EPTLord of the Rings Mafia
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Cyber_Cheese
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Cyber_Cheese
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I'm doc, is my heal wasted on him? | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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Activity: You must post in this thread five times per day/night cycle and vote every day while you are alive. If you fail to do so, you will be modkilled. To kick things off, Archon_Toilet seems rather untrustworthy, just look at that hideous underscore he chooses to have inside is name. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote: Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption. Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective. Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment. I'm not sure if you realise it or not but that plan sounds awfully anti-town. How do we guarantee that even those 1-3 people can pass the ring in the first place? And even if they can, how does that confirm anybody? In this game, only people with roles that relate to the ring should bother searching for it secretly, and if the ring is passed it will either be the fruits of their efforts or a complete accident. As for the effects of the ring, there is no real way to find out, the only people that know are the ring bearers and mentioning that you have it/explaining what it does is virtually ensuring you get killed overnight in the hopes that you can't pass it. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On September 17 2011 15:03 TranceStorm wrote: First, if the players in question cannot pass the ring, then the plan does not go into effect. A player only announces that they had the ring in the previous turn. If they can't pass it on, they stay silent and we are none the wiser. Second, given Radfield's argument that evil players probably don't have the mechanic to pass the ring (otherwise they would pass it amongst themselves), if we can get two successive passes, that would confirm at least one player. The danger of course is passing to a mafia player, but that probability initially is small. At any rate, I think it is pretty likely that the ring will worm into non-town hands (whether 3rd party or mafia) given that non-town players will constantly search and probe every turn. There's no way to comprehensively prevent them from getting the ring, therefore, why not get some benefit to it. Finally, another point that can be made is that the player who passes on the ring and reveals themselves can also reveal what the ring does. Given that every player already covets it, it would be nice to at least have that information. So basically you want people to say "I had the ring guys, I managed to pass it off, but I'm not saying to who" and maybe list it's effects? We can't be sure evil players can't pass the ring, and if the person who claimed to have got rid of it was telling the truth or not. There is way too much uncertainty, and I believe only a non-town party would be trying to push a bad plan to get the ring Unless you can come up with a really good reason you care so much about the ring bearer ##Vote TranceStorm | ||
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On September 18 2011 07:29 Erandorr wrote: Sup! O Hai! You've got a fair bit to catch up on yet. Keep in mind while catching up that the minimum is 5 posts per day/night. On wherebugsgo, I get the distinct impression he's just a townie who wanted to have the ring and decided acting as Smeagol and demanding the ring until people got bored of it was better than trying to defend himself actively. I'm willing to bet there is no posting restriction, in fact I think it was explicitly stated somewhere that there wasn't. That said, I'd be comfortable with a lynch on him on the off-chance he is telling the truth about being third party, purely because that seems to make him a safer bet than most others. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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Not really... I'd be playing more along the lines of: They took my precious etc. | ||
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On September 19 2011 01:16 jcarlsoniv wrote: Yeah navi, it was something I was going to bring up later on. Seems as if he's just trying to not take a stance and avoid offending anyone. Those who's votes are not on the main lynch candidates need to get them on the (at least) 3 main targets. The more scattered the votes are, the more beneficial for the scum. It looks like WBG, prpl, and jackal are the front runners. It worries me how quickly the votes for jackal piled up, although he was inactive until recently. So cyber, JeeJee, GGQ, drh, cir...could you put your votes in a place where they will be useful? Now that I think about it, we haven't ears for drh or radfield in a while. A majority is not required, I can place the vote where-ever I feel it is best used That said, here's lowdown of my opinions on everybody currently voted. I think WBG is currently someone we want to keep around till at least day 2. His latest post seems to be far and away better than all his other posts combined + Show Spoiler [I mean this one] + On September 18 2011 16:21 wherebugsgo wrote: I still don't have the ring! What a surprise. The following post is well-reasoned and should be listened to: As I said earlier and as Kitaman has nailed pretty well, we absolutely need to encourage the lurkers to participate. If they don't participate, or we let them get away with stupid shit (more on this later) then we are just hurting ourselves. We cannot let mafia blend in, and we need to identify when someone is trying to blend in, to identify them as scum. I will give you all two examples of this right now: Firstly, this guy is saying absolutely nothing with this entire post. He says there are so many people yelling at each other, that it's hard to read what's going on. He insinuates that there is a lot of confusion and noise, yet he adds to this by splitting the vote even further and throwing a shitty vote on a person who so far has not done anything scummy (as far as I can tell.) The worst part is that there are no specifics in this post. To clarify: wat so, he says there are "many plans and ideas, some good some bad." Way to go sherlock, either the plan is good or it's bad. You've really told us a lot there. What the fuck is that supposed to contribute? What's specifically good about these "good plans"? Who made them? What about the bad plans? The only thing he alludes to is that he thinks people like me and Trance are probably fine and just giving bad ideas. Well, the only idea I've pushed is giving me the ring. Trance is receiving votes, if Archon is scum then it totally makes sense for him to soft defend him here. And "all the guys" talking like us are fine. Whoa, so if someone makes a plan they're autoconfirmed town? Wtf? God this makes no sense whatsoever. Yeah hey guess what genius, you were lurking until now too, AFTER you were called out on your shitty posting record. I'm pretty sure you're just throwing a random vote out there and feigning analysis so you don't get a shitstorm for not posting and not contributing anything. This isn't even a real vote! Our last example is this: Clear lack of reading comprehension/hasn't read the thread. Granted, from what I saw in XLIV his town play is absolutely horrible so I'm not inclined to think he's scum. However, the type of logic he's using is precisely pro-mafia logic. I wouldn't put it past him to be scum, but for now we just need to push more posts out of our friend here Pyo. Specifically, the bolded part is his reason for voting me. In other words, he doesn't think I'm scum. He's voting me because he wants to get information. That's a terrible reason to want to lynch someone. You lynch someone primarily because you think they're scum. You get information NO MATTER WHO YOU LYNCH. This is an example of exactly what I want to see from him, as compared to all the 'ring lol' trolling and if he can keep it up he's realistically a valuable asset for town. Speaking of valuable assets for town, the DrH lynch: The reasoning didn't sound too great. At this point either way DrH was a good contributor, and while I would keep an eye on him, there are people that seem to pop-out as a much better choice for day 1. I'd rather keep him around for the chance to get this information of out him in following day(s). Note that the only person that was behind this was prplhz Prplhz: His analyses on doc weren't too bad compared to many of the posts in the game so far, at this point those analyses alone are the reason I want him around. I see potential, and in this regard he's in the same boat as WBG. + Show Spoiler [My reference] + On September 18 2011 06:15 prplhz wrote: wow what a 100th post i'm so blown away i want to vote for me too now i don't like drh or heist or wiggles but there are tons of people here who are worthy of scrutiny stuff like this, it's the wiggle room we want 'cause that's when people really have to talk about stuff, even if we're lynching a scum i think 51/49 is better than 100/0 and drh should probably think so too unless he's a crazyman i'm fine with wbg and cyriandor and syllogism, good questions and wbg is not worth the attention he's getting right now, let him troll around and then maybe a vig can shoot him at some point or whatever On September 18 2011 09:47 prplhz wrote: okay i don't like drh i'm reluctant to push a mafia forum legend on first day but then someone said that if you have a vibe you should just go for it voting greymist because he asked for ring on day1 .. asking for ring is pretty silly but the vote doesn't accomplish anything as i really doubt anybody will feel pressured by a couple of votes this early in the voting cycle with that bad of a reasonable as you say, wbh is bad-townie not scum. you don't waste a lynch on a dude because he's a bad townie, you threaten with vigihits or hope he gets mafia killed or his mom takes his internet away. as pressure it makes little sense as he was already posting his ass off. is he scum acting as bad townie or is he SK? anyway, you are saying that we should all vote for this guy because he's 3rd party, instead of lynching someone who might be scum just because we can't be sure? this is a terrible idea, you lynch scum and 3rd party is left until a vigilante shoots them or until you have a scumtell on them. and you can never be sure that someone is scum, it will always be analysis and gut feelings and you're not encouraging that right now. on the whole multiple candidates v all votes on single target, i'm pretty sure it's always better if there are multiple candidates and i can't believe you're actually trying to argue that that's not the case. your argument is that 100% votes on a target who is 100% scum is best, but you will never be 100% sure that someone is scum, is that what you want to wait around for? i really don't think you're trying to promote a good environment for scum hunting by saying that someone is a clown and noise. again, you'd rather just lynch wbg than trying to scumhunt and you want a guy who is 100% scum. well do you think we're gonna get that by just all voting for wbg and then calling it a day? scum wants 3rd party dead too i think, gollum wasn't exactly on sauron's side. all in all i think drh is playing pretty weird compared to what i have seen from other people who are supposedly good at this game and i think he is promoting agendas that aren't good for town and if he's that smart he'd know that. the guy is scummier than the other dudes, 'cause none of them were really that scummy after all. ##Vote: DoctorHelvetica Jackal: I hear he is usually killed off within the first couple of days regardless of faction, I swear it's the name or something, I'd like to see his opinions in following day(s) time, not as much as DrH, but still more than others. JeeJee voting for himself, I'd love to spite him and see him lynched in part because of his own vote, but I can't foresee that happening. Archon_Toilet: I'll quote myself here from the first post of the day, originally it was supposed to be a rather obvious joke On September 17 2011 08:07 Cyber_Cheese wrote: I'd like to call attention to To kick things off, Archon_Toilet seems rather untrustworthy, just look at that hideous underscore he chooses to have inside is name. I'm somehow saddened that he doesn't look any more trustworthy now, but at the moment I think he's a townie who didn't read the thread and panicked when he got voted. IGrok seems a little bit suspicious, but since I'm giving archon_toilet a break I guess I'll be doing the same here. TranceStorm: His plan is only good if townies a) choose to pass the ring, b) choose to mention that they did, and c) nobody lies about it So many questions get raised here though, by all sorts of things like the 'how do we confirm it reliably?', 'does a townie even have the ring?', but it really seems to boil down to convincing town to risk throwing the one true ring into scum hands. It's all risk and little to no reward, spruced up to sound like the greatest thing since sliced bread, hence my vote stands on him. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On September 19 2011 03:48 Pyo wrote: Jackal said "Lynch him OR give him the ring." It's pretty clear what Jackal meant and it wasn't what you claimed it to be. This post: is an example of why doing what WBG is doing is bad. People aren't reading the post to generate their own impressions, they read "analysis posts" and take the "analysis" at face value. That is how scum manipulate town into believing what they want you to... It's how chaoser got away with that bullshit DT claim in XLIV, for example. No I actually think he remembers it correctly, the and seems to be used to bring up both the courses of actions Jackal wanted to take, rather than connect them. Why would Jackal want to give WBG the most powerful item in the game AND want to kill him off? Wanting to do both of the extremes exclusively still seems like very bad play. However, I'm choosing to ignore this because of his meta for today for better or for worse. He's yet another person I want to see more of more than someone I don't think we should be keeping around, for now. | ||
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I collapse in my bed with a few hours to go, and out of nowhere someone who hadn't even been considered previously was lynched. Bad call on Errandor, I really didn't see that happening, and I guess I'm not the only one On September 19 2011 05:29 Navillus wrote: Okay why on earth do we have 2 people attempting to start new wagons with like 3 hours until lynch, we are not lynching supersoft or erandorr today and if you leave your votes there for the lynch you'll be my first targets come tomorrow. I did find something I consider interesting amongst all the posts On September 19 2011 10:46 Mr. Wiggles wrote: @Wherebugsgo: I don't think scum would be dumb enough to do that. If the point of the plan was to get the ring, do you really think they would have looked over that major detail? Based on the number of players, there should be maybe 5-6 mafia (maybe less, rough estimate), so it seems unlikely that none of them would catch it. As well, it seems unlikely that if it was a mafia ploy they would have had Jackal deliver the plan. Even if one could give away the ring during the day, it would draw a lot of attention to the person proposing it, due to certain short-comings. It makes more sense to get one of the lesser experienced mafia members to propose it, because heat being drawn to them isn't as bad, and it can more easily be passed off as not thinking it through enough. The rest of that quote isn't really relevant, but here is the list of people that voted on Errandor On September 19 2011 09:03 jcarlsoniv wrote: And the subsequent bandwagon happened VERY quickly. I'm more than willing to bet there are multiple scum on this list: Palmar Radfield Syllogism prplhz kitaman27 OriginalName Vain TranceStorm xtffc If we filter the list with the people that posted a plan to change the holder of the ring it leaves TranceStorm. I would have waited for day to point this out but I didn't want to risk it. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On September 19 2011 21:37 chaos13 wrote: Hey guys, sorry my activity level has been down, I've been pretty busy. Hopefully I'll be able to contribute more this week. I haven't had a chance to read the case(s) on Erandorr in much depth but whenever town flips as a lynch D1 there will be at least one scum on their wagon. Granted, this time around he was lynched with a very small percentage of votes so it's possible that they stayed away from it. Either way look at the vote lists of people who didn't get lynched and you'll find scum. Especially on WBG (assuming he is town or third party and not mafia himself) because that is an easy justification for mafia vote D1. He was being pretty much useless and this gives them a great excuse to vote for someone. Check out Dr.H, iGrok, and Jackal on that list. All three players should know better. Sorry I couldn't be around to do more than vote and leave again yesterday. I'll do my best to be more present in the future. It essentially boils down to Radcliff bringing him up and Errandor failing to defend anything, and about about 8 | ||
