TL Mafia LVI

On June 30 2012 11:05 VisceraEyes wrote:
Why, you of course.

On June 30 2012 11:09 austinmcc wrote:
Mattchew I'm not sure if you can trust what I think you're trusting.

On June 30 2012 14:23 casualman wrote:
I love to bandwagon. Being a newb, I can read nothing from these posts and will blindly trust in authority figures. Woohoo!

##Vote BroodKingEXE

On June 30 2012 14:23 casualman wrote:
I love to bandwagon. Being a newb, I can read nothing from these posts and will blindly trust in authority figures. Woohoo!

##Vote BroodKingEXE

On July 02 2012 03:40 Foxtrotter wrote:
Sorry i haven't posted yet ladies and gentles was a little busy and had to catch up.
I've read through the thread and my opinion is that everything mK has done (or lack of) up to this point seems scummy.
The fact that he has not defended him self is extremely unsettling to me. (I hope that nothing personal has happened.)


With his comment of however,




I am pretty comfortable voting for him on D1.

##vote mK

On July 02 2012 04:55 Twelve wrote:
@Mattchew

haha where to start...

My first post that you quote was from before the game even started, so it probably shouldn't be taken to seriously. I simply don't know anyone here and was trying to start a conversation. The fact that you see a contradiction is also puzzling I can sort of see how it could be misinterpreted that I was saying "I am all for the hatred of bandwagons" but thats not what I was saying. In fact I was saying the opposite, I was asking to be clued in so I could join a bandwagon, but this was largely a joke. Suffice to say, anything I said before the game officially started probably shouldn't concern town too much.

I do take issue with your use of the word band wagon though, upon reading the thread I found both BKE and Kurumi extremely suspicious, regardless of other players posts, and made my thoughts known. BKE says alot while conveying extremely little actual information, appearing to be helpful but really just mixing the pot. Kurumi writes long winded, somewhat schizophrenic sounding poems to his co-workers that are about as informative as a fortune cookie. I don't to see a vote count or FOS: BKE FOS:Kurumi for my brain to begin forming conclusions. As for the cutesy yuck bit, he seemed pretty angry that I would vote in the vote in the voting thread without warning him, so I tried to keep things light (read: I wrote something much ruder but thought better of it and decided to kill him with niceness :D)



As far as calling out casualman, I tried very hard to think of any strategic reason a town would vote for themselves and I could think of none. I had the same issue with VE voting for himself, but voted unvoted in the same post, sort of like lowering and raising a supply depot while you wait for your rax to build i guess, so I really don't have a problem with it going under the radar.

On July 01 2012 08:24 Twelve wrote:



This reads as scum to me. Reorganizing public information and posting it as a friendly town helping message, even though in reality it offers very little information. I hear "Hey guys, scum would never post a vote count where they are losing! Clearly BKE just has the town's best interests at heart!"

On a side note though, what reasons would there be for casualman to vote for himself if he were town?

On July 02 2012 05:08 s0Lstice wrote:
oh hai mattchew. I don't like most of what you just posted.

Firstly, you wrongly interpreted what Twelve said. Him saying he is for bandwagon hatred does not mean he hates bandwagons, it means he is fine with hating someone using someone elses reasons.

On July 02 2012 05:08 s0Lstice wrote:
How you read Casualman as anything but a troll at this point is beyond me. Trolling isn't alignment indicative.

On July 02 2012 05:08 s0Lstice wrote:
Your reasoning on BM is: ....we should kill BM because he shouldn't be alive.

On July 02 2012 05:08 s0Lstice wrote:
Your portion on drwiggl3s is off as well. He does say a reason why he thinks people are scummy for not voting BKE: they are soft-defending BKE and trying to turn the attention elsewhere. You may not like his reason, but it's a reason.

On July 02 2012 05:08 s0Lstice wrote:
You also threw casualman into the spotlight, and then walked away from it for quite awhile. Talking about what casualman is doing is a colossal waste of time, because you can sum it up in one word + Show Spoiler +.

I find it hard to believe you are acting in the town's best interest at the moment. Your fails in reading comprehension raise my eyebrows. I'm beginning to think you're scum.

On July 02 2012 05:38 Mandalor wrote:


Awesome. I love how you blatantly leave out parts of my post so it alligns with what you say. Maybe I should really disregard my anti-post-analytics on day 1 policy, because that reeks of scum.

