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rastaban
United States2294 Posts
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rastaban
United States2294 Posts
First, I agree with the Millers claim day one, and policy lynching all Millers after today. In a game where they are self aware it is a huge boon for town. The benefits far out way the negative of less people with possible blue roles. First and most importantly it guarantees our checks. Detectives know any red checks from non-mafia get lynched, since sanity isn't an issue in this game. Any Mafia will always claim miller if checked and we don't force a day 1 reveal. It will cause a lot of confusion, it is best to eliminate this by forcing day one claims. It also forces Mafia's hand, if they want to claim they have to do it now before they are in too much water. This is hard for mafia to do, they don't want to be scrutinized and that is why they claim miller as a last resort. While it is argued that Millers make it easier to snipe blues it also makes our blues more effective. Look at Bang Bang where I, as a doctor, pushed strongly for a miller claim night one. Second, the focus of Marv makes me think of karma after seeing him do it to Gonzaw in our last game together. We need to be careful with tunneling though, when you push someone so hard day1, they will often come across as scum no matter what since the only content you have is them trying to defend themselves against accusations. He could be scum but I just want to say that we need to be cautious, as I feel the case against him is a bit biased. Now his day 1 "meta" is to spam 1 liners so I personally wouldn't mind him getting lynched if there isn't a better candidate but I feel like there is too much discussion on him this early in our day. Remember we have 48 hours, half that time hasn't even passed yet so I don't like the band wagoning on Marv so quickly. That said I have a hard time getting anything from his filter right now. Some people analyze best when their quarry is under pressure but for me that introduces too many variables so I like to read posts where they aren't defending themselves. So marv would you mind answering the original question ( as leading as it may be) about what you feel are your tells, and second who do you feel is most likely scum? | ||
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Check it out: On June 22 2012 07:28 risk.nuke wrote: Well Zentor started out very strong but then his activity dropped which is all-in-all a scumtrait. He spends half of his posts unnecessarily defending himself and the other half is useless 1-worders. I would very much like him to come here and explain himselves. Seeing how he can be one of the largest postcount in this game and have said so little of significance. This is his most rounded and contributing post... And it is a joke post. Next we get this gem: On June 22 2012 07:52 risk.nuke wrote: While I agree Zentor is a scourge to have on the gamefield I don't think we should kill him to be rid of him. That's not the way. As for now I want to hear from more players. Not much here, he defends Z but against an attack that was never going to happen anyway so a null read on this one What a quality contribution, but after wanting to hear more from players he certainly doesn't add anything himself or even push this thought further. The original post was a joke regarding probs penchant for losing lately but risk doesn't follow up to even find that out. On June 22 2012 08:03 risk.nuke wrote: I say we lynch zephirdd on account of not realising we're past fun-time. Wants to lynch zeph but like most bad actors he says the lines but doesn't have his actions (vote) match up to his words. He doesnt want to have the case lead back to him, and until more people have joined in he holds his vote. Perhaps you might think he is an actor who values life and is very conservative with his voting habits, but you will soon see that is not the case. On June 22 2012 08:55 risk.nuke wrote: lol, ok #1 scum response ##Vote: marvellosity Now he gets crazy like Charlie Sheen, he now throws his vote onto the marv train, but he doesn't add anything to the arguments, he doesn't even mention agreeing with others but instead he bases his vote off one post. What was this incriminating post? Well I thought it must have been the dodge marv made or perhaps his posts where he says he is confidant he doesn't get lynched, but no it is this one. On June 22 2012 08:53 marvellosity wrote: Thanks, I will pass this on to my scumbuddies immediately. Marv is showing how absurd it is to have millers breadcrumb so they can be saved later, and this post is the one risk decides justifies throwing the weight of his vote behind? I think he thought the risk train was gaining momentum and wanted to get on board. On June 22 2012 19:01 risk.nuke wrote: ##Unvote: marvellosity ##Vote: von Klaust II Here is his latest post, what!!!??? This is so out of the blue, he never says why he changes his mind, he doesn't even say why he votes for klaust though I am guessing inactivity. This is a huge throw away vote meaning nothing as he doesn't even ask for klaus to speak up. On top of that look at the time stamps, this occurs 10 hours after his Last post. So picture this, risk votes marv, 10 hours later he comes and votes klaust with no reasoning at all. Ahha, but what has changed? Well I and a few others have pushed for slowing down on tunneling marv, and he realizes that it might not happen. Prob mentions the lurkers need to get posting and names klaust as one of them, risk immediately votes for him. So he has 10 hours between his posts and apparently knows enough to change his mind on the marv lynch and that klaust hasn't posted yet and still we don't get even a single line of content from. This is a mafia mindset, all of hs targets are equally scummy since none of them are scum so he doesn't care about who gets lynched as long as it isn't them. Let's kick this sham of an actor off our set before he changes this movie from Signs into The Happening. ##Vote: risk.nuke | ||
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United States2294 Posts
On June 23 2012 00:39 Zephirdd wrote: + Show Spoiler [Worst-case-ever] + On June 23 2012 00:31 rastaban wrote: I would like to put forward a new actor into the spotlight who I feel doesn't want this movie finished. One risk.nuke! This fellow looks shady to me and he must have gotten Kirsten Stewart for his actor for the poor job he has done hiding his distain for our movie. Check it out: This is his most rounded and contributing post... And it is a joke post. Next we get this gem: Not much here, he defends Z but against an attack that was never going to happen anyway so a null read on this one What a quality contribution, but after wanting to hear more from players he certainly doesn't add anything himself or even push this thought further. The original post was a joke regarding probs penchant for losing lately but risk doesn't follow up to even find that out. Wants to lynch zeph but like most bad actors he says the lines but doesn't have his actions (vote) match up to his words. He doesnt want to have the case lead back to him, and until more people have joined in he holds his vote. Perhaps you might think he is an actor who values life and is very conservative with his voting habits, but you will soon see that is not the case. Now he gets crazy like Charlie Sheen, he now throws his vote onto the marv train, but he doesn't add anything to the arguments, he doesn't even mention agreeing with others but instead he bases his vote off one post. What was this incriminating post? Well I thought it must have been the dodge marv made or perhaps his posts where he says he is confidant he doesn't get lynched, but no it is this one. Marv is showing how absurd it is to have millers breadcrumb so they can be saved later, and this post is the one risk decides justifies throwing the weight of his vote behind? I think he thought the risk train was gaining momentum and wanted to get on board. Here is his latest post, what!!!??? This is so out of the blue, he never says why he changes his mind, he doesn't even say why he votes for klaust though I am guessing inactivity. This is a huge throw away vote meaning nothing as he doesn't even ask for klaus to speak up. On top of that look at the time stamps, this occurs 10 hours after his Last post. So picture this, risk votes marv, 10 hours later he comes and votes klaust with no reasoning at all. Ahha, but what has changed? Well I and a few others have pushed for slowing down on tunneling marv, and he realizes that it might not happen. Prob mentions the lurkers need to get posting and names klaust as one of them, risk immediately votes for him. So he has 10 hours between his posts and apparently knows enough to change his mind on the marv lynch and that klaust hasn't posted yet and still we don't get even a single line of content from. This is a mafia mindset, all of hs targets are equally scummy since none of them are scum so he doesn't care about who gets lynched as long as it isn't them. Let's kick this sham of an actor off our set before he changes this movie from Signs into The Happening. ##Vote: risk.nuke Post-by-post case on a <24hr game, huuuuuuuuuuuge fluff accusing no one other than risk - I'm scummy when I'm town because I never roll scum - nuke. Have you played other games, rastaban? link me please. Yeah bang bang that just wrapped up, check out my post on cephiro, which nearly everyone ignored based on his few early game posts but in the end it was found out he was mafia. I think you are dismissing it way to fast. I may have played up bits to fit the setting but I stand by what I said, I really don't see town swapping votes like that with no reason and the sudden defense of him is quite astounding to me. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
On June 23 2012 00:40 marvellosity wrote: rastaban: no, someone said they were gonna lynch me and I said "lol, ok" - risk says lol ok = scum response and votes me. Will read your case in more detail later but that's a correction for now Thanks I misunderstood the Iine of thought there. I really want to hear risk give some reasoning for his bad play. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