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On September 20 2011 01:54 wherebugsgo wrote: Thank god someone else noticed this. The whole point of me calling out Dr. H was to expose this contradiction. He said he had no scum reads, then said Erandor is probably scum and didn't vote him despite saying he would vote someone other than me once he actually had scum reads. Somewhere in there he magically goes from me bein third party to being scum solely because no one else thinks I am scum. I find it strange behaviour for sure, but consider this: Errandor is bandwagoned at the last minute. Errandor flips blue. WBG tries to cast suspicion on people who didn't last minute change their vote to Errandorr off him. Also of note is that in WBG's argument he conveniently forgets that his play style changed from trolling to serious. WBG wised up somewhere in between the first and second post here. That is why I'm not sold. I think either Radfield is mafia trying to save WBG and/or prphlz, or more likely mafia found it a convenient person to bandwagon to save WBG and/or prp after Radfield's argument came up. | ||
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On September 20 2011 02:50 syllogism wrote: Cyber_Cheese who do you think is scummy? Your activity has been very low and your only post that could be characterized as a contribution is a list post in which you don't really find anyone scummy, except sort of the person you are voting based on rather flimsy reasoning. I'd rather save all the convincing arguments until daytime where they will be useful, and I can throw my initial vote in alongside them. | ||
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On September 20 2011 04:23 wherebugsgo wrote: Was this post serious? Surprised no one caught it. No, it was an excuse to put it off because I don't actually have them written up. Since you want my thoughts, I'm going to give basic versions for now. My current plan is to write something up on TranceStorm come day 2, and possibly other people involved in swinging the vote to someone none of us would have considered at the time I last posted on day 1. I believe one of you/prphlz/DrH is scum, but I'm not sure which, and I'm leaning towards checking you first because you changed your vote the most, possibly looking for bandwagons, but the list of people that swung the vote seems more relevant to me. | ||
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On September 20 2011 04:43 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Why aren't they useful at night? As a townie, you want to get your reads out before the day time somehow, in case you get shot, but if you think they're very important or game-changing, right before the deadline, so that mafia can't react and change their hits to cause chaos or WIFOM. Waiting until day is a good way to get shot without letting your opinion be known, so I'm not sure why you aren't worried about that. Or maybe you aren't worried about being shot... Hmmm... No, it's because of timezones, I could easily have fallen asleep by the deadline. (7am) I work during the afternoon so being up now (4am) is common. | ||
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On September 20 2011 04:56 wherebugsgo wrote: IMO You get on the right track toward the end but it's bad to assume things. Think about the justifications for your assumptions and see if they're valid. What reason is there for assuming only one of us 3 could be scum? Could we all be scum? Could there be two of us as scum? Could we all NOT be scum? If you make an incorrect assumption and base the rest of your argument around it your argument will look okay, but it'll be really wrong. Mafia, in addition, will jump all over it and make you a target. Unless, ofc, you're scum, in which case I'm want to believe that you actually have no valid opinions. That was a summary of my current beliefs, it's not to say I'm not open to suggestion, and the relation to you three and the swung vote is something I plan on looking into further. Rest assured that you aren't really my primary focus at the moment WBG. I'm willing to chalk the multiple votes up to your huge amount of activity and the voting insecurities that come with Day 1, and you've been much more active than many of the people who swung the vote, added to the fact that you didn't end with a vote on Errandor. As an aside, it comes across that you feel the need to discredit everybody. I maybe looking at it the wrong way and be wrong about that, but either way, I'd like to remind you. One does not simply discredit into Mordor. + Show Spoiler + OH YEAH 37 COOL POINTS! | ||
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On September 20 2011 05:29 wherebugsgo wrote: Au contraire I believe I have pointed out that there are people in this town who have been posting fairly logically. Examples that come to mind are Radfield (though his read was wrong) sandroba, to some extent Syllogism, and jcarl. People who aren't making sense but probably town: Pyo, TranceStorm People who I think are scum: Dr. H, Jackal, Drazerk. Possibly a couple others as well but I will not reveal those names yet. The vast majority of the other players fall into some sort of null/fenceish category Yeah I just really wanted to be the first to use the Mordor line more than anything, it's not actually that accurate. It was a recent impression that I realised was wrong from your filter. hence all the looking at it wrong way buisness. On September 20 2011 05:30 wherebugsgo wrote: There's a specific reason for this. It's actually not terribly hard to figure out, either. Survival instinct, and I'd love to continue talking about it but it seems like it would sidetrack the scum hunt. What makes you think TraceStorm might be town? | ||
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On September 20 2011 05:50 wherebugsgo wrote: Trancestorm is town IMO because of the way he posts. He responds to a lot of things and it appears he puts in more genuine effort than most other players in this game. In addition his plan wrt to the ring was bad but it actually promoted discussion. After I pushed him a little and he posted more I saw less and less to suggest that he's scum. Is he for sure town? Certainly we don't know anything yet, but there are better focuses today. Also, bolded is wrong. Any town players reading this should ask why I would ask for the ring. If you can understand my behavior from my POV then you will see why I was concerned with the easy lynch wagon on me (and the players I found to be scummiest who had left their votes there) Well assuming does make an ass out of me, I figured nobody wants to die in mafia, and discrediting the person making the argument can be more effective than discrediting the argument. I agree that once you picked your game up you weren't a sensible a vote, and from your point of view I can understand an annoyance at the people who didn't decide to cut you a break after you did pick your game up. I'm not entirely sold on that making them necessarily scummy. There is one more question I have for you, what is your opinion on prphlz, the other person that was leading the vote before the swing? And for that matter, prphlz, what's your opinion on WBG? You both never voted on each other at any point yesterday, despite multiple vote changes. And finally I want to drag some of the other much less mentioned people who swung the vote forward, but one thing at a time. | ||
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On September 20 2011 17:27 Pyo wrote: man, I look away from the thread for about a couple hours and this crazy shit happens...anyway, what an incredibly scummy thing to say... Filtering a confirmed mafia scummy? The most dismissive DocH got was on TranceStorm here: On September 17 2011 15:19 DoctorHelvetica wrote: TranceStorm has a bad plan. Big deal, hopefully he can be made to see the problem with it. The main problem is that this game is not about confirming townies using mechanics we don't understand the goal is to find and catch scum. Wherebugsgo I don't know your metagame but here's what I see. 1. begging for the ring in every post 2. vague allusions to why you want it 3. voting for TranceStorm and FOSing him with no reasons. You're playing absolutely detrimental to town. This is not pro-town play, it is not how we catch scum. It's how shit gets stirred and people always let bad scum like this slide (coag in countless games) because they figure "oh no way scum would act so brashly or bad". ##Vote wherebugsgo At the very least, if you aren't scum, you are a stellar example of how town players should never act I'm preparing more evidence in a little while, really need to catch up on MLP mafia, but if you need more immediately filter me I've been FOS'ing him a bit ##Vote TranceStorm | ||
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On September 21 2011 01:36 syllogism wrote: I don't understand what's going on with this cipher. Assuming the intention isn't just to mislead, there is no reason to voluntarily post an anonymous message in code, especially something that short. Thus if we assume the source of the message is a townie, it would have to be some sort of information role result. If that is the case, obviously the role has to have a posting restriction that prohibits him from talking about it, or perhaps simply doesn't know how to solve it either. The message structure and word length indicates the message could say [player X] is [alignment]. However, the first word is 6 letters long and none of the names match if it's a substitution cipher. Similarly replacing the last four letters with TOWN or SCUM doesn't get you anywhere, as doesn't replacing the two letter word with 'is'. Yeah I've been toying around with it by shifting the alphabet up and down, it doesnt really help much... between one letter up and one down, you can make out is in the middle and wn on the end of the last word, but the rest is all jargon still so i doubt that's actually the methodology required if your correct in assuming its regards someones alignment, the first word is 6 letters long so I could see it being these: jackal palmar xtfftc jeejee archon cheese prphlz trance sandro? ciryan? I've been thinking it could be in reverse somehow too, ring is secure or something? It's really confusing though... | ||
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On September 21 2011 05:16 kitaman27 wrote: How do you know mafia all have safe claims? It's in the OP that scum all have safe claims isn't it? | ||
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On September 12 2011 03:19 Curu wrote: [b]This is a closed setup. No roles or numbers will be revealed. You may not quote your role PM. You may paraphrase it if you wish. Do not rely on flavor to win the game – all non-Town players have been provided with safeclaims. Flips are not hidden. | ||
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Now assuming you were the mafia, who would you assign to propose the pro-scum plan that may or may not go through? In the words of MrWiggles (notably deceased): On September 19 2011 10:46 Mr. Wiggles wrote: As well, it seems unlikely that if it was a mafia ploy they would have had Jackal deliver the plan. Even if one could give away the ring during the day, it would draw a lot of attention to the person proposing it, due to certain short-comings. It makes more sense to get one of the lesser experienced mafia members to propose it, because heat being drawn to them isn't as bad, and it can more easily be passed off as not thinking it through enough. Now, all this person really needs is a few quiet days while people slowly forget what he did day 1 if things go bad, so they *could* try to lurk until it all blew over. With that in mind, lets take a second look at TranceStorm's plan to confirm townies- On September 17 2011 14:36 TranceStorm wrote: Debating about who should get the ring and what each role can or cannot do at the moment is pointless at the current time. However, I do like one of the plans that was proposed by a few people: having the person who successfully passed on the ring claim themselves. This way, we can enable a 'chain' to be made - i.e. the first player can confirm the second player once the second player has passed on the ring themselves. This is all dependent on the assumption that evil players cannot pass the ring themselves which as Radfield pointed out, is probably a true assumption. Given this, however, this plan would probably only be effective for the first few 'passes' and perhaps near the end of the game when town circles become more clear. The risk after the first few days that the person holding the ring is killed, or has the ring stolen (which is a possible role according to the OP) makes the plan ineffective. Therefore, I think that such a plan should work for the first 2 or 3 days to confirm at least one or two people. Any thoughts or ideas about this? I haven't fully fleshed this out yet (i.e. the possibility of fake claims is strong), but its probably a better discussion than the arbitrary finger-pointing going on at the moment. This seemingly bad town plan has a ton of flaws. -Townies might not be able to further pass the ring, and therefore not safely claim after the ring was given to them. The ring is now stuck on someone who can't move it, when the previous towns person could have moved the ring if he sensed danger. -The difficulty of finding a new townie who the ring should be passed to. With every pass, the chance of the recipient being a scumbag increases. Self explanatory -Bad payoffs. A 'confirmed' townie won't be able to accomplish much. -The chance of scum lying to gain whatever town cred exsists. This admittedly could potentially force a counter claim, and get a scum lynched for one townie, but the chance of scum actually trying it is low. -The assumption seems horribly scummy, it helps pave the way for scum to confirm themselves. It also seems to rely on a town aligned role with the power to search for the ring, just in case the scum player decided not to even try to pass it. -The plan overall balances a low payoff with a rather low reward. After the plan is dismissed, Trance proceeds to act wishy-washy and brings up a case on anyone he believes might legitimately form a bandwagon, before deciding to join a pre-exsisting one. I don't have much to say about this part because I don't understand why all three major wagons were town, but I believe mafia have their reasons to want to flip both WBG and prphlz, and so they bandwagoned onto a convenient easy target in Errandor. For the sake of this point, I advise you read through his filter: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=264699&user=27938 What I do know, is that DocH (deceased) was willing to oversee his plan rather quickly- On September 17 2011 15:19 DoctorHelvetica wrote: TranceStorm has a bad plan. Big deal, hopefully he can be made to see the problem with it. The main problem is that this game is not about confirming townies using mechanics we don't understand the goal is to find and catch scum. If I'm not mistaken, that was among the most dismissive statements DocH said while he was alive. At the same time DocH was gaining town cred by helping to dismiss the plan after townies already had (Yet another benefit.) On September 17 2011 15:22 DoctorHelvetica wrote: We don't know anything about the ring. Passing it on to scum could have terrible consequences. If we knew exactly what the rings powers were and what powers each player had relating to it then we could maybe form some plan for its use but otherwise this discussion is pretty much off the table. In the lore of LOTR the one ring basically reflects the power of its holder. A simple hobbit like Frodo simply becomes invisible holding it. But a powerful wizard like Saruman or god forbid Sauron could use it to become basically invincible/mind control/etc. And I'm not sure the ring will have evolving powers (just speculating) but hopefully my points be simple to understand 1. We have no idea what the extent of the consequences would be if the one ring were to fall into the hands of an evil player. 2. We have no idea what the ring even does other than the player who holds it or maybe some other role has knowledge. 3. It is not worth risking getting the ring on the wrong side of the town simply to MAYBE confirm a few players. TranceStorm is Scum | ||
