound like Lazer's pet parrot.

Like I said, if people D1 lynch me based off bad jokes like you and lazer's posts, the town is doomed anyways.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 03:03 GMT
#154
On July 05 2012 11:55 YourHarry wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2012 11:29 JingleHell wrote:
On July 05 2012 09:18 YourHarry wrote:

Here, someone may question whether my initial vote against Hopeless also makes me scummy for above reason. But as I explained, I don't particularly find him scummy and my initial attempt to incite responses from him and others did partially succeed - mostly in the forms of accusations toward me.


You didn't even begin to answer them sufficiently, all you did was repeat yourself. You want to gamble, based on all your anecdotal experience playing with completely different people. That's great and all, but I consider it scummy. Now, considering that you seem to think votes are "just pressure" or some such, if you're really town, and think you can defend yourself adequately, why are you so concerned by my vote?

Unless there's something to what I said, which you didn't seem to acknowledge, as you and lazer have made it into the basis of a "case" against me, then you shouldn't be bothered in the slightest. And if you do admit that there's something to what I said, you probably should have unvoted Hopeless instead of trying to start attacking me because of "just pressure". That would make sense, right?


I never said I wanted to gamble. I said in the worst case, IF my voting based on less than substantial evidence actually DOES leads to a lynch, it may still be not the worst thing in the world because there is some chance that I might have picked the scum. It was a supporting evidence to my argument why it is OK to random vote in the beginning of day 1 (in fact, I think we SHOULD start voting light in the beginning, just to start reasonable discussion. Again, I have never advocated random voting.

And even if this is a newbie game, people can read and discriminate bandwagon based on random vote vs. a case based on substantial evidence. You are saying that you experienced otherwise. If true, I would say that it was an exception rather than the norm. Ultimately, there is not much point in playing mafia if people you are playing with are incapable making such discrimination.

I am not bothered, per se. I wanted you to explain why you think I am scum because your response did not make much sense to me. That said, beside what seems to be unreasonable suspicion against me, I do not get a scum vibe from you.

##Unvote


Fair enough. May have just been we both didn't quite grasp each other's meanings quite as well as we thought we did. Now that you put it in those words, it actually seems much more logical.

We're probably both a bit guilty of letting ourselves get expectations based on a combination of WIFOM and what we've seen.

As for the bit I've bolded, well, we don't always get to pick the people we play with, or their thought processes. Although I think for the most part, people are demonstrating a flaw of "vote for discussion". If the lurkers end up being town, you may well end up with a light vote on someone giving scum room to make something resembling a case from small fractions of a filter.

##Unvote
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 03:04 GMT
#155
On July 05 2012 12:01 YourHarry wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2012 11:29 JingleHell wrote:
. And if you do admit that there's something to what I said, you probably should have unvoted Hopeless instead of trying to start attacking me because of "just pressure". That would make sense, right?


I realized I didn't answer this question.

1. I vote lightly in the beginning of the game, unless a player is close to lynch. With 13 players, it requires 7 to lynch. Even with lazer's vote, which came after mine, you had total of 2 votes.



FYI, this is why you shouldn't expect everything to be the same here as at mafiascum. Not all TL games use majority voting for lynch. This game is plurality. Highest vote count gets lynched.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 14:08 GMT
#177
I do wish we could stop looking at Lazer's first post as "contradictory". Actually, for that matter, I wish we would leave alone all the initial burst of posting, the entire purpose is to get people talking, which was accomplished. Frankly, I don't think Lazer's first post felt scummy, because while it was only very basic, it was an effort to do the same thing I accomplished by bringing up sex toys. I've just discovered that something meaningless works better.

Instead of cluttering things up, I'll just say that Bass and Lazer's analysis on TMG sounds good, and I'll be interested in seeing what he has to say.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 05 2012 15:02 GMT
#181
On July 06 2012 00:00 Release wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 05 2012 23:08 JingleHell wrote:
I do wish we could stop looking at Lazer's first post as "contradictory". Actually, for that matter, I wish we would leave alone all the initial burst of posting, the entire purpose is to get people talking, which was accomplished. Frankly, I don't think Lazer's first post felt scummy, because while it was only very basic, it was an effort to do the same thing I accomplished by bringing up sex toys. I've just discovered that something meaningless works better.