I'd like to highlight that specific part again for future reference:


Also you seem to have issues with reading comprehension. I didn't say I didn't read in my first post. I said I didn't catch up, yet. Huge difference (10 pages in my situation). Obviously that only helps your case against me.

Since you're making yourself so important, I guess I'll just do that too. You are now my die-list.

On July 02 2012 05:44 Bill Murray wrote:
I dislike mattchew attacking me with 0 reasoning
I also like him attacking wiggles, i have a townread on wiggles

On July 02 2012 05:49 Twelve wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +

I'm not sure how my reasoning would be considered random. I explained why I thought the 2 people that I thought. You seem much more concerned with meta gaming then focusing on the game you in right now. Saying that someone is scum in 90% of past games shows that you are behaving irrationally, emotionally, or just plain being disruptive. As well as a deficiency in statistical analysis

On July 02 2012 06:23 Mandalor wrote:
I said I didn't catch up to the thread. That implies I've read parts of it. Whether that's 10 pages or 14 or 8 is irrelevant I think? I didn't know that was important. There are several people that voted and changed their mind during the course of day1. I didn't change my mind, although I'm not at all sure about BKE, but I don't see how that makes me scum.

On July 02 2012 06:19 Mandalor wrote:


You left my third post out and decided to summarize and add some nice flavor to it. You know, the whole voting for someone because he was highlighted yadda yadda. I never said or implied any of that. I gave my reasoning in my third post. And you repeat that I voted for BKE with no reason. It's right there. It's fine that you think I'm scum, but you're not helping town by putting words in my mouth. You just join the people that have a case against me and add some lies to it. That's nice, I think I did this in mafia 3.

I gave my reasons in post 3. Nothing to add, really. Here's a link to my filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=344514&user=2074

On July 01 2012 10:21 Mandalor wrote:

On Day1, I feel like there's only two good options for town.
a) kill a lurker
b) kill a guy that causes trouble just hours into the game

I don't like option a). Playing as mafia is fun. You hang around in a chat channel and make your plans. You're probably more busy with the chat than writing in the thread, but still... you're less likely to lurk. If the mafia is smart, they will have a couple of lurkers, but definitely not the majority so the odds of killing a town lurker is a lot higher on day1.

BKE qualifies for option b). Whether or not he's mafia, I personally don't like people in my game that use words like "scummy" judging people's first post in the game. Noone has posted enough in this game that I could possibly have built a good enough opinion on them, but apparently he can do that.
I'm not even going to address his newbie-theory.

I'm not saying I'm sure about BKE whatsoever, but he's our best option in my book.

On July 02 2012 06:26 EchelonTee wrote:
Foxtrot and kthez look bad.

On July 02 2012 06:31 EchelonTee wrote:
Mattchew, adam, ve, katina; is the mK lynch good to you? Something feels a bit fishy; I need reassurance or a cold slap in the face. We narrowly have time for a mass switch; only other option I see as feasible and good is a BM lynch.

On July 02 2012 06:45 Mandalor wrote:


Yeah I voted before reading every page. Guilty of charge. I was afraid of being modkilled and therefore decided to place a vote early. BKE's post in question was early in the thread and it looked suspicious to me. I then decided to read the rest of the thread and I'm up to date now.
So yeah, it was forced. Not forced by anyone in the game tho. Noone implied I was mafia before I voted, so - again - how does that make me scum?



This post:


s0lstice first post in the thread (after the game started). I still don't see anything fishy there.

At this point I'm even more convinced of mK or probably even you. If I vote for mK, people will call me an obvious bandwagoner. If I vote for you, I'm throwing away my vote, looking probably even more scummy. This is a sitation I haven't been in, yet. Tbh I don't see how to clear myself. People like you seem to have made up your mind on 0 evidence and literally anything I do will make me look worse.

On July 02 2012 06:51 layabout wrote:
If you read through Broodking's post's you may notice that he is not very concerned about who we lynch so long as it isn't him.
He keeps jumping into argument's and telling us not to kill him rather than telling us what he thinks about other players. He put more effort into telling us he isn't a noob than he put into his vote.

On July 02 2012 06:53 marvellosity wrote:
Can we kill Kurumi please?

On July 02 2012 06:57 Mandalor wrote:


Okay one more post I guess.
I don't understand his reasoning. It just looks like the desperate try to start a bandwagon. That's what looks fishy to me.
Plus the newbie-theory which would just open up another characteristic of mafia to act like.

As I said you're putting words in my mouth. You desperately try to make me look bad without hard evidence. People have called me out earlier and you just join in. No matter what happens tonight, I will remain on people's radar and you solidify that by inventing and implying stuff I never said.