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On September 21 2011 05:51 TranceStorm wrote: @Cyber_Cheese You really have been tunneling me all game, so I will respond to some of your arguments. I made a bad plan, I get it. We've already established that. It was an idea I had and I asked for input from other people to improve the plan, instead, everyone decided to say the plan was a bad idea so I dropped it. Why are you focusing only on Dr. H's response to the plan? A dismissive response says absolutely nothing at all. For example, I am making a dismissive statement about your arguments; does that mean we are secretly cooperating with each other? There were many other responses saying that it was bad. That takes up a majority of your large post. Then you say that I jumped onto different bandwagons until I settled on the easy target of Errandor. Take a minute to think about that. If I were mafia, I would already know that prplhz was a townie and could keep my vote on him and pretend to be afk knowing that a townie would be lynched on day 1. After Errandor got lynched, I could stand around and shout "damn! I wasn't there to stop the lynch! Of course Errandor was innocent" (like many people did say). Moving from prplhz only increased the suspicion on me, something which a mafia would not do (which is why I don't suspect OriginalName either, since he moved in the same way that I did). The last time I let an anti-town plan slip, it was my first game in Cosmic Horror mafia, and I changed MrWiggles suggestion into a good one while siding against TheFerryman who called him out on it. I'm not making the same mistake twice. For that matter, if you were mafia, why did you kill or attempt to kill the other day 1 suspects? I'm iffy on that whole section of the game. On September 21 2011 05:56 TranceStorm wrote: You are selectively choosing quotes here. Look through my posts again. I rearticulate a point that I feel was valid against his criticism i.e. the idea that a person who has had the ring in the past should reveal its abilities. In fact, I act in the same way towards you and Cyber_Cheese as well agreeing with you when you articulate certain points while adding my own input. Simply because I responded to Dr. H does not mean we were working together. Until Dr. H posted with a negative light on your plan, you stuck by it and attempted to work on it, and then it was suddenly a thing to be left in the past. | ||
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On September 21 2011 06:29 TranceStorm wrote: First off, so is your argument that I intentionally posted a bad plan so that Dr. H would be in a good light? That seems to be a very infeasible explanation for posting a plan in the first place. It's because I had a genuine idea which I believed would work. Second, I am not aware at all of what happened in your previous games, but I will maintain that proposing ideas for the town to debate about is not an anti-town measure. Before I made my proposal there was absolutely no discussion about really important issues. People were merely speculating about other unimportant things (which mafia loves to feed as you said). Because I proposed a plan, there became more focus in the town's initiative (partly helped by WBG's antics). Mafia would be fine leaving the town in the discussions that existed before my plan came around. I obviously can't account for why the mafia decided to target the people they did last night, but I will maintain that my vote switch from prplhz to Errandor would not be a move made by someone with mafia motivations. And finally, I had revised the 'plan' after Dr. H's post - from the 'chain' idea to that of the 'reveal what the ring does' idea after multiple people expressed displeasure. It wasn't only Dr. H's reasoning that convinced me to give up the plan, it was the fact that I realized that no one was going to accept my logic afterwards. The first point I believe to be an unexpected side-effect that accidentally benefitted you. The second was merely to point out that these things do happen and that not every bad plan should be dismissed so easily. The voting and mafia's targeting seems too open to interpretation to be relied on here. What possible reasons would 'noone accept your logic afterwards' for? If no one likes an idea, it's because it was ill-thought through. My argument here is it required your scum buddy to post before you realised just how ill-thought through it was. | ||
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On September 21 2011 20:20 Palmar wrote: How is this even a discussion? Murder the shit out of iGrok. This post aroused some serious suspcions on Palmar when I read it, he wants to shutdown discussion on other possible scum candidates apparently. I took a look through his filter for some background, and subsequently lead me to believe he is scum. When prodded by Syllogism to provide some background, he returns with this: If bandwagoning is useful, then sure he's a great help. But in the interests of being fair, let's look more at his voting on IGrok: On September 20 2011 22:32 Palmar wrote: Erandorr worked because it was less bad a bandwagon than the others, which has now become apparent. DrH should really have been it, but I wasn't around to push them buttons. I never asked whom you have a town read on, giving that away would be incredibly stupid. I asked if you actually had a town read on someone, (the alternative being you don't have a town read on anyone). I was basically provoking you into start thinking about townies you can trust. But I know it's extremely hard to work with you're stubborn and have really bad reads. I just hope that you'll be able to figure out what to do if you actually are the ring bearer. And I hope our medics understand that you're a great target tonight too. In any case, it's time to lynch mafia. ##Vote iGrok Up until this point, his comments on IGrok were On September 20 2011 19:05 Palmar wrote: I don't like the smell of iGrok and Kita... On September 20 2011 21:59 Palmar wrote: iGrok's play is so much more passive and less assertive than it was in Ace's game. I'm thinking he's scummery. I'm gonna read the context of his posts better, but just a quick filter and you can see he's not really pushing any ideas, he's just being derp and making one-liners and lists. So he doesn't like IGroks smell, and the rest of his reasoning relies on meta. It doesn't get any better as time passes On September 21 2011 00:31 Palmar wrote: Radfield, I'm looking at iGrok. I haven't gotten overly scummy vibes from anyone else (apart from DrH, but he's dead). Syllogism is... dangerous, he's echoing what Sandroba and I are saying which makes sense if he's town, but he'd do it as scum anyway, because as soon as he disagrees on bad reasoning he's scum. He has made a few good calls though, but I expect him too, both as scum and town. So the rest are probably lurking, or they're people like Jackal whose alignment I simply can't deduce due to him having a meta of being useless/wrong enough as town that I can't figure him out as scum. Thing is, townies like posting more than mafia does, and I have quite a few good town reads. I'm actually reading now, so it'll pick up soon enough. We can only lynch one guy today anyway, and iGrok is a great candidate. Go compare his style this game to his style as town in Ace's game, I'm not talking about content or amount, I'm talking about attitude and context. Notice how everything he uses is purely meta? This in itself is fine, but if you want to use meta, you have to do more than simply mention the word meta. He doesn't prove a comparison of IGrok's current playstyle to this meta, nor does he choose to bring up anything related to IGrok's actions in the current game. I'm not sold on IGrok either, but if this counts as a reason to vote for someone and useful contribution, somethings wrong. ##Unvote ##Vote Palmar | ||
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On September 21 2011 21:27 prplhz wrote: @drazerk rofl so we should just accept anything from anybody, 'cause people have been acting shit all game long anyway? No, but we shouldn't use it as the only evidence we have. Wherebugsgo nearly died off his senseless Gollum claim, and DocH was pushing his lynch quite hard. I don't want to see that happen again and work as IGrok, Balrog and Palmar respectively. | ||
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On September 21 2011 21:40 syllogism wrote: You should probably retire from mafia if you really believe he could be a townie doing it for fun at this point. You don't even need his claim to see he isn't playing like a townie would You haven't made any convincing arguments in your filter, and you completely ignore the precident set by WBG. If you think IGrok is so obviously a scumbag, make a solid case against him, rather than blanket statements designed to offend anyone that disagrees. Aside from being angry he survived your attack for what ever reason, I'm not sure why your pushing to lynch IGrok. You claim to have survived a hit for whatever reason too, don't let it blind you from potentially better candidates. I would advise you to look at my argument against Palmar on the previous page, I would like to know your opinion on him. | ||
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On September 21 2011 22:54 prplhz wrote: @drazerk why would it be idiotic to shoot him? why do you even think anybody is gonna shoot someone who already survived a hit somehow? why do you want to keep a guy alive whose only defense is a claim, and who then magically survives a hit even though his claim said nothing about that ability? the guy needs to die and a lynch is the only way to go. although i'm interested in any case you think you can make against jack/pyo/rad. Let's not forget the other people that survived a hit and didn't claim at all so hastily. What do you think of Palmar? | ||
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On September 21 2011 23:00 prplhz wrote: what? palmar is in this game? why do you even want my opinion, i'm confirmed town. i'm not gonna scumslip or anything. maybe you should focus on people who actually might be scum. Because there may be better targets in the game then the one you choose to tunnel. Aside from surviving a shot, I haven't seen any cases made against him since his claim. That I would find enough in itself usually, but two other people already survived a hit today, the first of which (chaoser) promised to pay his debts. | ||
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On September 21 2011 23:08 Cyber_Cheese wrote: What, you thought confirmed town meant you could just bandwagon willy nilly? I should add to that. You are the sole person all townies can trust, and therefore when you say something we can be assured you don't have an ulterior motive. I don't want to see that wasted because you don't properly review all of the evidence and instead hop on a mafia fuelled bandwagon. | ||
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On September 21 2011 23:27 prplhz wrote: uhmn isn't it a bit weird that igrok claimed after 3 pressure votes. i mean, a lot of people got 3 votes during day1 and they didn't claim, i've actually never seen anyone claim after just 3 votes and we weren't that far into the day, a lot of things could have happened. i think igrok felt very guilty and thinks the case against him is pretty strong, because he is scum. and that made him claim some shit he just made up. also @drazerk but medics don't protect through day. thus he's either a veteran or he's somehow immune to ##cleave, no matter what then he lied about his role. also, why would any medic protect igrok, he is scummy as hell and he didn't contribute during day1 at all. The way I've been looking at it, his assassination target get mod-killed and that caused the claim. I'd be much more concerned about him surviving "##Cleave" if two other people hadn't survived attacks, including the person who activated the '##Cleave'. It's likely any medics heals do last for the day too, we should force a role claim from both chaoser and syllogism first before declaring that to not be a possibility in a closed setup. There are six options here for things I believe IGrok could be: 1) Mafia, somehow surviving the attack. 2) Town, trolling, maybe thinking it's a kinda cool claim. 3) Telling the truth, not actually sure how he survived. 4) He may have purposely left part of his role out for some reason, but I doubt it. 5) An immune third party, which means we won't be left with any information on other scum. 6) Town, blue role hiding under third party claim. Without more information on how the others survived too, it's hard to piece together anything. If you can make a case based off actions he made that aren't explained by his current claim, I am all ears, but so he seems like a convenient lynch for the mafia to take because they are relying on us to stop talking about the other targets in the meantime. See also. On September 21 2011 20:20 Palmar wrote: How is this even a discussion? Murder the shit out of iGrok. | ||
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On September 22 2011 00:28 chaoser wrote: ##vote iGrok Says he was filtering DrH's posts. Never did. Said he had analysis. He actually never did any. Says a medic protected him. One, why would any medic protect him? Two, Medics generally only protect in the night which is what makes day vigis so powerful. Says he's a third party that wants to help us but needs the ring. First of all, we don't know if that IS ACTUALLY your wincon, second of all you haven't been a help to town yet, why should we trust you to suddenly become helpful all of a sudden after you get the ring? You could just lurk the fuck out. This is protactinium all over again and this time I've learned my lesson. This is a dangerous post because it contains misinformation. I double checked IGrok's filter because of it to look for anything else and try and throw a vote on. He posted an analysis on Palmar in the very same post as his claim that relied on Palmar trying to confirm himself off DocH, so I'm tempted to believe you didn't read it. More than anything though, it would help us if you explained how you allegedly survived an attack, to compare and contrast to IGrok's reasoning. | ||
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On September 22 2011 00:51 syllogism wrote: He already took a hit and didn't die And so did you apparently. How? | ||
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Also I'm still looking for an answer from back when I asked your opinion on Palmar. | ||