Also I never saw Sloosh's post as it took me far longer than 30 minutes to work up a case against risk. You know why ,because I don't throw accusations around wildly until I have convinced myself. Last game as a doctor I had no gun and so I had to mafia reads and a town read but since it was my first game in a year and I was afraid that without a gun if I pushed too hard they would want me to shoot and out my role. Well no one seemed to care about my cases but me but in the end I was correct. Day 1 of Bang Bang I posted this: "Meapak_Ziphh, your filter looked really bad last night tons of filler and no posts contributing to discussion, but you seem to be posting more like your normal self today. Mind explaining what was going on?" I actually had an entire case typed up like I just did for risk and yet I decided to go easy and let him slide, well guess what he was GF. If I had pushed for him like I thought I should have day 1 we might have outed GF immediately. This game I am trying something different since I don't worry about having a gun, I am going to push my scum reads and try and save my town reads. If I get lynched for that, at least town gets a trail votes to follow that led up to it. Sorry but this is so similar to bang bang's Gonzaw fiasco where everyone clamored about him being red while I thought the case against him was awful, he gets shot flips blue and since it was almost all townies pushing the lynch we started the next day clueless as to where to begin which is why I had to post the Cephiro case linked above to begin with. So yeah, I stand by thinking risk is our best candidate and want him lynched. I am putting forward someone who is actually scummy instead of the marv case where half of it is based on his reaction to a leading question. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
On June 23 2012 03:19 Snarfs wrote: Why risk.nuke and not MrZentor? Can you demonstrate the differences you see which makes risk.nuke the more likely scum, in your opinion? Because I feel they have played a similar game up until now. When I review MrZentor I see someone who hasn't contributed much, which, while scummy, isn't enough to lynch yet in my opinion.,Especially when he commits to delivering something tomorrow. I have seen players like Foolishness say the same thing so I am inclined to give him till tomorrow before I make my Judgment on him. I feel like Nuke hasn't just been a null, like MrZentor, by not contributing, but that his actions further scum agendas. There are legitimate reasons a town player may not contribute day 1, but I can't find legitimate town reasons for Risks actions. His "lol, ok #1 scum response ##Vote: marvellosity" Seems like such a cop out to get a vote on marv, instead of finding for a reason himself or even investigating it. It is the combination of not contributing but still trying to push a lynch that I find very questionable and seperated him from MrZ. What does town gain by him voting Klaust later, but not mentioning why he is doing it? The huge time gap, is so strange as well. I can see not being caught up and posting a quick one liner, but to be aware enough that one of the players still needs to post, to take your vote off someone you said was scummy, and yet not take even a moment to say something seems strange to me. I would like to hear from him on these actions and why he did it, maybe I am missing something but I feel that his actions make him extremely suspicious. | ||
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On June 23 2012 19:34 marvellosity wrote: Fairly happy with risk's recent contribution. Had a look through Zentor's filter. His vote on me was the first time he mentioned me at all (other than the general 'how intense' comment), and worse it was in response to Zephirdd's comment about scum bussing. 'One of them has to die' - why? no reasoning. I first got my anti-town read on Zentor in Bang Bang when he mysteriously lumped Toad into his list of scumreads without having previously mentioned him, because other people had done so. So pretty satisfied with where my vote is right now. I disagree about risk, he defended himself but didn't actually contribute yet. However I doubt I am going to get enough people to vote for him today. The reason I wanted to wait on on mr.Z untill tomorrow was because he stayed in, even after subbing out. now it isn't deffinate by any leas but it increases the likelyhood he got a blue or red role. I didn't mention this earlier because if he wasn't scum then it increased his chance of getting hit tonight. However I think his vote on marv after claiming both were probably town is pretty incriminating. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
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United States2294 Posts
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United States2294 Posts
##Vote: MrZentor | ||
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United States2294 Posts
On June 24 2012 01:26 marvellosity wrote: I'd like to know exactly what you meant by that, rastaban In my post I compared him to Kirstin Stewart and Charlie Sheen, because this is movie star mafia, and I thought it was a funner way to getting across than using the terms scum and mafia. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
Funner way to get my point across. On June 24 2012 01:49 risk.nuke wrote: rastaban zephirdd and zentor, what are your thoughts on eachother? I already posted my thoughts on Zentor, Zephirdd is Pretty likely town, when he asked about by previous games he followed up by looking into the case and linked my previous case so others could review as well, that is a pretty town aligned action in my opinion and his last comment isn't something scum would say. It invites attention, but a townie just wants to find the truth and not be played. I liken it to my statement last game where I jokingly said that ace had rigged the game so that all lurkers were scum. It was half a joke but also out there to get people to think in that direction if things started getting fishy. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
On June 24 2012 04:40 slOosh wrote: Yea I really think rastaban has a higher chance of flipping mafia than MrZentor. He isn't doing what he said he would do - hold him accountable. He pushes risk saying that he is scummy, yet waits for risk to defend himself. When he does, all he doesn't comment on whether the defense is valid or not, but dismisses the whole thing and says risk still hasn't contributed. How is that pushing scum reads? He clearly still has one, but isn't pushing it. He is merely going with the flow and sentiment of town. Compare his play here to his play in Bang Bang, in which he is confident in what he says and isn't afraid to put out his thoughts. In this game there is more fluff and more references to games that don't really prove anything. Moreso, suspicions of him have been ignored several times, which indicates resistance. Vote rastaban. Guess what there is more than 1 mafia in this game o.O surprising huh. I still want risk lynched, but do you really think 6 other people are going to do that in the next few hours? No, because everyone seemed to want to discuss me instead of my case. And this game if we don't get 7 votes on someone then it is a no lynch which is very bad for town. Also if I stay on risk it doesn't say anything about my alignment if I am the only one. I think Zentor is currently the second scummiet player after risk. As I mentioned earlier his voting for someone who he thought wasn't scum pushed me from being neutral on him to him being likely scum. I felt his play only fit a red or blue player, I don't think he is blue now so red is most likely. Also staying on risk is the safe move it means regardless of the lynch results I am not responsible For the outcome. | ||
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On June 24 2012 04:54 risk.nuke wrote: Rastaban if you still think I'm scummy why haven't you bothered defending your case? Most of the responses were attacking me or dismissing it out right. The only legitimate response I got regarding my post was from Snarfs wanting to know my thoughts vs you instead of Zentor, which I responded why on. On June 23 2012 03:47 rastaban wrote: When I review MrZentor I see someone who hasn't contributed much, which, while scummy, isn't enough to lynch yet in my opinion.,Especially when he commits to delivering something tomorrow. I have seen players like Foolishness say the same thing so I am inclined to give him till tomorrow before I make my Judgment on him. I feel like Nuke hasn't just been a null, like MrZentor, by not contributing, but that his actions further scum agendas. There are legitimate reasons a town player may not contribute day 1, but I can't find legitimate town reasons for Risks actions. His "lol, ok #1 scum response ##Vote: marvellosity" Seems like such a cop out to get a vote on marv, instead of finding for a reason himself or even investigating it. It is the combination of not contributing but still trying to push a lynch that I find very questionable and seperated him from MrZ. What does town gain by him voting Klaust later, but not mentioning why he is doing it? The huge time gap, is so strange as well. I can see not being caught up and posting a quick one liner, but to be aware enough that one of the players still needs to post, to take your vote off someone you said was scummy, and yet not take even a moment to say something seems strange to me. I would like to hear from him on these actions and why he did it, maybe I am missing something but I feel that his actions make him extremely suspicious. I feel like people are viewing what I said about you as being due to the lack of content when I was referring to how you went about posting. | ||
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What do you think of my post defending Zephirdd: Zephirdd is Pretty likely town, when he asked about by previous games he followed up by looking into the case and linked my previous case so others could review as well, that is a pretty town aligned action in my opinion and his last comment isn't something scum would say. It invites attention, but a townie just wants to find the truth and not be played. I liken it to my statement last game where I jokingly said that ace had rigged the game so that all lurkers were scum. It was half a joke but also out there to get people to think in that direction if things started getting fishy. Do you think mafia would have followed up on something like that? When I played mafia a long time ago I almost never went through players past games as it was pointless since I knew they were town. | ||
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On June 24 2012 05:26 marvellosity wrote: I seriously need an explanation for some of this. What do you mean by his last comment isn't something scum would say? looking at his filter his last comment is explaining appeal to emotion to me as an acronoym. Are you talking about this? The fact you never went through past players game just means you're lazy as mafia. Don't attribute this to anyone who might play mafia. Sorry I was quoting my earlier post. His last comment at that time was saying he thought the two people were bussing each other. I thought it was meant partly in jest but to be alert incase that was the case. He has said since then that he actually believes they were bussing each other so I guess it wasn't a joke like I originally thought it was. | ||