Plus the newbie-theory which would just open up another characteristic of mafia to act like.

On July 02 2012 06:57 layabout wrote:

move fox up it.

On July 02 2012 07:02 Kurumi wrote:
I like to trim hedges. I like the way our fellow colleague works. He might dislike me, but I find his job proper. I would like him to decide on one of the main candidates. I find his target adequate, but not the best.

On July 02 2012 07:22 Mandalor wrote:


Gah, I'm tired.
You don't use my words when you say I voted on BKE because that was the general opinion at that time. That wasn't my reason and I never implied it was, but you make it sound like that.

This is the newbie theory post I'm talking about:


If we followed this theory, mafia newbies could hide a LOT better. They could easily falsely analyze players as scum and ppl would just view them as a newbie doing it wrong. Afterall, they tried to "help" the town by posting analyses.

On July 02 2012 08:42 s0Lstice wrote:


Voting later excludes me from making opinions on how the votes fell on someone? I'm 1 vote out of 10 dude.

On July 02 2012 08:45 VisceraEyes wrote:




Anyone interested in a nice easy contradiction to jump on?

On July 02 2012 19:49 ShiaoPi wrote:
Well, your inactivity would have looked a lot better if you say so beforehand, you know, establishing credibilty and stuff.
Now onto mattchew. His list generated discussion for town, which is good and also neatly piled up all the "scummy lurkers", which was a good thing. Why are you so intent on lynching for information?
Mattchews line about "deserving" I interpreted as simply one lurker down, if he had been interested in this game he might have defended himself? A mislynch on a townie is bad but foxtrot did nothing that helped town, so it is kind of "deserving" as anti-town play is especially play we want to make out and eliminate, so to me there is nothing wrong with that quote.

Your conclusion that if mattchew dies all ppl on the list are town is just wrong. Bussing has always happened and will always continue to happen.

On July 03 2012 01:06 marvellosity wrote:
Acro, Matt, whoever - thoughts on wiggles please, especially in light of austin's recent posts

On July 03 2012 03:08 Adam4167 wrote:
OK, im fairly intoxicated still, but someone who's making sense in the thread start talking to me so hung over Adam can wake up to a solved game and not have to think

On July 03 2012 04:08 NoSmurfHere wrote:
Kill:

Twelve
rastaban
Ghost
Katina
BM
VE

Assuming mK is town. If he flips scum then lynch them all anyway

On July 03 2012 04:12 NoSmurfHere wrote:


Don't like it? W/e, not my problem (at least for now)

Dr looks too stupid to be scum but I could be wrong there. I don't think he'd say specifically to get you lynched if he was scum.

On July 03 2012 04:21 NoSmurfHere wrote:


No real point in wasting my time during the night. I don't even know if I'll live to tomorrow.

I like s0lstice though. He seems intelligent.

On July 03 2012 04:28 Adam4167 wrote:


I pushed Mandalor because I thought he was scum and was unconvinced by the other lynch being pushed at the time (BKE).

I agree though, there are far too many lurkers in this game. Almost half of my spreadsheet is just grey.

On July 02 2012 06:46 Mattchew wrote:

No buts its because i have a weird town read on him. I think as newb scum, he would have had a much more carefully constructed first post. His post had a bunch of grammatical errors that would probably been fixed had he read it over like I feel scum would do

On July 03 2012 06:49 Mandalor wrote:
The more wiggles posted, the more weird his posts became. To a point where he made really odd mistakes (not scummy at all -> 100% scummy)
I don't know, I hold onto my opinion that he's town for now. I know I put a lot more thoughts in my posts when I was mafia.

I would still like Matt to explain his read on fox.

Ghost's last minute vote seemed odd. I'll look into his filter tomorrow.

On July 03 2012 22:52 Hyaach wrote:
Katina's filter auto explains herself.

ShaoPi's filter are easy to make.

Mattchew's list has most turn out town and one turned out ringleader.

After his initial meta push on BM, he never went back to discuss BM's play. Spreads FoS over everyone, granted, they were all making bad post but so was BM. And his response to nosmurfhere's list was kinda odd. quoting it 3 times to make a point?
VE may be town but I don't get how he see Katina as town too. Then he went on to say nosmurfhere looks scummy to discredit his list.

On July 03 2012 22:52 Hyaach wrote:
Mattchew's list has most turn out town and one turned out ringleader.