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On September 22 2011 01:11 Palmar wrote: I'm not apathetic you derp, I'm highly enthusiastic about lynching iGrok! Even if in some crazy world his claim is true (I don't fucking believe it for a second), then he's a survivor and can as well ally with the mafia if they do well. Just kill him, I think he's not third party, I think he's scum, and should be deaded. Use some of that enthusiasm and respond to the case he made against you + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2011 19:31 iGrok wrote: Oh, ##vote: Palmar. For everything I said earlier. + Show Spoiler [For those of you who skipped my big post] + On September 18 2011 08:24 Palmar wrote: hey guys, I'm in a good mood so I'm not gonna ruin it by reading the thread. See you tomorrow This was his first post. Nothing scummy here, but it sets the mood for everything else he posts. Now, here's a list of his opinions since then. Radfield, WBG, Errandor prplhz DrH Radfield, himself, Sandroba, Pyo Pause. Next post. On September 20 2011 19:05 Palmar wrote: In any case, if you're lying, you should consider giving it away. btw, Sandroba is almost definitely town, but only if he takes his vote off me. I'm basically confirmed town from my exchanges with DrH, but only people like sandroba/syllo etc will see it. We need to keep an eye on syllo... yarly. chaoser is also very likely town. I don't like the smell of iGrok and Kita... Here, minimal interaction with DrH is played off as enough to auto-confirm him. This post sets off alarm bells in my head. Palmar contributed 4 posts before DrH died, 2 of which were "Herp I'm not reading the thread" (He was obviously reading the thread). Its his fourth post that interests me: "DrH is giving me really bad vibes." At the time, it looked like just another throwaway post. But post DrH's death, this post looks more like DrH new he was going to be modkilled and Palmar jumped out early to get a townie point. For the rest of the game, two things are going on. He puts faith in Radfield, and he continues to stress Sandroba town. (yes theres other shit but those're the important parts) Palmar already feels scummy. So lets continue on that assumption, and introduce possibilities. 1)Radfield and Sandroba are both town. If this is true, then Palmar is trying to gain town cred when they flip. With sandroba acting scummy and a possible lynch, and Radfield a good mafia target, thats two points for him. Fits with calling DrH scum. 2)Radfield is town, Sandroba is scum. This is using Radfield's town cred to make Sandroba look better. Even those who don't trust Palmar will subliminally put them on closer levels. If sandroba didn't look so damn scummy, it might work. 3)Radfield is scum, Sandroba is town. I just... don't see this as possible. 4)Both are scum. I don't know what this would mean actually And while your at it, care to answer my questions about you? + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2011 21:10 Cyber_Cheese wrote: This post aroused some serious suspcions on Palmar when I read it, he wants to shutdown discussion on other possible scum candidates apparently. I took a look through his filter for some background, and subsequently lead me to believe he is scum. When prodded by Syllogism to provide some background, he returns with this: If bandwagoning is useful, then sure he's a great help. But in the interests of being fair, let's look more at his voting on IGrok: Up until this point, his comments on IGrok were So he doesn't like IGroks smell, and the rest of his reasoning relies on meta. It doesn't get any better as time passes Notice how everything he uses is purely meta? This in itself is fine, but if you want to use meta, you have to do more than simply mention the word meta. He doesn't prove a comparison of IGrok's current playstyle to this meta, nor does he choose to bring up anything related to IGrok's actions in the current game. I'm not sold on IGrok either, but if this counts as a reason to vote for someone and useful contribution, somethings wrong. ##Unvote ##Vote Palmar I feel like this whole case on iGrok is just mafia leading the lynch, because aside from his apparently senseless claim there isn't much on him. He could have just done what Palmar is doing right now and ignored anything that put him in a negative light, but he chose to come forward with his role, and now I believe the mafia are using the role claim to blind town from the questions we raise on them, the most notable of which being iGroks argument against Palmar attached to his role claim. | ||
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On September 22 2011 01:30 raynpelikoneet wrote: I would be actually more interested finding mafia than a 3rd party, but as I see it we really have no choise this point but lynch iGrok. Or do we? Vote for whoever you feel to be the most deserving of a lynch. This is not a majority required game, a no-lynch won't occur. | ||
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On September 22 2011 02:25 Palmar wrote: no you're not prplhz, and I agree with you. I'm not going to respond to a case made by scum Cyber, sorry. I can answer some of your questions though, because given the last game I played with you, you were dumb enough to believe shit like "mafia shoots people who are obviously town, but wrong" and then voting for obvious townies. some things. a) it's not bandwagoning when I'm the first person to vote him b) discuss other people all you want, but not lynching iGrok would be nothing sort of stupid right now. c) I always scumhunt on meta only. Call me bad for it, but I'm actually very effective at finding scum. I'm a bit of a dick so I'm less effective at convincing town. But yeah, iGrok claiming is weird and unbelievable. So can you provide the meta your using with comparison or not? | ||
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On September 22 2011 02:31 Palmar wrote: Stop giving bad advice. If you have a good case, make it. If it doesn't take off, take a stance towards the other cases. If you think one of the cases is not terrible, vote for that, because townies voting random wagons that aren't working gives mafia statistically more sway in the vote. Your full of it. The mafia only gain more sway only if they decide it's safer to have all their votes in one place where it's easy to link them all. People don't have to vote for a leading candidate, and really shouldn't unless they feel that person is the most scummy. We saw your methodology fail Day 1. People didn't like the options yesterday and were too easily swayed into a third 'major' target in Errandor because they felt they had to go with a major lynch. | ||
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On September 22 2011 03:05 Archon_Toilet wrote: igrok is a strange one. All the reason I wanted him killed make sense now that he has claim survivor role. He has however either left out crucial mechanic or lied about his role now that syllo try to kill him and he survived. I would be ok with lynching him still if nothing else come up, better lynch third party than a townie. I am dropping jcarlsoniv for now that case was going nowhere. I feel drazerk has kind of disappeared and isn't getting enough attention. He has very bad voting history, strange interaction with the only confirm mafioso and majority of his post are very short and uninformative. Do you have an opinion on Palmar? | ||
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On September 22 2011 03:30 syllogism wrote: Why would you protect igrok? Even for you that would be unbelievably stupid Says the person who chose to day vig him the day he revealed. You should have waited for the next day at least, such that any medics could change target If there was a medic on iGrok, this raises more questions on the other two that 'survived hits' | ||
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On September 22 2011 03:37 syllogism wrote: You've already repeatedly established that you are really daft, so I'm not even going to bother explaining the obvious to you We can use iGrok's one shot kill to our advantage. I'm not about to hang him for offering us that instead of saving it for himself. | ||
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On September 22 2011 03:40 syllogism wrote: Drazerk and now please slowly explain what you protecting igrok says about his alignment I can't speak for him, but iIt's not about his alignment, it's about the alignment of the people pushing his lynch that I care about. | ||
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On September 22 2011 04:17 chaoser wrote: Yeah it's WIFOM but not all WIFOM is the same. Everything in the game is technically WIFOM, even someone pushing intensely for a mafia's lynch. This one literally makes no sense. Agreed, I don't think chaoser and iGrok are part of a scum team together. If he planned to bus his teammate, he would have kept his vote there. On September 22 2011 04:18 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yeah, he wins with mafia TOO, so why would mafia kill waste a KP on him over townie? He can pick his side and he sure will pick a side that suits him best. Also no townie can confirm 100% that iGrok actually isn't mafia. Also this. Something stinks about iGrok's claim for sure. ##Vote iGrok iGrok i still would like to hear your response, why do you find sandroba scummy? If we use his ability and hit a scum, it puts us in a very advantageous position. Mafia might kill him in the hopes that he doesn't choose to use his kill. | ||
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On September 22 2011 04:26 raynpelikoneet wrote: Can you confirm 100% iGrok is not mafia? Can you confirm 100% anyone is not mafia? The question you want to be asking is "Can you attest that the chances of X being mafia are higher than the chances of Y being mafia?" If Y was iGrok, I would say yes for the following current candidates -Palmar -TranceStorm -I'm undecided on Jackal and pyo | ||
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On September 22 2011 04:32 raynpelikoneet wrote: Yeah, sorry about that. I meant to say: What makes you and Cyber_Cheese think iGrok would ally town over mafia? Town is the majority, his kill would end the game faster if it were to hit a mafia, and that brings his victory closer as well as ours. | ||
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On September 22 2011 04:40 supersoft wrote: That's wrong. We are the majority, but mafia has a much higher killpotential. They only lost DrH. We lost many more people. Right now, the scumteam is in an advanteogus position. Only because we seem to be concerning ourselves with the third parties, don't forget the scum kp usually goes down as they die, and we can try and find one today to kill. If iGrok's kill isn't on the person we want it on, we lynch him tomorrow and he loses. We don't have to hand over the ring and seal the deal he proposed, he's going to value his survival and eventual victory more than he will value the spite of wasting his kp on one of us. | ||
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On September 22 2011 04:37 raynpelikoneet wrote: Or then he can wait to the late game and see which side is more powerful. Right now mafia is doing far better then town. And town still can't be sure he is not mafia, only mafia knows that. I'm not sure about you, but that applies to everyone in the game for me. | ||
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On September 22 2011 06:04 prplhz wrote: i'm inclined to believe all this because of how shitty igrok has played it's like he doesn't want to put in any effort at all so he just posts one liners and when his win con is met he tries to ally with town .. it's like a great progamer once put it "it's funny, you won without doing a single thing" i like chaoser for lynch how about that? Make a convincing write-up on him and I'll consider it. I'm not a fan of a new lynch target with a couple of hours to go, but it was possible on Errandor so... | ||
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Here is the only post he ever made a significant response to, followed by said response: On September 22 2011 01:46 Cyber_Cheese wrote: Use some of that enthusiasm and respond to the case he made against you + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2011 19:31 iGrok wrote: Oh, ##vote: Palmar. For everything I said earlier. + Show Spoiler [For those of you who skipped my big post] + On September 18 2011 08:24 Palmar wrote: hey guys, I'm in a good mood so I'm not gonna ruin it by reading the thread. See you tomorrow This was his first post. Nothing scummy here, but it sets the mood for everything else he posts. Now, here's a list of his opinions since then. Radfield, WBG, Errandor prplhz DrH Radfield, himself, Sandroba, Pyo Pause. Next post. On September 20 2011 19:05 Palmar wrote: In any case, if you're lying, you should consider giving it away. btw, Sandroba is almost definitely town, but only if he takes his vote off me. I'm basically confirmed town from my exchanges with DrH, but only people like sandroba/syllo etc will see it. We need to keep an eye on syllo... yarly. chaoser is also very likely town. I don't like the smell of iGrok and Kita... Here, minimal interaction with DrH is played off as enough to auto-confirm him. This post sets off alarm bells in my head. Palmar contributed 4 posts before DrH died, 2 of which were "Herp I'm not reading the thread" (He was obviously reading the thread). Its his fourth post that interests me: "DrH is giving me really bad vibes." At the time, it looked like just another throwaway post. But post DrH's death, this post looks more like DrH new he was going to be modkilled and Palmar jumped out early to get a townie point. For the rest of the game, two things are going on. He puts faith in Radfield, and he continues to stress Sandroba town. (yes theres other shit but those're the important parts) Palmar already feels scummy. So lets continue on that assumption, and introduce possibilities. 1)Radfield and Sandroba are both town. If this is true, then Palmar is trying to gain town cred when they flip. With sandroba acting scummy and a possible lynch, and Radfield a good mafia target, thats two points for him. Fits with calling DrH scum. 2)Radfield is town, Sandroba is scum. This is using Radfield's town cred to make Sandroba look better. Even those who don't trust Palmar will subliminally put them on closer levels. If sandroba didn't look so damn scummy, it might work. 3)Radfield is scum, Sandroba is town. I just... don't see this as possible. 4)Both are scum. I don't know what this would mean actually And while your at it, care to answer my questions about you? + Show Spoiler + On September 21 2011 21:10 Cyber_Cheese wrote: This post aroused some serious suspcions on Palmar when I read it, he wants to shutdown discussion on other possible scum candidates apparently. I took a look through his filter for some background, and subsequently lead me to believe he is scum. When prodded by Syllogism to provide some background, he returns with this: If bandwagoning is useful, then sure he's a great help. But in the interests of being fair, let's look more at his voting on IGrok: Up until this point, his comments on IGrok were So he doesn't like IGroks smell, and the rest of his reasoning relies on meta. It doesn't get any better as time passes Notice how everything he uses is purely meta? This in itself is fine, but if you want to use meta, you have to do more than simply mention the word meta. He doesn't prove a comparison of IGrok's current playstyle to this meta, nor does he choose to bring up anything related to IGrok's actions in the current game. I'm not sold on IGrok either, but if this counts as a reason to vote for someone and useful contribution, somethings wrong. ##Unvote ##Vote Palmar I feel like this whole case on iGrok is just mafia leading the lynch, because aside from his apparently senseless claim there isn't much on him. He could have just done what Palmar is doing right now and ignored anything that put him in a negative light, but he chose to come forward with his role, and now I believe the mafia are using the role claim to blind town from the questions we raise on them, the most notable of which being iGroks argument against Palmar attached to his role claim. My replies are underlined, things I consider important are bolded On September 22 2011 02:25 Palmar wrote: no you're not prplhz, and I agree with you. I'm not going to respond to a case made by scum Cyber, sorry. I can answer some of your questions though, because given the last game I played with you, you were dumb enough to believe shit like "mafia shoots people who are obviously town, but wrong" and then voting for obvious townies. some things. a) it's not bandwagoning when I'm the first person to vote him He was under suspicion from yesterday. You did not provide any arguments outside of meta that you couldn't contrast for us. b) discuss other people all you want, but not lynching iGrok would be nothing sort of stupid right now. c) I always scumhunt on meta only. Call me bad for it, but I'm actually very effective at finding scum. I'm a bit of a dick so I'm less effective at convincing town. I ignore cases other people bring up just in case people act the same as they did in previous games? But yeah, iGrok claiming is weird and unbelievable. Breaking down that reply leaves: On September 22 2011 04:04 Palmar wrote: well you're right, he does win with mafia  So, let me sum this shit up. iGrok claims 3rd party role that wins with mafia. We have Cyber_cheese defending him like the baddie he is, could be town/could be mafia So if you aren't sure I'm scum why don't you reply to all my points instead of picking and choosing? we have chaoser telling us to let mafia deal with him... what the hell? mafia would not shoot him in a million years. mafia. and we have Drazerk claiming medic to save 3rd party (what the shit?) because he's sure mafia will go after him.... mafia. can't be this terrible. This is hilarious. On September 22 2011 02:49 Palmar wrote: I already stated it... day 1 of some mafia game by Ace. It's really not relevant anymore since he claimed an anti town role. Then he claimed a medic save (no medic in their right mind would save him at that point). So what exactly are you voting him on if this meta is inaccurate? | ||
