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I've decided to change my stance on lynching lurkers. I was thinking it would be in towns favor to not lynch someone over lynching someone for being inactive, because there's not much to go off of. After reading everyone's response I'm convinced we should be looking for someone to lynch, but I do feel we should try to find a good reason to lynch someone before we target lurkers.
I'm must suspicious of MannerKiss right now, like most of you. I'm surprised he threw out that one line response to DoYouHas and then never came back to defend himself.
Another suspicion of mine is gumshoe. He's made a lot of posts so far, and most of them being him defending himself for making the poll in the beginning. From a scum perspective, this seems like a good idea. Opening with a useless poll gets your name out there while trying to make it seem like it had a purpose. From then you're able to clutter the thread with discussion over the useless poll, all the while falling back on being a new player as an excuse and some vague reasoning behind it(which might I add has changed several times).
Even if gumshoe is not scum, I can't see this as pro-town behavior.
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Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
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On February 18 2012 04:44 DoYouHas wrote:
Gumshoe, I would like it if you would start taking stances on players. You have cluttered the thread with talk about a useless poll (and yes it IS useless, it does not matter what it could have been). The only posts that I have found useful of yours are the two on MidnightGladius. I did not need a clarification on people's stances on lynching lurkers, I have read the thread. Your early list was largely contentless and just took up space in my opinion. I want you to start talking in specifics. Taking the wide view isn't a bad thing, you just need to bring up something that doesn't look obvious when you post like that.
I prefer lists, if you want something specific ask me, you got the useful information out of me because I was asked. So if you want something specific I'll oblige you otherwise I'll continue to take the wide view until a new issue comes up thats worth confronting directly.
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On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
Days are 48 hour cycles. We have at least ~26 hours before lynch deadlines.
No go on the no lynch. Mafia get a kill at night and we'll be stuck in day 1 all over again.
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On February 18 2012 05:25 slOosh wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
Days are 48 hour cycles. We have at least ~26 hours before lynch deadlines. No go on the no lynch. Mafia get a kill at night and we'll be stuck in day 1 all over again.
Ops, I forgot it's 48 hours, Q_Q.
No go indeed for the no lynch then. Not now at least.
With that said, as I stated before, I consider mannerkiss the best candidate, but it's a bit too early yet.
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Something else I want to address.
Many people are taking about lynching lurkers.
Lurkers aren't simply people who don't post. Everyone in the game has posted at least once since day started.
Lurkers are people who don't post anything substantial. People who post for the sake of looking like they are contributing.
So if you say you want to lynch lurkers, point out people who are posting fluff.
(As for MannerKiss just wait for his response. There are plenty of lurkers like him out there - go find them).
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On February 18 2012 04:19 DoYouHas wrote:
sl0osh, he overreacted badly to a perfectly fine way of calling him out. Everything in his exchange was just an extended version of OMGUS (attacking the person who attacked you only because he attacked you). 1. I think it is too easy to dismiss sl0osh's failure to see the reason behind ET's actions as his standard confirmation bias. Not acknowledging that ET's initial reference to him was purely to get him talking, not to frame him as mafia. 2. I also thought that whole post about ET's tone was just a big pot of confirmation bias.
1. This refers to you failing to see the reasons behind ET's pressuring of you. Your post about ET's attitude towards yourself and gumshoe is not based in that failing.
2. THIS refers to that post about attitude. A post which I thought was clearly founded in confirmation bias.
They were 2 opinions about 2 sections of your exchange with ET. You treating them both as if they referred to the same thing is wrong.
(You = sl0osh)
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On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
Definitley need to take the risk of a lurker lynch, there are three lurkers currently in the game, manner zell and one more I forget, theres a 75 percent chance one of them is mafia. A chance I think we need to take cause were one townie short. You brought up this proposal rather meekly, no authority no anger, I gotta say its a bit suspicius.
My current list of people I find suspicious
Steveling( too light, doesn't seem stressed at any point isn't very aggressive. Also has suggested a no lynch, terrible option for town in this game because as I said where one short.
