EPTlol what, I just searched for it with strg-f
embarassing :-D
Bang Bang Mafia 2 - Page 8
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
lol what, I just searched for it with strg-f embarassing :-D | ||
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Meapak_Ziphh
United States6789 Posts
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
Ahm let's discuss the dayshooting: Should VTs shoot day1, to maximize their number of KP? | ||
GMarshal
United States22154 Posts
On June 11 2012 16:07 Meapak_Ziphh wrote: The king of smurfs is having some struggles with his identity As I said, I don't have time for games for a while, I'm not in this game. ^_^ And since I just noticed that the game has begun I will stop posting. Sorry Ace. Hit me with an obs qt if there is one. | ||
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
On June 11 2012 16:26 supersoft wrote: 4 scum, 4 blues? 1-2 GF means there is a 33% chance if we shoot into the non VT players to hit scum. 1/5 of all players are scum, so lets shoot all nonVTs day1? Or can only one VT shoot?! I kinda struggle with that setup right now... | ||
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deconduo
Ireland4122 Posts
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Dirkzor
Denmark1944 Posts
On June 11 2012 16:26 supersoft wrote: 4 scum, 4 blues? 1-2 GF means there is a 33% chance if we shoot into the non VT players to hit scum. 1/5 of all players are scum, so lets shoot all nonVTs day1? Shit you just don't read the OP do you? Where does it say the number of blues are 4? How do you know scum even have a GF? Or 2. (It does say that scum KP = 1 but that doesnt have to be a GF) We can only shoot 1 person per day phase. Whenever we shoot someone it goes to nightphase. Please go re read the ENTIRE thing... O_o | ||
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
Now i got it. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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gonzaw
Uruguay4911 Posts
If you think someone is scum and really want to shoot them...you can always shoot them later (if everybody follows this trail of thought we'll have normal days). Okay people, if we have a Miller, do they claim tonight or tomorrow? If they claim tonight, and we have a cop the cop won't check them, but if they don't claim tonight there' s a chance the cop will. If they claim tonight however, there's a chance scum will shoot them because of their "semi-confirmed" status (i.e scum never fake-claim Miller, so someone claiming Miller is 80% telling the truth). Oh wait, here's the plan: Miller, as soon as D1 starts, claim and you'll be the one in charge of shooting on D1 My plan goes like this: First of all, a Miller claim will avoid a cop checking him subsequent nights. Second, the Miller can shoot at day, therefore we can use him to choose the D1 shot. Third, like said before the Miller is "semi-confirmed" because in average scum never fake-claim Miller, and they will most likely not do it today. Why? Because then the Godfather will be the one forced to fake-claim Since the plan is for the Miller to shoot on D1, and the only scum that can do so is the GF, then only him can fake-claim Miller (if any other scum claims Miller, they'll get instantly caught once they refuse to shoot). So, let's imagine the GF fake-claims Miller, what then? Then there is another Miller or there isn't: 1) There is another Miller claim: Then there will be a counterclaim; and one of them will basically be confirmed scum (the chances of 2 Millers is EXTREMELY low). We then let them shoot each other. If the real Miller is faster, great he'll shoot the GF and we'll live happily ever after. If the GF is faster, well then we can kill the GF the next day/night. 2) There is no other Miller claim: In this case, although we may take him as "confirmed" for a while, he'll be in the spotlight for quite a while. Not only that, we can make a tracker track him at night, that way we can catch him as GF. After we get rid of the GF, then catching the remaining scum will be easy if we all claim if we have a gun (and can shoot) or not. Those that claim they have a gun take turns in shooting each day (to actually confirm they have a gun) into the group that claimed they didn't have a gun (of course shooting those we think are actually scum from that group, not shooting our freaking blues >_>). So, if the GF claims Miller there is a high chance he'll get fucked, therefore I don't think he will. Therefore I think we can trust a Miller claim tomorrow, and in the worst case we'll get a tracker on him at N2. So people, this is the plan I was thinking of, do you agree or not?: To Miller:
To Town:
To Tracker the next night:
If we don't have any Millers it will be apparent soon (before the 24 hours or so) since everybody will post but there will be no claim. If that happens, then after the 24 or so hours normal VTs are allowed to shoot. The purpose of this plan is:
Of course this means everybody would follow the plan (those that have a gun and those that don't), so we are guaranteed to have some D1 time to discuss So people, what do you think? Observation: Maybe the SK can fake-claim Miller, since he can shoot at Day. However, the SK is forced to shoot at night, therefore a tracker on him WILL catch him. Also, since a "confirmed" Miller is bad reputation for scum, scum are likely to shoot the Miller claim, so the chances of scum shooting the SK will increase, blowing his cover once he survives the hit (and no medic claims his save). Basically, the SK fake-claiming Miller will let us/scum catch him sooner or later, and doing so to get the D1 shot (why would he want the D1 shot?) and a little confirmed status for a while isn't worth it for him. Observation2: There is a chance we don't have a tracker. In which case we can't confirm the Miller. First of all, the point is that scum don't know if we have a tracker either, so by having the GF fake-claim Miller they risk we actually having one. Second, even if we don't have a tracker, the GF will still be in the spotlight, because town will assume the tracker tracked him and got a "good" result (i.e that he didn't visit anyone), but the "Miller" claim will keep being alive throughout the whole game. This will mean that one day or the other the Miller-fake-claiming-Godfather will fall; so again it's not very convenient for him to do so | ||
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marvellosity
United Kingdom36161 Posts
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On June 11 2012 17:25 gonzaw wrote: Please everybody don't make a L plan to shoot a townie 5 minutes into D1. If you think someone is scum and really want to shoot them...you can always shoot them later (if everybody follows this trail of thought we'll have normal days). Okay people, if we have a Miller, do they claim tonight or tomorrow? If they claim tonight, and we have a cop the cop won't check them, but if they don't claim tonight there' s a chance the cop will. If they claim tonight however, there's a chance scum will shoot them because of their "semi-confirmed" status (i.e scum never fake-claim Miller, so someone claiming Miller is 80% telling the truth). Oh wait, here's the plan: Miller, as soon as D1 starts, claim and you'll be the one in charge of shooting on D1 My plan goes like this: First of all, a Miller claim will avoid a cop checking him subsequent nights. Second, the Miller can shoot at day, therefore we can use him to choose the D1 shot. Third, like said before the Miller is "semi-confirmed" because in average scum never fake-claim Miller, and they will most likely not do it today. Why? Because then the Godfather will be the one forced to fake-claim Since the plan is for the Miller to shoot on D1, and the only scum that can do so is the GF, then only him can fake-claim Miller (if any other scum claims Miller, they'll get instantly caught once they refuse to shoot). So, let's imagine the GF fake-claims Miller, what then? Then there is another Miller or there isn't: 1) There is another Miller claim: Then there will be a counterclaim; and one of them will basically be confirmed scum (the chances of 2 Millers is EXTREMELY low). We then let them shoot each other. If the real Miller is faster, great he'll shoot the GF and we'll live happily ever after. If the GF is faster, well then we can kill the GF the next day/night. 2) There is no other Miller claim: In this case, although we may take him as "confirmed" for a while, he'll be in the spotlight for quite a while. Not only that, we can make a tracker track him at night, that way we can catch him as GF. After we get rid of the GF, then catching the remaining scum will be easy if we all claim if we have a gun (and can shoot) or not. Those that claim they have a gun take turns in shooting each day (to actually confirm they have a gun) into the group that claimed they didn't have a gun (of course shooting those we think are actually scum from that group, not shooting our freaking blues >_>). So, if the GF claims Miller there is a high chance he'll get fucked, therefore I don't think he will. Therefore I think we can trust a Miller claim tomorrow, and in the worst case we'll get a tracker on him at N2. So people, this is the plan I was thinking of, do you agree or not?: To Miller:
To Town:
To Tracker the next night:
If we don't have any Millers it will be apparent soon (before the 24 hours or so) since everybody will post but there will be no claim. If that happens, then after the 24 or so hours normal VTs are allowed to shoot. The purpose of this plan is:
Of course this means everybody would follow the plan (those that have a gun and those that don't), so we are guaranteed to have some D1 time to discuss So people, what do you think? Observation: Maybe the SK can fake-claim Miller, since he can shoot at Day. However, the SK is forced to shoot at night, therefore a tracker on him WILL catch him. Also, since a "confirmed" Miller is bad reputation for scum, scum are likely to shoot the Miller claim, so the chances of scum shooting the SK will increase, blowing his cover once he survives the hit (and no medic claims his save). Basically, the SK fake-claiming Miller will let us/scum catch him sooner or later, and doing so to get the D1 shot (why would he want the D1 shot?) and a little confirmed status for a while isn't worth it for him. Observation2: There is a chance we don't have a tracker. In which case we can't confirm the Miller. First of all, the point is that scum don't know if we have a tracker either, so by having the GF fake-claim Miller they risk we actually having one. Second, even if we don't have a tracker, the GF will still be in the spotlight, because town will assume the tracker tracked him and got a "good" result (i.e that he didn't visit anyone), but the "Miller" claim will keep being alive throughout the whole game. This will mean that one day or the other the Miller-fake-claiming-Godfather will fall; so again it's not very convenient for him to do so I like this one. I read it and didn't like it the first time because I thought millers don't have a gun because all there is in the OP is Miller - You are a Vanilla Towny that unfortunately seems so scummy you show up as SCUM to an investigation. and I guess this means they have the same powers as VTs :p I disagree with some things though: 1) DIsagree 1) There is another Miller claim: Then there will be a counterclaim; and one of them will basically be confirmed scum (the chances of 2 Millers is EXTREMELY low). We then let them shoot each other. If the real Miller is faster, great he'll shoot the GF and we'll live happily ever after. If the GF is faster, well then we can kill the GF the next day/night. I really don't know if this is true to begin with. I usually get into a game with millers assuming about 1/4 of all VTs are millers, so yeah I usually assume there's multiple millers but I don't know if that's the reality. I think it was in that one game I keep forgetting the number. I'd rather let them shoot into someone they consider to be scummy nevertheless. Yes it could be there's only 1 miller but I can't judge that so far and there's no reasonable to assume such a thing yet, unless of course you have more information than I do :p It's just the same thing we had in LII just reversed. I claimed VET in that game and while gonzaw pushed me for something he saw me in there the majority that followed him actually did it for other reasons. We had 2 veterans who both voted me because they said "it's impossible to have more than 1 vet in a 30 player game. I am a vet therefore Toad has to be mafia" which was just hands down retarded. 2) Disagree Observation2: There is a chance we don't have a tracker. In which case we can't confirm the Miller. First of all, the point is that scum don't know if we have a tracker either, so by having the GF fake-claim Miller they risk we actually having one. Second, even if we don't have a tracker, the GF will still be in the spotlight, because town will assume the tracker tracked him and got a "good" result (i.e that he didn't visit anyone), but the "Miller" claim will keep being alive throughout the whole game. This will mean that one day or the other the Miller-fake-claiming-Godfather will fall; so again it's not very convenient for him to do so Either I'm retarded and missing something because I only checked the OP a couple of secs ago but I can't see a tracker in the OP lol. + Show Spoiler [Roles] + Cop - Kinda sucks that you can't shoot during the day but someone has to uphold the law. At Night you may investigate a player and get a result of Innocent or Scum. You may be Sane, Insane or Paranoid. Doctor - Saving lives is your job! Shooting people is a no no! You can't day kill but you can protect someone at night. You can't protect the same player on consecutive nights. You can be Sane, Insane, Paranoid or Weak. Watcher - Looking out for people is what you do best. At night you can choose to watch a player and I'll tell you who visited them at night. You can't target yourself or the same player on consecutive nights. Miller - You are a Vanilla Towny that unfortunately seems so scummy you show up as SCUM to an investigation. Scum Godfather - You appear innocent to Alignment checks. You can also shoot during the day time by typing ##kill(##Kill): player in the thread. Scum Roleblocker - You can stop anyone from carrying out their night actions. Blocking a Vanilla Towny does not rob them of the ability to Day Kill. You can't kill during the day. You can not target the same player on consecutive nights. Vanilla Scum - At Night you may coordinate with your other allies and decide who to kill. You can't kill during the day. Serial Killer - Lone wolf. You must survive until the end of the game and eliminate both Town,Mafia and any other factions. At night you are bulletproof and can't be shot. You also show up as Innocent to role checks. You can kill at Night OR Kill during the day. You must kill at Night or the following Day or else I will mod kill you. However, we probably have a cop and in this setup the GF can't choose what he wants to show up as when being checked. This is important because usually the GF can choose what he returns on checks and therefore could choose to return as "Goon (mafia)" as well or whatever millers return as. This game they can't which means that a DT check on them WILL give us a green check meaning they're busted because there's no way a miller could produce a green check on beind DT'ed in a setup without a framer. So screw this tracker thing. Goon and RB can't fakeclaim. We just DT the guy and if he turns out green we shoot him because both GF and SK show up as green lol. So in general I like the plan. I just don't like the "shoot the counterclaimer" part because that's some speculation which isn't just unsupported right now but also in my opinion wrong. I don't think 2 millers in a 20 player game is unusualy. I'd actually say it's more likely than having just one miller lol. | ||