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On June 24 2012 06:19 slOosh wrote: rastaban, this is probably the post that makes you think the Zentor switching his mind is scummy (correct me if I'm wrong). Notice the timestamps. There is a whole day - a little more than 24 hours between his two posts, pages 11~19, in which a lot of VE Marv interaction happened. Do you still think what he did was scummy? (p.s. to everyone else this is what I was alluding to when I asked people for opinions on Probulous - I think it's bogus reasoning to hop on a bandwagon). I hadn't noticed the the gap so while that weakens the case slightly I am bothered more by his voting marv without any reasoning. Not giving a reason for your vote isn't good for town, we need to know why (one of the reasons I think risk.nuke is scummy). When asked about his vote he says:" I want to lynch marvellosity, because it will provide a lot of information about VE's role. I switched from my they're both innocent theory to the at least one is probably mafia theory, because of they're both pretty good players, and I don't think both of them are wrong." Lynching someone for more information on someone else isn't a good option and it still doesn't tell us why he picked Marv over VE if he thinks 1 of them is scum. When pressed further he finally answers: On June 24 2012 00:18 MrZentor wrote: 1. Marv has been acting weird, and his first posts were pretty scummy. 2. Even if I knew for sure that VE was scum, I probably wouldn't be able to get him lynched, because half the town is sheeping him. Earlier he stated: "In Bang Bang mafia 2, I thought Rastaban was mafia, and it turns out that he was doctor. Now he looks innocent to me, but I'm not really sure if that means anything." but now most recently he has stated On June 24 2012 04:43 MrZentor wrote: There are people who I'd rather see dead *cough*Prplhz*cough*, but Rastaban isn't a bad choice. ##Unvote: Marvellosity ##Vote: Rastaban Strangely he never once even voted for prplhz though, and he doesn't give a reason for his latest switch to me. Is marv now less scummy to him, or did he suddenly see something he missed earlier that made him se my play in a new light? I don't know 100% that he is mafia but I think he is a pretty good lynch target for day 1, and he hasn't done anything since I voted him earlier to make me think he is playing more town alligned. | ||
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On June 24 2012 06:51 wherebugsgo wrote: Vote Count - Roughly 10 minutes to go MrZentor (8): prplhz, VisceraEyes, prplhz (0): Probulous (0): marvellosity (0): von Klaust II (0): risk.nuke (0): rastaban (5): Snarfs, Snarfs (0): I am in the unique position of knowing I am town so mafia obviously wasn't worried this lynch either way. The marv lynch team is split evenly onto both lynches. I am going to review what has happened so far along with the votes and see what I can find out. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
I have a case incoming in a bit, going to eat supper before I finish it. | ||
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United States2294 Posts
I will start with his post responding to my original post. On June 23 2012 10:15 risk.nuke wrote: So my first thought is what two players are yelling the loudest at eachother. It's Vicera and Marv. So naturally my first assumption would be to remove both of those from my day 1 lynch pool. While Vicera doubtlessly seems like the towniest townie ever towned marv seems a bit scummy. Partly because how his inabillity to see how Vicera is town. Anyway lets go to Rastaban, I'm sort of writing this on the fly out of lazyness so I still haven't decided who I want dead the most yet. + Show Spoiler [Rastaban Says] + On June 23 2012 00:31 rastaban wrote: I would like to put forward a new actor into the spotlight who I feel doesn't want this movie finished. One risk.nuke! This fellow looks shady to me and he must have gotten Kirsten Stewart for his actor for the poor job he has done hiding his distain for our movie. Check it out: This is his most rounded and contributing post... And it is a joke post. Next we get this gem: Not much here, he defends Z but against an attack that was never going to happen anyway so a null read on this one What a quality contribution, but after wanting to hear more from players he certainly doesn't add anything himself or even push this thought further. The original post was a joke regarding probs penchant for losing lately but risk doesn't follow up to even find that out. Wants to lynch zeph but like most bad actors he says the lines but doesn't have his actions (vote) match up to his words. He doesnt want to have the case lead back to him, and until more people have joined in he holds his vote. Perhaps you might think he is an actor who values life and is very conservative with his voting habits, but you will soon see that is not the case. Now he gets crazy like Charlie Sheen, he now throws his vote onto the marv train, but he doesn't add anything to the arguments, he doesn't even mention agreeing with others but instead he bases his vote off one post. What was this incriminating post? Well I thought it must have been the dodge marv made or perhaps his posts where he says he is confidant he doesn't get lynched, but no it is this one. Marv is showing how absurd it is to have millers breadcrumb so they can be saved later, and this post is the one risk decides justifies throwing the weight of his vote behind? I think he thought the risk train was gaining momentum and wanted to get on board. Here is his latest post, what!!!??? This is so out of the blue, he never says why he changes his mind, he doesn't even say why he votes for klaust though I am guessing inactivity. This is a huge throw away vote meaning nothing as he doesn't even ask for klaus to speak up. On top of that look at the time stamps, this occurs 10 hours after his Last post. So picture this, risk votes marv, 10 hours later he comes and votes klaust with no reasoning at all. Ahha, but what has changed? Well I and a few others have pushed for slowing down on tunneling marv, and he realizes that it might not happen. Prob mentions the lurkers need to get posting and names klaust as one of them, risk immediately votes for him. So he has 10 hours between his posts and apparently knows enough to change his mind on the marv lynch and that klaust hasn't posted yet and still we don't get even a single line of content from. This is a mafia mindset, all of hs targets are equally scummy since none of them are scum so he doesn't care about who gets lynched as long as it isn't them. Let's kick this sham of an actor off our set before he changes this movie from Signs into The Happening. ##Vote: risk.nuke There are alot of things I don't like in his so called analysis of me. Mainly because these posts were made right at the start of the game and were mostly just for getting up the activity and he complains how they are content-short. It should be obvious why it's impossible to make a case when you're the first player to talk. Oviously he doesn't approve of the case, and he says the posts were made right at the start of the game, so there was nothing to discuss. Only the first 2 posts fit this criteria and I pointed out they weren't applicable. What is else is that you will see nothing has changed since this point in his posting habits Second I think it favors town to lynch mafia rather then prioritizing people soley because they are unpleasant and that's what I said. How is it scummy? I didn't understand that inside joke that post seemed to be and I wanted Prob to come back and explain himself or post some more. Scum are sometimes a bit tense and scared to jump into the thread and zephirdd choose to jump in with some joke-post which I thought was suspicious. His entire, Oh the game has started "insert joke stuff here" felt in the spur of the moment like a condemnable lie. I voted marv because I though that was something a mafia would say when they thought the case against them was poor. Then lastly he's completely misinterpreting my voteswitch. This you probably don't know but I felt a bit annoyed because i realised that in my last games I've had an unstatisticly high ratio of misreads in the earlygame and I came to the conclusion that it's because I'm to lenient to lurkers. So I pressurevoted a guy who still hadn't joined us (but shortly after did~ heeyoo~) Anyway I didn't explain myself because I thought a pressurevote on a lurker was decent reasoning enough and it shouldn't had been so hard to figure out that was what I was doing without me spelling it out for you. Here he admits he is changing his play style and his reasoning is he is too lenient to lurkers, but he is lurking this whole game. I don't buy it + Show Spoiler [Rastaban Says II] + On June 23 2012 03:08 rastaban wrote: Wow, really surprised no one sees the vote switching without any reason at all not scummy. My case is misconstrued as "risk.nuke has not yet posted anything of value." That would be a case against Also I never saw Sloosh's post as it took me far longer than 30 minutes to work up a case against risk. You know why ,because I don't throw accusations around wildly until I have convinced myself. Last game as a doctor I had no gun and so I had to mafia reads and a town read but since it was my first game in a year and I was afraid that without a gun if I pushed too hard they would want me to shoot and out my role. Well no one seemed to care about my cases but me but in the end I was correct. Day 1 of Bang Bang I posted this: "Meapak_Ziphh, your filter looked really bad last night tons of filler and no posts contributing to discussion, but you seem to be posting more like your normal self today. Mind explaining what was going on?" I actually had an entire case typed up like I just did for risk and yet I decided to go easy and let him slide, well guess what he was GF. If I had pushed for him like I thought I should have day 1 we might have outed GF immediately. This game I am trying something different since I don't worry about having a gun, I am going to push my scum reads and try and save my town reads. If I get lynched for that, at least town gets a trail votes to follow that led up to it. Sorry but this is so similar to bang bang's Gonzaw fiasco where everyone clamored about him being red while I thought the case against him was awful, he gets shot flips blue and since it was almost all townies pushing the lynch we started the next day clueless as to where to begin which is why I had to post the Cephiro case linked above to begin with. So yeah, I stand by thinking risk is our best candidate and want him lynched. I am putting forward someone who is actually scummy instead of the marv case where half of it is based on his reaction to a leading question. Not much here but I think it's safe to say it shouldn't take 30 minutes or more to analyse what very little I had written, come on, it's not many lines. Another key thing, he faults how long it took me but as you will soon see for thinking it only takes 30 min to argue a case he doesn't ever post one himself. In this post Rastaban makes sense. He supports the miller-must claim which is basic. Though I wouldn't award him town-points for agreeing. The