Manner kiss(could just be a disillusioned player if so hes useless to us)
DimmuKlok. You say almost nothing for half a day and then show up suddenly and accuse a) the most obvious seeming runt in the litter (manner kiss) and b) the second most obvious seeming runt in the littler(me) without suggesting anything new whatsoever.
The mafia introducing a useless pole and then taking uneccecairy heat is an AWFUL idea, why would any mafia draw attention to themselves in a such a stupid way? A single investigation can easily ascertain wether or not their mafia, its way to risky for scum (im not even sure if it was a good idea for a townie to do... ok it wasn't a good idea for a townie period!)You also post for the first time in a while in relative tangent with Steveling who also hasn't posted in sometime... Both your posts are regarding lynching, one of you saying we should lynch lurkers another saying we shouldn't. Not so sure what i think of you but I definitely don't trust you.
Gladius. I'm not gonna vote for you, but you are on my radar, as I am on everyone else's.
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On February 18 2012 05:44 gumshoe wrote:
Definitley need to take the risk of a lurker lynch, there are three lurkers currently in the game, manner zell and one more I forget, theres a 75 percent chance one of them is mafia. A chance I think we need to take cause were one townie short.
Could you explain this further? I don't follow the 75% chance.
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On February 18 2012 05:44 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
Definitley need to take the risk of a lurker lynch, there are three lurkers currently in the game, manner zell and one more I forget, theres a 75 percent chance one of them is mafia. A chance I think we need to take cause were one townie short. You brought up this proposal rather meekly, no authority no anger, I gotta say its a bit suspicius. My current list of people I find suspicious Steveling( too light, doesn't seem stressed at any point isn't very aggressive. Also has suggested a no lynch, terrible option for town in this game because as I said where one short. Manner kiss(could just be a disillusioned player if so hes useless to us) DimmuKlok. You say almost nothing for half a day and then show up suddenly and accuse a) the most obvious seeming runt in the litter (manner kiss) and b) the second most obvious seeming runt in the littler(me) without suggesting anything new whatsoever. The mafia introducing a useless pole and then taking uneccecairy heat is an AWFUL idea, why would any mafia draw attention to themselves in a such a stupid way? A single investigation can easily ascertain wether or not their mafia, its way to risky for scum (im not even sure if it was a good idea for a townie to do... ok it wasn't a good idea for a townie period!)You also post for the first time in a while in relative tangent with Steveling who also hasn't posted in sometime... Both your posts are regarding lynching, one of you saying we should lynch lurkers another saying we shouldn't. Not so sure what i think of you but I definitely don't trust you. Gladius. I'm not gonna vote for you, but you are on my radar, as I am on everyone else's.
I'm very confused by you.
You mentioned at least 2 times that people should have a reason to suspect you are scum after you defended yourself for dear life all day yesterday. You also accuse people on not accusing you? What?
If you are scum your play is brilliant, lol.
I'll have an eye on you.
I'll check some filters and post something else later. Peace.
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gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain.
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+ Show Spoiler +On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
No reason for a no lynch yet big hoss, we've got plenty of time.
Ok brahs, now for some case building....
Here's a little fliter you all should check out. DimmuKlok
Only three posts so let's investigate.
Post #1
+ Show Spoiler +On February 17 2012 15:26 DimmuKlok wrote:
Hello everyone,
I just finished reading through the thread. I would first like to echo TKHawkins first post about lurking and availability when posting. I've been checking the thread nightly to see if the game had started, and tonight it did. I would not be surprised if the majority of people who haven't posted yet are unaware that the game has started.
Now a little bit about myself... This is my first mafia game, and I'm looking forward to it. I really like gumshoe's idea with the report. I'm sure it's already common place, but I recommend everyone make their own private version of it. It's not hard, and it makes it a lot easier to keep track of everyone. I don't have much to contribute yet when it comes to suspicions. It's still too early.