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On September 22 2011 06:46 GreYMisT wrote: My vote will remain on Jackal. Radfield how do you recommend we direct IGrok's target? On September 22 2011 06:52 Drazerk wrote: If we have a vigi he should be aiming his gun at palmar tonight. It's best we consolidate onto jackal for today especially with how little time we have left I'm not sure that consolidating on Jackal is a good idea, but I think we found a target. | ||
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On September 22 2011 06:51 sandroba wrote: Man here is the deal. Let's assume igrok is telling the truth. We don't lynch him and we tell him to shoot X person tonight. Obviously if that person is mafia he will be roleblocked. If the person is town they will either let the shot go through or roleblock him and create a fucking mess and possibly waste more lynches. He can withold his shot indefinitely and claim rb. He can claim he found saruman at any time and possibly make us mislynch. We can't deal with him later in the game close to lylo. So even if he is actually telling the truth I don't see how we can trust this and trust he won't do pro-mafia actions. There is currently 7 townies and 1 mafia dead, so I know who I would side with if I was what he claims to be. Mafia is never going to get rid of him for us. We can either lynch him now or have a copy of this day at a later date, so I don't think we have much of a choice besides lynching him now. It's an unstoppable kill, I imagine RB won't stop it. | ||
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On September 22 2011 07:16 prplhz wrote: hey TranceStorm why are you ghost voting on the bandwagon and why are you always one of the last guys to jump on the bandwagon? I think you missed this post, he will need to answer the second half himself though. On September 22 2011 06:51 TranceStorm wrote: Both Jackal and Palmar are really really similar in my eyes. Both of them post a ton of one-liners and haven't given really substantive analysis at all this game. Both of them always seem to do that in all of their games. However, Jackal hasn't voiced an opinion at all on the current candidates but continues to jump around calling everyone scum. My vote will be going to Jackal right now. | ||
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Why did so many people wait for Radfield's opinion? Surely your all capable of having one for yourselves. I am currently wondering how this accusation weighs in: I am also thinking that night might be the perfect time to work on the cipher, since throwing around things like the one above can make you a priority target. On iGrok's kill; It occurs to me that every day we don't use it is a day that mafia have a reason to attack him on, whether this is a worthy trade-off for waiting I am not sure, I'd much prefer to use it but I can see value in saving it and it's probably worthy of debate. Giving him the ring for night immunity to absorb more hits I played around with in my head and is stupid. | ||
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On September 22 2011 19:10 supersoft wrote: yes well, sorry for not voting, i was so tired and i slept in. i didnt want to vote for jackal. therefore i tried to find a better target. palmar what do you think about radfield. i think he controlled the town day1/2 and lead us nowhere. jackal really was a bad lynch. lynching him this early in the game when he had no time to do something and scum had no time to shoot him isn't optimal. When presented with the choice, he chose jackal for whatever reason,and then all those people figured they could follow his lead. While you should remember that Jackal didn't look innocent, the case was better on Palmar than it was on Jackal, I suspect him and/or several of the people that moved to Jackal are scum. These people were on both Errandor and Jackal's wagons at days end, and in my opinion are therefore people we should be wary of: -Radfield -kitaman27 -OriginalName -TranceStorm -Drazerk | ||
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On September 22 2011 21:04 prplhz wrote: @palmar how the hell is drazerk pushing scum agenda? if he is pushing scum agenda then igrok is clearly scum, why doesn't he appear on your list? because he's the one doing the kill? If we're voting on the NK or at least making cases for it, I'm going with Palmar for reasons that appear in my filter. | ||
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On September 22 2011 21:10 prplhz wrote: @cyber_cheese i don't understand that answer. iGrok isn't about to use his one shot power to kill himself... | ||
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On September 23 2011 00:49 chaoser wrote: Because you just called me a dumbass. So I want to know WHY I'm a dumbass. Just saying I'm a dumbass doesn't make me understand the situation. I'm not going to read you calling me a dumbass and go: "OHHHHH so THAT'S why my thinking was wrong, I'm just a fucking dumbass. I guess I'll try to be less of a dumbass and then I can see what the fuck Palmer is talking about." So why am I a dumbass palmer? He's been using OMGUS to dispel anything he feels like contending while never providing reasoning to the contrary, and it's part of the reason I'm sure he's scum. | ||
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On September 23 2011 02:19 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why do you think syllo as a day vigi has some "extra powers on top"? He claimed to survive a hit too, and never did explain how, but acted like he knew. Check his filter. | ||
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On September 23 2011 05:11 kitaman27 wrote: I HAVE 15 NIGHT ACTIONS! *evil laugh* There's your missing majority problem right there then mig | ||
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On September 23 2011 06:00 prplhz wrote: so there are hobbits in this game?! interesting I think he was trolling. Hobbits wouldn't really fit in with the lore... | ||
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##Vote Palmar | ||
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On September 23 2011 08:29 Drazerk wrote: I came up with three possibilities 1. That is a translated version of the day 1. ( DT scans sends message then someone else translates?) 2. Mafia have left this to try and trick us. 3. Curu likes giving us scum? 1 and 2 I could foresee happening, The OP specifically states there are no clues 4) The ring has something to do with it? If it changed hands and a new person made the claim. And I wouldn't put any faith into this last one, but it crossed my mind so I should probably give it mention. 5) A dt can do it, used themselves day 2 hence the encoding then and not now. | ||
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On September 23 2011 09:09 TranceStorm wrote: Hmm, Radfield's flip has tipped me off to a event I found quite curious at the time. I raised a case against supersoft here in which I accused him of using many many excuses to cover up his lack of activity (although he did get to work in the German Parliament - congrats btw). Radfield responded with this post here - saying that supersoft would be away for the time being. What was curious was that Radfield didn't spend any time at any of the accusations on the periphery players, but chose to respond specifically to my accusation. Whats also curious was that supersoft never explicitly said that he would be away until Wednesday - he said that he was merely working in Berlin until Wednesday (and showed that he could still communicate from his hotel). Maybe I'm reading too much into this, but perhaps Radfield slipped here picking up on something he read from the mafia QT? Anyways, supersoft has done nothing to alleviate my suspicions with his current activity so I will continue to view him as mafia. I'll join the rest of your discussions in just a minute. I'm not sure they are scum buddies, I'd assumed it was an excuse to lurk until wednesday too, it just kinda give that vibe with the whole- "However, because I am not on the scumteam, noone can provide me with information about what's going on. Therefore I have to read the whole thread with my iphone. GG" section. | ||
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On September 23 2011 23:06 kitaman27 wrote: lol wrong answer So this means you would have had to kill prp/ciryandor on day one. Since I know you're going to claim you thought they were scum too, guess what, I have another quote for you: Sandroba posted during night one that prp/ciryandor confirmed eachother as town. That means you would have known they were town, when you shot them. The only reason you would kill them was if you were after the ring. Tough luck. Don't forget that on night 1 we still thought prplhz was worth a lynch. The only reason we think he's town now is because he was attacked and ciryandor's death confirmed him. | ||
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Unless someone counter claims him, he could be a vig. Ciryandor and prplhz can't just 100% confirm each other. What would a sk gain from attacking a top suspect on the votes? | ||
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On September 23 2011 23:29 kitaman27 wrote: At your earliest convenience of course. Wouldn't want a typo in your fake claim. All non-town were provided with a safe claim, I don't understand what this would achieve. | ||
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Learning his exact capabilites so you can rb him? | ||
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On September 24 2011 23:31 Palmar wrote: don't take orders from scum chaoser! Oh the irony | ||
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Go back and look at the claims of chaoser and igrok, if we must kill a neutral party, chaoser is the optimal choice. However, keeping the third party for now might be better because any serial killers within it have a reasonable chance of hitting more of the remaining mafia. Ideally, I would lynch Palmar today for being entirely useless and acting very scummy. I don't see that happening, so I'm going to ##Unvote I'm going to vote ON because he was one of the people that followed both of Radfield's vote swings, among other previously listed reasons that convinced me. ##Vote OriginalName | ||
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On September 25 2011 03:14 raynpelikoneet wrote: Why do you prefer chaoser lynch over iGrok, given the facts; 1) chaoser shot scum 2) iGrok didn't shoot anyone, instead he comes up with a Saruman over OriginalName. iGrok was wierdly enough checking ON night 2, when he was pretty sure Palmar is scum (at least he stated so). Why did he check ON over Palmar? The only reason i can think of is that he checked Palmar night 1. Is that so iGrok? Also he comes with this "ON being Saruman" thing just after heist and Pyo have accused ON. Don't you find it suspicious? Bottom line first, of course it's suspicious, that doesn't make it impossible. That claim wasn't one of the things that convinced me, because it likely was convenient lie. I wouldn't even put it past him to have found the real Saruman and lied about who rather than be forced out of that information so far from the lynch. Chaoser attacked the person who was leading the town best, The fact Radfield flipped scum doesn't necessarily excuse that. I'm not sure about iGrok's reasoning, but learning he could be blocked changed things. The rest of the difference between the two of them in my eyes is related to their claims. Chaoser used a claim that sounded relatively safe, but had many mistakes like Boromir as a neutral party when he was party of the fellowship and a 'win with town' victory condition. iGrok's is nothing near safe and is relatively more believable. | ||
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On September 25 2011 03:30 chaoser wrote: I think we have different definitions of what "Best" means cause I'm pretty sure two mislynches brought on by last minute bandwagons isn't such. You know what, fuck it ##vote: igrok I'm talking in terms of how many of us were willing to follow him. Leading us in the wrong direction albeit. | ||
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It makes so much more sense if the plan was to bus iGrok from the beginning. | ||
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On September 25 2011 10:22 prplhz wrote: lol@cheese you wanted igrok to survive day2 'cause then he could use sauron's unstoppable kill on me. maybe it's time you do like igrok did and just stop talking. I think if that were the case you would be dead by now, and frankly, I'm offended that you think I'd want to kill confirmed town. | ||
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On September 25 2011 23:50 jcarlsoniv wrote: I've been on Palmar because I still think that he could be scum. Players who run around saying "i'm town confirmed" raise a flag for me. Now, it seems rayn is raising some of the same concerns that I did in this post: + Show Spoiler + On September 23 2011 11:12 jcarlsoniv wrote: I don't like the way he's playing. This is partly because of his intentionally abrasive attitude, but also because of his lack of trying to help. Looking through his filter: -Intentionally lurking Day 1. -Calls Radfield a cool guy, votes for Erandorr (but before Radfield does) -Says DrH is giving him bad vibes -Wants the Ring to be passed to a strong town read, i.e. Radfield, Sandroba, himself, or Pyo. At the time, He was one of my weakest town reads, and I was weary of Radfield because of the Erandorr lynch, so this raised a flag for me. - Says Sandroba is likely town, but only if Sandroba stops voting for him. Claims he's basically town confirmed because of his exchanges with DrH. Literally the only time he mentioned DrH before his death is:+ Show Spoiler + On September 19 2011 08:32 Palmar wrote: DrH is giving me really bad vibes. -Says chaoser is more than likely town. -Accuses iGrok, but is also ok with lynching syllogism -I vote Palmar, he clearly didn't give a fuck. -More pushing on iGrok, gives fairly good reasoning. -Continuing to be malicious, especially against syllogism and Cyber. -Now claims chaoser is scum (wait what?) -Believes Drazerk is scum -Starts to think syllogism is town, and Sandroba is looking worse. -More accusing of chaoser and plenty of BM I think Palmar could very possibly be scum. There were quite a few red flags that were raised reading through his filter. The ONLY reason I could see Palmar as being town is because he pushed the iGrok lynch for a long time. But this could be scum bussing iGrok. It would make sense because there was no huge reason for iGrok to claim, and it made him an easy lynch (granted, an easy lynch that we derped on). Palmar's reason to start the votes on iGrok yesterday was meta from a game that iGrok was a blue role in, and now he's calling himself confirmed town for the second time this game, the first being after claiming a conversation with DocH was the evidence no less. | ||
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On September 26 2011 04:14 heist wrote: Palmar always claims he's confirmed townie. Don't look too much into it. I don't have an extensive history with him, but I don't remember him doing it in Cosmic Horror, and he was town in that game... | ||