On July 03 2012 23:14 Acrofales wrote:
Ah Mattchew. Can you shed some light on your town read of Katina?

On July 03 2012 23:42 Acrofales wrote:

Hrmmm, I disagree. I don't know when she started making decent sensible cases and pushing her reads in Jubjub, but she has not done that yet here. I guess the frivolous nonsense is more like jubjub than like MTG, but I don't get the feeling she's putting effort into scumhunting this game (see her D1 reason, and later defense of her BKE vote), whereas she was clearly doing that in jubjub.

##vote katina

On July 04 2012 07:30 NoSmurfHere wrote:
Given that Shiaopi gave two unsure verdicts on Katina and Twelve and then a scum verdict on a third player who looks the same as the first two, I'd say Hyaach is a bad lynch.

Literally Shiaopi says he doesn't know what to make of Twelve's disappearance but Hyaach's disappearance makes him scum. Dafak?

Let's kill katina or Shiaopi today. Acro what do you think?

On July 04 2012 08:43 NoSmurfHere wrote:
Mattchew, what is it about Shiaopi you find townie?

On June 30 2012 22:56 ShiaoPi wrote:
EBWOP:

Forgot Bill Muray,

he looks like aggressive playing townie to me, at least for now.

On July 01 2012 00:51 ShiaoPi wrote:
@Vivax

I do not want to argue about semantics with you but take it in general terms:

BKE states that he believes it beneficial to be forgiving towards newbies, he then proceeds to attack 2 people's opening posts in which they clearly state that it is a "first time" for them.

It is much more the general idea behind his posts, he tries to encourage newbies first and then attacks the first two who are "newbies" in kinds of definition.

If you cannot see the contradiction here, than there is indeed no point in further arguing with you about the case on BKE

On July 01 2012 02:09 ShiaoPi wrote:


Excuse me but whre did you say that solstice is not a newb? Looked through your filter, found nothing.
Have you actually considered the possibility that he is in fact busy and so he dropped by with that post to say he is sorry in advance? Might be motivation to do just that, also check his other games, his opening is pretty similar to the games he has played and judging from that single post that he could be scum does not convince me.

I agree on your reasoning on Casual, he is on my radar as well.

I do not understand though what your "noobishness" has anything to do with the issue at hand. Nobody accused you of hiding behind noobishness so why bring it up? Until now your defense has been:
-I said solstice is not newb (no idea where that comes from...)
-I am not scum, since I made policy talk and two accusations.

Not strong to be honest. Everyone can make policytalk and the two accusation are kind of easy, solstice is gone for a while and casualman went retard/wtf-mode.

Right now I am tending on scum on you, so that will make my FoS into a vote: BroodkingEXE

On July 01 2012 05:57 ShiaoPi wrote:


of your secret plan to world domination, which involves random vote-dropping?

On July 01 2012 06:54 ShiaoPi wrote:


I know, I quoted that already and asked him, but he just does not answer...
For now I will just probably ignore him

On July 06 2012 01:51 Vivax wrote:
I'm still not sure if twelve is scum, but he is most likely of opposite alignment to BKE for keeping his focus on him the entire time.

And BKE is for sure of opposite alignment to katina, cause of this post:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=344514&currentpage=22#429

And maybe of opposite alignment to grush, who called BKE out once:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=344514&currentpage=26#515

NSH already suggested the version where twelve AND ET are townies, so we just have to detect scum skating by.

I suggest we start by lynching BKE, the other scum players are:

Mattchew, ShiaoPi, Maju/casualman/grush.

If you wonder about Mattchew: He just complained about the ET lynch when he had his vote ticked on him. Looks like he doesn't care much about the town agenda he tries to fake.

On July 06 2012 23:36 Mandalor wrote:


huh? what do you mean by town reads? People I view as town, people that turned out as town or people you think are town?
I suspected BKE, Katina, MattChew and Twelve to be scum. Might be missing someone.

Nothing has changed for Twelve in my eyes and I'll probably vote for him again.

On July 07 2012 10:06 Kurumi wrote:
Maybe I am just overreacting, but why he did not say that faster?

On July 08 2012 02:34 VisceraEyes wrote:
I can lynch casual instead of Katina. Just sayin. I'd also be down with lynching grush.

On July 08 2012 08:11 Katina wrote:
The deadline was push up two hours. So day ends in four hours... There's still time to change votes. I'm telling you, we need to lynch someone else.

On July 08 2012 08:24 BroodKingEXE wrote:
Im so confused, we know Kat's alignment so how am I supposed to legally vote?