- 1st he goes ahead and defends those who had not posted yet, not a huge deal in and of itself but we will see how this is a trend in his postings.
- He then goes on to say that we should all have a list of lurkers. That's as scummy as making a list of lurkers but not actually doing the work to update it.....
Post #2
+ Show Spoiler +On February 17 2012 18:09 DimmuKlok wrote:Show nested quote +On February 17 2012 17:11 Janaan wrote:
3. Something I'm really concerned about right now is that there seems to be a few players who have posted since the game started, but only in the most fluffy of ways. Specifically, jaj22, DimmuKlok, trackd00r, MannerKiss, and to a lesser extent, Steveling and TKHawkins. I understand if they didn't have the time to do more than just check in at the start of the game, but still, for so many people to just put out one or two fairly useless posts is overall not a good pro-town atmosphere. We HAVE to find some way to get people involved and posting.
One player that concerns me right now is MannerKiss. First he gets called out to provide some decent content by DoYouHas, then he posts a single sentence acknowledging DoYouHas's post, but doesn't post any content. I'm getting slightly scummy vibes from his play right now. It's worth looking into as we go forward.
Alright, lets take a look. MannerKiss: I think it's unanimous that we would like to hear more from him. His first post was a simple one line introduction, and his second was his one line reply to DoYouHas, which was almost humorous in how suspicious it sounded. Jaj22: He was the one that initially started the conversation about lynching lurkers. I don't agree with his stance. I would rather not have a lynch than lynch a lurker on the first day. I'm not sure if his posts are much to be suspicious over, but worth keeping an eye on. Me: I don't see how someone could read my post and think it didn't have a pro-town atmosphere, but that's your opinion. Trackd00r: I found his first post to be useful and agreed with some of what he said. He never contributed again after that, but it's still pretty early. I don't see the anti-town atmosphere in his post.
- First he agrees that the person who voted one time should be suspicious.....How incredibly helpful....
- Then he goes on to say he would rather no lynch than lynch a lurker on the first day. As someone posted above, giving the mafia a free kill and leaving in someone who is adding nothing to the town and only creating more confusion is counter productive....
- Denies how someone could think his all fluff no substance post would be scummy at all.....
- Follows up with another fluff analysis of Track, saying nothing, making no stance, providing nothing.
Post #3
Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:19 DimmuKlok wrote:
I've decided to change my stance on lynching lurkers. I was thinking it would be in towns favor to not lynch someone over lynching someone for being inactive, because there's not much to go off of. After reading everyone's response I'm convinced we should be looking for someone to lynch, but I do feel we should try to find a good reason to lynch someone before we target lurkers.
I'm must suspicious of MannerKiss right now, like most of you. I'm surprised he threw out that one line response to DoYouHas and then never came back to defend himself.
Another suspicion of mine is gumshoe. He's made a lot of posts so far, and most of them being him defending himself for making the poll in the beginning. From a scum perspective, this seems like a good idea. Opening with a useless poll gets your name out there while trying to make it seem like it had a purpose. From then you're able to clutter the thread with discussion over the useless poll, all the while falling back on being a new player as an excuse and some vague reasoning behind it(which might I add has changed several times).
Even if gumshoe is not scum, I can't see this as pro-town behavior.
- Immediately retracts his old lynching policy. Even saying "After reading everyone's response I'm convinced we should be looking for someone to lynch, but I do feel we should try to find a good reason to lynch someone before we target lurkers."
- Announces that he is still suspicious of MannerKiss, in light of all the recent developments..... (that was sarcasm, of course you would still be suspicious.... he still hasn't posted).
- Jumps on the latest flavor of the thread, Gumshoe, and makes a vague, semi accusatory statement.
That, ladies and gentleman is what you call a lurker.... a real scummy looking lurker.....
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On February 18 2012 06:03 DoYouHas wrote:
gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain.
Well, I thought we were 4 hours from night. With our current cases, I just thought that we were gonna lose a towny.