second paragraph is more interesting to me. It shows that he knows how to be carefull with bandwagons. Which makes no sense at all that the next thing he does is he try to push me hard on exagerated and out-of-context reasoning. I think I'm done with rastaban but it's 3:15 now. Sorry T.B.C. tomorrow. He ends with T.B.C. tomorrow, but as you will see he never followed up with anything to help town from this point on. Let me lump he next few posts together. On June 24 2012 01:49 risk.nuke wrote: rastaban zephirdd and zentor, what are your thoughts on eachother? On June 24 2012 01:53 risk.nuke wrote: vonKlaust II what are your thoughts on the lynch? Instead of contributing any original thoughts at all to the conversation he sits around asking 1 line questions with no follow up. This is a perfect way for scum to hide as it doesn't require any original thoughts from them. On June 24 2012 02:22 risk.nuke wrote: There are a few hours left but it's starting to become time we worked up on a majority. I'm going to vote for Rastaban ##Unvote: von Klaust II ##Vote: Rastaban Again we have a vote, this time on me but what is missing? Any reasoning on why. His biggest reason is to start working on a majority, but at this point we already had or almost had one on Zentor, so why vote for me over zentor? I think he just wanted to spread out the mafia vote so they weren't all on one guy. On June 24 2012 04:47 risk.nuke wrote: Honestly I'm fine with both Zentor and Rastaban (Klaus aswell and maybe zephirdd), I'm feeling I prefer rastaban but I don't care enough to sway people one way or the other. Aslong as we have majority on one, This post is incredibly incriminating... he is fine with lynching 4 different people. He has yet to give a single reason on any of them but he finds all of them viable targets. To me this is the words of mafia and not a town player. On June 24 2012 04:54 risk.nuke wrote: Rastaban if you still think I'm scummy why haven't you bothered defending your case? Another post where he asks questions of other players and yet still adds 0 to the game himself. On June 24 2012 04:58 risk.nuke wrote: I agree completely prplhz those are thoughts I've felt about zephirdd aswell. Now he agrees with someone, and says he had been thinking the same thing. He uses past tense and yet why didn't he bring the accusation forward or say something but instead waited on others? He has already said it shouldn't have taken me 30 minutes to put a case together against him, and yet he is so busy he can't not only put a case together but not even add a single original thought this entire game. He hasn't added a single thing to this entire game, and his only time to post anything longer than a line or two was when he felt threatened. He promised to follow up but didn't, He was fine with lynching any of four people, never trying to narrow those results down to the right one because as scum he doesn't care who dies when they are townies.. ##Vote risk.nuke | ||
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On June 25 2012 07:34 Zephirdd wrote: ebwop actually a jailer could have saved the target instead of stopping it from shooting, which makes a lot of sense actually. Yeah I was doctor last game with a night 1 save so It seemed most likely, I had also forgot in this one you could block night KP, in bang bang you couldn't block KP. | ||
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On June 25 2012 07:51 risk.nuke wrote: Rastaban if you really are townie (which I don't think you are) you dodged a lynch last night and seeing how we mislynched a townie that makes the situation even worse for you. My point is if you don't want to die soon you should do something more usefull then dumb shit tunneling. Sorry scum, but you can't shake me. Is that really your version of a defense? | ||
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On May 30 2012 22:55 risk.nuke wrote: I fully agree we should form a plan for the poisons. As it's already been said some of them are looking very dangerous. One thing I'm not sure about is if we can just remove two because it wont go past day5. If there is a medic save or just for theory for whatever reason the mafia decides not to kill anyone it could prolong the game into that zone. So I think it might be a safer to not leave for example these -The mafia team recieves a secret hidden vote -Majority + 1 is required for a sucessful lynch for that window. I do however see it as unlikely that it will come to day 7 so we can probably safely remove 1. For the voting I'm not sure if one power is stronger then the others but I agree that we're probably better of not sharing our votes ahead of time (so we use the encryption system) because I don't think any power we give the mafia will be more advantagous for us then not letting them know what we're giving them. Until I started looking at your history I thought maybe you had never posted more than 1 line, then I realized you do when you actually wanted town to win. Or how about when you actually tried to analyze people? On June 03 2012 23:50 risk.nuke wrote: I think we should lynch zephirdd for two reasons. 1. It will shed light on the voteswitch. It is infact very important that we learn zephirdds aligntment or we'll just stab ourselves in the foot if he turns out to be town. 2. Wbg was for lynching 3 people. Myself, Navillus and Zephirdd (And kurumi who he might not have pushed for because he didn't think he could get him lynched). Wbg was killed which indicates that the mafia believed he was on to something. Knowing that I am town, Navillus is town that leaves Zephirdd (and Kurumi). How comes you contribute in that game but not in this one? Why you want town to lose? | ||
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On June 25 2012 08:30 prplhz wrote: If we have a roleblocker then he should just claim who he blocked and we lynch that guy. It's that simple. The odds of us having a roleblocker AND a jailkeeper who jailed successfully should be negligible in a balanced-for-teamliquid C9++. If there is a jailkeeper and there is no roleblocker claim then this jailkeeper should think carefully if his target is now confirmed town or confirmed scum. If I understand right we have no way of knowing. The rb could have blocked someone and it was a jailer that save the hit so the rbs block didn't matter. The guy the jailer tried to save could have been the shooter, or the guys role blocked could have shot. No one claim, at least not yet as we don't know what could have happened. | ||
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On June 25 2012 09:06 Zephirdd wrote: Well, we would never know that right? A roleblocked scum would never claim it. Why not, we don't know if he was the one hit, or if he tried to shoot and got blocked. you get notified both ways and as Artanis said even if they are notified they haven't been yet since he isn't sure. On top of this their could be a role blocker out there as well that may have actually stopped the kill. not counting possible duplicate roles. I think claiming to have been roleblocked last night is fine if you got one, as mafia might have a RB as well. | ||
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On June 25 2012 09:11 prplhz wrote: Yea, I'm kind of covering all that in my post. Roleblocker claim is the best thing he can do right now, jailkeeper need to think it over if he wants to claim and he probably shouldn't unless he's very sure about himself (in which he probably can't help it but to claim). Why do you want them to claim? that seems really bad to me. Am I missing something, but if they claim we still don't know who shot, there is a chance it was the person they blocked but we don't know that for sure. | ||
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On June 25 2012 09:15 marvellosity wrote: Surely the person who got roleblocked should just claim, not the person jailing/roleblocking? yes, and remember anyone jailed hasn't been notified yet so no jumping the gun as we don't know the jailers yet. | ||
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On June 25 2012 09:17 rastaban wrote: yes, and remember anyone jailed hasn't been notified yet so no jumping the gun as we don't know the jailers yet. What I mean by "we don't know the jailers yet" is that if there is only a role blocker then his target is most likely scum, however if there is a jailer or more than one role blocker (including a scum one) then the chance of the claimer being scum is way less. | ||
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On June 25 2012 09:21 prplhz wrote: I'm sorry, did you not read my post? Who is "them" in "Why do you want them to claim?"? I don't know if you're missing something. Roleblocker is pretty useless role and if he got insanely lucky on day1 then he should claim 'cause that'll give us a lot of information and I think it's worth it. What I was saying is that it doesn't really give us any information as we don't know what roles are in the game. How does it help us any more than just having the guy role blocked claim. Maybe we have him claim end of day if no one admits to being roleblocked but I think it is too early to have him claim yet. | ||
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But notice how even after he says to remove both of them he follows up with "marv seems a bit scummy. Partly because how his inabillity to see how Vicera is town." which leaves it open for a future vote and still throws suspicion on marv. As for removing VE from the lynch pool, marvs recent vote on VE was the first this whole game. Despite the back and forth it was only ever 1 way, VE was not in any danger of being lyched at any point so all he really states is: don't vote marv yet, but he is a bit scummy. Also a lot of people had come out in defense of marv by that point saying we need to hold off on lynching him. If this had been the one to help get the votes off marv I would be more inclined to think it town aligned but as it is, it just seems regurgitated to me. | ||
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On June 26 2012 04:38 marvellosity wrote: why don't you try actually commenting on my case, rastaban? I don't see how you go from one moment thinking VE is so town that both a jailer and mafia would try and hit him noght one to then thinking he is the leading scum. I think it is most likely that you are both town arguing with each other like you and gonzaw in bang bang. I thought maybe VE was scum for a bit as well due to the fact that he didn't get a single vote yesterday despite the back and forth but going through his filter I didn't see it. He also tried to lead yesterday's lynch which scum is often hesitant to do. marv, what are your thoughts on risk? he hasn't changed a thing since I called him out yesterday, and now says we should ignore him because he is lazy.... | ||