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On September 26 2011 20:45 raynpelikoneet wrote: Also, this. If these messages really are from mafia as i believe, they want us to think there is a 3rd party TEAM, which i don't see probable. Yes, there definetly is Gollum out there who strangles people and might even have the ring now that frodo is dead. Mafias reasoning for this message could be to distract us. If anyone hits a 3rd party, town would still think there is another out there. So be curious about this one. If there was two seperate scum teams, it'd be Sauron and Saruman imo, unless not reading the books means missing another major faction. Igrok's ability leads me to believe that Saruman and Sauron are on the same team + Show Spoiler [Ability in question] + Passive Ability [Oneshot]Whatever my Master Desires: You were bred for the sole purpose of serving your masters, Sauron and Saruman So I doubt it's true. As for Gollum having the ring, if the strangulation is indeed Gollum, unless someone is Bilbo Baggins, he definitely has it now if he didn't already. | ||
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I've been doing it the last two days and he hasn't given me much reason to stop now. Will provide an argument at some point when I find the time to write it up tomorrow. | ||
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On September 27 2011 03:09 Archon_Toilet wrote: Pretty sure heist needs to go. He called out DrH as a terrible lynch on day 1, defended Drazerk to the death then voted for him, called out iGrok as a terrible lynch, was on the original name train. Low activity, atrocious voting, defends scum then disappears. Heist needs to go. Vote for heist. Low activity and atrocious voting? Sounds much like someone I know... That is the very first time you have mentioned heist all game. | ||
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On September 27 2011 03:43 GreYMisT wrote: What is your actual opinion on him (Heist) though? He seems town to me, he's asked for people to give well thought out reasons to vote and didn't follow the Radfield wagon. Scum or not, DocH wasn't the best choice for a day 1 lynch, and that was very evident in that he never became a major candidate. I don't think that should be used against him. I would like to hear some of his current thoughts since the flip. I'm on the fence about his 2 candidate policy, it's situational whether two candidates is better or worse than one. Moreover, the voting for people other than iGrok I believe to have been a mafia bus. so he seems to be a townie to me at the moment. For as long as I'm asking people, what is your opinion on Palmar? | ||
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On September 22 2011 19:39 Cyber_Cheese wrote: These people were on both Errandor and Jackal's wagons at days end, and in my opinion are therefore people we should be wary of: -Radfield -kitaman27 -OriginalName -TranceStorm -Drazerk Of which, Radfield is dead and Drazerk is very likely a medic, so I'm comfortable with a lynch on the middle three if it's not Palmar today Im going to list my reasons to vote Palmar once more, because I believe he was one of the scum behind the bus Let's start with Palmar confirming himself: Pre DocH being modkilled- On September 20 2011 19:05 Palmar wrote: In any case, if you're lying, you should consider giving it away. btw, Sandroba is almost definitely town, but only if he takes his vote off me. I'm basically confirmed town from my exchanges with DrH, but only people like sandroba/syllo etc will see it. We need to keep an eye on syllo... yarly. chaoser is also very likely town. I don't like the smell of iGrok and Kita... Post iGroks death- On September 25 2011 22:24 Palmar wrote: seriously wtf rayn, I'm confirmed town now. I'm not scummy Now keep in mind that iGrok was more than likely bussed At this point, go through Palmar's filter and look at just how sure he was that iGrok was mafia, correct or otherwise. It's amazing how he's working only on meta that he refuses to contrast to iGroks current play. On iGrok's meta however- On September 22 2011 02:49 Palmar wrote: I already stated it... day 1 of some mafia game by Ace. It's really not relevant anymore since he claimed an anti town role. Then he claimed a medic save (no medic in their right mind would save him at that point). On September 22 2011 05:51 iGrok wrote: I'm awake now, and I've calmed down a bit. First: Palmar, you try to meta me from a game I was BLUE. Dumb. Now, some of you don't get why I claimed. So look at it from my perspective. You have a check. You have a oneshot unblockable kill. If you get the ring, you become bulletproof. If you get the ring, you're fucking set, and you become a town-aligned Bullet-Proof Vigilante with a bonus check. I doubt mafia have a SECOND unblockable shot, it died with Sauron. Which means I really am unkillable by mafia, which makes me town-aligned. I'll prove it. I'm not listening to syllogism or Palmar. However, syllogism, who do you think is the most town - I'll let them pick. Fair compromise? This is so similar to the Protactinium situation chaoser - but its better for town, and thats why I thought it would work this time. On September 18 2011 04:01 TranceStorm wrote: I suppose we've decided to defer discussion on the ring until later in the game. That's fine, but I would like to point attention to someone who did catch my eye: This is iGrok's only contribution to the thread at the moment. Having played with iGrok in one game before, he was much more active at the beginning of the game and tried to reason his votes better than this (he was godfather though haha). Nevertheless, I would love to hear more from you, iGrok about your thoughts about what is going on. Currently, he seems to be slipping by relatively unnoticed. So apparently iGrok's 'meta' wasn't even relevant from the beginning what? For now my votes staying on Palmar. | ||
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On September 27 2011 14:15 TranceStorm wrote: Anyways, if you are looking for a discrepancy in terms of players who defended iGrok while they wanted chaoser dead, then look at this quote here: Cyber_cheese has defended iGrok throughout the game. Both chaoser and iGrok made suspicious remarks in their claims that were pointed out. However, chaoser has the saving grace of having shot Radfield (no one has counter-claimed) yet Cyber_Cheese says its a better idea to knock off chaoser and has earlier argued for 'controlling' iGrok as well. I noteably didn't want to kill either, I just wanted to kill the one who claimed to have more kp first. I stick by Palmar being our best lynch. | ||
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On September 28 2011 02:21 jcarlsoniv wrote: wut...what would this achieve? We knew prpl was Frodo. So you could claim to protect Frodo, who is a good target for scum, but actually protect someone entirely different, when it was pretty clear scum wants Frodo dead. How does that make any sense at all? If scum think they know where the medic is, they can avoid it... | ||
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On September 28 2011 02:59 kitaman27 wrote: ... GGQ, Grey, ON, Archon, Cheese, heist, Tance, Pyro...do any of you guys have an opinion or are you all going to sit back and watch the mislynch? I'm staying on Palmar for now. I plan on using his flip to influence my next move. | ||
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On September 28 2011 03:05 jcarlsoniv wrote: Quoting myself. Really would like to know someone else's thoughts on this. I've made several cases against Palmar, none of them took off, but he hasn't done much to prove his innocence. On September 28 2011 03:04 kitaman27 wrote: That's nice. What happens when I get lynched instead of Palmar? Are you going to continue to vote for him for the rest of the game since mafia is never going to kill him? Both of you would probably be interested in this post of mine + Show Spoiler + On September 27 2011 11:30 Cyber_Cheese wrote: To quote myself from a while back Of which, Radfield is dead and Drazerk is very likely a medic, so I'm comfortable with a lynch on the middle three if it's not Palmar today Im going to list my reasons to vote Palmar once more, because I believe he was one of the scum behind the bus Let's start with Palmar confirming himself: Pre DocH being modkilled- Post iGroks death- Now keep in mind that iGrok was more than likely bussed At this point, go through Palmar's filter and look at just how sure he was that iGrok was mafia, correct or otherwise. It's amazing how he's working only on meta that he refuses to contrast to iGroks current play. On iGrok's meta however- So apparently iGrok's 'meta' wasn't even relevant from the beginning what? For now my votes staying on Palmar. | ||
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On September 28 2011 04:12 Palmar wrote: we need more votes on kita, at this rate mafia can basically scumswitch and own us. Asking townies to move votes seems like good cover for mafia to move theirs. I'd rather catch the mafia out on a late scum switch at this point. I'm more interested in where these five people who havn't voted at all today decide to go: jcarlsoniv GGQ OriginalName heist TranceStorm And if I'm not mistaken, GGQ hasn't even spoken this cycle + Show Spoiler [Current Votes (If im not mistaken)] + Palmar Cyber_Cheese Heist Greymist Archon_Toilet Drazerk OriginalName Pyo Kitaman27 Palmar Chaoser Raynpelikoneet Chaoser Kitaman27 In the meantime, | ||
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How exactly is the game 'over'? | ||
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On September 28 2011 22:57 Drazerk wrote: It doesn't he just meets his win criteria and gets a little foot note in the end post. and yes we can lynch him tomorrow but we're not going to ( Palmar might need lynching however should he survive ) If it doesn't end the game I'm perfectly fine with leaving both of them to win/lose/w.e of their own accord, they just seem to leave many hints that it might. On September 28 2011 08:10 Palmar wrote: no, I'm gollum. I have to survive till the end of the game, I have a kp, and I only win if by the end of the game I'm in possession of the ring. So, town can hardly afford lynching me, but mafia likes my KP, so I'm just gonna ally with mafia. On September 28 2011 08:10 chaoser wrote: No, Palmer can only win if he survives the night. Then he's out of the game. On September 28 2011 08:08 Palmar wrote: of course he's gonna. btw, if I die, you must lynch chaoser immediately. If you don't, you'll lose the game. On September 28 2011 08:26 Palmar wrote: what chaoser isn't telling is that the game ends in a 3rd party victory if he survives  | ||
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Dead people are striked out with cause of death. These don't include votes that were retracted. + Show Spoiler [Day 1 Lynch Votes] + Final Day 1 Votecount Erandorr Palmar kitaman27 TranceStorm Drazerk Erandorr lynched. + Show Spoiler [Day 2 Lynch Votes] + Final Day 2 Vote Count Jackal58 (9) Greymist chaoser Drazerk raynpelikoneet jcarlsoniv TranceStorm OriginalName kitaman Jackal lynched. + Show Spoiler [Day 3 Lynch Votes] + Final Day 3 Vote Count iGrok (13) GGQ Archon_Toilet Palmar Greymist Drazerk raynpelikoneet Kitaman jcarlsoniv chaoser Archon_Toilet TranceStorm iGrok Lynched! + Show Spoiler [Day 4 Lynch Votes] + Final Day 4 Vote Count OriginalName (5) Heist Drazerk Kitaman27 TranceStorm Chaoser OriginalName Lynched! 1) TranceStorm is the only person to have participated in all of them. 2) The mafia doesn't seem to be targeting the people who were in on the lynches. | ||
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Both Pyo and I haven't been on any, and if we disclude the third which most of the town was on, GGQ joins us. | ||
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On September 29 2011 01:48 Cyber_Cheese wrote: Oh I overlooked Drazerk and Kitaman27 being on all of them too... Both Pyo and I haven't been on any, and if we disclude the third which most of the town was on, GGQ joins us. I'm not actually sure what to discern from that, but it seems to chalk this up to coincidence: On September 29 2011 01:37 Cyber_Cheese wrote: 2) The mafia doesn't seem to be targeting the people who were in on the lynches. Drazerk and Kitaman are both probably blue roles according to the evidence so far, and I'll concede that people that didn't go along with the lynches looks like a much scummier pool at the moment, but considering that the first two lynches were swung by Radfield, I think it's unlikely that all three people that have been in every lynch are innocent. | ||
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On September 29 2011 02:08 Pyo wrote: coming up with a contrived way to clear yourself... am I the only one who thinks this is really scummy? ON flipping town makes me really hesitant to push anyone (especially given that it is night still), but it really should be pointed out that "always being on the right side of a lynch" means you know something that the rest of town didn't... I still haven't wrapped my head around all the chaoser/palmar bullshit. The thing that really bothers me about it is that if I were to pick 2 people at the start of the game who would have absolutely no trepidation with fake claiming a 3rd party, it would be those two. Neither of their claims make any sense nor does the fact that they're both still alive. Hopefully at least one of them dies tonight to make things simpler... or better yet if I die tonight then I don't have to think about it – either way, I'm going to wait till the day post before I really try wade through the fake claiming/sheeping/bull shitting that's been going on. It wasn't intended to clear me, that was an observation I noticed later on. I was asleep during most of them due to timezones and last minute swaps. The Chaoser/Palmar thing we shoud re-evaluate tomorrow IMO, and see if either die in the meantime. | ||
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On September 29 2011 11:21 chaoser wrote: This is actually what Cyber was trying to do. Also, cyber posted this gem over night: Wants to lynch a third party over actually looking for mafia when, even If we had lied about our wincons, it would have been figured out by waiting a single cycle if palmer died and I didn't. He also never actually gets on anyone as scummy and has been cruising through this game so far. No, I was just pointing out some inconsistencies in your collective logics, that was my reasoning behind not believing you. Suddenly you were a game of thrones character as a SK, turned into a vanilla townie because Palmar left? Somehow that doesn't make believing you any easier, but whatever. | ||
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On September 29 2011 11:40 kitaman27 wrote: Also, did Greymist breadcrumb any of his checks? As far as I can tell, Palmar was night 3 On September 27 2011 05:49 GreYMisT wrote: I have not played many games with palmar, so I only have this game of info to reliably depend on, but despite the trolling and one-liners he seems to be taking a fairly pro town stance. Posting the kind of things he is posting might be bored/frustrated town, might be unknown third party, but I do not believe he is scum. That aside, he might have checked iGrok night 2 because he changed his stance, and I suspect he would have checked WBG night 1, but those are both speculation. | ||
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On September 29 2011 11:21 chaoser wrote: He also never actually gets on anyone as scummy and has been cruising through this game so far. Since you are rather indirectly asking for the list of people I think are scum: TranceStorm; there's a few reasons in my filter from day 1/2 and one last night. Archon_Toilet; comes in sporadically, votes someone at almost random, leaves. GGQ; comes in sporadically, seems to give it about 2% more thought than Archon and leaves again. | ||