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On February 18 2012 05:53 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:44 gumshoe wrote:
Definitley need to take the risk of a lurker lynch, there are three lurkers currently in the game, manner zell and one more I forget, theres a 75 percent chance one of them is mafia. A chance I think we need to take cause were one townie short.
Could you explain this further? I don't follow the 75% chance.
In a sample group of 4 random players in a 16 player game with 4 mafia its almost a 100 percent chance that one of the 4 in the random group is mafia, this is not a random group though, none of these 3 specific lurkers have contributed much making them suspeicius which increases the odds of them bieng mafia. Overall if we pick a lynch from of the three random lurkers there is statistically speaking a good chance that one of them will be mafia, because a) one in four players is probably mafia and b) there behaviour is suspicious. I only see three obvious lurkers therefore the odds are not 100 percent of one of them being mafia. There is a 60 percent chance rather(15 divided by 5 = 3 three is 20 percent of 15. So the odds of three random players being lurkers is twenty percent, but the odds of one of them being mafia is 60 percent exactly.
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On February 18 2012 06:14 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 06:03 DoYouHas wrote:
gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain. Well, I thought we were 4 hours from night. With our current cases, I just thought that we were gonna lose a towny.
See again you come off as so cuddly despite the fact Im accusing you ) : it makes me feel bad for suspecting your mafia but that behaviour is why i suspect you in the first place.
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On February 18 2012 06:15 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 06:14 Steveling wrote:On February 18 2012 06:03 DoYouHas wrote:
gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain. Well, I thought we were 4 hours from night. With our current cases, I just thought that we were gonna lose a towny. See again you come off as so cuddly despite the fact Im accusing you ) : it makes me feel bad for suspecting your mafia but that behaviour is why i suspect you in the first place.
Well don't know what to say to that. That's generally how I post or talk. lol
Imagine I'm the Sheth of Mafia. xP
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On February 18 2012 05:56 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:44 gumshoe wrote:On February 18 2012 05:20 Steveling wrote:
Ok, just woke up and caught on the action.
So, my view on the whole thing is that we should push for a no lynch day 1.
The reasoning: We are close to the night, very close actually and we have zero solid cases on anyone.
Yes mannerkiss's weird 1 liner is scummy, also both eche and sloosh became defensive too fast and yes there are some lurkers as well. Nothing we can make a strong case on.
But chanses are that we are probably gonna misslynch day1 with the current situation.
So the way I see it, we either push for a lurker lynch or a no lynch. And with a no lynch we promote more discussion without losing an unlucky towny, more discussion always benefits the town.
What do you guys think?
Definitley need to take the risk of a lurker lynch, there are three lurkers currently in the game, manner zell and one more I forget, theres a 75 percent chance one of them is mafia. A chance I think we need to take cause were one townie short. You brought up this proposal rather meekly, no authority no anger, I gotta say its a bit suspicius. My current list of people I find suspicious Steveling( too light, doesn't seem stressed at any point isn't very aggressive. Also has suggested a no lynch, terrible option for town in this game because as I said where one short. Manner kiss(could just be a disillusioned player if so hes useless to us) DimmuKlok. You say almost nothing for half a day and then show up suddenly and accuse a) the most obvious seeming runt in the litter (manner kiss) and b) the second most obvious seeming runt in the littler(me) without suggesting anything new whatsoever. The mafia introducing a useless pole and then taking uneccecairy heat is an AWFUL idea, why would any mafia draw attention to themselves in a such a stupid way? A single investigation can easily ascertain wether or not their mafia, its way to risky for scum (im not even sure if it was a good idea for a townie to do... ok it wasn't a good idea for a townie period!)You also post for the first time in a while in relative tangent with Steveling who also hasn't posted in sometime... Both your posts are regarding lynching, one of you saying we should lynch lurkers another saying we shouldn't. Not so sure what i think of you but I definitely don't trust you. Gladius. I'm not gonna vote for you, but you are on my radar, as I am on everyone else's. I'm very confused by you. You mentioned at least 2 times that people should have a reason to suspect you are scum after you defended yourself for dear life all day yesterday. You also accuse people on not accusing you? What? If you are scum your play is brilliant, lol. I'll have an eye on you. I'll check some filters and post something else later. Peace.