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On June 26 2012 10:16 marvellosity wrote: There's not a lot else I can say on the matter by this stage. If that's really enough to lynch me then whatever. I hate that there are so many players who basically haven't contributed this cycle. Where is Matt and his promised reads? Where are Shraft and Snarfs? Why is rastaban always so irrelevant? Why does risk who always has an opinion not have an opinion? Hey I am not sure what you want from me, since day one I have had a town read on both you and VE. I think Risk is scum (you admit hasn't contributed). I agree a lot of people are very absent and need to get posting so we can see what side they are on. | ||
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"He thinks marv is scummy but did not want to vote for him day 1? That's perfectly reasonable play." Guess what Zentor was much scummier than Marv day one, which you yourself must have thought or you wouldn't have voted him as well. At the time I posted that statement we were early in day one and people were starting to bandwagon marv before we could evaluate everyone. SO yeah it was reasonable, jumping on the wagon is what wouldn't have been reasonable. Isn't it obvious why VE is town, we have the only person voting for VE claiming he was was the most likely mafia shot and others saying he is the towniest of the town. I don't know about marv yet, I felt he seemed town yesterday as he spent the whole time fending so I never got a chance to see much from him. His actions today don't feel mafia to me, His sudden switch on VE would obviously put him under scrutiny but he still did it, that is something a town player would be more willing to do than a mafia. Risk is my Number one read and I am looking through the filters of some of the other players to find possible scum. I will look through prplhz again That said why are you posting 3 different people with miniature cases? I would much prefer an actual full case on someone rather than cherry picking an item or two on three different players. Everyone makes small decisions that isolated can make them look scummy, it is finding a trail of them to show it wasn't just a single bad play that helps us make an informed decision. @Probulous, didn't get to review your case as well as I wanted to, and I need to get off for a bit but I will look back over it in case I am reading marv wrong in the morning and give you my thoughts. | ||
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I feel this is a very well thought out argument against Marv. I had a rough time with VE's arguments as there was so much yelling back and forth but I think Probulous does a good job extracting the needed information here. Marvs insistence on shooting VE, only makes him look more like scum. On June 26 2012 21:57 risk.nuke wrote: Sure, He's not mafia because he claimed vig and not a soul said something as the clock slowly ticked towards the deadline. An SK is like a ninja, marv's been a rooster. If he is a vigilante we get a shot tonight, or we force the mafia to roleblock+kill. If he's a SK we also get a shot tonight, or we force the mafia to roleblock+kill. He doesn't get his shot refunded, so wouldn't mafia just RB him tonight? No need to kill him since tomorrow he will have just not shot and we will be in the same situation. If he is scum then they would just pull their RB and claim RB no kill. I feel like claiming Vig was the safest claim for mafia since there is no way to disprove it with a night situation as it can be blocked and there is no second chance like a normal blue role would have where you force mafia to take care of it. | ||
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The zentor lynch for one. He was the only person who thought Zentor had claimed blue. On June 23 2012 10:16 Mattchew wrote: I am going against my policy of always lynching mrzentor cause I don't think it's smart to lynch a claimed blue in a mini on day 1 especially with no counterclaim... Are we thinking that he got lucky with his guess or someone is holding their tongue? Do you think someone counterclaiming would be worth it to likely Out 1 scum? Ve Marv and prob i would like your thoughts on rasta.. He is also very quick to believe it. when he realized he made a mistake he quickly switches On June 23 2012 10:23 Mattchew wrote: Is this not for this game.. Cause If not fuck me let's lynch mrz Now think about this, for a town player they could make the same mistake, but they would be trying to root out if it was a valid claim or not. Instead he takes it at face value and thinks it is enough on its own not to lynch someone. Nothing changes from when he realizes Z is blue to actually green and yet that sole reason makes him switch his vote. Like I said, town could make the same mistake, but I don't think it would be handled the same way. Similarly we see today he posts this case: On June 26 2012 12:05 Mattchew wrote: So I have three suspects in my list for scum/sk players. Those three (in order of how I would like them lynched/killed) are Rastaban, Prplhz and marvellosity My First Suspect is Rastaban. + Show Spoiler + On June 23 2012 04:10 Mattchew wrote: (big post by post case on Risk.Nuke that I am not quoting) This all feels extremely middle of the road, I am ready to jump on a bandwagon but don't want to commit to anything scum play. He also contradicts himself about the talks about Marv, then contradicts his we have 48 hours post, by posting a case that he is pretty deadset on, about risk.nuke. Overall I just feel like Rastaban's posting has been flaky and his case on Risk is bad. To answer his question to the thread, I read his vote switch that he was not confident in a Marv lynch, and that he wanted to pressure a lurker with no content. Also, his first 30ish hour case doesn't take into account that Risk.nuke has played many many games before ##Vote: rastaban He thinks marv is scummy but did not want to vote for him day 1? That's perfectly reasonable play. I find this tone (throughout the game) when in conversation with Marv to be strange. He has not ever given a reason for thinking Marv or VE is town, yet constantly lumps them together as townies arguing. All in all, I find the tone of Rastaban's posts to be hesitant and a little off. I find that his lumping of townreads on players suspicious, and he has never really responded to a single case brought up. Instead he has just safely tunneled his forced case on Risk. I want scum Rastaban dead. He barely even defends himself even though he was extremely close to being lynched which shows me he's more scum than bad town (for you prob... <3) ##vote Rastaban Next up we have Prplhz I have already posted my thoughts on his timing of his Zeph case. While I was wrong about MrZ being his scum teammate, that hasn't dropped my suspicions. He posted a case, when it had no chance of actually impacting anything. I can't see a reason a townie would do this. It is obviously not going to get the attention he should want it to receive and all it provides him with is the ability to later on say I've been making cases all game. He hasn't posted about Zeph since that day ended. I think enough time has been given to say WTF? and then he goes and posts this... Like is Risk now your #1 target too now? Where did his suspicions of Zeph go? Why isn't he trying to push his case on him that he wanted to lynch me for calling him out on the weird timing? Why can't I equate almost anything he has done with a Town Agenda? Finally we have Marv. I actually should maybe color Marv black, because I think his play just feels very off. I think I lean him being the SK more than I do him being scum. Either way he eventually needs a noose. His filter is long and fluffy. A ton of arguing with VE but even more deflecting of actual answers... instead he resorts to inane arguments full of WIFOM and fallacys, like in all these filter enhancing posts. Can someone pick me out anything pro-town from these? + Show Spoiler + On June 22 2012 07:29 marvellosity wrote: I like this question a lot. I think there are a couple of possible tells. But tell me what you think first. On June 22 2012 07:30 marvellosity wrote: incorrect answer On June 22 2012 07:32 marvellosity wrote: lol, ok dear. If people could look for themselves, then maybe just one person in the whole of LV and the obsQT might have had a tingling suspicion, no? No. On June 22 2012 07:34 marvellosity wrote: here's a clue count how many times anyone said i said or even hinted at anything scummy in LV see the pressure i was under at the start in magic at the start for wanting to shoot NT off the bat compare to current situation profit On June 22 2012 08:52 marvellosity wrote: lol, ok. On June 22 2012 09:39 marvellosity wrote: VE, you're so tedious sometimes. On June 22 2012 09:50 marvellosity wrote: I've quite clearly stated I am not, stop it. The similar thing, VE, is that I wasn't afraid of saying something that was scummy in that game. In this game, unless you underestimate me which I think you do not, you should be aware that I know making a sidestep to Mattchew's question could be viewed scummily, and I'd avoid it like the fucking plague if I were scum. On June 22 2012 09:52 marvellosity wrote: Don't be an idiot. Why would I let myself in for this (fairly predictable, even if how long and hard it has continued was not) when I didn't have to? Use your noggin. On June 22 2012 09:56 marvellosity wrote: a) because i'm unafraid b) because i get information from who and how i'm pushed On June 22 2012 10:19 marvellosity wrote: wrong way of looking at it Prob if I were scum I'd have thought more before answering matt's question. even if this conversation has been quite interesting On June 22 2012 10:13 marvellosity wrote: it means you're a very special boy <3 On June 22 2012 10:20 marvellosity wrote: who knew being the centre of attention was so tiring?! gosh On June 22 2012 10:39 marvellosity wrote: we could dance? On June 22 2012 10:43 marvellosity wrote: haha me too ^^ On June 22 2012 18:31 marvellosity wrote: What an exceptionally stupid thing to say, well done. On June 22 2012 23:05 marvellosity wrote: I didn't make a conscious decision to go 'lol gonna appear scummy now'. I read Matt's post and made a reply to it without giving it that much thought. The point being I give every post I make as scum due thought. On June 23 2012 07:15 marvellosity wrote: 'fabricated some fantasy' your posts are just littered with insidious phrases like this. On June 23 2012 07:19 marvellosity wrote: If you're trying to figure shit out, you're doing a fucking awful job of it. On June 24 2012 03:29 marvellosity wrote: No, I'm just arrogant and sarcastic. But it's not the case. stopping cause the point is made and this is getting tedious. This alongside his flip-flopping on VE, which I think is less likely then the usual confident (he called himself arrogant) town Marv. Instead of actually picking one person he decides to do three cherry picking small specific things rather than focusing in on one person and trying to get them lynched. We end up getting our second mistake from him where his case against prp is based on not even reading the day post. How can he be taken seriously as hunting scum when he isn't even following thread. I think it shows that his goal wasn't to find scum but to look like he was. We also have him pushing for marv, but look at how long it takes for him to actually switch to marv despite having him on his top 2 scum list. It takes 2 different people mentioning it for him to setup an obvious situation (who you shooting marv) to finally make a reason to justify his voting for marv. I am not confident in killing Marv, I can understand what he means about being more careful when playing as mafia. In the past when I have played as mafia I reread everything looking for things that make me seem suspicious and remove them. Everything I say seems artificially sanitized, but as town I am more concerned about finding scum regardless of peoples opinions on how I do it. I say we let him live tonight and see what mafia does knowing who our Vig is. If he lives for a while we can come back to the issue and kill him but now mafia needs to make a choice. Also mafia may not even have a roleblocker but town does, or we might have a detective who can investigate him for us etc.. I think Mattchew is Mafia and a better lynch than marv today.. ##unvote risk.nuke ##vote mattchew | ||