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On September 17 2011 03:51 chaoser wrote: Winter is coming... On September 17 2011 08:56 chaoser wrote: asking for the ring outright? tsk tsk. My steel and iron comes for you. On September 20 2011 08:19 chaoser wrote: Woe is my life as I have been shot. Thankfully I am not dead. Don't worry though shooter, I have your bullet and I hope to return the favor. I always repay my debts. On September 23 2011 23:01 chaoser wrote: What a creepy slime. Like a kraken... My sword of steel and iron tasted the salty blood of Radfield last night. No hostages were taken. Anyone can counter claim if they want but they're not going to get very far. On September 23 2011 23:41 chaoser wrote: Also, RIP Ned Stark =[ A great but stern man if I ever knew one. I hope one day that the wrongs that have fallen on his family are righted =[ On September 23 2011 23:53 chaoser wrote: Sigh, woe is my life. I am [b]Boromir, Lord of Gondor, Son of Man[b] I can kill people if certain requirements, that I will not say, are fulfilled. I am also bulletproof I win together with town. And that's upto somewhere on page 5 of the 13 in your filter so far, so I'm willing to believe you. | ||
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On September 30 2011 01:31 chaoser wrote: He's been tunneling TS all game and yet he votes Palmer twice (Day 2 and 4) (a useless vote since he was never in danger of being lynched, why not just put your useless vote on TS then?), and for day 3 voted ON. He only voted TS day one. Even now he talks about how he thinks TS is scum but his vote never gets to rest there. If you're so convinced TS is scum why are all your votes meaningless (voting for non-majority people that aren't TS)? SCUMMMMM Because Palmar was scummier obviously I swapped to tunneling Palmar, my vote was on him day 3 up until near the end of it. Every vote on a non-majority person is useless? So we should all have only one person with the votes on them at the end of the day? | ||
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On September 30 2011 02:04 chaoser wrote: lol and yet you keep going back to TS, this was last night btw. I'm surprised that you say Palmer was "scummier" when you've been talking about TS, made the biggest case AGAINST TS, and continue to talk about TS as scum since day 1. Posted last night. Also posts this bullshit "I wasn't in any of them, I'm not scum." Only scum would feel the need to do this. Also you imply that you pyo and ggq weren't in them and thus have "townie points" but all of a sudden later: You post this right after Palmer flips, even though you thought palmer was scum. So either you read through the thread hella fast to reevaluate who the last three mafia are or you just pulled out three convinent people. GGQ appeared alongside me in the hasn't last minute switched poll, and has done worse than Pyo this game. After Drazerk pointed out that Trance in fact wasn't the only person to be onboard every lynch, I made an excel sheet and pointed out interesting things I saw to raise discussion. I admitted to that group looking the scummiest, which you conveniently overlook, and of Pyo and GGQ, I find GGQ worse, so he made the cut. The four people that voted along side Radfield in both his lynches were: TranceStorm Drazerk OriginalName Kitaman27 And I'm willing to bet they aren't all town. ##Vote TranceStorm | ||
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On September 30 2011 03:32 TranceStorm wrote: First off, the first lynch doesn't prove anything at all. All 4 of the candidates were later shown to be townie - therefore, it doesn't prove or disprove scum motivations to change from one candidate to the other. Therefore, you'd have to expand your list a bit to look at the second lynch. Funny enough, on the second lynch, you'd think that iGrok would have voted with Radfield if he was scum. Its convenient that his vote was on a Palmar as was yours. Then why would Radfield bother changing it? Mafia wanted Errandorr dead for some reason. On September 30 2011 03:32 kitaman27 wrote: heh scum don't always vote together cyber. If anything, they try to spread their votes apart so they can't be connected to each other. @rayn, who do you want to lynch and why? @jcarl, you were pretty absent the previous lynch and didn't come in until the last minute to vote Palmar. Thoughts? Sure they spread the votes out, but there's bound to be at least one mafia member. Keep in mind that they were very late bandwagons. Mafia were more than likely not all around waiting for the countdown since none of them were on the line. It makes sense to have an accomplice, someone to keep in reserve if possible and just nudge the lynch in the right direction, without drawing focus. The first one didn't mean anything? In first one, he waits for the reaction to the response to see if it's safe to jump on board. The 'edited content' wasn't even lied about, and he is the first person to mention it as such. On September 19 2011 07:23 TranceStorm wrote: Woahhh. Erandorr responded really really poorly to that pressure. Radfield's initial case against him was quite convincing, but his response to the pressure was to write a defense and then outright lie about the content that he edited. That is definitely the clearest sign of scum that we have had throughout this entire day. Therefore, I'll definitely be switching my vote as well onto Erandorr. And he does it again with another late bandwagon day 2. On September 22 2011 06:51 TranceStorm wrote: Both Jackal and Palmar are really really similar in my eyes. Both of them post a ton of one-liners and haven't given really substantive analysis at all this game. Both of them always seem to do that in all of their games. However, Jackal hasn't voiced an opinion at all on the current candidates but continues to jump around calling everyone scum. My vote will be going to Jackal right now. Notice how he nudged people away from Palmar with the comparison, to make sure the one Radfield chose would be the lynched one? | ||
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On September 30 2011 04:45 TranceStorm wrote: Also I would like to bring attention to what else Cyber_Cheese does. He accuses me of being on all of the majority lynches. That is true. But notice that Cyber_Cheese is never on a single one. In 3/4 lynches, he votes for side candidates who he knows will not get lynched and will consequently paint him in a bad light. This seems very quirky to me - it seems very much like Cyber_Cheese wants to avoid the spotlight of having made a poor vote. The one time that Cyber_Cheese does vote for one of the top candidates for the lynch, he's voting for ON against iGrok. There's only been a single majority lynch so far, and all three of the others were late swings in which TranceStorm had a participatory role. He's been taking the votes late, looking to make sure it's safe to climb upon the wagon's and made sure he's voting with the majority to try to avoid suspicion by hiding amongst townies. | ||
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On September 30 2011 05:56 heist wrote: Late swings in which his vote is unnecessary. Why would he do that unless he believed in the lynch as a townie? If he raised evidence to vote someone else, he might have accidentally swung it back, and he could ensure he was on hand to swing it back in the right direction if it wavered. | ||
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On September 30 2011 08:16 kitaman27 wrote: Cyber, I'm trying to decide if you are a scum or just a newbie. I'm not sure I understand your case on Trance. How is it a scum agenda for him trying to move votes away from Palmar? That fact that there hasn't really been any opposition kinda worries me. Heist and GGQ come in with 1 liners, jumping on you, and Pyo and rayn have been completely absent. Could you please explain your thought process on day two and day three for not voting iGrok? Also, why were you unwilling to switch on day 4 to save me, after I basically confirmed myself as town? It might be time for a role claim considering it seems pretty likely you're going to get lynched today. Radfield's agenda was to move votes to Jackal over Palmar, therefore whatever they were thinking, it's a scum agenda. I think the scum saw more potential for Jackal to pick up his game than for Palmar. I was asleep during your presentation of evidence, I'm only awake now because I stayed back at work. As I've said multiple times, timezones were partially at fault for not last minute bandwagoning. I'm Meriadoc Brandybuck, Hobbit of the Fellowship. | ||
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On October 01 2011 05:01 heist wrote: There's no way we should be focusing on a 3rd party lynch anyways. Go for mafia or go for broke. I'll post my thoughts on TS later. Although, honestly my basis is that at least 2 mafia voted for Jackal day 2. I don't know how reliable that is as a starting point, but I'll look through and see if there's anything more concrete than the stuff on pyo. That and the plan to risk giving a ring to people you believe to be town are why I'm thinking it's him. I mean, Radfield and DoctorHelvatica would have been likely have been major contenders for ring passing target if the plan had gone through. On September 30 2011 10:34 kitaman27 wrote: Could you provide a case against Trance, rather than just a voting list? What seperates him from rayn or jcarl? The plan for the ring he made on day 1 | ||
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On October 01 2011 05:01 heist wrote: There's no way we should be focusing on a 3rd party lynch anyways. Go for mafia or go for broke. I'll post my thoughts on TS later. Although, honestly my basis is that at least 2 mafia voted for Jackal day 2. I don't know how reliable that is as a starting point, but I'll look through and see if there's anything more concrete than the stuff on pyo. I agree with that, assuming there is 3 mafia left and their kp is two, the sk (assuming there still is one) has a kp, so either way we take a kp off, the difference is the sk's kp can still hit mafia, or force a mafia roleblock -> medic isn't roleblocked. | ||
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On October 01 2011 18:19 Drazerk wrote: So I just found a dusty old ring on the corpse of a dead hobbit and now I have the ability to survive unlimited amounts of KP, not only this If I survive till the lynch I can res anyone who had voted for scum at any point in the game. Lylo pffffft So thus ressurection mechanic, one per day or any/all of them at your discreetion? Multi-use? | ||
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On October 01 2011 19:45 Drazerk wrote: Once per day multi use ability, however people I res will be given a different role / alignment than they originally had and if I die my spirit will linger on and all players but myself will be resurrected each day resulting in a never ending game ( Unless the world radiation gets above 10 in which case I can't res any more as they just die instantly ) I'm sure we could make an epic game out of that... Somehow. Maybe if everyone was a compulsive veteran vigilante? | ||
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On October 01 2011 22:16 Drazerk wrote: and yet you still manage to have higher activity than most even if we are just mass trolling at this stage I had to reach the activity limit  Hell if other people had been reaching it too the content might not even have been trolling :/ | ||
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On October 02 2011 06:09 chaoser wrote: Also, mafia shot me to kill me, and Drazerk is proof of that, so I don't see how this "chaoser is sk" thing works. At the moment, we have your word that your a VT I'm not sure how Drazerk's message reads, or if the heal comes before invulnerability if it applies On October 02 2011 05:28 GGQ wrote: archon_toilet, cyber_cheese, and perhaps heist for the last mafia? If anyone has a kp, direct it in that direction, please. I'm not sure what your reasoning is on any of those, and I'd like to hear it. I'll agree on Archon, my best logic is that he's a smurf of a good player and frankly he's been playing quite sub-par so far. When he realised it was working that he could vote quasi-randomly, he found he didn't need to change it up and might win anyway. I suspect you for a similar reason, especially because you gave out less opinions while doing it. | ||
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There's a large difference. | ||
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On October 02 2011 10:08 chaoser wrote: 22. Cyber_Cheese 27. heist 30. TranceStorm 5. kitaman27 28. Drazerk 23. chaoser 6. GGQ Here's my list right now. kitaman and Drazerk are "confirmed" and I'm "confirmed" if you'll believe me. So that means if all three of us are townies, then mafia fucked themselves over with their kill last night cause we'd just vote between GGQ, Cyber_cheese, heist, and TS. A three in four chance to lynch a mafia. I believe GGQ to be town so in that case it's just full on lynch of three mafia ezpz. But there's no way they would have done this. One of kita and Drazerk is 100% scum. I'm actually willing to believe both are. ##vote: kitaman27 At this point you need to explain actually (paraphrase) how your role works, who you picked to track every single night and why. I'm currently going through your logs. Also, Drazerk, who did you protect night 1? This seems like good methodology to attack 'confirmed' townies. WIFOM applies Assume you get to late game, and all three mafia are with 3 confirmed town and 3 suspects If mafia kill two suspects, they can shift the focus to the living confirmed town. There is two paths we should look down: A) Does that mean there's no mafia outside of the confirmed town? If not, is it more viable to pursue them? B) Confirmed by who exactly? Here I'm going to assume what you say is correct, and Kitaman OR Drazerk is mafia, and further assuming that you are in fact town and got that information from your back and forth with Palmar in the win conditions. (The latter half of that one being a fairly logical derivative of Palmar knowing what was going on before he left.) That leaves two mafia amongst four people, and it should be easier to spot someone scummy amongst them than in the confirmed townies section. | ||
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On October 02 2011 10:51 chaoser wrote: In that case I'd vote for you I was aware it lead back to me. I bet there's still scum left around me. What makes GGQ seem town to you, compared to TranceStorm and Heist? You seem to think I'm scum, so lets work under the assumption that I am for a minute. TranceStorm and GGQ were the ones who voted me yesterday. What seperates the two that makes TranceStorm look like the mafia? I've been FOS'ing him a lot this game, and he did it back yesterday, was that to distance myself like Radfield and DocH were doing? It's going to seem strange for me to back down on voting TranceStorm having said that, but I was pushing TranceStorm because he voted both times with Radfield's late wagons, along with ON, Drazerk and Kitaman. I didn't believe that all four of those people would be town, but with Drazerk and Kitaman still alive, it seems viable that one of them might be the scum that I was accusing Trance of being. Therefore, the two people I want to look into most at this point are GGQ and Heist. | ||
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##Vote Heist | ||
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On October 02 2011 23:48 TranceStorm wrote: Hmmm. Why have Cyber_Cheese and heist moved off from voting for me (and to voting for each other at the moment). Nothing has changed from the previous day to this day so why should they have seemed to change their minds? The fact Drazerk and Kitaman are alive this late in the game means there is a good chance at least one of them is mafia. They were both on Radfield's late swings like you, and I figured there was another mafia voting with Radfield. You being that other mafia was my reason to push you, but that doesn't seem so logical now they are both alive. I only believe one of you three to be mafia, and somehow chaoser looks trustworthy, so I think the other two mafia are Heist and GGQ. | ||
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On October 03 2011 03:50 Drazerk wrote: The fact that I have been saying I was going to protect Kita most nights probably swayed scum into only role blocking Kita. As for myself well I have no idea why I am still alive especially after Curu basically mod confirmed me as a medic. Of course they could of chosen the kills purely because they are trolling at this stage or simply are not following the game. Even if you and Kita are town and I was right about Trance all along, there is likely two other mafia, and Chaoser seems less scum than GGQ and Heist at this point, with the hit you saved him from. | ||