Well you'd be an idiot not to at least slightly accuse someone for such a dumb poll ) : that was part of the purpose of the poll. Also how is me defending myself for dear life any different from slush defending himself when he was called out by Ech? We defend ourselves, its what we do regardless of wether or not were town or mafia.
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On February 18 2012 05:34 DoYouHas wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 05:13 slOosh wrote:On February 18 2012 04:19 DoYouHas wrote:
sl0osh, he overreacted badly to a perfectly fine way of calling him out. Everything in his exchange was just an extended version of OMGUS (attacking the person who attacked you only because he attacked you). I think it is too easy to dismiss sl0osh's failure to see the reason behind ET's actions as his standard confirmation bias. Not acknowledging that ET's initial reference to him was purely to get him talking, not to frame him as mafia. I also thought that whole post about ET's tone was just a big pot of confirmation bias.
Contradiction? How is failure to see the reason behind ET's actions scummy? You are more logical than this. Sure you suffered a bit of confirmation bias on Simberto lynch in the prior game we played, but at least it started logical. 1. This refers to you failing to see the reasons behind ET's pressuring of you. Your post about ET's attitude towards yourself and gumshoe is not based in that failing. 2. THIS refers to that post about attitude. A post which I thought was clearly founded in confirmation bias. They were 2 opinions about 2 sections of your exchange with ET. You treating them both as if they referred to the same thing is wrong. (You = sl0osh)
(I fixed the chain quoting as leaving what I said out of the post is a skewed presentation of information)
What are you going on about?
1) I asked for the logic in behind lynching me because I allegedly failed to see the reasons behind ET's pressure on me.
Please answer the question.
2) Thank you for clarifying. But then are you seriously trying to lynch me on confirmation bias?
You lynch people for being illogical or pushing mafia agendas.
You don't lynch because they have confirmation bias, nor do you lynch them for their inability to understand other peoples actions.
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On February 18 2012 06:20 Steveling wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 06:15 gumshoe wrote:On February 18 2012 06:14 Steveling wrote:On February 18 2012 06:03 DoYouHas wrote:
gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain. Well, I thought we were 4 hours from night. With our current cases, I just thought that we were gonna lose a towny. See again you come off as so cuddly despite the fact Im accusing you ) : it makes me feel bad for suspecting your mafia but that behaviour is why i suspect you in the first place. Well don't know what to say to that. That's generally how I post or talk. lol Imagine I'm the Sheth of Mafia. xP
Ironically enough sheth plays a lot of tl mafia, and he's less cuddly then you'd expect. That said at one point he was suggesting that his own lynch was towns most viable move...
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On February 18 2012 06:22 gumshoe wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2012 06:20 Steveling wrote:On February 18 2012 06:15 gumshoe wrote:On February 18 2012 06:14 Steveling wrote:On February 18 2012 06:03 DoYouHas wrote:
gumshoe brings up a good point against Steveling when you consolidate gum's posts on him. Steveling initially said that lynching lurkers is our best scumhunting option so long as nobody looks very scummy by the end of the day. But then when he thought the day was ending he decided to push a no-lynch. Please explain. Well, I thought we were 4 hours from night. With our current cases, I just thought that we were gonna lose a towny. See again you come off as so cuddly despite the fact Im accusing you ) : it makes me feel bad for suspecting your mafia but that behaviour is why i suspect you in the first place. Well don't know what to say to that. That's generally how I post or talk. lol Imagine I'm the Sheth of Mafia. xP Ironically enough sheth plays a lot of tl mafia, and he's less cuddly then you'd expect. That said at one point he was suggesting that his own lynch was towns most viable move...
Could you stop posting so broadly and casually gumshoe? You are cluttering the thread and making it difficult to read the more serious posts.
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EPT