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On June 27 2012 05:39 prplhz wrote: @rastaban Can you get a little more concrete than just "I read his filter" into "Town"? Sure So Day 1 you mentioned that he did pursue his vote one me, but he actually didn't want to vote for either of us and wanted to try and get a new target. Knowing as I do that I am town, and as well all do that zentor was town, I can't fault him for that though I can understand why this might not seem as compelling to you next we have this post On June 25 2012 10:30 Shraft wrote: risk.nuke you need to step up your game. Wanting to lynch lurers and then lurking hard yourself makes you look bad. On top of that your only substantial post is the one where you defend yourself (you never followed up on that post either, despite saying that you would). Why would you even bother defending that hard when nobody agreed with his case anyway? You ask for the other lurkers to share their reads and to contribute, but you do nothing of the kind yourself. Aside from lurkers, you're only suspicious of rastaban (but you haven't really shared much thought on him either, it looks more like OMGUS to me). And what the fuck is this? He would've tried to dodge the lynch regardless of his alignment, why do you act as if it is a scum tell? he pushes risk and defends me. Why would he do this unless he really meant what he had said the day before. Also I would think scum would be less likely to point out I would have tried to dodge the lynch regardless as it lessens suspicion on me who was likely to be pushed day 2. On June 27 2012 02:06 Shraft wrote: In my sleep drunken state of insanity I'm actually starting to believe that marv is somehow town... I'm going to research his play in the coming hour, and then I'll come back and post my findings. How long do we have left on the day? A couple of hours, right? He is being wishy washy on marv a bit, but I am too as is a lot of town. This lynch is a hard one to call with marv, half the time I want to kill him and half I think he defense seems legit. Thats why I currently would rather let mafia shoot him tonight if possible and make that decision for us. I don't see it as conclusive that he isn't scum, but I think we have a lot more obvious targets right now other than him. Hope that clears it up a bit. | ||
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On June 27 2012 05:52 marvellosity wrote: What??? If I survive the night, why would mafia shoot me?! Well there were 2 roleblocks night one, so lets go with that for now. 1 was the jailer, so that leaves only 1 roleblocker left. Now both town or mafia can have a role blocker. If it is town, then they need to kill you or you get confirmed when you shoot, if it is mafia then he blocks you but we force the mafia to spend their night block on you b/c if someone else claims to have been RBed then we know you are lying and that your shot didn't work. The detective could also check you if we have one... | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + HINT: On June 27 2012 08:13 marvellosity wrote: you shouldn't lynch me because i'm town. and fingers crossed my vigi shot should mostly confirm me as town and mafia will have to kill me off at some point. and hopefully if i am alive i'll be able to find scum, because i'm not too bad at that. On June 27 2012 08:18 VisceraEyes wrote: Meh - you didn't really think that through. You're never ever going to get a vig-shot. Ever. If you're town, scum are going to roleblock you until the cows come home (which is a long ass time, for those not familiar with American colloquialisms.) You're going to keep on living each night, and each morning you'll be saying "Guys I swear I'm a vig...it's this damned ROLEBLOCKER!" Town isn't going to have any choice but to lynch you because not only have you had myself and Probulous on your shit since D1, but you're going to look even worse if/when I get nightkilled and flip town. Town is GOING TO HAVE to kill you. It's just a matter of when. The correct answer was "Tomorrow if I get Roleblocked". On June 27 2012 08:20 marvellosity wrote: Just because you're on my shit doesn't make me any less town. Town either believes I'm town now and that I got roleblocked or they don't. You're pushing the idea that I have to be lynched now because it could cause trouble later. No, you only lynch me now if town is convinced I'm scum. That is the correct answer my friend. + Show Spoiler + Neither has read the Vigilante role text You are the most conservative member of town, and as such you really enjoy exercising your 2nd Amendment rights to shoot criminals in the face. You have a gun with X bullets and you may shoot if you so wish at night. You are never refunded a bullet under any circumstances. You win when all the mafia have ceased to breathe. If they had they would know the bullet didn't get refunded and so he only needs blocked 1 night. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/CPvTH.jpg) ##unvote ##vote marvellosity | ||
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On June 27 2012 10:04 Probulous wrote: AMAZING CATCH! What does it say? Like seriously how is this useful? The whole point of the discussion is that there is no way marv can confirm himself. How does this help us clear that up? If your actually vig you would have read your role, ergo he doesn't have the vig role. | ||
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I need to review the vote counts as I would rather either of you be lynched than a no lynch. | ||
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On June 27 2012 07:29 Artanis[Xp] wrote: Vote Count - 5 Hours to go risk.nuke (0): Zephirdd (RIP) (0): rastaban (1): xsksc VisceraEyes (0): marvellosity (5): VisceraEyes, Shraft, Mattchew, Rastaban, xsksc (1): risk.nuke Shraft (1): prplhz Mattchew (1): Snarfs, Not voted (2): marvellosity, Probulous, xsksc,risk.nuke,prplhz You guys need to start deciding on a candidate to push as an alternative, splitting out your votes is pointless right now. | ||
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##unvote ##vote Mattchew | ||
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On June 27 2012 11:02 Probulous wrote: Well assuming, Snarfs, Probulous, VE, Marvellosity, Shraft, we need one more. Don't forget little ol'e me | ||
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On June 27 2012 10:29 prplhz wrote: it's like 3am and i can't make rational decisions anymore yes, sloosh jailed me during night1 and that should be pretty obvious if you read his god damn filter (and mine) i don't even know what this refundability thing means i don't want to no lynch so i'm just going to vote marvellosity. he could be scum and it's weird that he used the night to flip flop when vigilantes usually use it to make up their mind. going to pass out for a while if you don't mind Is this the prpl post in question? and is there more to the case than this? Sorry It has been a while since I reviewed his filter. | ||
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On June 27 2012 12:00 VisceraEyes wrote: We'll probably lynch prplhz next, is that okay? :/ Honestly I'd rather lynch him now - we have an hour, can we make it happen? X( I think marv has gone to bed so not sure it is possible and I prefer a Matt lynch. I need to do some more reading of prplhz to come to a conclusion as I think his last post could make sense when it is very late and you hate no lynches. I would the same thing unless I was positive the guy was scum. Also it is hard to stand your ground with so many other people certain someone is scum. He might be scum but I would need more time to read his posts, I think it is a great topic for tonight or once day starts. . | ||
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I would do the same thing unless i was positive the guy wasn't scum. | ||
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On June 27 2012 12:18 Probulous wrote: Yeah that's a really bad post rastaban Care to explain why? You think a no lynch is better than a lynch when unsure? Unless I was sure someone is innocent I would much rather have a lynch. | ||
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On June 27 2012 12:25 Mattchew wrote: Anyone notice the amount of no-reason votes on me and then disappear acts pulled for this lynch. Its bullshit And yet I who posted a reason and am not hiding Is your number one read. How about if you are really town contribute on who else you think is scum instead of Adding nothing and repeating lynch Rastaban over and over again? | ||
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On June 27 2012 12:32 Probulous wrote: The fence couldn't be farther up your ass if you tried. You agreed completely with his actions to the point that you would do the same but he could be scum  Matt your only chance is to convince people that xsksc is scum. I mean your most active point in the game is right near the deadline of your lynch. Be realistic, we don't have enough people to lynch prpl, or rastaban or anyone other than you or xsksc. Unless you are pushing for a no-lynch what are you doing? The fence couldn't be farther up your ass if you tried. Haven't heard that one before . Does it mean I am oblivious or that I incriminated myself?I am saying I don't find his last post incriminating and I would do the same. That is why I need to spend time reading everything else as maybe he has been scummy in other ways but I can't fault him for that last post. If you were in his situation What would you have done at that point stayed on shraft? | ||
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On June 27 2012 12:56 Mattchew wrote: I'm trying to win by avoiding a mis lynch I'm appealing to the same logic you've used to push my lynch Aka none What was your opinion on marv, is he innocent you think? | ||