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On October 03 2011 05:07 DropBear wrote: | ||
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On October 03 2011 10:38 kitaman27 wrote: cyber, if you're on heist, does that mean you don't think trance is scum still? trance, who do you prefer, cyber or heist? + Show Spoiler + On October 02 2011 11:19 Cyber_Cheese wrote: I was aware it lead back to me. I bet there's still scum left around me. What makes GGQ seem town to you, compared to TranceStorm and Heist? You seem to think I'm scum, so lets work under the assumption that I am for a minute. TranceStorm and GGQ were the ones who voted me yesterday. What seperates the two that makes TranceStorm look like the mafia? I've been FOS'ing him a lot this game, and he did it back yesterday, was that to distance myself like Radfield and DocH were doing? It's going to seem strange for me to back down on voting TranceStorm having said that, but I was pushing TranceStorm because he voted both times with Radfield's late wagons, along with ON, Drazerk and Kitaman. I didn't believe that all four of those people would be town, but with Drazerk and Kitaman still alive, it seems viable that one of them might be the scum that I was accusing Trance of being. Therefore, the two people I want to look into most at this point are GGQ and Heist. On October 03 2011 02:53 Cyber_Cheese wrote: The fact Drazerk and Kitaman are alive this late in the game means there is a good chance at least one of them is mafia. They were both on Radfield's late swings like you, and I figured there was another mafia voting with Radfield. You being that other mafia was my reason to push you, but that doesn't seem so logical now they are both alive. I only believe one of you three to be mafia, and somehow chaoser looks trustworthy, so I think the other two mafia are Heist and GGQ. On October 03 2011 04:03 Cyber_Cheese wrote: Even if you and Kita are town and I was right about Trance all along, there is likely two other mafia, and Chaoser seems less scum than GGQ and Heist at this point, with the hit you saved him from. | ||
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##Unvote ##Vote GGQ | ||
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Ok, so here's what everyone should know. Drazerk said he got hit on Day 4. He also got motivation and used it on Night 3 to protect prplhz and me. This is confirmed by Curu. He later protected me from a hit on Night 4. This means that syllo must have given him motivation on Night 2. But Syllo died on Day 3. That makes it impossible for him to protect Drazerk for day 4 since he wasn't around on Night 3 to do it. That means the only way Drazerk could have survived a hit was if there was another medic. This confirms heist as the other medic. At the same time, it explains why mafia didn't shoot Drazerk since they knew he was being protected but not by who. That leaves: 27. heist 22. Cyber_Cheese 5. kitaman27 30. TranceStorm 6. GGQ Mafia would obviously all pile onto heist since I just said I'm willing to lynch him. There's a 3/5 chance to hit mafia here, and 3/4 if you think kita is town tracker. I feel however, Cyber_Cheese is 100% mafia. [quote]On wherebugsgo, I get the distinct impression he's just a townie who wanted to have the ring and decided acting as Smeagol and demanding the ring until people got bored of it was better than trying to defend himself actively. I'm willing to bet there is no posting restriction, in fact I think it was explicitly stated somewhere that there wasn't. That said, I'd be comfortable with a lynch on him on the off-chance he is telling the truth about being third party, purely because that seems to make him a safer bet than most others.[/quote] He's ok with lynching third-party. He then says iGrok is suspicious but is "giving hi a break". [quote]IGrok seems a little bit suspicious, but since I'm giving archon_toilet a break I guess I'll be doing the same here.[/quote] He then goes on to defend iGrok when iGrok claims third-party. [quote]Go back and look at the claims of chaoser and igrok, if we must kill a neutral party, chaoser is the optimal choice.[/quote] but he wants to lynch me over iGrok if I'm third-party. [quote]LOL WHAT I collapse in my bed with a few hours to go, and out of nowhere someone who hadn't even been considered previously was lynched. Bad call on Errandor, I really didn't see that happening, and I guess I'm not the only one[quote] He also pulls exactly what people have said about mafia leaving their vote on prp and then going WHAT STUPID TOWNIES when Errandor gets lynched. ##vote: Cyber_cheese[/QUOTE] I was hoping to keep avoiding role-claiming in full so mafia could waste hits on me, but that doesn't help me if I die. I am Meriadoc Brandybuck, Hobbit of the Fellowship, Hider. I have the ability to hide behind people at night, with a 50% chance to die if my target is mafia. So far, I've hidden behind: iGrok - Night 1 iGrok - Night 2 Greymist - Night 3 Raynpelikoneet - Night 4 Chaoser - Night 5 You who claimed multiple kp were a better choice than someone who claimed one if it had to be third party. The Errandor thing genuinely surprised me, it was an overreaction. I changed my stance on third parties after I made that WBG quote, when I realised lynching someone that might be mafia would be better for information. | ||
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On October 03 2011 12:35 chaoser wrote: Ok, so here's what everyone should know. Drazerk said he got hit on Day 4. He also got motivation and used it on Night 3 to protect prplhz and me. This is confirmed by Curu. He later protected me from a hit on Night 4. This means that syllo must have given him motivation on Night 2. But Syllo died on Day 3. That makes it impossible for him to protect Drazerk for day 4 since he wasn't around on Night 3 to do it. That means the only way Drazerk could have survived a hit was if there was another medic. This confirms heist as the other medic. At the same time, it explains why mafia didn't shoot Drazerk since they knew he was being protected but not by who. That leaves: 27. heist 22. Cyber_Cheese 5. kitaman27 30. TranceStorm 6. GGQ Mafia would obviously all pile onto heist since I just said I'm willing to lynch him. There's a 3/5 chance to hit mafia here, and 3/4 if you think kita is town tracker. I feel however, Cyber_Cheese is 100% mafia. He's ok with lynching third-party. He then says iGrok is suspicious but is "giving hi a break". He then goes on to defend iGrok when iGrok claims third-party. but he wants to lynch me over iGrok if I'm third-party. He also pulls exactly what people have said about mafia leaving their vote on prp and then going WHAT STUPID TOWNIES when Errandor gets lynched. ##vote: Cyber_cheese I was hoping to keep avoiding role-claiming in full so mafia could waste hits on me, but that doesn't help me if I die. I am Meriadoc Brandybuck, Hobbit of the Fellowship, Hider. I have the ability to hide behind people at night, with a 50% chance to die if my target is mafia. So far, I've hidden behind: iGrok - Night 1 iGrok - Night 2 Greymist - Night 3 Raynpelikoneet - Night 4 Chaoser - Night 5 You who claimed multiple kp were a better choice than someone who claimed one if it had to be third party. The Errandor thing genuinely surprised me, it was an overreaction. I changed my stance on third parties after I made that WBG quote, when I realised lynching someone that might be mafia would be better for information. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On October 03 2011 13:04 chaoser wrote: Why would mafia hit you if you're fucking suspected of being mafia? And this fear is only contingent on IF we are able to lynch mafia today. It's between you, who looks scummy as fuck with all your contradictions and scumminess and GGQ, who has been fingered by Radfield as scummy and someone that should be shot and also pushed for iGrok's lynch at the very beginning. He looks so damn clean it's kinda suspicious. You on the other hand look so fucking scummy. We can skip over this debate by lynching TS who is 100% mafia and try to buy another day, hoping that mafia doesn't kill anyone tonight since we got two medics if everyone is willing. Yeah they might not attack me, but they definitely wouldn't once I claimed in full, I figured some chance was better than none. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:10 heist wrote: Let's assume you have this power. Why the hell have you been using it every night? I'm not gonna lie, this is a terrible power you revealed. Either you have a 50% chance to die for nothing if you hide behind mafia or You throw someone else in front of you (someone who could actually have blue powers) just to save yourself. Because then if I survive I can protect the person I was behind. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:16 Cyber_Cheese wrote: Because then if I survive I can protect the person I was behind. That's also not how it works, things that target me miss, things that hit the other person hit us both. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:19 heist wrote: So you choose someone to hide behind. You get targetted. And instead of that person taking the hit for you, you come out and save the two of you? What's with this "if", won't you live regardless of being targeted if you are hiding? Erm what? I hide behind someone. Things aimed at that someone hit us both. Things aimed at me miss entirely. If that someone is mafia, I have a 50% chance to die. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:25 heist wrote: Lemme get this straight: 1. Any attacks on you will miss. 2. The only way to kill you at night (assuming you target a townie) is if your target gets hit. The hit will apply to both of you. 3. Yet you can also protect your target? wtf? I don't protect them... | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:28 chaoser wrote: How does this work again? You don't protect shit, you just survive. Also, please explain why you hid behind iGrok for two whole days when there's a 50% chance you would die and you didn't apparently? iGrok the first night because I didn't think he'd get hit. When I was alive day 2 I figured I should defend him because I survived. I then decided to double check night 2 because it was only 50/50, and if I died he was very likely to get lynched day 3 anyway at that point. As it turns out I wasn't able to save him despite getting lucky and surviving again. On October 03 2011 13:31 chaoser wrote: Also, why the fuck would Merry be a hider? He fucking kills Nazgul. Not once in the books did he hide. This looks like you went into PYP mafia and stole the hider role from there. Why the fuck would Theon Greyjoy be in a Lotr themed game? Defend them from the people pushing to lynch them. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 13:43 chaoser wrote: That's how a real hider is used. You didn't play in a way that would have invited mafia bullets at all. What a bullshit claim. I'm from an alternate universe and my role is in-character (I'm a greyjoy, we rob the coastline, we also kill people and take their shit) Yours makes no sense in-character. Thanks for the shit claim though. 100% mafia. Where is the quote from? That's just telling mafia which target to hit to get 2 for the price of 1... | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 03 2011 14:37 chaoser wrote: You're saying that you're playing a role you've never heard about and played before and you didn't go google it? This quote is fro mafiawiki. Obviously you don't tell people in advance who you are hiding behind but you can hint it to people by FOSing them and then when you die they will know. Regardless of that fact, what's your hider ability called? All of the abilities have names. What's yours? It's called Cloak of the Elves. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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Cyber_Cheese
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On October 03 2011 20:22 kitaman27 wrote: haha did you just claim mafia?  | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 04 2011 01:19 chaoser wrote: Ok switch back, I find it kind of odd that cyber_cheese decided to hide behind iGrok after he had claimed third party on Night 2, especially since it was very much possible for a vigi to have just shot him. ##vote: cyber_cheese Sorry everyone but can you please switch back. I spent a lot of time and energy defending him day 2, and my curiosity of whether it was justified or not overpowered my common sense. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/tCp90.gif) | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On October 04 2011 01:50 chaoser wrote: Drazerk and Kita, switch over now please. For a vanilla townie, your awfully willing to lynch just about anyone | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 04 2011 02:01 chaoser wrote: I'm clearly not which is why I've been going back and forth all day trying to figure out this tangled web of scum. Your buddies better kill me tonight before I get the rest of them. Does it feel good to have dropped all pretenses of defense and go after me instead? I'm already confirmed by Drazerk protecting me from a hit by mafia. When your reply to my explaination of my actions is On October 04 2011 01:45 chaoser wrote: lol, bullshit It's very hard to 'defend'. This confirmation of you and Drazerk seems to rely heavily on you two confirming each other at the moment too... | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On October 04 2011 02:06 chaoser wrote: Drazerk is already confirmed by Curu. Burns doesn't it? Grasping for straws much? Not really, I already knew that. | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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On October 04 2011 02:18 Drazerk wrote: also did GGQ ninja vote? yes although he did accuse me much earlier so it's possible he simply forgot | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
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Cyber_Cheese
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Cyber_Cheese
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We came so close, It's a shame GGQ didn't make an arguement on trance based off my filter, with the sudden stance change on my last day Stuff happens Here's what made Rayn rage http://www.mediafire.com/?n73walyf4l73f5n I ran him though a common word count ^_^ I wonder how long it'll be untill he spells 'becouse' wrong again Well hosted Curu, sorry for raging about the Eowyn/Éowyn thing, though I do think it's a little harsh to need the word perfect | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 10 2011 15:35 GreYMisT wrote: Yea I wasnt able to be too active at the start of this game, My RA training for college was in full swing and this (and MLP at the same time) was the first time I had rolled blue, didnt know how to initially handle it aside from not posting too much. I felt like I started to get the hang of it later on, but it was too little too late on my part. The kill on you was more or less random. In particular there are three things I would change in hindsight. 1) I feel like we should have attacked Drazerk instead of trying to bomb him (with ) because it was a weekend.2) I should have realized I'd claimed to be ok with lynching neutrals on day1//Not defended iGrok to that extent. Or not said I was ok with it and defended iGrok that much. 3) Chosen my claim right on day 1 and played accordingly, or not claimed at all. Oh and attacking chaoser/trance over that last night could have thrown suspicion on Heist for not dying | ||
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Cyber_Cheese
Australia3615 Posts
On October 17 2011 03:57 JACCUZISPLAT wrote: They proved nothing, town was being retarded. This. I was telling him not to use them or he might have posted them much sooner. I had assumed him posting the logs wouldn't change anything. On October 16 2011 10:14 raynpelikoneet wrote: You all should give credit to Palmar. Fuck yeah, he won. Gratz man. GG You played awesome. ggwp. Why town left him alive is a mystery to me. | ||
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