Instead of cluttering things up, I'll just say that Bass and Lazer's analysis on TMG sounds good, and I'll be interested in seeing what he has to say.

This is kind of interesting

You defend Lazer and try to downplay the importance of first posts (despite Lazer calling his own post bad).

Absolutely not. If his post caught traction, we would waste lots of time. Your post did catch traction, but we hardly wasted any significant amount of time. Something meaningless works better than what he did because we know it's not serious. You know it, i know it, he knows it, but he chose to choose something "significant."

TMG looks rather shit, but if his english actually sucks, then we have a serious problem.

Lurkers speak up now. I will lynch you if Lazer is not a serious contender.


How is that a defense? It's my own read on it. I think it was a relatively useless post, which I've never hidden, but I don't see trouble in motive, just implementation. Same thing you're saying, less effort to saying it.
JingleHell
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States11308 Posts
July 06 2012 01:02 GMT
#223
On July 06 2012 08:49 Mackin wrote:
Oh and I might as well put my thoughts on Jingle since I won't be back for hours... Jingle looks like the type of Mafia player who is so good they cruise along for days without people realising he's Mafia (when he is playing as it). I'm totally not saying he is scum, I honestly just can't get a good read from checking through his posts so far. Everyone else I'm meeeh on because I'll fall asleep on the keyboard if I read for much longer


Honestly, while me saying this won't be convincing, especially because of WIFOM, I'm much more careful when I'm playing scum. I need to work on consistency, really.

Sorry I've been away, I randomly get busy with my three year old son, TKD, or books I suddenly decide to re-read. Or the tech board.

Uhm, right now, I'm going to say Jiexian doesn't look scummy based on the meta, in XVIII when he said good night in the thread, he generally used it as an excuse to get out of the thread and would stay in the QT for quite a while chatting. His "oh yeah" type posts after saying good night earlier suggest less paranoia, so based purely on meta, I'm guessing townie at this point, but the statistical sampling IS kind of small.
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
PiGosaur Cup
00:00
#90
davetesta76
CranKy Ducklings11
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ViBE258
FoxeR 80
Nina 0
StarCraft: Brood War
Rain 3704
GuemChi 3022
NaDa 23
Counter-Strike
summit1g12392
tarik_tv3945
adren_tv37
minikerr22
Super Smash Bros
hungrybox419
PPMD41
Other Games
Day[9].tv947
shahzam407
C9.Mang0351
Maynarde147
XaKoH 104
CosmosSc2 31
Temp016
RuFF_SC20
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick2573
BasetradeTV256
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 18 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Hupsaiya 125
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP6
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• blackmanpl 32
• Azhi_Dahaki22
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• masondota21359
League of Legends
• TFBlade747
Other Games
• Day9tv947
• Shiphtur308
Upcoming Events
The PondCast
9h 10m
Kung Fu Cup
10h 10m
Replay Cast
1d 8h
CrankTV Team League
1d 10h
Replay Cast
2 days
CrankTV Team League
2 days
Replay Cast
2 days
RSL Revival
3 days
Clem vs Lambo
Scarlett vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
3 days
IPSL
3 days
Dragon vs Hawk
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
4 days
Classic vs Trap
herO vs SHIN
Sparkling Tuna Cup
4 days
IPSL
4 days
Bonyth vs Ret
WardiTV Weekly
5 days
Monday Night Weeklies
5 days
PiGosaur Cup
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

YSL S3
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E2

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026

Upcoming

Escore Tournament S3: W3
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 1
Escore Tournament S3: W4
ASL S22 SEASON OPEN Day 2
Escore Tournament S3: W5
CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
HSC XXX
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Logitech G Connect 2026
StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.