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Now we don't know if Matt was town or mafia, if marv was town or mafia and all the votes are nearly pointless right now as we don't know who was on scum and who wasn't. On June 27 2012 12:43 rastaban wrote: Until we get a verbal confirmation that we have enough people to kill xsksc please no one switch your vote. Mafia would love nothing more than have us do a no lynch. If someone switches and makes us have a mislynch I will do my best to get you policy lynched tomorrow. | ||
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On June 17 2012 19:53 marvellosity wrote: Mafia heuristic: if an outrageous play is retarded from both a scum and a town viewpoint, it is usually from mafia | ||
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VE let his opinion supercede the votes of half the town He reacted when there could be no recourse or time to switch to a different lynch which is deceptive He filled the chat with spam between himself and marv for 2 days and then cops out at the last minute We don't get to see the flips on anyone discussed so we don't know what was right or wrong. Both marv and Matt were on his top list of scum As others have pointed out he specifically has stated that even if matt was town it wasn't that bad for town. We could have learned from the votes when we found out for sure what matt was, but now we don't know b/c you can be sure mafia isn't going to hit mat tonight. | ||
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On June 28 2012 06:54 VisceraEyes wrote: I also prefer a Matthchew lynch - or a prplhz lynch, or a risk.nuke lynch. Not a big fan of the prplhz lynch, I would rather lynch either of the other two and decide which way to head once they flip red. | ||
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 Time to read through his posts and hope he bread crumbed some information. | ||
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I think he should have died last night if he hadn't have been saved last minute :/ | ||
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On June 28 2012 08:41 marvellosity wrote: ok but no-one else claimed rb. ok scratch that sorry Yeah, very unlikely he is sk, though as you said scum is possible. I am going to review the current players, I have felt risk was scum the whole game but I'd he was rbed that wouldn't work. | ||
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Lets go through the lynch. It ended with this being the final vote count: risk.nuke (0): Zephirdd (RIP) (0): rastaban (1): xsksc VisceraEyes (0): marvellosity (3): xsksc (1): risk.nuke Shraft (0): Mattchew (5): Rastaban, Snarfs, Probulous, Now remember mafia knows marv isn't lying and they believe he can shoot. Now the real question here is what alignment is Mattchew? Lets discuss him being scum vs town If he is mafia why would scum switch to him? They can lynch marv and we would be in the spot we are right now. just switch marv and VE. Remember scum didn't know that VE would switch off so they play knowing that matt gets lynched. We know probulous and marv are both town that leaves me snarfs and shraft. If mattchew is mafia then the mafia team would seem to be prplhz,risk.nuke,Mattchew. Because if any mafia voted for him it would have been an awful play they lose their first member and we go into town today with 3-1-2 and a way to track things back to them. The real problem is their is no need to do it, Any of them can feign not being on line and just let marv be lynched we could only switch because we had the exact amount, 6 players, online. what are our chances that all town voted for matt, I think it is unlikely How about if Mattchew is town, well then things start to make a lot more sense from an optimal play stance. Mafia knows that either lynch is good for them, but they have good reason to believe they can control marv with either a block or letting him kill VE. This means that both lynches are good for them but killing matt is slightly better (2-1-3 instead of 3-1-3) I think they thought the lynch of mattchew would end the game for them with a 2-1-3 day today so they got a bit bold I would like to point out something else, including today every lynch has had Snarfs and Shraft voting in sync for the same person. Also check out this: On June 27 2012 03:42 Shraft wrote: Snarfs meta Here's a short list that describes Snarfs' posting in EMM (where he was mafia) quite accurately:
Here are Snarfs' post game thoughts: I compared Snarfs' play in EMM (where he was scum) to his play in WoF MM (where he was a vigilante), and I found some differences:
I think that it's too early to guess his alignment based on meta in this game, but his play looks more like his town meta to me. The way he presents his case on Zephirdd doesn't seem like his conservative scum play in EMM. However, it could just be him adapting his scum play according to his post game thoughts in EMM, which makes me quite uncertain. Conclusion: Snarfs is still a null tell to me. I spent one hour researching his meta, but it didn't make me any more certain on his alignment. ._. He spends an hour researching his "meta" and comes back with a null tell. he never follows up on this, and why didn't he judge him based on his own merits? Shraft doesn't fare any better under scrutiny, Remember that long post on Zeph before we found out he died. As was pointed out he was too scummy to have been a scum target and they probably shot our jailer. My previous game I was working on a large case do you know when I posted it, minutes before day because I knew I might get shot and have all that effort wasted. Look however at his timing shortly after day post. and until a moment ago where he accuses me it was his only case this whole game. A whole game with 1 case that gets posted 15 min. before that person is revealed dead and flips town. My conclusion is that Mattchew is not scum so he must be SK I am going out on a limb here and I hate to admit I am wrong but with things the way they are it makes sense to me that risk.nuke is probably really town with that roleblock. The whole block the SK thing makes sense and so i will give him townie award #2 And of course marv is our last townie. Now thew question is which of these scum do we lynch first? ##Unvote | ||
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To steal Marv's idea bonus townie points for quick answers | ||
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Please... | ||
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On June 28 2012 22:54 Mattchew wrote: Marv To simplify your process I will give you a step by step of how you should approach everything. We are in Lynch Scum or Lose. Mis-lynching town or the SK will result in a scum victory The first and MOST IMPORTANT thing you need to do is come up with a final read on Risk. The reason for this, is that he is pretty much the only player 100% guaranteed not to be the SK. Personally I believe him to be town. I don't think there is any logical reason for scum to hold their RB when I believe the SK has been hunting them all game (Zeph then Xsksc were scummy targets that I doubt scum would shoot at and I believe SK shot at them to kill mafia). It would be extremely bold of them to hold their RB and increase the chances of one of them being hit by SK. If you disagree, I feel that you must vote and lynch Risk because if you are correct, he will flip scum 100%. There is no one else you can say this for. If you agree with my assessment that Risk is town, then you have 5 players left, 4 of which are not town. I think the first step you must take is trying to remove the remaining townie from the pool of 5. This way (and this is so weird to actually say out loud) you can start to play connect-the-scum, something that normally can demolish town. However in this scenario, it is actually the best way to try and lynch a scum team member over the SK or townie. Any route you choose I will support, other than voting me for lynch. I also will help you think out your reads if you would like my opinions. Basically Marv, the game comes down to your reads, no one else's, if you read the situation as Risk being town then his reads also matter, but until that point, the game is on your shoulders. This is a very levelheaded and well thought out post, which coincides on my read that you are not scum. I agree we shouldn't lynch you today. And if you really aren't scum then VE may have saved the game with his shenanigans last night. What do you feel about my post and its possible scum targets. I know we need marv on board to do anything but I would like your input. | ||
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I still don't want to change my mind, but the logic says that they are not scum and I can't fight with that as it is the best lead town has right now. Post game I will discuss more and hopefully get some insight on what I did wrong until then lets lynch scum. | ||
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On June 28 2012 23:13 Mattchew wrote: I mean I dont think you are the SK and I think town is me/marv/risk so I dont really care much for your opinions no offense Thats fine, I don't really want your thoughts on my opinions but the logic behind the vote on you last night. Also if you really believe what you just posted why are both Ss bussing me? If I am scum that doesn't make any sense. I have you, Sharft, and Snarfs out to get me, it doesn't make sense for me to be part of a scum team. Especially if you believe the players you listed are town. | ||
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On June 29 2012 00:13 marvellosity wrote: The only player at the moment where my read on risk/matt others at the moment doesn't matter is prplhz. ##unvote ##vote: prplhz I this this is a good call, Snarfs you are fine with this too right? He was on your list... ##vote: prplhz | ||
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On June 29 2012 00:42 Shraft wrote: prplhz your case is fucking shit. You didn't even bother responding to me when I pointed out that some stuff is your case is factually wrong. @rastaban Well, you are my #1 scum read at the moment, and you are comfortable lynching prplhz, and that makes me kind of wary... Well since I am scum I am obviously just bussing my teammate. Might as well take advantage of this since the only way town can win is by lynching scum. Then tomorrow you lynch me win-win right. | ||
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I don't think so, I think he really was Roleblocked last night. | ||
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On June 29 2012 00:51 marvellosity wrote: so there's 3 townies, me, you, risk, matt seeing the problem yet? As I said earlier, I think Matt is the SK | ||