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supersoft
Germany3729 Posts
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
I can't see a drawback yet. | ||
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Dirkzor
Denmark1944 Posts
Roles: These are just some of the roles that may appear in the game. Also not every role you see appears in this form! Cop - Kinda sucks that you can't shoot during the day but someone has to uphold the law. At Night you may investigate a player and get a result of Innocent or Scum. You may be Sane, Insane or Paranoid | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On June 11 2012 20:29 Dirkzor wrote: I simply refuse to play if you guys don't read the OP. This is just over the top stupid... The first one: Does that mean there can be roles that are not in the OP? I thought that means "not every role in the OP has to be in the game" oO But yeah you're right that sounds a little weird... Second one: So what? A DT won't claim d2 but will instead keep on checking people to figure out his alignment, like every other DT. It's still a nice anti-GF measurement for this plan unless mafia somehow manages to shoot the cop (if he exists) really early on. | ||
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Dirkzor
Denmark1944 Posts
But I'll try again: Roles: These are just some of the roles that may appear in the game. Also not every role you see appears in this form! Bolded part means this is basicly a closed setup. Underlined means we can have a rolecop, scum doctor or whatever other role Ace can think of. About you whole DT strategy... On June 11 2012 19:28 Toadesstern wrote: However, we probably have a cop and in this setup the GF can't choose what he wants to show up as when being checked. This is important because usually the GF can choose what he returns on checks and therefore could choose to return as "Goon (mafia)" as well or whatever millers return as. This game they can't which means that a DT check on them WILL give us a green check meaning they're busted because there's no way a miller could produce a green check on beind DT'ed in a setup without a framer. So screw this tracker thing. Goon and RB can't fakeclaim. We just DT the guy and if he turns out green we shoot him because both GF and SK show up as green lol. You logic is just super flawed. 1) Yes a DT check can produce a green result. 2) Miller can also produce a green result 3) We don't know if scum have a framer 4) You just want to kill someone based on the first DT check that might not be correct? Outing the DT and giving scum the oppotunity to kill our DT? Seems to me you just want people to claim regardless. I've never found you to be this stupid so maybe its on purpose... | ||
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Toadesstern
Germany16350 Posts
On June 11 2012 20:49 Dirkzor wrote: Toad, please. Read every word in every sentence. Will make it easier for both of us... But I'll try again: Bolded part means this is basicly a closed setup. Underlined means we can have a rolecop, scum doctor or whatever other role Ace can think of. About you whole DT strategy... You logic is just super flawed. 1) Yes a DT check can produce a green result. 2) Miller can also produce a green result 3) We don't know if scum have a framer 4) You just want to kill someone based on the first DT check that might not be correct? Outing the DT and giving scum the oppotunity to kill our DT? Seems to me you just want people to claim regardless. I've never found you to be this stupid so maybe its on purpose... yeah I guess it's flawed. As mentioned I assumed the part was poorly worded and it means "not every role mentioned in here has to be in the game". If it's what you said it's obviously flawed because I assumed there's no framer (again because I thought it's only the roles in the OP, just as I said when I said there's no tracker). If we can't be sure if mafia have a framer we can't do this plan at all. And I never said 4). I said that the DT check gives the DT information nevertheless. I actually stated that the DT should not claim d2 at all because he's not sure about his alignment but will be later on and that way we still get a Mafia the moment the DT is sure about his alignment and by that time he can claim (that's usually after 3 to 4 checks?). But again, that's flawed because I thought we only have the roles in the OP. We can't do this if a framer is possible because we're painting a big, red cross above the guy who's shooting d1... | ||
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Zona
40426 Posts
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