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On June 29 2012 00:59 Shraft wrote: @rastaban Can you explain to me why you took a bunch of null tells on risk.nuke, said they furthered scum agenda and pushed them as if they were blatant scum tells? Or do you still insist on them being actual scum tells? Until now I thought it was a good case. In light of recent events I don't logically think he can be scum. I pushed Mepach_Ziph (sorry for butchering your name) last game day 1 very slightly for the same reasons, but then he improved once I did it,so I let him go. Later we found out he was GF, and I kicked myself for not pushing him harder. So this game I decided I wouldn't let that happen again, so I tried to trust my read on him. Most likely it was just both of them being lurkers so after this game I will be reviewing my play to see where I went wrong. To be truthful I would still like for him to be scum so I can say I told you so, but I think it is more likely I made a bad play than for him to be faking a RB last night given the current state of things. | ||
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On June 29 2012 03:09 marvellosity wrote: don't do this, I don't want anyone now saying who they think SK is. Well can you list just your scum reads then? | ||
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On June 29 2012 03:32 marvellosity wrote: rastaban: a tidbit for you to consider. Post your thoughts as you please. When Snarfs voted for Mattchew yesterday, he was leaving the thread and it seemed like there was zero danger of Mattchew getting lynched. Hmmm His case comes moments after I switch my vote to you. If he was scum bussing Matt b/c he felt he wouldn't actually be lynched at that point then there is a possibility of a Matt, Snarfs, X team. I was thinking he votted matt when I was pushing for matt as well, but I checked and it actually occurs after I switched my vote to you. Ok time to reread how that went down a few times and see what I can learn. | ||
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On June 29 2012 04:24 marvellosity wrote: ok. rastaban/risk/matt opinions too please! thx Working on it, reviewing his play in Pick Your Poison right now to see how it matches up. | ||
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His play seems slightly different that in his previous game where he contributed more but he does seem to try to break up the conflict between you and VE which he said in previous games is what causes town to lose when their isn't an atmosphere of teamwork. It is possible he isn't scum but it is a pretty long shot, perhaps if risk faked the block he could be scum but I don't think it is a high probability. I lean scum but at this point I think Snarfs is a better choice. | ||
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On June 29 2012 04:48 marvellosity wrote: hurray! only risk/matt to go :o Gratz on Ghost :D sorry you had to use it here. | ||
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That means we have a 50/50 chance between shraft and snarfs of getting role blocker. It also means one of them was the shooter that night as the role blocker can't shoot on nights he role blocks, don't know if that will help in narrowing it down though. Time to go back through their filters. | ||
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On June 29 2012 05:24 marvellosity wrote: one way or another my information pool is growing. I'm on to the 4th page of my Holy Document of All Things. Our faith and hopes rest on your precious document. Treat it well. | ||
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I think this was a good choice, his role as the first on the matt lynch makes me think he is the better choice, At the time it seemed marv was a sure thing so they would have wanted someone off of him when he flipped vig. | ||
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On June 29 2012 21:41 marvellosity wrote: Assuming we lynch scum, overnight it will be 3-2-1. Town lynches the roleblocker 3-2-1 will likely become 2-1-1. Town cannot possibly win. Is the mafia's best ploy to kill a townie? Presumably any sane SK (rofl :/) chose one-shot bulletproof for situations just like these (BH chose it last game). So if mafia tries to shoot at SK then likely it ends up 3-1-1, worse for mafia than 2-1-1 (obviously) Town doesn't lynch the roleblocker 3-2-1 becomes 2-2-1. An even worse situation for town numerically speaking, where the only hope is for town to lynch a mafia and then mafia and SK to shoot each other (extremely unlikely...) Basically town cannot possibly win unless by some miracle mafia hits the SK tonight. Presuming this happens: If SK gets roleblocked, it will be 3-2-1 tomorrow and we can potentially win by lynching scum. If SK does not get roleblocked, it will be 3-1-1 tomorrow, where fate is entirely in town's hands. In other words, town can only win if mafia does not kill town tomorrow. This being the case, our chances are greatly increased if we manage to hit the roleblocker. Everyone please comment. Am I making correct assumptions here? The one of course that it's based on is a 3-1 scum/SK split. In Emergency it was 3/1 and town had cop, roleblocker, jailer, similar blue powers to here, so it seems reasonable. Don't forget we can no lynch. in a 2-1-1 or scenario town's best chance is to go for a no lynch. It doesn't assure a victory but it ends up making the the SK and Mafia play WIFOM with a possibility of town taking the game. There might be a possibility for a 3-2 tomorrow as well, If the SK chose investigation immune or if bulletproof can be suppressed (In my previous game this was the case but RB didn't block KP then so it might not) and mafia try and eliminate him tonight. Does Roleblock suppress the SK's one shot bulletproof? | ||
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where TTT = 2 Goons + Roleblocker, Serial Killer (Investigation Immune OR 1-Shot Bulletproof) which matches with the general consensus right now. | ||
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On June 29 2012 23:23 marvellosity wrote: do you agree with me though our chances are increased by killing roleblocker? (2-1-1 instead of 2-2-1)? A no lynch at 2-1-1 and lynching mafia at 2-2-1 going into night means both situation resolve to a 2-1-1 night phase. The difference is that in one SK has to hit mafia at night and in one we as a town have to lynch mafia during the day. The SK can't win if he hits town tonight so he will be aiming for mafia. Now the other problem is that you are almost certainty going to die tonight unless Mafia tries to kill SK. So tomorrow town won't have a confirmed townie to spear head the vote. When todays lynch flips red I think it will confirm your theory so town will vote accordingly. I think you should list out after the lynch who the next target should be to be sure whichever case it is the shot/lynch goes accordingly. | ||
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On June 30 2012 03:16 Mattchew wrote: I am an idiot woops Its been almost 2 years since I played any mafia so an easy mistake to make. You are currently helping town. I just need to make sure you shoot scum tonight and not me. Please follow Marv's recommendation on who to shoot, You can't win if you hit a townie so it is important that a mis-shot doesn't occur. Remember I helped in finding out you weren't scum why would I do that when you seemed an easy lynch, especially with VE pushing you just before he died, unless I was town? | ||
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On June 30 2012 04:02 Mattchew wrote: I would like everyone's lists real quick Of Myself/rasta/sharft/snarfs/prp who is scum, who is town and who is sk I think/know + Show Spoiler + Me town Snarfs SK sharft/rasta/prp Scum Rasta and Marv thinks + Show Spoiler + Rasta town Mattchew SK Sharft/Snarfs/prp Scum Im missing some so sharft/snarfs/prp/risk I would like to have everyones opinions for the record I think you should include risk in that list, there are some scum who are trying to put him forward as scum to fit their version of things that have happened. | ||
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On June 30 2012 00:15 Shraft wrote: rasta + prplhz + matt/Snarfs probably. | ||
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On June 30 2012 06:40 marvellosity wrote: i am clearly going to play SC2 through deadline. cheers. Not if it is a pvp | ||
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##vote no-lynch If everyone agrees could we fast forward to night phase? Also game break down. I was wrong when I thought shaft was scum. I'm sorry shaft, I think my mistake was in trusting Matthew. Risk I am assuming you are the other town. If you are scum then I guess you deserve to win for your great play. I will make a deal with you. We work together and scum decides which of us wins. I am bullet proof so they have a choice shoot you then me and sk wins, they can also shoot me 2x and town wins. I tried this whole game to help town with my day posts and make my shots hit people who were suspicious but i thought townies. I had thought this would keep both sides balanced instead my day play was so bad it didn't work. You will notice the dt probably checked me which is why he pushed me but not very hard since he didn't want to be outed for the sk and hoped to catch scum. You don't need to do anything but vote for no lynch so they cant day kill us and we will let our scum opponents play king maker between the two of us. | ||
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On July 01 2012 08:29 risk.nuke wrote: Im on the phone so I can't bold but wbg ##vote no-lynch I just found out I can select it and click bold instead of using tags, don't know if your mobile device lets you do that though. | ||
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On July 01 2012 08:31 rastaban wrote: I just found out I can select it and click bold instead of using tags, don't know if your mobile device lets you do that though. The way I said that was confusing. I am referring to the B at the top left of the text box, not something on my phone specifically, I just didnt know if they showed on all mobile devices. anyway sorry for off topic. Good luck | ||
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Well played scum, kept me guessing to the end, | ||
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On July 01 2012 13:20 Zephirdd wrote: Okay then, My absolutely flawless plan of drawing a shot night 1 fucking worked. Basically, I went full apeshit on the miller stuff, focusing so much on "protecting our blues" and "we need to keep the possible blue pool as large as possible!" into "holy shit I'm a vanilla and I was shot n1" Is that logic correct, rastaban? I killed you because people suspected you as mafia but I felt you were town. I thought it would make day 2 discussion easier without weakening mafia. My goal was to try and get mafia lynched, but apparently I am awful at that, and then shoot townies every night that town doubted. Sorry for tunneling you risk I really thought you were scum early on, was this a normal game for you? | ||
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